About the unreleased live album 1972. I know it has been talked about here before. Just wonder, anyone ever seen a copy of it anywhere? I mean, the album was stopped by Allen Klein just weeks before it should hit the record shops.

This means there must be lots of albums somewhere? People in the factorys, or office should have acces to some copies. Surely Mick had one copy. Wasn't it that he played in the video compilation "Running out of luck"? Live versions of brown sugar and Jumping Jack, sounded live 1972.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2023-08-26 20:03 by bv.

As far as I know there was the master which was leaked to radio and there was a mock-up of the cover art, but nothing manufactured. The drama of stopping it just before it shipped is likely just a good story.

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Rocky Dijon
As far as I know there was the master which was leaked to radio and there was a mock-up of the cover art, but nothing manufactured. The drama of stopping it just before it shipped is likely just a good story.

Which recording is the "master that was leaked to radio"?

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Kuntaman
Surely Mick had one copy. Wasn't it that he played in the video compilation "Running out of luck"? Live versions of brown sugar and Jumping Jack, sounded live 1972.

No, that's from Love You Live.

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TornAndFried
Which recording is the "master that was leaked to radio"?

VGP-243 Keep Your Motor Runnin' [iorr.org]

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TornAndFried
Which recording is the "master that was leaked to radio"?

Courtesy of Nico Zentgraf:

720811A 11th August: THE ROLLING STONES. US radio (WMMS)/(Radio Cleveland).
Broadcast of the unreleased 1972 tour live-album.
- You Can't Always Get What You Want (MJ/KR) - Houston 25.06.72, 1st show
- Sweet Virginia (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 21.07.72, 1st show
- Bitch (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- All Down The Line (MJ/KR) -Houston 25.06.72, 1st show
- Happy (MJ/KR) -Fort Worth 24.06.72, 1st show
- Tumbling Dice (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- Rip This Joint (MJ/KR) -Fort Worth 24.06.72, 1st show
- Gimme Shelter (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- Brown Sugar (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- Uptight/Satisfaction (Sylvia Moy/Henry Cosby/Stevie Wonder)(MJ/KR)
-unidentified source, July 1972

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Rocky Dijon

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TornAndFried
Which recording is the "master that was leaked to radio"?

Courtesy of Nico Zentgraf:

720811A 11th August: THE ROLLING STONES. US radio (WMMS)/(Radio Cleveland).
Broadcast of the unreleased 1972 tour live-album.
- You Can't Always Get What You Want (MJ/KR) - Houston 25.06.72, 1st show
- Sweet Virginia (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 21.07.72, 1st show
- Bitch (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- All Down The Line (MJ/KR) -Houston 25.06.72, 1st show
- Happy (MJ/KR) -Fort Worth 24.06.72, 1st show
- Tumbling Dice (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- Rip This Joint (MJ/KR) -Fort Worth 24.06.72, 1st show
- Gimme Shelter (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- Brown Sugar (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- Uptight/Satisfaction (Sylvia Moy/Henry Cosby/Stevie Wonder)(MJ/KR)
-unidentified source, July 1972

I had a boot called Unreleased Decca Live Album that had that running list. At one point Mick mentions corn flakes and the breakfast show which I imagine is from a late morning show in Philly. Who knows if that really was the planned album? I've read that like Ya-Yss the '72 was suppposed to be a double album with one side for Wonder songs but publishing rights issues of his earlier songs killed that idea.

I recall reading somewhere that Love You Live was going to be a mix of the '73 and '75 tours, but in the end, Mick decided it was better to just move on past the Taylor years.

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ThePaleRider
I recall reading somewhere that Love You Live was going to be a mix of the '73 and '75 tours, but in the end, Mick decided it was better to just move on past the Taylor years.

What could have been! Listened to Love you Live this week actually. Still don't like the mix. Just never clicked for me (other than side 3).

I would so love to have this officially released as intended, Stones one disc, Stevie one disc, with that torn concert poster artwork.

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big4

I had a boot called Unreleased Decca Live Album that had that running list. Who knows if that really was the planned album?

