Tell Me :
Talk
Not as sloppy as this:
"So many Jagger/Richards songs deal with time (and, implicitly, memory), don’t they? “Time Is on My Side” (“Time, time, TIME / Is on my side … yes it is”)"
"As we say in England, it can get a bit trainspottery"
In this NPR interview Melissa Block asks Jagger, "who did what in writing this song?"
[www.npr.org]
Jagger does not "claim" (just my opinion)
In contemporary music with performed words, song lyrics can be considered part of the composition especially in the case of Jagger-Richards
Vice versa.
Maybe it's just that he's not known mainly as a lyricist as say Dylan or Lennon, even though he's every bit as good I think. His stage persona because it is, if not the best, among the best, is the talent of his that gets the most attention. That's just my take though, maybe the people that wrote the underrated comments think differently. Obviously anyone on these boards though is not underrating him as a lyricist, but it is fun to see what lyrics some people like that others hate.
Dylan has written a lot of crappy lyrics as well. It's just that his most famous songs are, generally, his most eloquent and more universal in subject matter. I think Mick is every bit as good as Dylan and Lennon.
That's a fairly bold observation...and not that I disagree, but I think what would be interesting is to take MJ's most profound lyrical venture, and hold them up to something profound by Dylan and Lennon.
How would it hold up?
What is lyrically, MJ's best song?
Even some of their simple songs give so much insight in just a few words. Like..."Now she gets her kicks in Stepney not in Knightsbridge anymore" and "I want to see the sun blotted out from the sky"
And there's so much to be said about the way he sings the lyrics - he does things that are amazing with the pacing...like "Everywhere I hear the sound of marching, charging feet boy"...OR "The telephone is ringing
I say, "Hi, it's me. Who is it there on the line?"
A voice says, "Hi, hello, how are you?"
Well, I guess I'm doin' fine"
I think so much of what the Stones have done is underestimated. Of course, I might be a bit biased.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-08-20 00:46 by memphiscats.
I wrote this post some time back about a Mick quote in the film "20 feet from Stardom" where he is being interviewed about Gimme Shelter:
Lady Jayne
Saw this today and found it a fascinating and very enjoyable film. The combined talents of the women featured was awesome. Very interesting to hear Merry Clayton and Mick talk of the famous GS vocals - was it throwaway when Mick talked of Merry singing the lyrics "he" had written (I had always thought Keith was responsible for music and lyrics of this one)? Lisa came across very well - as a grounded person and well as a supremely talented one. It also struck me, not for the first time, how much more impressive and entertaining MJ is on the rare occasions he is being asked to talk about something other than himself.
I can't now find a clip on Youtube but I'm pretty clear he talked about 'his' and not 'ours' or Keith's lyric as it took me by surprise given the folk lore about this track.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-08-21 01:02 by Lady Jayne.
"folk lore" and "circumstantial" indeed it is that Gimme Shelter is "entirely" Keith. Keith's "claims" aside, there is no more direct line of questioning than the NPR interviewer who asks "who did what". Jagger's responses couldn't be clearer - he wrote the lyrics - Keith wrote the tune.
I have always surmised that Jagger-Richards composed and co-created Gimme Shelter
Great post and examples. I haven't really contributed to this thread because it's so hard to just sum it up. He's funny, witty, dark, sarcastic, smart, sexy, morose, cynical, romantic, light-heated and deep and and sometimes in one song.. its all seems so seamless and natural. I can't begin to explain what's great and underrated about Mick as a songwriter.
I always love to point out Lady Jane, Back Street Girl and Under My Thumb...the songs are so lighthearded-sounding, and almost pop, but his lyrics are sharp as a knife.
Excellent point. He pretends not to give a ***, and creates this ruse that his lyrics are meaningless, and many people, and fans, believe him. And because of his public persona, the blase, strutting rock star, that;'s easy to do.
I remember it as "when we wrote it", and that he didn't say anything about the lyrics in particular.
And I watched it two weeks ago...
Yes, but for all they can do, neither Dylan or Lennon or Macca could never have written a Stray Cat Blues, Live With Me, Brown Sugar, Miss You, Respectable and so many others......those are rock and roll songs in a different universe. They also can't match the sassy (Green Lady's word) and sexy, strutting phrasing of Jagger at his best.
