Hi folks,

I have a theory....the poor sales of the new album in the USA shows that the US fans are just interested in the old Stones..in the Greates Hits Stones..they don`t want to hear the new stuff..
they are even not intertested in it...

but in europe or the rest of the world people are interested in what are the Rolling Stones like TODAY ?
How is their new stuff ?...they see the Stones as a living and developing Rock band wheras the US fans just see the Stones as kind of nostalgica act...

No one would go for a beer during a new song in germany for example...but in the US the new songs and the Keith tunes are welcomed to have a piss or a beer brake....man, I would piss in my trousers before I would go for a pee during a Rolling Stones gig...that has something to do with respect...in europe people go and buy the new album after hearing the new tunes during a Stones gig..in the US the fans are buying Greatest Hits album, after hearing them in the Show..

That´s why they seem almost to ignore the new album in the US leg of the tour.

What do you think ?
Are the europeans more interested in the present Stones than the US fans ?

I say..YES .

regards

salar

Therefore ticket sales in some European countries are less than in the US.
So this couns up. Further more I do not know how the downloads are counted.

totally agree. Im from Scotland but was lucky enough to be in the states for the recent St Louis show. The gig was awesome but loadsa people cleared out during Keiths set. I had to tell some arseholes behind us to shut the @#$%& up during "this place is empty". Its a different world out there. The people around us were sitting eating hot dogs and big buckets of popcorn like it was the bloody movies!

Just a myth. With open admission on the floor and not an allocated seat you don't really notice who is going in and out of the crowd. People just move around all the time. What do you call those hundreds of boxes all lined up in a stadium in Europe, with endless queues? John? Anybody remember Oberhausen? And how about those endless primitive "do it against the wall" plastic things they have every time in Werchter Belgium? Very efficient in fact. I don't go there during shows but I am sure all the people who pass by me at every show suring every song in every city in Europe have the same goal as everywhere else in the world. We are all the same. First input. Then output. And beer sales are booming at shows. Happens everywhere. Don't give me another stupid US vs. Europe discussion.

Bjornulf

piss off. I was there. Its the first gig Ive seen in the states and my observations are true. I loved the show but the US audiences are different from European ones. And it was a mass exodus when Keith took the mic. Plus everyone around us was eating hot dogs and popcorn and talking throughout. If that makes this a USA vs Europe debate then Im sorry

Agree with BV. People piss during Keith in euope as well. On "Miss you" people go and come as well. And in Europe 99% of the people who come to the stadium want to hear their greatest hits cd.

sorry bv I just reread your post, and my reply looks a bit stupid and mean spirited. back to my wine and Eastenders on the tv!!

European = You're a peeing?

There is an "Edit post" you know in case you regret posting something.

I would not judge people from going to one show. Like judging all people from the opening show Chicago 1997 or Copenhagen Denmark 1995 or even Vancouver 1994. Never seen so many beer drinkers as at these shows. Or Prague 1995 when they actually had the beer truck right inside the stadium on the field. Happens ewverywhere. It's about how easy it is to get a beer, and how easy it is to get rid of it eventually. When you are treated like animals at the shows, which is the case in Europe, then they do often have one toilet per 1000 person (feels like) and then smart people don't drink that much. The other half (not so smart or plain thursty) drink anyway.

Bjornulf

Mine was just a joke. See the . No problem with anyone.

Yeah by the way you can't be a stones fan when you think that Keith time is beer time.Only if you have gone to 100 gigs and you were used to the idea that you see stones.

-



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-12-23 01:32 by cirrhosis.

bv Wrote:
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> Just a myth.

Beep, wrong. In Europe there are just other expectations
when you have been waiting outside for hours. Most of those
"pitch people" WANT to hear and see them for 2 hours, not less.

In the US (experienced myself on 2 tours) the more convenient
it is, the more it´s NOT R&R. People coming late, going for a piss
or popcorn, wanting you to sit down etc. because they have got a "seat"
on the pitch. In Europe the pitch people have to stand the ground.
And piss in a plastic bottle and throw it at the support act (witnessed myself).