A standard bootlegged soundboard of a 1972 show wouldn't lead off with YCAGWYW and deliberately omit songs that were on YA-YA'S. Whether it was the final version of the album before it was scrapped, I couldn't say definitively, but it's a lineup they were planning for their sides of the LP.

As for the publishing rights scrapping the project, it was ABKCO not Motown that was the problem.

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wiredallnight

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TornAndFried
Which recording is the "master that was leaked to radio"?

VGP-243 Keep Your Motor Runnin' [iorr.org]

I haven't played it in a while (somewhere in a pile of CDs), but the track listing was something like:
1. Brown Sugar
2. Bitch
3. Gimme Shelter
4. Happy
5. Tumbling Dice
6. Sweet Virginia
7. You Can't Always Get What You Want
8. All Down the Line
9. Bye Bye Johnny
10. Rip This Joint
11. Uptight / (I Can't Get No) Satisfaction

and left out other tracks that had previously appeared on Ya Yas like Jack Flash, Love In Vain, Street Fighting Man, etc as not to duplicate. Also, from what I remember (someone can certainly tell me if I 'm inaccurate), I think there were overdubs on some of these tracks which leads me to believe that this may have been intended for commercial release.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023-08-26 21:02 by Sighunt.

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Sighunt

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wiredallnight

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TornAndFried
Which recording is the "master that was leaked to radio"?

VGP-243 Keep Your Motor Runnin' [iorr.org]

I haven't played it in a while (somewhere in a pile of CDs), but the track listing was something like:
1. Brown Sugar
2. Bitch
3. Gimme Shelter
4. Happy
5. Tumbling Dice
6. Sweet Virginia
7. You Can't Always Get What You Want
8. All Down the Line
9. Bye Bye Johnny
10. Rip This Joint
11. Uptight / (I Can't Get No) Satisfaction

and left out other tracks that had previously appeared on Ya Yas like Jack Flash, Love In Vain, Street Fighting Man, etc as not to duplicate. Also, from what I remember (someone can certainly tell me if I 'm inaccurate), I think there were overdubs on some of these tracks which leads me to believe that this may have been intended for commercial release.

Overdubs - correct

They did overdubs for the L&G movie, and they did overdubs for a possible LP release. Jagger wanted to have two sides, one with the Stones and one with Stevie Wonder, which Klein did not want and he vetoed the release. Same issue with 1973 tour: they wanted to release a mix of Wembley and Brussels, but couldn't reach an agreement with Klein. So the finished mixes went to KBFH for broadcast. For Love You Live there was less Klein owned material so an agreement could be met. The release was stalled due to Billy Preston demanding more money. Exit Preston.

Mathijs

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timmyj3

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ThePaleRider
I recall reading somewhere that Love You Live was going to be a mix of the '73 and '75 tours, but in the end, Mick decided it was better to just move on past the Taylor years.

What could have been! Listened to Love you Live this week actually. Still don't like the mix. Just never clicked for me (other than side 3).

I LOVE the LYL mix. So rough and ready and rock and roll. Mick’s voice COULD be a bit lower in it, but it’s still great. Side 4 is ENORMOUS. Side 3 on the other hand…great performances, but just don’t BELONG on this record and sound “weedy” by comparison to the other 3 sides. The songs on side 3 sound so out of place, as they obviously were, and thank goodness that was properly and belatedly rectified by the Mocambo official release.

Rod

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bitusa2012

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timmyj3

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ThePaleRider
I recall reading somewhere that Love You Live was going to be a mix of the '73 and '75 tours, but in the end, Mick decided it was better to just move on past the Taylor years.

What could have been! Listened to Love you Live this week actually. Still don't like the mix. Just never clicked for me (other than side 3).

I LOVE the LYL mix. So rough and ready and rock and roll. Mick’s voice COULD be a bit lower in it, but it’s still great. Side 4 is ENORMOUS. Side 3 on the other hand…great performances, but just don’t BELONG on this record and sound “weedy” by comparison to the other 3 sides. The songs on side 3 sound so out of place, as they obviously were, and thank goodness that was properly and belatedly rectified by the Mocambo official release.

