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deardoctor

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liddas

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liddas
I always had a bad relationship with vocals in general. It’s a sort of mental block. I have some general knowledge of music, but don’t understand singing, not even the basics. I can normally say if an instrument is out of tune, playing the wrong note or has a bad timing, but vocals are Arab to me!. If I had to sing lead to save my life, I would be dead!

All this to say, can one be so kind to explain where the auto tune part starts, and how do you recognize it?

Thank you!

C

Start with the bridge, particularly toward the end. Then check out when Mick sings the word "lose" on a different place in the song.

I’m embarrassed for my dumbness, but what should I hear?

C

1:48... 'So much time to lose', 'creep in my bed', sounds like he's singing in a bubble.

CORRECTION: it's not autotune.

It's a vocoder.

I wondered, because I never heard an autotune here.
The vocoder is a very different thing

I knew better, yet could only think of autotune. Indeed, completely different. So all the autotune whiners can shut up now.

Either way, they're both gimmicks that artificially alter vocals.

So is a phase pedal, wah-wah pedal, reverb... it's different. Apparently you don't like different. Or new. Whatever it is, you ain't getting it.

Is it too trendy? Behind the trend? They're really good at being behind trends. The vocoder has been around for a long time. Longer than the Stones.

It's texture. It works great in this tune.

Come on, no need to be snotty about it ...I'm not talking about guitar effects, but cheesy gimmicky vocal effects and that's just my opinion.
The only example I can think of someone using a vocoder in rock music was Neil Young on his Trans album early '80s' and it was pretty bad.
For the most part I'm not a fan of gimmicky artificial sounds on vocals whether it's autotune or vocoder, or helium, or whatever.
You're right though - I "ain't getting it", but that doesn't take away from my enjoyment of the song though - it's the best they've released in years!

Oh yeah...Mister Roboto by Styx...that might be a vocoder also...whatever it was, horrible

Wasn't being snotty, it was more of a statement, a confirmation, that you don't like it/get it (ain't getting it as in you ain't goin' there), and then just me pointing out other treatments that take away from the pure sound of something that create... texture. It's subtle, how they used the vocoder with Mick.

I don't think it's gimmicky. T-Pain's use of it is gimmicky, although what he did with The Lonely Island is genius.

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NilsHolgersson
Mick produced the Exile and Some Girls bonus discs, SuperHeavy album, GRRR!, Blue & Lonesome, Gotta Get a Grip/England Lost, a child (Deveraux), Living in a Ghost Town, lots of Stones tours, a James Brown biopic, a series called Vinyl, The Burnt Orange Heresy, etc etc, I would say he's still very active in his late 70s

I'm sticking specifically to worthwhile original songwriting production on a level that's acceptable and expected from Mick and Keith.
If you want to break it down use the 14 brilliant tracks on Crosseyed Heart against a smattering of pointless efforts. KEITH'S MORE PRODUCTIVE.
Keither has also collaborated with many musicians over the past 20 years, too many to list.

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Four Stone Walls
The 12" of Mixed Emotions - was that a remix?

Much better than the original (which was fine by me)

Yes.

They've had several remixes - real remixes; true remixes:

Miss You
Undercover Of The Night
Too Much Blood
Harlem Shuffle
One Hit (To The Body)
Winning Ugly
Mixed Emotions
Rock And A Hard Place
Terrifying
Sexdrive
Saint Of Me
Don't Stop

There have been single remixes - Love Is Strong, Out Of Tears, I Go Wild, Out Of Control, Plundered My Soul, Doom And Gloom.

Then you have "remixes", ie club or dance mixes, the ones with extra beats and sounds that aren't part of the original song (RAAHP, Love Is Strong, You Got Me Rocking, ASMB, Rain Fall Down are enough of the horrible "remixes").

Extremely unlikely a remix of LIAGT will be a true remix - very likely it will be full of noise.

Thanks.

So nearly all real remixes are pre 92.

Good to read all these posts about relative productivity.

I think Mick likes to keep active and so he keeps things going (and anyway his main full time activity is to keep the band touring). But when Keith does produce - well Cross-eyed heart was a cut and class above anything Mick has done since B2B in my opinion. But was knocked out by gotta get a grip - and only heard it once!