But Jagger can write Gimme Shelter, No Expectations, Exile...
That's what makes him different.
Yeah, Jagger would never 'claim' to have written anything. That's not his style. He 'claims' Keith wrote "Let it Loose" and even Keith denies this.
The GS lyrics, imagery, just sound like Mick.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-08-21 00:49 by stupidguy2.
SYMPATHY FOR THE DEVIL-game over.
Again ---- the only direct line of questioning thus far in regards to Gimme Shelter comes from the NPR interviewer who asks "who did what". Jagger's responses couldn't be clearer - he says " I wrote the lyrics - Keith wrote the tune"
Jagger typically says "we", sometimes he says "Keith", more rarely says "I"
My conjecture after years of Jagger watching and listening to Jagger speak
When Jagger says: "I", it means "I"
When Jagger says: "WE", it could mean "WE" or "I"
When Jagger says "Keith" it could mean "Keith" or could still mean "WE" or "I"
My conjecture after years of Keith watching and listening to Keith speak and/or reading what he supposedly stated - he should stick to creating riffs and playing rhythm guitar. In regards to most other things, he would be better if he got some more fiber in his diet...
Talk about your favorite band.
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Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
Deltics
()
Date: August 18, 2014 11:26
Quote
Bliss
It can be very difficult to work out Mick and Keith's respective lyrical contributions, although there are some songs which are sole compositions which give you a good idea of their style. They do have a distinctive style, but sometimes things are added or fixed up.
Lyrics are sung, and as the singer, Mick could well add some touches to Keith's lyrics that make the song sound better.
But the circumstances that led Keith to write "Gimme Shelter" are so well known that it seems sloppy for the writer to mention it as an example of Mick's lyrics.
Not as sloppy as this:
"So many Jagger/Richards songs deal with time (and, implicitly, memory), don’t they? “Time Is on My Side” (“Time, time, TIME / Is on my side … yes it is”)"
"As we say in England, it can get a bit trainspottery"
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
Rockman
()
Date: August 18, 2014 11:29
YEAH Deltics ......... that's down right sloppeeeeeeeeee ...
ROCKMAN
ROCKMAN
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
Rockman
()
Date: August 18, 2014 11:41
Bet your mama was a tent show queen
And all her boyfriends were sweet sixteen
.........Awwww Yeah pure rock & roll stuff .... they don't come no better ....YEAH!!!
ROCKMAN
And all her boyfriends were sweet sixteen
.........Awwww Yeah pure rock & roll stuff .... they don't come no better ....YEAH!!!
ROCKMAN
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
wanderingspirit66
()
Date: August 18, 2014 19:14
Quote
OzHeavyThrobber
Yeah nice contribution to the thread. As a sideline I read lower case just as competently as upper.
Jagger has never made comment as far as I'm aware he had anything to do with the composition of it and Richards basically claims it entirely as his own in 'Life'.
If you've anything to add that sheds light on Jagger having co-written this I'd be INTERESTED.
In this NPR interview Melissa Block asks Jagger, "who did what in writing this song?"
[www.npr.org]
Jagger does not "claim" (just my opinion)
In contemporary music with performed words, song lyrics can be considered part of the composition especially in the case of Jagger-Richards
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
memphiscats
()
Date: August 19, 2014 00:17
I love the humor in his writing...
"You left me twisting in the wind, dangling in the night
You'll be Mr. Christian and I'll be Captain Bligh...
"It's today that's the day of the plunge
Oh, the gal I'm to marry is a bow-legged sow
I've been soakin' up drink like a sponge"
His amazing ability to turn a phrase...
"Pretty lips were sealed, I wrote a letter
Full of trite confessions about wounds that heal"
The way he can convey loneliness in just a few words...
"And your late night friends leave you in the cold grey dawn"
"And as I watch you leaving me
You pack my peace of mind"
"I got silence on my radio
Let the air waves flow, let the air waves flow"
"One day I woke up to find, right in the bed next to mine
Someone that broke me up with a corner of her smile, yeah"
And how he creates such memorable images using just a few words...