I´m not interested in seats in a Stones show. Never. So Salar is right.

Btw: Is the Groaning Moans "Urine Peein Tour" a bootleg title?
I always liked that one;-)

People seem to neglect salar's main point here, about the different sales of ABB in USA and Europe. That's a fact, not an opinion. I have always wondered that thing: how come the band tour 'behind' a new vital album, easily sell outs everywhere, but the album just sells next to nothing. The same happens with Paul McCartney. It seriously looks like that the reason is that those two names are viewed only as a nostalgy act. The big crowd isn't interested in their new music. The same tendency is in Europe, but I think, but perhaps not so powerful (yet) - here there seems to be lots of people who are interested what those old guys create nowadays (expect McCartney - who really is a nostalgy act).

- Doxa

salar Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hi folks,
>
> I have a theory....the poor sales of the new album
> in the USA shows that the US fans are just
> interested in the old Stones..in the Greates Hits
> Stones..they don`t want to hear the new stuff..
> they are even not intertested in it...
yes



> What do you think ?
> Are the europeans more interested in the present
> Stones than the US fans ?
yes, their standards are lower lol

Don´t drink beer at shows! Too much water, nearly no alcohol and you need to piss every few litres!

Better get yourself some good half litre of vodka, mix it in a big plastic bottle with some orange lemonade (just like Keith?). This one will do until the end of the show. And if you like: Smoke some nice weed.

But don´t drive your car afterwards. Go to an after show party (maybe I even organise some party myself this year in Cologne - I will let you folks know if so) and enjoy the rest of the night with the finest Stones music.

ABB doesn't sell well in the United States because in America the audience would rather see a live mouse than a dead lion.

In Germany ABB is in the top ten album charts of some serious music journalists. I don´t think this fact is very important, but it shows that some critics rate the album higher than some fans here at this board.

lodge Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
Further more I do not know how
> the downloads are counted.


While I think both USA and Europe is fairly similar regarding the rate of downloading, I'm certain that ABB has been downloaded more in the US than in Europe. But I don't think the difference is that significant.

Pietro Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ABB doesn't sell well in the United States because
> in America the audience would rather see a live
> mouse than a dead lion.


I think the lion is pretty lively. Check the Superbowl!

I have a different 2 part theory as to the relatively poor sales of the album in the U.S. and the U.K. as compared to other European nations.

The majority of record buying is done by young music fans and those fans have been priced out from buying Stones concert tickets since 1998 in the U.S and 1999 in the U.K., whereas tickets on continental Europe will still affordable in 2003. As a result, the Stones have not had a sizeable young record buying demographic see them live in the U.S. and U.K. since the late 90s. I think anyone on this site will agree that if you see the Stones live once, you are then hooked on the band.

In 1997-98, for all stadium shows in the U.S. the top price was $60, a price that allowed almost all fans a chance to see them and to see them up close for a good price. This includes many of the 15-20 year old music fans that had heard a lot about the Stones and had the chance to see them live for the first time. I think a lot of these kids then bought the Bridges album after seeing the Stones. By 2002-03 the prices in the U.S. had escalated to where they no longer were affordable, thus the Stones had cut off a good percentage of younger fans.

By 2003, the prices for the U.K. shows, which were seated instead of standing on the field, also carried a much higher price than on the continent, cutting off young U.K. fans who had been able to afford the 1999 U.K. tickets.

The result of this is that when the Stones, after 8 years, finally released a new studio album, they had completely lost the young record buying market in the U.S. and U.K., but held onto it in Europe, because young 15-20 year old fans were able to afford seeing the Stones there in 2003 and are still filled with the excitement they encountered at those shows. These young, now 17-22 year old fans, had no problem buying a new studio album by a band that had thrilled them so much just 2 years earlier.

