Sorry, but I must say that all this filesharing
is hard to stand, especially

a) sharing OFFICIAL stuff. Buy the official stuff in the stores!
To be a fan means supporting the band by buying their songs (I´m
not talking about T-shirts & golf balls).

b) It´s hard to understand that everyone has an opinion when the band
were better or worse or wrote better or worse songs etc. But if
I look at the bottlegged songs/shows that are shared here - even
the classics are not known to a lot of people here.
Boogie Chillen with John Lee Hooker? Never had it on a disc?
Atlantic City??? 3 LP box??? Some Girls outtakes?
What are we talking about? When you are a fan - you have it!
On a @#$%& disc! Since the Paris Results series! Bought at
a fair or stolen or anything...Run Rudolph Run? It´s official!
Buy it on a vinyl single, it has a great cover, btw!

c) Maybe it´s the times we are in: downloading, not spending
anything when you get it for free. But to me it´s more: sitting
in a stool, putting on records or CDs and listening over the HiFi -
getting a feeling, reading the booklets, looking at the sleeves or
just touching history (esp. the originals!!). All those filesharers
are missing a lot. And: "vinyl or CD files" are hard to erase.

Just a few thoughts. Merry Christmas.

Hey man!

You say: when you are a fan, you have it. Ok. But that means, you have to get it some time. I mean, not everyone was born in the 19. century. Some peopla in their twenties get these stuff now. By the time they will be 60+, these bootlegs will be also as well known to them, as they are to you these days.

Merry Christmas.

with the stones more than ANY other band there is just SO MUCH stuff out there......so something comes out and it is the new thing for about 3 days and then something else comes out and everyone forgets about one the old "new" thing and they all go for the next one.

you can say what you want about atlantic city 89....and not having it on disc....i had a tape of the show for years.....lost the tape at some point....and by the time i started searching for the show on cd i simply could not find it anywhere.

i personally enjoy sharing stuff that i think many people on the board may not have....and that by hearing it their appreciation of the stones greatness is increased and they become bigger fans.

i agree with you about sharing material that has been officially released...that is REALLY wrong and in bad taste.

but just because there are lots of people out there that don't have EVERYTHING ever put out on a boot that does not make them less of a stones fan. when i see someone go nuts about material that has been around for years and years i get a kick out of it......it's kinda like seeing a baby take their first steps.....

sure buying the disc or vinyl is nice...does anyone even have a record player anyomre? but that is a SUPER expensive way to get this material. plus i suspect many people downloading the mp3's here are putting them in some kind of collection and burning them onto cd for keeping.

In 1975 a stones concert ticket cost about $25......this year alone i have spent several thousand dollars on stones tickets as have many others on this board. So maybe i don't want to spend another couple of thousand buying unreleased material that the stones don't see a dime off of anyway. and instead of putting more money into the bootleggers pockets i share the files with lots of stones fans here.

i assume that you are a long time stones fan and that you have an amazing bootleg collection. that being the case, i think you owe it to those less fortunate to nurture them and help them to attain your status....rather than put them down.

the tone of your post says...."look at me...i am a big man...and if you don't have everything i have that you are an idiot!!" you may not mean to come off that way but you do.

so stop it and be nice!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-12-26 22:11 by todd40fla.

They key to filesharing is ASSEMBLING GOOD COLLECTIONS...

Examples: The Red Hot Chili Peppers have 30 of the greatest songs ever written, at least 30... BUT they only have perhaps one or 2 albums I'd recommend buying... The other albums contain a few gems and a bunch of filler.

Led Zeppelin has at least 30 great songs, but really only 1 total album (LZ3) and one pretty good album (LZ1) that are worth buying...

Stevie Ray Vaughan is the greatest guitarist who ever lived, you can fill up 2 CDs with brilliant songs (25 or more in all) but he only has one worthwhile album: In Step.

SO, what am I supposed to do... go out and buy all their marginal albums so I can get one or two good tracks off of them ??

Heck no, I'll fileshare...

WHEN THESE ARTISTS DECIDE TO RELEASE COMPLETE ALBUMS, like STICKY FINGERS, WITH GREAT SONGS START TO FINISH, I'll be the first to buy the albums!

"It's just that demon life has got me in it's sway..."

Have to agree with Too Tough here, I mean, aren't we actually ripping off our favorite band. Oh, hey, look, I just got my credit card bill with all the charges from the San Francisco shows. Let see, tickets, parking, booze, T shirts. Plus the Bigger Bang reular and special edition C.D.s...and of couse the "rarities" C.D....You know what, Too Tough? Eat shit and die!

The thing is I would love to get those rarities shared here on real cd's but they have been out of print for years now

Thank you todd40fla you've 100 % right !!!!

Elliott Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > Thank you todd40fla you've 100 % right !!!!