"I've been bit and I've been tossed around
By every she-rat in this town"
"You left me twisting in the wind, dangling in the night
You'll be Mr. Christian and I'll be Captain Bligh...
"It's today that's the day of the plunge
Oh, the gal I'm to marry is a bow-legged sow
I've been soakin' up drink like a sponge"
His amazing ability to turn a phrase...
"Pretty lips were sealed, I wrote a letter
Full of trite confessions about wounds that heal"
The way he can convey loneliness in just a few words...
"And your late night friends leave you in the cold grey dawn"
"And as I watch you leaving me
You pack my peace of mind"
"I got silence on my radio
Let the air waves flow, let the air waves flow"
"One day I woke up to find, right in the bed next to mine
Someone that broke me up with a corner of her smile, yeah"
And how he creates such memorable images using just a few words...
"I've been bit and I've been tossed around
By every she-rat in this town"
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
alieb
()
Date: August 19, 2014 04:34
I think you just managed to completely capture everything that is good about his writing in a single post.Quote
memphiscats
I love the humor in his writing...
"You left me twisting in the wind, dangling in the night
You'll be Mr. Christian and I'll be Captain Bligh...
"It's today that's the day of the plunge
Oh, the gal I'm to marry is a bow-legged sow
I've been soakin' up drink like a sponge"
His amazing ability to turn a phrase...
"Pretty lips were sealed, I wrote a letter
Full of trite confessions about wounds that heal"
The way he can convey loneliness in just a few words...
"And your late night friends leave you in the cold grey dawn"
"And as I watch you leaving me
You pack my peace of mind"
"I got silence on my radio
Let the air waves flow, let the air waves flow"
"One day I woke up to find, right in the bed next to mine
Someone that broke me up with a corner of her smile, yeah"
And how he creates such memorable images using just a few words...
"I've been bit and I've been tossed around
By every she-rat in this town"
Re: Jagger's Worst Lyrics
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: August 19, 2014 08:38
Quote
PietroQuote
Come OnQuote
Pietro
There is a "Jagger's Best Lyrics" thread. Which inspired me to start a "Jagger's Worst Lyrics." Here's my choice:
What exactly is gonna happen
When her father finds out
That his virgin daughter has bordello dreams
And he's the one she wants to try out
From "Family" on "Metamorphosis."He He this is brilliant lyrics in a brilliant song Pietro...
I don't see how anyone can find merit in these lyrics. "Bordello dreams"? So she wants to work in a bordello. And after she gets that job in the bordello, her father wants to try her out. Bizarre!
Vice versa.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: August 19, 2014 08:40
Is Mick really underrated as a lyricist, and by who?
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
alieb
()
Date: August 19, 2014 09:29
Quote
DandelionPowderman
Is Mick really underrated as a lyricist, and by who?
Maybe it's just that he's not known mainly as a lyricist as say Dylan or Lennon, even though he's every bit as good I think. His stage persona because it is, if not the best, among the best, is the talent of his that gets the most attention. That's just my take though, maybe the people that wrote the underrated comments think differently. Obviously anyone on these boards though is not underrating him as a lyricist, but it is fun to see what lyrics some people like that others hate.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: August 19, 2014 09:42
<Maybe it's just that he's not known mainly as a lyricist as say Dylan or Lennon, even though he's every bit as good I think.>
He is not at Dylan's level, so that's rightfully so, imo.
Lennon has a few gems and lots of clunkers, imo.
He is not at Dylan's level, so that's rightfully so, imo.
Lennon has a few gems and lots of clunkers, imo.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
Bliss
()
Date: August 19, 2014 12:11
I definitely think he's underrated. I think I have only ever seen one other article apart from the one I posted above praising his ability as a lyricist.
I agree it is because it is overshadowed by his performing abilities and stage presence, things which Dylan and Lennon can't even approach.
They definitely brought out the best in him however. Mick's best lyrics are sadly long in the past.
I agree it is because it is overshadowed by his performing abilities and stage presence, things which Dylan and Lennon can't even approach.
They definitely brought out the best in him however. Mick's best lyrics are sadly long in the past.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: August 19, 2014 12:50
I think one of the reasons he is underrated (if he indeed is?) is that he also has written loads of childish, bland and downright unimpressive stuff.
