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bv

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GasLightStreet

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bv
LV #1 on the 19th was cancelled due to Laryngitis.
LV #2 on the 22th was the last show with the main crew.
Most of the regular touring crew left on Sunday the 23rd.
Foxboro on the 25th was show a scheduled and contracted show, they could not cancel that.

All shows are scheduled and contracted. They have cancelled shows on recent tours. They could have cancelled the private show if they had needed to.

Are you a lawyer? Assuming they were paid 4 million US dollars for the private Foxboro show, who should pay for that if they cancelled? May be split it equally between Mick, Keith, Ronnie and Charlie? Just one million dollars on each. It is all in the contracts.

Also, would 18,000 people be able to arrive into Las Vegas for a show on Tuesday Oct 25, on a two days notice, if they announced LV #2 on Sunday Oct 23, using the "cancelled" Gillette date for a 2nd rescheduled LV show?

.

Are YOU THEIR lawyer BV? Always sticking up for THEM, never siding it seems for we the paying fans? How about siding with us, for once, those of us in less fortunate positions than you, who can, with no doubt well deserved good fortune, attend every and all shows you wish. Some, indeed, the vast majority of us can't. We scrimp and save to attend a few. Then one gets cxld, yet the band plays a private show a week later to line their pockets at the expense of playing a show for at least some of us who could attend a rescheduled gig. Absolutely no defence I am afraid.

Rod

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bv

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GasLightStreet

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bv
LV #1 on the 19th was cancelled due to Laryngitis.
LV #2 on the 22th was the last show with the main crew.
Most of the regular touring crew left on Sunday the 23rd.
Foxboro on the 25th was show a scheduled and contracted show, they could not cancel that.

All shows are scheduled and contracted. They have cancelled shows on recent tours. They could have cancelled the private show if they had needed to.

Are you a lawyer? Assuming they were paid 4 million US dollars for the private Foxboro show, who should pay for that if they cancelled? May be split it equally between Mick, Keith, Ronnie and Charlie? Just one million dollars on each. It is all in the contracts.

Also, would 18,000 people be able to arrive into Las Vegas for a show on Tuesday Oct 25, on a two days notice, if they announced LV #2 on Sunday Oct 23, using the "cancelled" Gillette date for a 2nd rescheduled LV show?

One might think it's why they have insurance. If they had to cancel a private show they'd have to cancel a private show. There's no way around that. Who pays? What does that matter? They wouldn't've made 4 million $ then - that's up to Mr Kraft or whoever did the deal. AC/DC figured something out with their tour but perhaps that was what one might call luck: Axl called them, things worked out.

The Stones cancelled the Australia run - but rescheduled and made it up. They've cancelled shows in the past and, as far as I can recall, did not make them all up. Logistics, crews, maybe it would cost more to make it up than to have the insurance pay it off.

If you think the private show with X amount of money means they play but someone has the flu or whatever, what makes you think they're really going to play it? It would be cancelled.

For them there is no difference between a private show and a public show. Every show is contracted and must be performed on the date given. Then after the tour the crew go different places. How can you do a Las Vegas show number two when half of the crew already is gone by Sunday the day after the Saturday Oct 22 show? With a different crew that does not know the show?

Sure they should have a back-up date one week later, they used to have that in the old days, but now it is too expensive and the cost level is too high. If an entire tour is cancelled like Austtralia, they go back. If a single show is cancelled then it is normally lost until the next tour in the same area. Or like Valladolid they did not want them back...

Bjornulf

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bv
LV #1 on the 19th was cancelled due to Laryngitis.
LV #2 on the 22th was the last show with the main crew.
Most of the regular touring crew left on Sunday the 23rd.
Foxboro on the 25th was show a scheduled and contracted show, they could not cancel that.
They looked into rescheduling the LV #1 show after the Foxboro date, but bringing in a different crew not knowing the show would be impossible. Also, I can't see how 18,000 people may rearrange travel, work, hotels and come back to Las Vegas for a show on Thursday 27. A tour is about logistics. Las Vegas is not a normal city. Most fans fly in from far away. Most people can not take time off work and book flights on four days notice.

