bv Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think a lot inded but I don't try to think too
> much why sugar is sweet and why I can't drink sea
> water. Sort of things you know quite easily. Or
> why I like a sunrise or why I like hot weather.
> Basic things in life don't need to be analyzed. If
> you analyze the show how can you enjoy it? I have
> a meal but I don't analyze it. I drink a beer but
> I don't analyze it. I meet a friend and we talk
> but I don't analyze what we talked about. I saw
> Bill Wyman this week and I enjoyed it but I don't
> analyze it.
>
> By the way analysis is my profession. I do it all
> day. Actually I have a M.sc. on it. But some
> things in life don't need endless analysis. Like
> the sun, the moon and the Stones.
>
> PS. Ever heard about Erastmus Montanus? I think
> that is H. C. Andersen or something famous
> Danish/Norwegian writer who made a fool of
> philosophs and people who think they are so smart.
> Mor (Mother) Nille is cold. I.e. Mor Nille is a
> rock. And so on. Don't be fooled by the "experts".
>
>
> Bjornulf



But shouldnt you analyze why you want to see Bill Wyman play live? OK, sorry, just kidding. I dont analyze Stones 70s cause I love that era and the 60s as well but they arer a cultural phenomen as well as a rock band. It's not just rock n roll. It's a lifestyle.

We don't NEED to analyse all of this, but we may want to do so, to take advantage of this communications mean to do it in our own humble, qualified or unqualified (but still PAYING!) way...
bv, if you do this all day long, no wonder you seem allergic to it! But should this be set as a standard for the rest of us?
And I don't see why you seem to equate analysing with "hating" or "not feeling anymore"... I personally tend to try and analyse musical material I still enjoy the #@#% out of... Then if same musician don't do it anymore to me, I just try and analyse again and see why it is so...
A food specialist's job is to analyse the chemical components of food. Does that make this person unable to appreciate good food at home or in a restaurant?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-10-27 16:33 by Odd-beat.

I am a very happy man - getting married in January, but listening to the bootleg recordings that have surfaced from the 2005 Tour - I get sad....

Keith - wake up and get excited/Motivated

Ron - are you alive - play guitar in tune perhaps ...? Keep of the drugs/booze?

Bass player - get out of your comfort-zone and mimic Bill..? Make the Stones sound like the Stones..??

Charlie - be interested/stop yawning...?

Mick - keep rocking on !!!!

Esky

S = satisfaction percent. The ultimate show measurement.

S = 1/4 * A + 1/4 * B + 1/4 * C + 1/4 * D

A = Percent songs you like a lot at the show
B = Percent of the crowd who love it (the show)
C = Percent special songs played
D = Percent of the crowd who are happy with the ticket price

S = 100 means 100% satisfaction and the best show ever.
S = 0 means 0% satisfaction and total crap show.

This formula is developed by me in 5 minutes now just in case you need a way to analyze the Stones in a 100% scientific way. If you like it then I may refine it with 2nd order variables so that we can put more weight into beer prices, rare songs, weather, people who sit down and so on. May be 100 variables with 1st 2nd and 3rd degree weith could give us a measure that could qualify every show in the world in a scientific and global and neutral way. Also with number of guitar errors and of course a factor saying if the piano is loud in the mix and 60% hate piano in the mix it will get a special factor.

But it is really a big waste of time I think. All shows and tours are due to subjective and individual feelings. Can't be compared. Can't be ranked.

Bjornulf

I agree with Bjornulf: the Stones are just not a band with brilliant musicians. They @#$%& up but if you see them live it's just magic. No band comes close

Who said anything about science?
You make it sound dry and calculated, while we're discussing music (and not necessarily musicology).
Analysing and criticizing can be fun!
Or what is this discussion board here for? Merely expressing that this is "great" or that this "sucks"?

We don't need no fancy formulas, here's the deal:

1. Lower the prices of tix

2. Play a greater variety of tunes

3. Get rid of those awful chairs at stadiums




Did I ever tell you I want to know
Hey baby, who's been sleeping here





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-10-27 17:20 by Rank Outsider.

Rank - very true:

..and to go on from that:

1. Give the "fans" a little bit more time on stage...just to make it worth the price of the ticket price!

<<Mathijs, you also turned down ABB after hearing four songs. It's okay to be critical, but wait until you have heard the album, and attended the concerts! I don't like that they re-release ABB with a few additions soon, that's money-grabbing. But, as always, it's hard not to love this band. >>

Right on! I can't see where he comes off labeling Charlie's drumming as just "ok.' I had the good fortune to attend the Albany show, and I must say I've never heard Charlie sound so good. Ronnie wasn't entirely on his game that night, but far from terrible with the exception of one particular solo. What I noticed, on the other hand, is the Stones had crafted a real organic sound that I haven't heard before.

And I don't hold it against Mathijs that he dislikes ABB, but I was one of the first to come out criticizing him many months ago as his opinion was based on 4 songs and a few previews. I too have become disillusioned by the album, but I gave it a few dozen listens before I drew that opinion and started sharing it with the board. That said, I am curious to how much of the concert tapes Mathijs listened too before tearing into the Stones...4 songs maybe?