That is also the case with many others, of course, but many of the Stones's hits aren't exactly Dostojevskij-material, and that sticks with the public, perhaps?
Some of the deeper cuts, however, are excellent - and only the fans know about those pieces.
Just an attempt of understanding this (again, if it is the case that he is underrated).
There is a difference in quality between Let's Work and Jig Saw Puzzle
That is also the case with many others, of course, but many of the Stones's hits aren't exactly Dostojevskij-material, and that sticks with the public, perhaps?
Some of the deeper cuts, however, are excellent - and only the fans know about those pieces.
Just an attempt of understanding this (again, if it is the case that he is underrated).
There is a difference in quality between Let's Work and Jig Saw Puzzle
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
latebloomer
()
Date: August 19, 2014 17:16
Quote
DandelionPowderman
<Maybe it's just that he's not known mainly as a lyricist as say Dylan or Lennon, even though he's every bit as good I think.>
He is not at Dylan's level, so that's rightfully so, imo.
Lennon has a few gems and lots of clunkers, imo.
Dylan has written a lot of crappy lyrics as well. It's just that his most famous songs are, generally, his most eloquent and more universal in subject matter. I think Mick is every bit as good as Dylan and Lennon.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
StonesCat
()
Date: August 19, 2014 17:36
I think why MJ gets downgraded in certain people's minds, in relation to a Dylan or a Lennon, is they feel that those two are really digging down deep and presenting something that's important to them. Mick can write great stuff, but it's often seen as being from a distance, or a pose. He doesn't help his own cause by brushing off most connections to people or places in his lyrics. Dylan does kind of the same thing, but critics choose not to believe his denials.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
treaclefingers
()
Date: August 19, 2014 17:52
Quote
latebloomerQuote
DandelionPowderman
<Maybe it's just that he's not known mainly as a lyricist as say Dylan or Lennon, even though he's every bit as good I think.>
He is not at Dylan's level, so that's rightfully so, imo.
Lennon has a few gems and lots of clunkers, imo.
Dylan has written a lot of crappy lyrics as well. It's just that his most famous songs are, generally, his most eloquent and more universal in subject matter. I think Mick is every bit as good as Dylan and Lennon.
That's a fairly bold observation...and not that I disagree, but I think what would be interesting is to take MJ's most profound lyrical venture, and hold them up to something profound by Dylan and Lennon.
How would it hold up?
What is lyrically, MJ's best song?
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
memphiscats
()
Date: August 20, 2014 00:15
Why Thank You!Quote
aliebI think you just managed to completely capture everything that is good about his writing in a single post.Quote
memphiscats
I love the humor in his writing...
"You left me twisting in the wind, dangling in the night
You'll be Mr. Christian and I'll be Captain Bligh...
"It's today that's the day of the plunge
Oh, the gal I'm to marry is a bow-legged sow
I've been soakin' up drink like a sponge"
His amazing ability to turn a phrase...
"Pretty lips were sealed, I wrote a letter
Full of trite confessions about wounds that heal"
The way he can convey loneliness in just a few words...
"And your late night friends leave you in the cold grey dawn"
"And as I watch you leaving me
You pack my peace of mind"
"I got silence on my radio
Let the air waves flow, let the air waves flow"
"One day I woke up to find, right in the bed next to mine
Someone that broke me up with a corner of her smile, yeah"
And how he creates such memorable images using just a few words...
"I've been bit and I've been tossed around
By every she-rat in this town"
Even some of their simple songs give so much insight in just a few words. Like..."Now she gets her kicks in Stepney not in Knightsbridge anymore" and "I want to see the sun blotted out from the sky"
And there's so much to be said about the way he sings the lyrics - he does things that are amazing with the pacing...like "Everywhere I hear the sound of marching, charging feet boy"...OR "The telephone is ringing
I say, "Hi, it's me. Who is it there on the line?"
A voice says, "Hi, hello, how are you?"
Well, I guess I'm doin' fine"
I think so much of what the Stones have done is underestimated. Of course, I might be a bit biased.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-08-20 00:46 by memphiscats.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
Green Lady
()
Date: August 20, 2014 20:10
Some of my favourite Jagger lyrics are on the Exile and Some Girls bonus discs. Whether these songs should have had new lyrics written is a different argument: the ones they've got are Mick at his sassy best.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
Lady Jayne
()
Date: August 20, 2014 22:08
Quote
OzHeavyThrobber
Yeah nice contribution to the thread. As a sideline I read lower case just as competently as upper.