The Rolling Stones owe us nothing. If you feel you have invested your life in the Stones and you expect them to pay back before they retire then sorry it does not work that way. A Rolling Stones show is a product just like an airline ticket or a hotel room. It may be cancelled and then they will refund. Over the years they have cancelled few shows, very, very few cancellations, but when the show is the last one, or close to the end of the tour, like Hanging Rock or LV #1, there is no mercy, they can't do it.

A post rooted in common sense at last!

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bitusa2012

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bv

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GasLightStreet

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bv
LV #1 on the 19th was cancelled due to Laryngitis.
LV #2 on the 22th was the last show with the main crew.
Most of the regular touring crew left on Sunday the 23rd.
Foxboro on the 25th was show a scheduled and contracted show, they could not cancel that.

All shows are scheduled and contracted. They have cancelled shows on recent tours. They could have cancelled the private show if they had needed to.

Are you a lawyer? Assuming they were paid 4 million US dollars for the private Foxboro show, who should pay for that if they cancelled? May be split it equally between Mick, Keith, Ronnie and Charlie? Just one million dollars on each. It is all in the contracts.

Also, would 18,000 people be able to arrive into Las Vegas for a show on Tuesday Oct 25, on a two days notice, if they announced LV #2 on Sunday Oct 23, using the "cancelled" Gillette date for a 2nd rescheduled LV show?

.

Are YOU THEIR lawyer BV? Always sticking up for THEM, never siding it seems for we the paying fans? How about siding with us, for once, those of us in less fortunate positions than you, who can, with no doubt well deserved good fortune, attend every and all shows you wish. Some, indeed, the vast majority of us can't. We scrimp and save to attend a few. Then one gets cxld, yet the band plays a private show a week later to line their pockets at the expense of playing a show for at least some of us who could attend a rescheduled gig. Absolutely no defence I am afraid.

You'll have to build a better argument for me to agree. Let's start with the fact many of the people with tickets to the cancelled show were accommodated at the show on the 22nd. Those that weren't were issued a full refund. Add to this that even if they had offered a rescheduled show many of the original ticket holders would be unlikely to attend anyway on account of having lives to lead.

The caterwauling here always reaches a crescendo when there is a cancellation.
It sucks the show was cancelled -- believe me I know how it feels -- but that is the way it goes sometimes. I would suggest putting the effort into seeing them elsewhere down the line or seeing someone else in the meantime.

If Mick had been too ill to perform on the night of the Foxboro show, then yes, it would have had to be cancelled and no doubt their insurers (or maybe Mr. Kraft's insurers?) would have paid up, as they must have done for the first Las Vegas show. Illness happens and can't be helped. As it was, the band just about managed to fulfil their obligation, with a setlist that spared Mick's voice as far as possible and Keith taking two songs (there isn't usually any Keith set at a private show).

Suppose they had cancelled the Foxboro show in order to "make up" the missing LV one - for a start, Mick's voice would still have been under par, they had no venue lined up, the crew had already gone home and many of the disappointed ticket holders couldn't have got there anyway. And I doubt if that would have been a valid reason for cancellation under their insurance agreement, so they'd have taken a considerable financial loss and no doubt Mr. Kraft would sue.

What - seriously - would you have wanted them to do in the circumstances?

If Jagger couldn't go on, they would have cancelled. One thing you can't hang on them is that they are No Shows...they're pro's and set a very high bar....now how smart to set a mini tour of 4 shows only?.....that's a fair criticism and begs the question was this just a money grab tour...more than likely....

This same type of thing happened in Milano 1998. Funny enough the concert was around half sold out when Mick came up with laryngitis. Okay, some say he broke in the previous concert in Nurnberg. To be honest I don't know. But I can tell you it's a fact Italian Fans did not get refunded until 6 months later, meaning someone made up the money on interest. I know this because my friend is close to the promoter. Fortunately I had a free ticket to this no-event in the end. Point I'm trying to make is the illness was honest some of us still won't believe it. Which is a shame of course. I don't want to think bad thoughts about somebody and something I love for so many years. Anyhow, all things considered I'm starting to wonder if they're thinking why bother to continue. The idea of ending on a whimper instead of a bang also crossed my mind. At this point I think anything could happen.

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bv
For them there is no difference between a private show and a public show.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-10-30 17:47 by TooTough.

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If Jagger couldn't go on, they would have cancelled. One thing you can't hang on them is that they are No Shows...they're pro's and set a very high bar....now how smart to set a mini tour of 4 shows only?.....that's a fair criticism and begs the question was this just a money grab tour...more than likely....