"You look like a leper dressed as Sergeant Pepper"

Lets just hope someone can shake them up to perform better now starting at the west coast. Show some creativity and some life.

bv Wrote:
> PS. Ever heard about Erastmus Montanus? I think
> that is H. C. Andersen or something famous
> Danish/Norwegian writer who made a fool of
> philosophs and people who think they are so smart.
> Mor (Mother) Nille is cold. I.e. Mor Nille is a
> rock. And so on. Don't be fooled by the "experts".
>
>

I am person who thinks I'm really dumb. Is there an Anti-Montanus who speaks to people like me?

Slick Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Mathijs Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > With all tapes of the new tour I have heard,
> I
> > never, ever had the feeling I missed a great
> show.
> > All I felt was boredom, a feeling that the
> music
> > just didn't touch me anymore. There's no
> groove,
> > it doesn't swing, the guitar work is awfull,
> the
> > set list is boring. There's not a hint of
> the
> > energy, the anxiety, the exciteness of a
> great
> > 70's or '81 show. This band just doesn't
> rock
> > anymore.
>
>
>
> Mathijs Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Now listening to the first Boston show, and
> what
> > do I hear? Loud guitars, hard hitting drums,
> no
> > Chuck, and -most importantly- all songs
> finally
> > played UPTEMPO again! She's So Cold is not
> that
> > far off from the 1981/1982 versions! They
> sound
> > like the Stones again: rough and raunchy!
>
> LOL what a hypocrite
>

This post just simply proves my point: I wrote the Olympia review just after I came out of the venue. It was the first time I saw them in a club shows setting, and I thought it was brilliant. But slowly I got to realize that it wasn't the music that made it brilliant, the music was actually pretty bad. I reallized that seeing the Stones in a club setting was brilliant, all the hoopla around the gig was brilliant, having Keith blasting at you from 5 meters away it is brilliant. The I went to Vredenburg, and since I wasn't as excited at the first time seeing them in a club, I noticed even more that the music actually wasn't good at all. But still, the crowd at Vredenburg was encredible, and just made the show. The I went to the Astoria, and as the English crowd is all very well manored and not really that excited, it just wasn't a good show at all.

My point: if you take all the hoopla away from the live show, the music just isn't anough anymore for me, it just doesn't excite me anymore.

By the way, my review of the first 4 songs of ABB wasn't very positive. Than I wrote a review of the entire album, and there I said this was there best album since Undercover, something I just didn't expect from them anymore. It just really is an excellent album. I must admit that I rarely ever listen to it though. After a month it left my player, and I actually never listened to it again. I think it's time to do so now!

Mathijs

That's your loss. A very big loss too. I pity your opinion, 'cause I think it's sad. And as I said before: A concert is really only meant to be heard once, so you kindda have yourself to blame for not liking them.

When I see or hear The Stones I can't get out of my head how vital they sound. I even thought that with Don't Stop. A very mediocre composition, but they sound so hungry.

It's funny 'cause my older brother is, like you, a trained musician. He says that the worst show on FF is Olympia. OK, fair enough. Trained musicians seem to "not get it" like regular people (Not trained musicians) do. I tell you man: Ask most people on here, and they'll choose Olympia.

JumpingKentFlash

Mathijs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Slick Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Mathijs Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > With all tapes of the new tour I have
> heard,
> > I
> > > never, ever had the feeling I missed a
> great
> > show.
> > > All I felt was boredom, a feeling that
> the
> > music
> > > just didn't touch me anymore. There's
> no
> > groove,
> > > it doesn't swing, the guitar work is
> awfull,
> > the
> > > set list is boring. There's not a hint
> of
> > the
> > > energy, the anxiety, the exciteness of
> a
> > great
> > > 70's or '81 show. This band just
> doesn't
> > rock
> > > anymore.
> >
> >
> >
> > Mathijs Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Now listening to the first Boston show,
> and
> > what
> > > do I hear? Loud guitars, hard hitting
> drums,
> > no
> > > Chuck, and -most importantly- all songs
> > finally
> > > played UPTEMPO again! She's So Cold is
> not
> > that
> > > far off from the 1981/1982 versions!
> They
> > sound
> > > like the Stones again: rough and
> raunchy!
> >
> > LOL what a hypocrite
> >
>
> This post just simply proves my point: I wrote the
> Olympia review just after I came out of the venue.
> It was the first time I saw them in a club shows
> setting, and I thought it was brilliant. But
> slowly I got to realize that it wasn't the music
> that made it brilliant, the music was actually
> pretty bad. I reallized that seeing the Stones in
> a club setting was brilliant, all the hoopla
> around the gig was brilliant, having Keith
> blasting at you from 5 meters away it is
> brilliant. The I went to Vredenburg, and since I
> wasn't as excited at the first time seeing them in
> a club, I noticed even more that the music
> actually wasn't good at all. But still, the crowd
> at Vredenburg was encredible, and just made the
> show. The I went to the Astoria, and as the
> English crowd is all very well manored and not
> really that excited, it just wasn't a good show at
> all.
>
> My point: if you take all the hoopla away from the
> live show, the music just isn't anough anymore for
> me, it just doesn't excite me anymore.


