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StonesCat

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drewmaster
This is where Keith starts losing his touch, where his abilities as a songwriter begin slipping away. It's a nice mood piece, but somehow misses the mark compared to Keith’s great ballads. There’s really not much of a melody here, and that booming ‘80s production doesn’t help matters.

Drew

Yep, this is where the divide amongst Stones fans starts, with those who dig the torch-song ballad Keith, and those, like me, who don't care much for the make it up as you go lyric style and demo-type feel to the tracks. Slipping Away is the keeper from the later era for me.

And this one?

It doesn't say much about the album, when this is the single shining star from it.

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treaclefingers
It doesn't say much about the album, when this is the single shining star from it.

Is isn't, it's just the perfect pre-closer.

It's awful.

It's great

what a horrible song, like the most of Richards singing songs.

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DandelionPowderman

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StonesCat

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drewmaster
This is where Keith starts losing his touch, where his abilities as a songwriter begin slipping away. It's a nice mood piece, but somehow misses the mark compared to Keith’s great ballads. There’s really not much of a melody here, and that booming ‘80s production doesn’t help matters.

Drew

Yep, this is where the divide amongst Stones fans starts, with those who dig the torch-song ballad Keith, and those, like me, who don't care much for the make it up as you go lyric style and demo-type feel to the tracks. Slipping Away is the keeper from the later era for me.

And this one?

For me, the post-1983 Keith keepers are Slipping Away and Thief in the Night. Both are real songs ... and unforgettable.

Drew

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drewmaster

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DandelionPowderman

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StonesCat

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drewmaster
This is where Keith starts losing his touch, where his abilities as a songwriter begin slipping away. It's a nice mood piece, but somehow misses the mark compared to Keith’s great ballads. There’s really not much of a melody here, and that booming ‘80s production doesn’t help matters.

Drew

Yep, this is where the divide amongst Stones fans starts, with those who dig the torch-song ballad Keith, and those, like me, who don't care much for the make it up as you go lyric style and demo-type feel to the tracks. Slipping Away is the keeper from the later era for me.

And this one?

For me, the post-1983 Keith keepers are Slipping Away and Thief in the Night. Both are real songs ... and unforgettable.

Drew

Both are great, but How Can I Stop is probably the most "real" of them all.

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DandelionPowderman

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drewmaster

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DandelionPowderman

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StonesCat

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drewmaster
This is where Keith starts losing his touch, where his abilities as a songwriter begin slipping away. It's a nice mood piece, but somehow misses the mark compared to Keith’s great ballads. There’s really not much of a melody here, and that booming ‘80s production doesn’t help matters.

Drew

Yep, this is where the divide amongst Stones fans starts, with those who dig the torch-song ballad Keith, and those, like me, who don't care much for the make it up as you go lyric style and demo-type feel to the tracks. Slipping Away is the keeper from the later era for me.

And this one?

For me, the post-1983 Keith keepers are Slipping Away and Thief in the Night. Both are real songs ... and unforgettable.

Drew

Both are great, but How Can I Stop is probably the most "real" of them all.

I've been trying to get into How Can I Stop for 17 years, Dandy! On an intellectual level, I can recognize that it is a fine track, but something is blocking me from really enjoying it!! Unlucky for me...

Drew

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drewmaster

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DandelionPowderman

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drewmaster

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DandelionPowderman

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StonesCat

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drewmaster
This is where Keith starts losing his touch, where his abilities as a songwriter begin slipping away. It's a nice mood piece, but somehow misses the mark compared to Keith’s great ballads. There’s really not much of a melody here, and that booming ‘80s production doesn’t help matters.

Drew

Yep, this is where the divide amongst Stones fans starts, with those who dig the torch-song ballad Keith, and those, like me, who don't care much for the make it up as you go lyric style and demo-type feel to the tracks. Slipping Away is the keeper from the later era for me.

And this one?

For me, the post-1983 Keith keepers are Slipping Away and Thief in the Night. Both are real songs ... and unforgettable.

Drew

Both are great, but How Can I Stop is probably the most "real" of them all.

I've been trying to get into How Can I Stop for 17 years, Dandy! On an intellectual level, I can recognize that it is a fine track, but something is blocking me from really enjoying it!! Unlucky for me...

Drew

Too bad, but in a way that's the beauty of music: we all get different experiences and joys

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DandelionPowderman

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drewmaster

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DandelionPowderman

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drewmaster

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DandelionPowderman

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StonesCat

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drewmaster
This is where Keith starts losing his touch, where his abilities as a songwriter begin slipping away. It's a nice mood piece, but somehow misses the mark compared to Keith’s great ballads. There’s really not much of a melody here, and that booming ‘80s production doesn’t help matters.

Drew

Yep, this is where the divide amongst Stones fans starts, with those who dig the torch-song ballad Keith, and those, like me, who don't care much for the make it up as you go lyric style and demo-type feel to the tracks. Slipping Away is the keeper from the later era for me.

And this one?

For me, the post-1983 Keith keepers are Slipping Away and Thief in the Night. Both are real songs ... and unforgettable.

Drew

Both are great, but How Can I Stop is probably the most "real" of them all.

I've been trying to get into How Can I Stop for 17 years, Dandy! On an intellectual level, I can recognize that it is a fine track, but something is blocking me from really enjoying it!! Unlucky for me...

Drew

Too bad, but in a way that's the beauty of music: we all get different experiences and joys

Very true! And this is one reason the Stones are so great ... their musical breadth allows you to enjoy How Can I Stop while I enjoy Back to Zero!