This wasn't really a tour at all, just a few odds and ends tacked onto the Desert Trip (well, while we're there, we might as well...)

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frankotero
This same type of thing happened in Milano 1998. Funny enough the concert was around half sold out when Mick came up with laryngitis. Okay, some say he broke in the previous concert in Nurnberg. To be honest I don't know. But I can tell you it's a fact Italian Fans did not get refunded until 6 months later, meaning someone made up the money on interest. I know this because my friend is close to the promoter. Fortunately I had a free ticket to this no-event in the end. Point I'm trying to make is the illness was honest some of us still won't believe it. Which is a shame of course. I don't want to think bad thoughts about somebody and something I love for so many years. Anyhow, all things considered I'm starting to wonder if they're thinking why bother to continue. The idea of ending on a whimper instead of a bang also crossed my mind. At this point I think anything could happen.

If ticket sales would have been good for Milan, they had rescheduled the show for 1999. This wasn't the case, so Jagger's voice problem was exploited at the end.

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frankotero
This same type of thing happened in Milano 1998. Funny enough the concert was around half sold out when Mick came up with laryngitis. Okay, some say he broke in the previous concert in Nurnberg. To be honest I don't know.

I was in Nuremberg 1998. Of course. Mick lost his voice completely half way through the show. By the time he arrived to the B-stage he could not sing. I am sure there are bootlegs that may confirm it. I remember it like it was yesterday.

Then I took the train from Nuremberg to Milano. On show day in Milano at noon I got the message. Show cancelled. So I took the train the long way via Switzerland, France and to Bilbao in Spain. I knew it might be cancelled but I had to go to Bilbao. Again. Cancelled.

So many conspiration theories. But the fact is simple. Mick had laryngitis. He could not sing.

Bjornulf

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bv
I was in Nuremberg 1998. Of course. Mick lost his voice completely half way through the show.

I was there too and I can confirm your story for 100%

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Keep On Rolling

I've heard the bootleg too. Certainly there is a change in his singing but he sang until the last song. I'm no doctor or expert and wish not to believe in conspiracy theories, for what it's worth. On a happier note and thinking of German concerts Stuttgart '99 was my favorite. Henrik87 posted pictures of passes in the "rarities" thread. All gigs hold a special memory for me for a variety of reasons. Like most fans I don't want it to end.

I'm curious as to how someone knows both Vegas shows were "nearly sold out"?

Have you seen show audits from AEG? If yes, please share.

I'm very very curious to know the actual sold number for the Vegas shows, not Casino buys or comps, actual sold seats to the general public.

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mnewman505
I'm curious as to how someone knows both Vegas shows were "nearly sold out"?

Have you seen show audits from AEG? If yes, please share.

I'm very very curious to know the actual sold number for the Vegas shows, not Casino buys or comps, actual sold seats to the general public.

And a breakdown by age, gender and reason for buying.
Otherwise it's all a sham, apparently

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MisterDDDD

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mnewman505
I'm curious as to how someone knows both Vegas shows were "nearly sold out"?

Have you seen show audits from AEG? If yes, please share.

I'm very very curious to know the actual sold number for the Vegas shows, not Casino buys or comps, actual sold seats to the general public.

And a breakdown by age, gender and reason for buying.
Otherwise it's all a sham, apparently

No, just a standard show audit will do so I can see how many were actually sold as opposed to comp tickets given away to casinos and sponsors.

Just watched the Fort Worth BR with the bonus material. SNL 78 - the first laryngitis show?

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Monsoon Ragoon
Just watched the Fort Worth BR with the bonus material. SNL 78 - the first laryngitis show?

Hamburg 1965? Might be just alcohol, though..

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DandelionPowderman

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Monsoon Ragoon
Just watched the Fort Worth BR with the bonus material. SNL 78 - the first laryngitis show?

Hamburg 1965? Might be just alcohol, though..

Haven't really listened to Hamburg yet.

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Monsoon Ragoon
SNL 78 - the first laryngitis show?

Well no, it was more of a bad case of Belushitis (snif snif).