That post just simply proves youre confused LOL




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-10-28 17:18 by Slick.

Time to write your own music and live your own life instead of pretending to be someone else and becoming delusional enough to think you are more talented than they are and in a position to pass judgement. You don't have one percent of Keith's talents even at this stage of the game and should show some respect, accept the realities of life and aging, and focus on the positives rather than negatives in a sad attempt to feel better about yourself. Continue as you are, and you'll only feel worse by repeatedly making a fool of yourself.

Steven Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Time to write your own music and live your own
> life instead of pretending to be someone else and
> becoming delusional enough to think you are more
> talented than they are and in a position to pass
> judgement. You don't have one percent of Keith's
> talents even at this stage of the game and should
> show some respect, accept the realities of life
> and aging, and focus on the positives rather than
> negatives in a sad attempt to feel better about
> yourself. Continue as you are, and you'll only
> feel worse by repeatedly making a fool of
> yourself.

Yes mathijs, listen to steven: no more criticism! be a sheep!

Yes sheep that pay $400 and scream yeah yeah yeah WOW! one more time.

It just might be the worst tour for those who sit on their asses in front of the computer and start assinine posts like this one.

For those of us who fork out a few $$$ or euros and get 2 hours of live Stones, who cares about comparing to the past? Pointless!!!

artur34 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


LMAO!!!!

that's the funniest, truest f-ing post of the year!!!!!!!!1

artur34 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
artur34 speaks truth.

It's no longer funny, it's bigger than money, the Stones don't move you anymore.

If liking the stones and wanting to go to this tour is sheeplike then baaaa and kiss my wolly arse. You know many of the haters on this board are @#$%& robots? admit it some of you are dissing this tour with only hearing one or two tracks not even an entire show, you sheep feed of each other as well. I mean just look at mathjis posts, completley inconsistant! he hears boston and loves it but then he thinks about it a bit and can't bring himself to admit it because of all his previous posts and then all the idiotic Taylorites come running to defend him whilst they are never going to praise anything the band has done since 74. why the @#$%& are you still on these boards, critical fans are good, I HAVE critizised the band before but this automatic dismisal of anything new by them is pathetic! Find a new band bitches!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-10-29 03:23 by Ket.

Thee are no bitches just dissapointed fans, lets see what Calgary can do?

You are obviously going thru a rough patch personally.Relax and enjoy the great classic rock.

Calgary: great city. Lotsa cowboys, lotsa orientals, lotsa good time.

Karl

Slick Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Mathijs Wrote:

> > My point: if you take all the hoopla away
> from the
> > live show, the music just isn't anough
> anymore for
> > me, it just doesn't excite me anymore.
>
>
> That post just simply proves youre confused LOL
>
>
>
>
> Edited 1 times. Last edit at 10/28/05 17:18 by
> Slick.


amen to that...make up your mind Mathijs....you USED to like the Stones or still DO...it's pretty simple.

Lots of sheep around Calgary too - just ask the cowboys. A BIGGER BAAAAAAAAAAH

bv. You are "the king" of this forum, and I really like what you´re doing here!

I don´t allways agree with Mathijs. But I enjoy reading his posts.

Unlike most of the other posts i read here, Mathijs know what he´s talking about. I don´t say that you have to be a musician to express yourself here, but it´s not wrong whith constructive critisism.

I´ll believe that Mahtijs is just a young guy who will "mess around" a little with us older Stones-lovers.

- You are a Stones-lover too Mahtijs, no doubt about it.

But i think, right or wrong, ( i wish my english were better) that you over the years, when your own guitar-playing increases, have lost your humbleness.

Let me introduce myself;

I´m a man, born in the south of Sweden in 1958. Around 1970 (12 years old) I was a Creedence-lover. Then an older friend introduced me to The Stones - Let It Bleed album. Since then i´m a complete Stones-addict.

We formed our first band in 1971 whith myself on the drums. I´m still play the drums, and I still love The Stones.

They are my no:1 choise if I had to choose one band to listening to for the rest of my life. "Get Yer Ya Ya´s" if I had to choose an album.

Over the years i´ve played, and of course listening to, pop, rock, jazz-rock and blues.

I enjoy listening to good musicians. And believe me, I have seen very good drummers from the front rows.
Still...
Charlie Watts is no 1, because of his humbleness, both as an musician as an human being. Ry Cooder´s drummer Jim Keltner and Billy Cobham share the second place.


bv and Mathijs, keep up the good spirit!



Sincerely,


"Ian F Nichols"
also known as "Firesoldier".






"You have the sun, you have the moon, you have the air to breathe, you´ve got The Rolling Stones"