I must agree

hitootough. i fell in love with their music in 2002(at the age of 17!). so for me it's impossible to have all their stuff right now. with the help of some patient and generous fans i managed to get an interesting collection. all these mp3's are just a contribution to a better orientation. whitch is really needed.sure, official releases shouldn't be uploaded here.
btw,can you please recommend me a record store that sells a run rudolph run single?thank you much in advance!

i reckon we all have our own principles with this stuff. at least i hope most people have principles that we've thought about.
it can be real interesting to hear what other people's principles are - sometimes they give us something worth thinking about.
my own principles are not to take/spread stuff that's available officially; of course i buy what's released/rereleased, even if i already own an unofficial version.
with stuff that was never released officially, i don't see any virtue in paying someone for it who doesn't have any right to it in the first place.
stuff that's gone out of print is a little iffier, i agree. in the end i feel the same way about it as the unreleased stuff - but i'll think about it some more.
thanks for speaking up, Too Tough; meanwhile, i try to bear in mind that my principles don't obligate anyone but me.


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-12-27 00:25 by with sssoul.

I have to laugh, when I think of all the Stones records I bought in my life, and yes I still have a record player. I think its cool to share rare songs and live shows but they will never match the official releases in my opinion, for me there is not one bootleg which can compare with Sticky Fingers or Some Girls cranked loud, or even Main Offender!. I think the process only provides more sales for the band and not less, and I read some statistics which support this.
Having siad that I really dig "We dont wanna go home" its dumb like a Ramones song but cool rock n roll.

to be totally honest, even if i could buy the stuff, i probably wouldn't. why? because i am a university student and just get by week to week, buying expensive stones rarities is not something i have the cash for. even though i wish my priorities went air, food, stones, water, clothing etc.

to me the files help renew how much i love the band, getting to hear their rough spots and forgotten gems that i wouldn't have found out about otherwise. I also don't 'know' about all of the rare cds, and am slowly learning about them as i collect the mp3s, since i want to find out about their source.

for a new fan of the band, the mp3s are a great way to hear stuff that i wouldn't have known about other wise, and i feel is like the subconscious of being a stones fan. you can like the official albums (anyone can know them with a bit of cash) but this rare stuff is only shared in the community of those who truly care and wish to hear it, whether it is paid for or not.

And I thought you were going to say it gets on your nerves b/c mp3 is a lossy (low-quality) format.

I agree that people need to define their own policy re: file sharing. I respect the moral high ground, but I also suggest keeping in mind that these guys own, like, islands and stuff. While they appear to have produced ABB on a rather small budget. Artistically, that's often a good idea of course, but it just smacks a little odd at this stage in the game.

Meanwhile, there are many great artists who haven't reaped the stones' success and more desperately need your $.

And please excuse me if I've spent a lot of time listening to those artists over the years and haven't yet completed (er, started) my collection of 1989 stones shows!

cc

Jed Clever Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>You know what, Too
> Tough? Eat shit and die!

Are you American?

Merry Christmas to you, too!

Merry Christmas Thomas!
I think it's ok to upload songs that were a B-Side some 20 years ago and that are not available in stores anymore. I think it's not ok to upload for example ABB on mp3 or something.


Belgrade-Bucharest-Budapest-Brno

TooTough Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
When you are a fan -
> you have it!
> On a @#$%& disc!


Ugh, please don't tell me we're all gonna get into that discussion about what makes a "real" fan now, are we?

Anyway, cc, gaigai and todd40fla said it best.

bayou wrote:


>Examples: The Red Hot Chili Peppers have 30 of the greatest songs ever written, at least 30



LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I already told this in other massages.

You should see my shellfs with vinyl records, CD's and other stuff. from some I have 3 versions vinyl, Cd and and SACD so don't tell me what is good or bad.

I download never released songs and live from the 60ties and 70ties as long as they are not planned to released them on a record.
Take the "Rarities 1971 - 2003" what the @#$%& is rare on this record ????

Nico




__________________________

Lighten up Too Tough

I agree that official stuff ought to be bought in stores, but then again everybody should decide this for themselves.

You may have Boogie Chillen but I'm sure that I have some vinyls that you don't even know exsist. Does that make you a better fan than me or VV?

I don't understand what you have against sharing outtakes. After all, most of the fans that collect outtakes have probably spent a great deal of money on the guys and even payed many times for the same tunes already (fist on singles, vinyl lps, re-issues, collector lps and than all over again on cd). I know I have.

Also if you don't like sharing whay are you not bothered paying some cd vendor of whom the stones will never get a penny anyway??????

I Appreciate averybody sharing whatever they want to make available. Keep it up guys.

Promoman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Lighten up Too Tough
>
> You may have Boogie Chillen but I'm sure that I
> have some vinyls that you don't even know exsist.
> Does that make you a better fan than me or VV?
>
> I don't understand what you have against sharing
> outtakes. After all, most of the fans that collect
> outtakes have probably spent a great deal of money
> on the guys and even payed many times for the same
> tunes already (fist on singles, vinyl lps,
> re-issues, collector lps and than all over again
> on cd). I know I have.
>
> Also if you don't like sharing whay are you not
> bothered paying some cd vendor of whom the stones
> will never get a penny anyway??????

> I Appreciate averybody sharing whatever they want
> to make available. Keep it up guys.

Well, promoman and all the others, if you look closely
to what I have written, I´m not against sharing gems,
I just can´t understand that official stuff is shared.
Why share official stuff? Go out and buy it. Period.