The only thing that was frustrating for me was that they canceled the show less than 24 hrs before show time. I'm not blaming anyone nor do I think it's any kind of conspiracy but it's a helpless,. frustrating feeling. The fact that it may well be the last time the Stones play in the US is certainly salt in the wounds. But we made the best of it and still had a blast.

But I agree that on several levels it didn't make any sense to reschedule. As others have mentioned, Vegas is a destination place, I wouldn't have been able to redo the whole thing a week later. And bv's point about the crew not being there any longer and it being the end of this little 'tour' makes perfect sense.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-10-31 21:34 by Gaetzi.

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If Jagger couldn't go on, they would have cancelled. One thing you can't hang on them is that they are No Shows...they're pro's and set a very high bar....now how smart to set a mini tour of 4 shows only?.....that's a fair criticism and begs the question was this just a money grab tour...more than likely....

My hunch is the tour was originally planned to be longer but somthing caused the
other dates to be dropped before theses dates were finalized. What was left was the two desert trip dates and the Vegas date with another Vegas date added due
to demand.

There never were more than 5 shows planned, desert trip x2, the private show at Bellagio and the 2 Las Vegas shows. The only one that got added was the Fixborough private show, added in August.
There are a number of contributors to IORR who knew that in May this year.
The other shows that were talked about were wishful thinking, pure and simple

Chriseganstar

Satisfied since 1976

I live in the Las Vegas area and also in Colorado, splitting time between both places. I had tickets for both Vegas concerts and plans to leave Las Vegas on the Tuesday following those concerts.

I was very disappointed in the Wednesday cancellation, and would have changed plans to attend that concert if it was rescheduled. But after discussing this with a couple friends there, I was almost certain they would not reschedule - exactly because of the reasons stated by bv, especially the issues of most 10/19 purchasers being able to attend a rescheduled concert. Think about that - and the logistics of being able to sell refunded tickets to others. Not practical at all, unless it was rescheduled for a date four to six weeks later; and that made no sense since the mini-tour was ending with the private concert on the 25th.

The frustration and disappointment of those who could have only seen the 10/19 concert is understandable - and I had friends in that situation. But, the conspiracy and "they owe us" comments here are not logical, they are emotional responses.

Their 10/22 concert was below par, but still was great in my opinion. I'm thankful they gave us their best, including 3 songs from Keith. I enjoyed the Las Vegas concert more than their longer and technically better second Desert Trip concert (which I also attended), because I like arena concerts better than huge outdoor concerts. I was actually closer to them in the pit at Desert Trip, but felt closer from low in section 4 in Las Vegas, because I could see everything overall better (and I'm not short) and move/dance around much more freely, than in the crowded desert pit.

Also, I don't like that their last concert was private, but I can understand it made sense scheduling things that way - and they have a right to do private concerts. Them performing three public concerts this year was much better than them not performing at all. Hope we get a chance to see them again in 2017, even if I have to travel much farther.

I'm surprised they haven't cancelled more shows over the years. All those old timers... Stones, Bob, Macca..they run circles around internet posters.

BV -

Not sure what you mean "they can't do it"?

They can't reschedule or they can't cancel and not reschedule?

Pecman

So I am one of the bitter ones that was in Vegas for the 19th show. And while I understand things happen that are out of everyone's control I feel they (stones, AEG, AXS, TMobil, etc) could of handled it much better.
While I would not of been thrilled to extend threw Sunday (arrived Tuesday) I would of certainly considered it as we were not flying out until Friday. Had they (see above) not only said that we are trying to reschedule so you can hang on to your tickets or if you can stay for the Saturday show there are still tickets available for that show and we will gladly do our best to get you comparable seats and if not possible a refund for the difference will be made.
If you think about it staying would be cheaper than coming back either a week, a month or 3 months later, but the offer was not made public even though I have read some fans did exactly that.
I have seen the Worlds Greatest Country and Western Band enough times that I have lost track and if in fact they do not come back to the North America I will think about jumping the pond and if not then I will say THANKS for the memories and the many GOOD TIMES we had at live shows and in our basements spinning viynl.

They could've rescheduled. Buy they would've had to spend some money to hire new crew etc. Heaven forbid!!!!

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donvis
They could've rescheduled. Buy they would've had to spend some money to hire new crew etc. Heaven forbid!!!!

Damn right.

Biggest band in the world would have trouble with crew so couldn't reschedule?

BS.