LYL seems to be loved or disliked among Stones fans. I was just getting into album rock as a young teenager as the 75 Tour was happening. I remember getting boots of NY and LA 1975 tour by mail from the bootleg company I fund in the back of Rolling Stone or some sort of music magazine. I loved the muddy lurching sound of the tour. Especially the funky Its Only Rock and Roll. Then came the 76 tour boots and still loving the sound. By the time LYL came out it seemed to my young ears as if the recording had sucked out the mood and feel out of it. Very polished (which was the standard of the late 70's). Gimme L.A. Friday and the two LP NY boot anyday.

I am not knocking LYL by any means, it is just my ears and head never really bought into it. It seemed like two completely different tours and band comparing LYL to the boots. There were some pretty decent quality boots of the 76 and 75 tours.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023-08-28 15:46 by timmyj3.

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Mathijs
They did overdubs for the L&G movie, and they did overdubs for a possible LP release. Jagger wanted to have two sides, one with the Stones and one with Stevie Wonder, which Klein did not want and he vetoed the release. Same issue with 1973 tour: they wanted to release a mix of Wembley and Brussels, but couldn't reach an agreement with Klein. So the finished mixes went to KBFH for broadcast. For Love You Live there was less Klein owned material so an agreement could be met. The release was stalled due to Billy Preston demanding more money. Exit Preston.

Mathijs

Several years ago I read some fascinating article/biography about Allen Klein. With regards to the Stones, with their contract with Decca ending, the group wanted to part company with Klein, start their own label, etc. In the early 70's, the Stones filed various lawsuits against Klein for false and/or fraudulent representation. Just before the 72 tour, a settlement was reached (which as Stones fans subsequently learned) allowed Klein and Abkco keeping the rights to past Stones recordings and the administration of their 1960's publishing. what I remember reading at the time (as part of the settlement) was that the Stones were reportedly prohibited from releasing a live album containing sixties material until 1977. Henseforth Love You Live.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023-08-28 16:21 by Sighunt.

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Sighunt

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Mathijs
They did overdubs for the L&G movie, and they did overdubs for a possible LP release. Jagger wanted to have two sides, one with the Stones and one with Stevie Wonder, which Klein did not want and he vetoed the release. Same issue with 1973 tour: they wanted to release a mix of Wembley and Brussels, but couldn't reach an agreement with Klein. So the finished mixes went to KBFH for broadcast. For Love You Live there was less Klein owned material so an agreement could be met. The release was stalled due to Billy Preston demanding more money. Exit Preston.

Mathijs

Several years ago I read some fascinating article/biography about Allen Klein. With regards to the Stones, with their contract with Decca ending, the group wanted to part company with Klein, start their own label, etc. In the early 70's, the Stones filed various lawsuits against Klein for false and/or fraudulent representation. Just before the 72 tour, a settlement was reached (which as Stones fans subsequently learned) allowed Klein and Abkco keeping the rights to past Stones recordings and the administration of their 1960's publishing. what I remember reading at the time (as part of the settlement) was that the Stones were reportedly prohibited from releasing a live album containing sixties material until 1977. Henseforth Love You Live.

The problem, at least as I recall it, was the so-called "re-recording clause" in their original contract and/or settlement with ABKCO that prevented them from releasing any re-recordings, regardless whether studio or live, of material that was controlled by ABKCO for a period of 5 years after termination of their former contract. Thus, a live "re-recording" of, let's say "JJF" from 1972 or 1973 could not be released in the period between 1971-1975. At least not without the permission of ABKCO, that is. And, of course: permission = money...

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Mathijs
They did overdubs for the L&G movie, and they did overdubs for a possible LP release. Jagger wanted to have two sides, one with the Stones and one with Stevie Wonder, which Klein did not want and he vetoed the release. Same issue with 1973 tour: they wanted to release a mix of Wembley and Brussels, but couldn't reach an agreement with Klein. So the finished mixes went to KBFH for broadcast. For Love You Live there was less Klein owned material so an agreement could be met. The release was stalled due to Billy Preston demanding more money. Exit Preston.

Mathijs

Interesting
You mean Preston was ousted for money issue? I thought it was musical issue... I remember a Keith interview... Keith said that Preston wanting his personal sound engineer during the shows was over the top...