Blue and Lonesome - the end as far as I was concerned, despite grey guitars and harp and vocals. These elements don't make a good album.

And now this. Everyone I have sent it to thinks it's a really good song and their best in ages.

I'm m staying in hostel at present and play quite frequently here and every one likes it and is humming it or singing it.

It may not be perfect for all of us, but those are signs that it is a really good song.

(guitars do not carry it ofcourse, which we would like, but even so, it does grow and that organ gives it some real depth and breadth) a

Not sure if this review had been posted yet, but for the most part very positive:

Rolling Stones drop ‘Living in a Ghost Town,’ 1st song in 8 years

Living in a Ghost Town

"...jam-packed with groove, melody and a signature harmonica solo by Jagger.
His vocals seem to have received a small hint of digital auto-tune treatment as well".

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Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Whats the big bitch about ....
Beatles used effects on vocals ..
It's used tastefully on Living In A Ghost Town .....







ROCKMAN

I think I posted that cool video in the "listening' thread not too long ago...

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

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powerage78
Good song, Mick writting work with a recognizable and brilliant Keith contribution.

Mick always prolific and active...
But Keith today ? Is he still able - does he still want - to compose a Stones song ?

It seems that nowadays, Keith needs some strong support from his co-partners to motivate him to create something "new". He said it himself in the Netflix documentary, that Steve Jordan really pushed him to work on writing and producing new material. It seems that Keith when he is home does not care about work. Mick is constantly writing, composing, keeping his creative abilities sharp & productive. Keith needs inspiration and help from his friends. Keith, eventually is great anywhere, anywaway.
Rockandroll,
Mops

"After Keith did his book tour, he actually contemplated retirement. I told him, What are you talking about? That's ridiculous, don't ever bring that up again... I thought (the idea of Keith Richards retiring was) the craziest thing I ever heard. He felt comfortable with where he was and what he had done and what he had achieved. But knowing Keith, to not have him pick up an instrument and play, it was weird. When you're a musician, you don't retire. You play up until you can't breathe.
- Steve Jordan, 2015, on encouraging Keith Richards to make the album
[www.timeisonourside.com]

Is not auto-tune folks. By the way .. people use "Melodyne" now ...not auto-tune!


The vocals had "Melodyne" on them...See here >>>> Ima sure (basically EVERYONE uses it and on every track believe it or not) ... however what you hear in Ghost Town is an effect ...not tuning. Melodyne did not create this effect. Melodyne is almost impossible to detect .... even on trained ears. When you actually hear this type of sound such as the vocals on Ghost Town is an effect of some sort .. not the pitch correction. Also Jaggers vocals are tripled in the song. Two in same key and one deeper key.

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powerage78
Good song, Mick writting work with a recognizable and brilliant Keith contribution.

Mick always prolific and active...
But Keith today ? Is he still able - does he still want - to compose a Stones song ?

It seems that nowadays, Keith needs some strong support from his co-partners to motivate him to create something "new". He said it himself in the Netflix documentary, that Steve Jordan really pushed him to work on writing and producing new material. It seems that Keith when he is home does not care about work. Mick is constantly writing, composing, keeping his creative abilities sharp & productive. Keith needs inspiration and help from his friends. Keith, eventually is great anywhere, anywaway.
Rockandroll,
Mops

"After Keith did his book tour, he actually contemplated retirement. I told him, What are you talking about? That's ridiculous, don't ever bring that up again... I thought (the idea of Keith Richards retiring was) the craziest thing I ever heard. He felt comfortable with where he was and what he had done and what he had achieved. But knowing Keith, to not have him pick up an instrument and play, it was weird. When you're a musician, you don't retire. You play up until you can't breathe.
- Steve Jordan, 2015, on encouraging Keith Richards to make the album
[www.timeisonourside.com]

Patti’s illness.

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There will be an authorised remix version made by a Brazilian DJ named Alok, who've already worked with Mick on his latest single. It will be posted on May 2.

[www.instagram.com]

Hmm, is this good news or bad news?

umm, TERRIBLE news.