I feel another reason that Bridges sold well in the U.S. compared to Bang is that songs like Out Of Control and Saint Of Me were real highlights of the shows in 97-98. These songs stayed in people's minds after they left the stadiums. Rough Justice and Oh No Not You Again are good rockers, but are much more standard by-the-books Stones sounding songs than those played on the Bridges tour, thus they are much more forgettable to people who only hear them once. People were blown away by Out Of Control and the sing-along to Saint Of Me and young and older fans alike then wanted to buy the new Stones album after seeing them played live. The songs they are playing from Bang just don't get the fans excited the way they did in 97-98.

The Stones are still getting die hard fans to buy the new album in the U.S. but it's much harder to get older fans into record stores these days. A Bigger Bang is an excellent album filled with good songs, but it lacks the show-stopping, knockout songs that Bridges had, particularly in a live setting.

>A Bigger Bang is an excellent album filled with
>good songs, but it lacks the show-stopping, knockout
>songs that Bridges had, particularly in a live setting.

How to find out when never playing them? Imagine Look What...
with a middle instrumental funky rock part with Jagger going
nuts?

Or Back Of My Hand played as mean as on the album with cranked
distorted guitars?

Or Let Me Down... with a longer ending with Ronnie sliding his
Zemaitis?

Or Laugh...


But they have to play them to find out, then the songs develope.
Compare Out Of Control Chicago 97 to San Diego 1998.

Or Saint Of Me from San Diego 98 to Prag 98.

I would say that it is very true that in the USA fans are still more into the classics plus radio does not play much of the new stuff no matter how good it is and it is very good. Don't get me wrong people in the USA still love the Stones but its more about what they have already done and don't really care about the new stuff. I have been to recent shows and believe me people gave them a hell of alot more cheers when they played the classics and were not really that much into the new stuff. Thats probably why there only playing about 3 new songs each night because they have to please the mass audiance of fans at the shows here to keep them happy and wanting more.

It seems to me, also, that USA is more into the whole "EW-- they're old" thing, whereas in Europe they care less about things like that. Old age in general in Europe is not as um, taboo.

different ticket pricing structures result in a different type of audience, thats why

Its more a nostalgia thing in countries where the prices are higher and the shows are all seated - because that attracts an older type of audience

Good post, halup, by the way



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-02-13 22:34 by Gazza.

ABBA are bigger in Europe!

The Stones have made a decision not to market to younger audiences. The ticket prices make this clear. Unless you create some level of "buzz" among the 18-25 (or even 35) crowd, how are you going to sell CD's?

The bright side is, all of older folks buying incredibly overpriced tickets in the US help to fund a fantasic stage and light show that all of you can enjoy in Europe.

i am from europe and i did a trip to vegas to see the stones but i have to say the audience sucks. it was a kind of a funeral mood there. never ever i go to US to see a concert!!! the people there should go to cinema where the could eat popcorn and not to go to a stones concert!! iam looking forward to see the boys in old europe.

Hm...everybody know that the people in the Us are much more into Amusement Parks like Disneyland etc. They brought it to europe but its an american thing. The Stones are a part of that, it has become a musical like show with original memmbers. ABB was a good move to get out of this world. I hope they do another record soon and go back to the clubs where there is no room for Jagger moving his 65 years old ass. Sit Mick and sing with passion again!

For various reasons, the Stones fan base is much more younger in Europe. Personaly i think the factor “ticket prices” is a bit overrated in our discussions on this board. There are other reasons, deeper, cultural and musical. For example, in the States hip hop, country and “modern R&B” are attracting young people much more than they can do it in Europe.Anyway, the result remains the same: the Stones fan base is much more younger in Europe. That means much more interest about the new stuff of the band. Even in UK ABB probably will outsell BTB and that’s great in the years of downloading.


USA is the “capital” of the music industry and of the music marketing too. This fact means that without good airplay you can do nothing there. I think the extremely poor ABB’s airplay in US has partly to do with “neo-con”. Perhaps Clear Channel Communications knows something about it! Also, USA market seems very strange and unstable, real “haos” (so many kinds of music, so many artists-new and old). Real haos! A Madonna’s album sells only 750,000 units but the next her alpum sells millions. A Pearl Jam’s studio record sells millions, the other only 450,000 copies.

Anyway, ABB sells well in the rest of the planet. Very well, I can say…