BTW... Flip the Switch was a great band, Mathijs

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bitusa2012

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timmyj3

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ThePaleRider
I recall reading somewhere that Love You Live was going to be a mix of the '73 and '75 tours, but in the end, Mick decided it was better to just move on past the Taylor years.

What could have been! Listened to Love you Live this week actually. Still don't like the mix. Just never clicked for me (other than side 3).

I LOVE the LYL mix. So rough and ready and rock and roll. Mick’s voice COULD be a bit lower in it, but it’s still great. Side 4 is ENORMOUS. Side 3 on the other hand…great performances, but just don’t BELONG on this record and sound “weedy” by comparison to the other 3 sides. The songs on side 3 sound so out of place, as they obviously were, and thank goodness that was properly and belatedly rectified by the Mocambo official release.

I thought side 3 of LYL should have side 4 if El Mocambo was included. I also thought LYL would be a stronger album if it was a single album but I’m glad to have all of the tracks!

I remember reading/hearing Preston would kind of take over a song the Stones were working on and kind of turn it into a Billy Preston song, like Melody, I guess.

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big4

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Rocky Dijon

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TornAndFried
Which recording is the "master that was leaked to radio"?

Courtesy of Nico Zentgraf:

720811A 11th August: THE ROLLING STONES. US radio (WMMS)/(Radio Cleveland).
Broadcast of the unreleased 1972 tour live-album.
- You Can't Always Get What You Want (MJ/KR) - Houston 25.06.72, 1st show
- Sweet Virginia (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 21.07.72, 1st show
- Bitch (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- All Down The Line (MJ/KR) -Houston 25.06.72, 1st show
- Happy (MJ/KR) -Fort Worth 24.06.72, 1st show
- Tumbling Dice (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- Rip This Joint (MJ/KR) -Fort Worth 24.06.72, 1st show
- Gimme Shelter (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- Brown Sugar (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- Uptight/Satisfaction (Sylvia Moy/Henry Cosby/Stevie Wonder)(MJ/KR)
-unidentified source, July 1972

I had a boot called Unreleased Decca Live Album that had that running list. At one point Mick mentions corn flakes and the breakfast show which I imagine is from a late morning show in Philly. Who knows if that really was the planned album? I've read that like Ya-Yss the '72 was suppposed to be a double album with one side for Wonder songs but publishing rights issues of his earlier songs killed that idea.

Mid-October 1972: Mick Jagger, Charlie Watts and Bill Wyman spend time in London, performing
overdubs on recordings of the 1972 North American Tour, for a never-released live album.


Keith Richards (1973): A live 1972 album nixed
Another reason for us not doing old songs (onstage) is that Decca have stopped us from releasing new live versions of material recorded on their label. A whole live album with Stevie Wonder on it recorded on the American tour has been scrapped because they've ballsed that up. They've got those songs for six years or something. I mean, if we're recording a live show with old numbers on it, we just can't put the motherfvcker out in the first place because recordings of those songs belong to them until 1976 or whatever.

[timeisonourside.com]

I remember one that started with "All Down The Line" which was weird.

Get Your Motor Running has the overdubs and I think was the planned album I believe. What's strange is "You Can't Always..." is mono. I don't understand that.

Anybody got any ideas on that?

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exilestones
I remember reading/hearing Preston would kind of take over a song the Stones were working on and kind of turn it into a Billy Preston song, like Melody, I guess.

Whoever told you that has got it 100% the wrong way round.

Melody started off the other way round. From Bill and picked up and owned by The Glimmer Twins.

--
Captain Corella
60 Years a Fan

<I had a boot called Unreleased Decca Live Album that had that running list>

My copy has this running list:





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023-08-29 10:01 by DandelionPowderman.

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GasLightStreet

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big4

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Rocky Dijon

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TornAndFried
Which recording is the "master that was leaked to radio"?