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doitywoik
Remixes - There hasn't been a Stones remix yet that gave me the goosebumps so I'm not holding my breath for this one. All remixes I remember always just took something away but didn't add anything new/worthwhile...

Agree, Remixes suck ... 'nuff said.

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powerage78
Good song, Mick writting work with a recognizable and brilliant Keith contribution.

Mick always prolific and active...
But Keith today ? Is he still able - does he still want - to compose a Stones song ?

It seems that nowadays, Keith needs some strong support from his co-partners to motivate him to create something "new". He said it himself in the Netflix documentary, that Steve Jordan really pushed him to work on writing and producing new material. It seems that Keith when he is home does not care about work. Mick is constantly writing, composing, keeping his creative abilities sharp & productive. Keith needs inspiration and help from his friends. Keith, eventually is great anywhere, anywaway.
Rockandroll,
Mops

"After Keith did his book tour, he actually contemplated retirement. I told him, What are you talking about? That's ridiculous, don't ever bring that up again... I thought (the idea of Keith Richards retiring was) the craziest thing I ever heard. He felt comfortable with where he was and what he had done and what he had achieved. But knowing Keith, to not have him pick up an instrument and play, it was weird. When you're a musician, you don't retire. You play up until you can't breathe.
- Steve Jordan, 2015, on encouraging Keith Richards to make the album
[www.timeisonourside.com]

Patti’s illness.

No, it was Mick! Just ask keithsman, he knows "his Stones"...

Sarcasm off, of course you're right.

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Rockman
Whats the big bitch about ....
Beatles used effects on vocals ..
It's used tastefully on Living In A Ghost Town .....

Big deal only for those who want it to be a big deal...

Yeah, Beatles... often double tracking their lead vocals... FOUL PLAY!

What's next? Uuuh, lead guitar on Satisfaction does not sound "natural"... There must be some fuzzbox involved or other dirty tricks...

YEAH wait till the Beatle Girls find
out parts of Strawberry Fields backing track are reversed...



ROCKMAN

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Wondering if Charlie’s drums were quantized?

Also not in love with how the kit sounds overall — especially the lack of pop in his snare. But that seems to be a deliberate choice; rather than a big, roomy sound, they wanted a quieter, more chamber-like drum track.

Really digging Mick’s phrasing and melody. That E note he hits when he sings “life was so beautiful” really cuts through..

The song grows more and more to me.
But seriously: it's not Charlie but a programmed drum machine isn't it?

Not absolutely 100% positive, but I just assumed it is Charlie, though I'm not a technical expert or a drummer. My money is on it being Charlie.
However, after reading about how great Darryl's playing is (a simple bass line really) how can we be sure it's actually Darryl playing? It could be Don Was for all we know, unless someone knows for sure otherwise?
And before any overzealous defender here freaks out at the thought of someone questioning the integrity of the recording, I'm not dissing the band or any members - just being genuinely curious.

It's definitely Charlie but quantized and edited. Normally Charlie would be doing a lot more fills transitioning from the verses to chorus to bridges etc but sounds like Mick and Clifford edited all those out to get a clean, uncluttered track. Who knows, maybe Steven Jordan was called in to fill in those gaps where they cut things out...?

So poor Charlie's drumming has been quantized...I guess that's another way of saying his drumming parts have been sterilized or neutered (?)...kind of sad in a way editing out all of his signature fills.

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Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

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I can't stand the phrase "sprinkle some fairy dust" and if memory serves, that is just because of this site here

That's incorrect, these are the very words Keith used to describe his work on "Let Me Down Slow", read up !

Just because he said it once we don't need to make it the standard expression for what he does in the studio. It sounds like the most campy thing one could do

....nah ..nah ... keith fairydust
comment was made towards Don't Stop .....



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Rockman
....nah ..nah ... keith fairydust
comment was made towards Don't Stop .....

haha there you have it. he said it to politely diss the song

Fairy dust might mean ... adding the guitars (magic) .....



ROCKMAN

No doubt about Keith work, adding great guitars.
I am just not sure he can plenty compose a song today.

***
I'm just a Bad Boy Boogie

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powerage78
No doubt about Keith work, adding great guitars.
I am just not sure he can plenty compose a song today.