Jagger has never made comment as far as I'm aware he had anything to do with the composition of it and Richards basically claims it entirely as his own in 'Life'.
If you've anything to add that sheds light on Jagger having co-written this I'd be INTERESTED.
I wrote this post some time back about a Mick quote in the film "20 feet from Stardom" where he is being interviewed about Gimme Shelter:
Lady Jayne
Saw this today and found it a fascinating and very enjoyable film. The combined talents of the women featured was awesome. Very interesting to hear Merry Clayton and Mick talk of the famous GS vocals - was it throwaway when Mick talked of Merry singing the lyrics "he" had written (I had always thought Keith was responsible for music and lyrics of this one)? Lisa came across very well - as a grounded person and well as a supremely talented one. It also struck me, not for the first time, how much more impressive and entertaining MJ is on the rare occasions he is being asked to talk about something other than himself.
I can't now find a clip on Youtube but I'm pretty clear he talked about 'his' and not 'ours' or Keith's lyric as it took me by surprise given the folk lore about this track.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-08-21 01:02 by Lady Jayne.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
wanderingspirit66
()
Date: August 20, 2014 22:58
Quote
Lady JayneQuote
OzHeavyThrobber
Yeah nice contribution to the thread. As a sideline I read lower case just as competently as upper.
Jagger has never made comment as far as I'm aware he had anything to do with the composition of it and Richards basically claims it entirely as his own in 'Life'.
If you've anything to add that sheds light on Jagger having co-written this I'd be INTERESTED.
I wrote this post some time back about a Mick quote in the film "50 feet from Stardom" where he is being interviewed about Gimme Shelter:
Lady Jayne
Saw this today and found it a fascinating and very enjoyable film. The combined talents of the women featured was awesome. Very interesting to hear Merry Clayton and Mick talk of the famous GS vocals - was it throwaway when Mick talked of Merry singing the lyrics "he" had written (I had always thought Keith was responsible for music and lyrics of this one)? Lisa came across very well - as a grounded person and well as a supremely talented one. It also struck me, not for the first time, how much more impressive and entertaining MJ is on the rare occasions he is being asked to talk about something other than himself.
I can't now find a clip on Youtube but I'm pretty clear he talked about 'his' and not 'ours' or Keith's lyric as it took me by surprise given the folk lore about this track.
"folk lore" and "circumstantial" indeed it is that Gimme Shelter is "entirely" Keith. Keith's "claims" aside, there is no more direct line of questioning than the NPR interviewer who asks "who did what". Jagger's responses couldn't be clearer - he wrote the lyrics - Keith wrote the tune.
I have always surmised that Jagger-Richards composed and co-created Gimme Shelter
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
stupidguy2
()
Date: August 21, 2014 00:34
Quote
memphiscats
I love the humor in his writing...
"You left me twisting in the wind, dangling in the night
You'll be Mr. Christian and I'll be Captain Bligh...
"It's today that's the day of the plunge
Oh, the gal I'm to marry is a bow-legged sow
I've been soakin' up drink like a sponge"
His amazing ability to turn a phrase...
"Pretty lips were sealed, I wrote a letter
Full of trite confessions about wounds that heal"
The way he can convey loneliness in just a few words...
"And your late night friends leave you in the cold grey dawn"
"And as I watch you leaving me
You pack my peace of mind"
"I got silence on my radio
Let the air waves flow, let the air waves flow"
"One day I woke up to find, right in the bed next to mine
Someone that broke me up with a corner of her smile, yeah"
And how he creates such memorable images using just a few words...
"I've been bit and I've been tossed around
By every she-rat in this town"
Great post and examples. I haven't really contributed to this thread because it's so hard to just sum it up. He's funny, witty, dark, sarcastic, smart, sexy, morose, cynical, romantic, light-heated and deep and and sometimes in one song.. its all seems so seamless and natural. I can't begin to explain what's great and underrated about Mick as a songwriter.