Courtesy of Nico Zentgraf:

720811A 11th August: THE ROLLING STONES. US radio (WMMS)/(Radio Cleveland).
Broadcast of the unreleased 1972 tour live-album.
- You Can't Always Get What You Want (MJ/KR) - Houston 25.06.72, 1st show
- Sweet Virginia (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 21.07.72, 1st show
- Bitch (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- All Down The Line (MJ/KR) -Houston 25.06.72, 1st show
- Happy (MJ/KR) -Fort Worth 24.06.72, 1st show
- Tumbling Dice (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- Rip This Joint (MJ/KR) -Fort Worth 24.06.72, 1st show
- Gimme Shelter (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- Brown Sugar (MJ/KR) -Philadelphia 20.07.72
- Uptight/Satisfaction (Sylvia Moy/Henry Cosby/Stevie Wonder)(MJ/KR)
-unidentified source, July 1972

I had a boot called Unreleased Decca Live Album that had that running list. At one point Mick mentions corn flakes and the breakfast show which I imagine is from a late morning show in Philly. Who knows if that really was the planned album? I've read that like Ya-Yss the '72 was suppposed to be a double album with one side for Wonder songs but publishing rights issues of his earlier songs killed that idea.

Mid-October 1972: Mick Jagger, Charlie Watts and Bill Wyman spend time in London, performing
overdubs on recordings of the 1972 North American Tour, for a never-released live album.


Keith Richards (1973): A live 1972 album nixed
Another reason for us not doing old songs (onstage) is that Decca have stopped us from releasing new live versions of material recorded on their label. A whole live album with Stevie Wonder on it recorded on the American tour has been scrapped because they've ballsed that up. They've got those songs for six years or something. I mean, if we're recording a live show with old numbers on it, we just can't put the motherfvcker out in the first place because recordings of those songs belong to them until 1976 or whatever.

[timeisonourside.com]

Yeah, as I've said in my above post, it's the contractual re-recording clause. My memory, however, was wrong about the 5 year period as Keith said it was actually 6, but anyway, in 1977 they were free to release Love You Live without any hassles with Klein/ABKCO concerning the pre-1971 songs.

That said, they could have released the fabled 1972 live album or recordings from 1973 in 1977, but obviously preferred a live album with the (then) actual line-up instead of Taylor-era Stones live recordings.

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CaptainCorella

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exilestones
I remember reading/hearing Preston would kind of take over a song the Stones were working on and kind of turn it into a Billy Preston song, like Melody, I guess.

Whoever told you that has got it 100% the wrong way round.

Melody started off the other way round. From Bill and picked up and owned by The Glimmer Twins.

It was Keith. I've also seen that quote where he says that 'brilliant players like Billy Preston' would put their stamp on a song and 'you end up with a compromised track'.Can't be sure he meant Melody. However, I find Mick and Keith's reluctance to give song writing credit where it is due one of their less appealing characteristics. If they have, as is rumoured, given Andrew Watt a song writing credit on the new album I suppose that reflects the fact that albums sell in smaller quantities these days and so they aren't losing so much my sharing the royalties.

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bakersfield

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CaptainCorella

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exilestones
I remember reading/hearing Preston would kind of take over a song the Stones were working on and kind of turn it into a Billy Preston song, like Melody, I guess.

Whoever told you that has got it 100% the wrong way round.

Melody started off the other way round. From Bill and picked up and owned by The Glimmer Twins.

It was Keith. I've also seen that quote where he says that 'brilliant players like Billy Preston' would put their stamp on a song and 'you end up with a compromised track'.Can't be sure he meant Melody. However, I find Mick and Keith's reluctance to give song writing credit where it is due one of their less appealing characteristics. If they have, as is rumoured, given Andrew Watt a song writing credit on the new album I suppose that reflects the fact that albums sell in smaller quantities these days and so they aren't losing so much my sharing the royalties.

I'm pretty sure he meant in general, and that he wanted to get the band's sound back together.

Regarding Andrew Watt, in the music business today (at least for the last 15 years) it's normal that the producer gets song writing credits if he/she (for instance) suggests or shows a bridge that he thinks suits the song. It could be less, too. Look at today's credits: many names behind most of the songs.

In the old days, this was merely the producer's job, developing the songs and putting them into shape if they lacked something.

I suspect something like this happened here.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2023-08-29 13:38 by DandelionPowderman.

Are there any legal issues that would prevent the 1972 live album being released today?

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Father Ted
Are there any legal issues that would prevent the 1972 live album being released today?

From 1977 and on they could release new live renditions of ABKCO stuff.