And if the credits read Keith Richards only, you would still doubt it, right?

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powerage78
No doubt about Keith work, adding great guitars.
I am just not sure he can plenty compose a song today.

And if the credits read Keith Richards only, you would still doubt it, right?

What's that supposed to mean. They do not and if they did we'd listen to How Can I Stop

It's time for THE RETURN OF NANKER .......






ROCKMAN

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powerage78
No doubt about Keith work, adding great guitars.
I am just not sure he can plenty compose a song today.

And if the credits read Keith Richards only, you would still doubt it, right?

What's that supposed to mean. They do not and if they did we'd listen to How Can I Stop

It means that with his prejudice he wouldn't believe it if it were like that, even if Keith wrote something by himself - like he did with Suspicious, Robbed Blind and a couple of others on Crosseyed Heart.

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powerage78
No doubt about Keith work, adding great guitars.
I am just not sure he can plenty compose a song today.

And if the credits read Keith Richards only, you would still doubt it, right?

What's that supposed to mean. They do not and if they did we'd listen to How Can I Stop

It means that with his prejudice he wouldn't believe it if it were like that, even if Keith wrote something by himself - like he did with Suspicious, Robbed Blind and a couple of others on Crosseyed Heart.

That feels like a slippery slope to me. Could he, would he, should he and how would that even sound. I would say in the case at hand it's pretty obvious that he didn't

LIAGT is still number one in Germany on the iTunes charts but on #17 on the official GfK midweek charts. I find this a bit strange because the #1 on the midweek charts was also released last week, was behind the Stones on the iTunes charts all the time (Right now it is #14) and has the same amount of clicks on YouTube. So it must be all about Spotify streams?!?!?

iTunes charts: [www.mix1.de]
midweek charts: [www.mtv.de]

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powerage78
No doubt about Keith work, adding great guitars.
I am just not sure he can plenty compose a song today.

And if the credits read Keith Richards only, you would still doubt it, right?

What's that supposed to mean. They do not and if they did we'd listen to How Can I Stop

It means that with his prejudice he wouldn't believe it if it were like that, even if Keith wrote something by himself - like he did with Suspicious, Robbed Blind and a couple of others on Crosseyed Heart.

That feels like a slippery slope to me. Could he, would he, should he and how would that even sound. I would say in the case at hand it's pretty obvious that he didn't

Not sure if I get what you're saying, but I'm sure there'll be a Keith-song on the new album that will answer the question, like so many times before. Why not?

You're just being difficult

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powerage78
No doubt about Keith work, adding great guitars.
I am just not sure he can plenty compose a song today.

And if the credits read Keith Richards only, you would still doubt it, right?

What's that supposed to mean. They do not and if they did we'd listen to How Can I Stop

It means that with his prejudice he wouldn't believe it if it were like that, even if Keith wrote something by himself - like he did with Suspicious, Robbed Blind and a couple of others on Crosseyed Heart.

That feels like a slippery slope to me. Could he, would he, should he and how would that even sound. I would say in the case at hand it's pretty obvious that he didn't

Not sure if I get what you're saying, but I'm sure there'll be a Keith-song on the new album that will answer the question, like so many times before. Why not?

You're just being difficult

Okay I have to hand that one to you =) I for one am sure he could write songs but not so sure if that would be the stuff we'd like to hear. But with the Stones I have learned better than to speculate. At this time, we're clearly looking at a song written by Mick but Keith made it clear that he absolutely feels it and that's all I need to be reasonably happy

No I won't DP.
Just a question.

I just think that Mick is a hyperactive man composing, playing and rehearsing.

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powerage78
No doubt about Keith work, adding great guitars.
I am just not sure he can plenty compose a song today.

And if the credits read Keith Richards only, you would still doubt it, right?

***
I'm just a Bad Boy Boogie

It's #3 on the Billboard Rock Digital Song Sales chart





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-04-29 13:05 by NilsHolgersson.

A pal in the UK writes to me...

"The new Stones song is Radio 2's "Record of the Week" this week and as such is enjoying airplay throughout the day"

--
Captain Corella
59+ Years a Fan