I always love to point out Lady Jane, Back Street Girl and Under My Thumb...the songs are so lighthearded-sounding, and almost pop, but his lyrics are sharp as a knife.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
stupidguy2
()
Date: August 21, 2014 00:40
Quote
StonesCat
I think why MJ gets downgraded in certain people's minds, in relation to a Dylan or a Lennon, is they feel that those two are really digging down deep and presenting something that's important to them. Mick can write great stuff, but it's often seen as being from a distance, or a pose. He doesn't help his own cause by brushing off most connections to people or places in his lyrics. Dylan does kind of the same thing, but critics choose not to believe his denials.
Excellent point. He pretends not to give a ***, and creates this ruse that his lyrics are meaningless, and many people, and fans, believe him. And because of his public persona, the blase, strutting rock star, that;'s easy to do.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: August 21, 2014 00:45
Quote
Lady JayneQuote
OzHeavyThrobber
Yeah nice contribution to the thread. As a sideline I read lower case just as competently as upper.
Jagger has never made comment as far as I'm aware he had anything to do with the composition of it and Richards basically claims it entirely as his own in 'Life'.
If you've anything to add that sheds light on Jagger having co-written this I'd be INTERESTED.
I wrote this post some time back about a Mick quote in the film "50 feet from Stardom" where he is being interviewed about Gimme Shelter:
Lady Jayne
Saw this today and found it a fascinating and very enjoyable film. The combined talents of the women featured was awesome. Very interesting to hear Merry Clayton and Mick talk of the famous GS vocals - was it throwaway when Mick talked of Merry singing the lyrics "he" had written (I had always thought Keith was responsible for music and lyrics of this one)? Lisa came across very well - as a grounded person and well as a supremely talented one. It also struck me, not for the first time, how much more impressive and entertaining MJ is on the rare occasions he is being asked to talk about something other than himself.
I can't now find a clip on Youtube but I'm pretty clear he talked about 'his' and not 'ours' or Keith's lyric as it took me by surprise given the folk lore about this track.
I remember it as "when we wrote it", and that he didn't say anything about the lyrics in particular.
And I watched it two weeks ago...
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
stupidguy2
()
Date: August 21, 2014 00:46
Quote
DandelionPowderman
<Maybe it's just that he's not known mainly as a lyricist as say Dylan or Lennon, even though he's every bit as good I think.>
He is not at Dylan's level, so that's rightfully so, imo.
Lennon has a few gems and lots of clunkers, imo.
Yes, but for all they can do, neither Dylan or Lennon or Macca could never have written a Stray Cat Blues, Live With Me, Brown Sugar, Miss You, Respectable and so many others......those are rock and roll songs in a different universe. They also can't match the sassy (Green Lady's word) and sexy, strutting phrasing of Jagger at his best.
But Jagger can write Gimme Shelter, No Expectations, Exile...
That's what makes him different.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
stupidguy2
()
Date: August 21, 2014 00:49
Quote
wanderingspirit66Quote
OzHeavyThrobber
Yeah nice contribution to the thread. As a sideline I read lower case just as competently as upper.
Jagger has never made comment as far as I'm aware he had anything to do with the composition of it and Richards basically claims it entirely as his own in 'Life'.
If you've anything to add that sheds light on Jagger having co-written this I'd be INTERESTED.
In this NPR interview Melissa Block asks Jagger, "who did what in writing this song?"
[www.npr.org]
Jagger does not "claim" (just my opinion)
In contemporary music with performed words, song lyrics can be considered part of the composition especially in the case of Jagger-Richards
Yeah, Jagger would never 'claim' to have written anything. That's not his style. He 'claims' Keith wrote "Let it Loose" and even Keith denies this.
The GS lyrics, imagery, just sound like Mick.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-08-21 00:49 by stupidguy2.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
lem motlow
()
Date: August 21, 2014 01:02
Quote
treaclefingersQuote
latebloomerQuote
DandelionPowderman
<Maybe it's just that he's not known mainly as a lyricist as say Dylan or Lennon, even though he's every bit as good I think.>
He is not at Dylan's level, so that's rightfully so, imo.
Lennon has a few gems and lots of clunkers, imo.