And I can´t understand that MOST of the stuff
that is uploaded is available on the 7th or so generation
of cheap bootleg or outtake CDs. Some are in perfect sound
and artwork. And knowing those outtakes is a fundament of most
of the discussions here (Ronnie´s influence in the late 70s
for example). Not knowing them means to speak about unknown things.

But that´s my point of view. My opinion. I´m 37 and maybe old
fashioned or hadcore. But not "better" or "worse" than a newbie.

And I´m not a better fan or such crap because I´m a collector.
I tried to make a "let´s share" thread once, but all of the mp3 users
didn´t want to.

[iorr.org]

Well in that case I got you all wrong. Must be my English (being Dutch and all).

Anyway I don't see much official material being posted.

I've never seen official stuff posted, but if it was, I wouldn't waste my time listening to an MP3 file if the full source audio was available.

However, I'll never be concerned about how much money the Stones make or don't make.

i started collecting the unreleased stuff about 20 years ago and it
was very hard to find anything in the beginning and very expensive too.
i travelled houndreds of miles a year from fair to fair to get a piece
for my collection. i ordered many things by phone or wrote letters on
the normal way.
now, with the www, it's very easy to find anything you want. and, praise,
the lord, there are so many freaks out there who wants to trade their
stuff with everyone.
what i want to say is, that i would have been the luckiest guy if i got
chances like that years ago. and if i would have a faster connection on
my pc i would upload more mp3s to make some people happy.

J.J.Flash Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> bayou wrote:
>
>
> >Examples: The Red Hot Chili Peppers have 30 of
> the greatest songs ever written, at least 30
>
> LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Since you're laffin' your uninformed ass off, I'll post a thread especially for people who WANT to assemble great songbooks....for those of you who want to download an unbelieveably great assembly of RHCP songs, here you go


[iorr.org]

The songs listed on that thread:

THE EARLY YEARS:

True Men Don't Kill Coyotes
Grand Pappy Du Plenty
Jungle Man
Freaky Styley
Backwoods
Organic Anti-Beat Box Band
Higher Ground
Knock Me Down
Taste the Pain
Pretty Little Ditty
Johnny Kick a Hole in the Sky
Power of Equality
Breaking the Girl
I Could Have Lied
Give it Away
Under the Bridge
Naked in the Rain

THE MIDDLE YEARS:

Deep Kick
Coffee Shop
Walkabout
Shallow Be thy Game
Show Me Your Soul
Transcending
Around the World
Parallel Universe
Scar Tissue
Californication
Easily
This Velvet Glove
Savior
Road Trippin'
Soul to Squeeze

RECENT YEARS:

By the Way
This is the Place
Don't Forget Me
Can't Stop
Zephyr Song
Midnight
Throw Away Your Television
On Mercury
Minor Thing
Warm Tape
Venice Queen



"It's just that demon life has got me in it's sway..."

I have spent almost $3,000 on This tour alone and have seen the Stones over 40 times since 75. The way I figure it, as a real Fan I have supported this band plenty.

So If there is a song to be shared that I have or want Then I have no Qualms about it what so ever.

Elitist & rich man´s bs. Sorry TT.

I would have thought that you would be pleased that these cuts would be going to new homes so to speak. I would have never found some of this stuff if it hadn't been for the sharing going on ... And I do go out and buy Stones Products all the time...every disc , any ticket to a show I can get to and t shirts and so on.Sometimes i just don't have the time to be an Indiana Jones of the Rolling Stones relics because I'm working alot. That's the way it is and i'm no less a fan because I can't get out and hunt these tunes down. I am very grateful to all that post these tunes and to BV who runs this site . So don't let the sharing bother you too much. Just think of all the RARE Stones tunes being discovered by us fellow Stones fans and how cool that is! Don't be Too Tough on us!

I see a really crucial point that TT brought up in his initial post that no one is really answering to. It's not so much about the sharing itself; I see him posing the Q that we are supposedly discussing on a higher level here. In ther words a certain base knowledge and experience is required and assumed. So when one sees so many "fans" asking to hear for the first time a track that is considered basic listening it makes one wonder. I myself went through that same process. It seemed to me that very often on this board the Stones story begins around Banquet. Made me wonder if anyone had listened to "Who's been sleeping here" as much as "Blinded by Rainbows". In the endless discussions about Ronnie's playing today I find it vital that one also considers Ronnie's playing from "Bad'n Ruin" etc. But often when certain "basic" cuts were mentioned there are so many Q for an MP3 with the mention of "I've never heard this one".
This I have noticed and maybe that was also part of TT's original point.

But you have to understand that outside of being able to get the official releases, some of us don't have (or didn't have up till now) the sources to hear some of this stuff. Believe it or not there is not a lot of bootleg disc stores in the capital district of New York as you might think. Sure if I take the trip to the city I would be more successful but I don't have the time for the opportunities to look . Beside FINALLY getting some of the rare stuff that I have never heard, I am also getting variations of well known cuts which are really cool too. And beside I have become more knowledgeable thanks to this site and it's contributors.Thats why IORR is such a cool site...Cheers!

Lets share even more mp3 pleeease!