Dylan has written a lot of crappy lyrics as well. It's just that his most famous songs are, generally, his most eloquent and more universal in subject matter. I think Mick is every bit as good as Dylan and Lennon.
That's a fairly bold observation...and not that I disagree, but I think what would be interesting is to take MJ's most profound lyrical venture, and hold them up to something profound by Dylan and Lennon.
How would it hold up?
What is lyrically, MJ's best song?
SYMPATHY FOR THE DEVIL-game over.
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
wanderingspirit66
()
Date: August 21, 2014 01:26
Quote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
Lady JayneQuote
OzHeavyThrobber
Yeah nice contribution to the thread. As a sideline I read lower case just as competently as upper.
Jagger has never made comment as far as I'm aware he had anything to do with the composition of it and Richards basically claims it entirely as his own in 'Life'.
If you've anything to add that sheds light on Jagger having co-written this I'd be INTERESTED.
I wrote this post some time back about a Mick quote in the film "50 feet from Stardom" where he is being interviewed about Gimme Shelter:
Lady Jayne
Saw this today and found it a fascinating and very enjoyable film. The combined talents of the women featured was awesome. Very interesting to hear Merry Clayton and Mick talk of the famous GS vocals - was it throwaway when Mick talked of Merry singing the lyrics "he" had written (I had always thought Keith was responsible for music and lyrics of this one)? Lisa came across very well - as a grounded person and well as a supremely talented one. It also struck me, not for the first time, how much more impressive and entertaining MJ is on the rare occasions he is being asked to talk about something other than himself.
I can't now find a clip on Youtube but I'm pretty clear he talked about 'his' and not 'ours' or Keith's lyric as it took me by surprise given the folk lore about this track.
I remember it as "when we wrote it", and that he didn't say anything about the lyrics in particular.
And I watched it two weeks ago...
Again ---- the only direct line of questioning thus far in regards to Gimme Shelter comes from the NPR interviewer who asks "who did what". Jagger's responses couldn't be clearer - he says " I wrote the lyrics - Keith wrote the tune"
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
wanderingspirit66
()
Date: August 21, 2014 01:40
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stupidguy2Quote
wanderingspirit66Quote
OzHeavyThrobber
Yeah nice contribution to the thread. As a sideline I read lower case just as competently as upper.
Jagger has never made comment as far as I'm aware he had anything to do with the composition of it and Richards basically claims it entirely as his own in 'Life'.
If you've anything to add that sheds light on Jagger having co-written this I'd be INTERESTED.
In this NPR interview Melissa Block asks Jagger, "who did what in writing this song?"
[www.npr.org]
Jagger does not "claim" (just my opinion)
In contemporary music with performed words, song lyrics can be considered part of the composition especially in the case of Jagger-Richards
Yeah, Jagger would never 'claim' to have written anything. That's not his style. He 'claims' Keith wrote "Let it Loose" and even Keith denies this.
The GS lyrics, imagery, just sound like Mick.
Jagger typically says "we", sometimes he says "Keith", more rarely says "I"
My conjecture after years of Jagger watching and listening to Jagger speak
When Jagger says: "I", it means "I"
When Jagger says: "WE", it could mean "WE" or "I"
When Jagger says "Keith" it could mean "Keith" or could still mean "WE" or "I"
My conjecture after years of Keith watching and listening to Keith speak and/or reading what he supposedly stated - he should stick to creating riffs and playing rhythm guitar. In regards to most other things, he would be better if he got some more fiber in his diet...
Re: Jagger's lyrics.
Posted by:
Lady Jayne
()
Date: August 21, 2014 01:58
Quote
wanderingspirit66Quote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
Lady JayneQuote
OzHeavyThrobber
I remember it as "when we wrote it", and that he didn't say anything about the lyrics in particular.
And I watched it two weeks ago...
Again ---- the only direct line of questioning thus far in regards to Gimme Shelter comes from the NPR interviewer who asks "who did what". Jagger's responses couldn't be clearer - he says " I wrote the lyrics - Keith wrote the tune"
I agree, he couldn't be clearer than in that interview. It also chimes with my recollection of what he says (unprompted) in the film. In so far as it conflicts with any direct quote from Keith (and I'm not sure it does) I would favour Mick's recollection over Keith's any day.
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