Drew

I think drewmaster and SilverDagger nailed my stance here. To think of how kind Keith 'solo' numbers degenerated during the 80's... After the run of "You Got The Silver", "Happy", "Coming Down Again", "Before They Make Me Run", "All About You", "Little T&A" - if not all classics, but at least killer songs, strong artistic statements and album highlights, then we got first a dull throwaway "Wanna Hold You", followed by this way-too-predictable and meaningless ballad.... the thrill and 'speciality' had gone, brilliance had turned into mediocricy. Fortunately TALK IS CHEAP included material which would show that there still was creative will and point in that front.

Nice to have Tom Waits here, but, frankly, there is not much 'Rolling Stones' in this track. Tells a sad story of the state of the band then, and how little Jagger cared of anything, when allowed a track like this to be released under the name of The Stones... jeez, even Ronnie Wood playing drums (and, yes, sounding horrible)...

- Doxa

Then Happy (Exile's second single) tells the same story

I believe Drew deservedly praised the beautiful Thief In The Night.

I still like This Place Is Empty, btw. And, to get on topic again, I have always loved Sleep Tonight. How can we not love the beautiful guitar(!) and the choruses?

No offense Keith but the song is terrible and the drumming is worse.

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buffalo7478
Very solid piece that conveys a mood.

Frankly my two fav songs on Dirty Work are both Keith numbers: Sleep Tonight and Too Rude. Neither his best work, but better than most of the rest of the record. The only other song worth listening to is One Hit.

Hate the production on the record (on top of most of the writing).

I mainly disagree with the rest of the quoted post, but I do agree with its first sentence. It is the observation about the mood by the way that makes me consider the song a cousin to "All About You". That is the song's main asset. That is also why I appreciate it higher than for instance "Before They Make Me Run" or "Little T&A" or, for that matter on an album otherwise with exclusively good songs, "Wanna Hold You".

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DandelionPowderman

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treaclefingers
It doesn't say much about the album, when this is the single shining star from it.

Is isn't, it's just the perfect pre-closer.

OK, you can't just say that and not give your opinion about what the 'shining star' from Dirty Work is.

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DandelionPowderman
Then Happy (Exile's second single) tells the same story

?

Is Ronnie playing the drums there as well?><

No, I think Jagger was rather pleased with that song, since it actually is a terrific song, single A-side material, and he sings background vocals there as well... Besides "Happy", despite having just technically speaking the Twins there, nothing but vital and energetic Rolling Stones. Miller, seemingly, had an ear how the drums should sound in a context like that. Whereas "Sleep Tonight" sounds like a bunch of old and tired drunks trying to do a cliche-full by-numbers nightclub number whose audience had already passed out... Maestro Wood's amateur-like over-playing of drums icing the cake beautifully. If that's Keef's idea how the Stones AD 1986 supposed to sound like, good luck... Tough times those deep 80's years were...

I also think that "Sleep Tonight" is Keith's worst vocal performance ever in a Rolling Stones recording. There Keith trying to sound like Keef-character took over his natural delivery, which used to be so convincing ("You Got The Silver", "Coming Down Again", "All About You").

I seemingly don't like very much this number...

- Doxa



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-08-11 21:31 by Doxa.

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Doxa

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DandelionPowderman
Then Happy (Exile's second single) tells the same story

?

Is Ronnie playing the drums there as well?><

No, I think Jagger was rather pleased with that song, since it actually is a terrific song, single A-side material, and he sings background vocals there as well... Besides "Happy", despite having just technically speaking the Twins there, nothing but vital and energetic Rolling Stones. Miller, seemingly, had an ear how the drums should sound in a context like that. Whereas "Sleep Tonight" sounds like a bunch of old and tired drunks trying to do a cliche-full by-numbers nightclub number whose audience had already passed out... Maestro Wood's amateur-like over-playing of drums icing the cake beautifully. If that's Keef's idea how the Stones AD 1986 supposed to sound like, good luck...

I also think that "Sleep Tonight" is Keith's worst vocal performance ever 23in a Rolling Stones recording. There Keith trying to sound like Keef-character took over his natural delivery, which used to be so convincing ("You Got The Silver", "Coming Down Again", "All About You").

I seemingly don't like very much this number...

- Doxa

and even still, you'd agree it's the best song on Dirty Work.

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treaclefingers
and even still, you'd agree it's the best song on Dirty Work.

Hmm... not far, but I still would give that title to the song, which follows it....

- Doxa

Classic

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Doxa

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treaclefingers
and even still, you'd agree it's the best song on Dirty Work.

Hmm... not far, but I still would give that title to the song, which follows it....

- Doxa

so true

For me, the only song I like on DW is Keith's other song, Too Rude. Just because there's some life to it and it's kind of enjoyable.

Personally, I just think that a lot of the "interesting" went out out of Keith's voice towards the late 70s, it's like a whole other person from the Exile and earlier days. And, while some of the later Keith songs kind of mask that with some jazzy touches, it still doesn't excite me.

[www.youtube.com]

Great song. Always liked these performances, especially the first one.

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StonesCat
For me, the only song I like on DW is Keith's other song, Too Rude. Just because there's some life to it and it's kind of enjoyable.

Personally, I just think that a lot of the "interesting" went out out of Keith's voice towards the late 70s, it's like a whole other person from the Exile and earlier days. And, while some of the later Keith songs kind of mask that with some jazzy touches, it still doesn't excite me.

Are you saying Keith's voice don't move you anymore?

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drewmaster

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DandelionPowderman

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StonesCat

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drewmaster
This is where Keith starts losing his touch, where his abilities as a songwriter begin slipping away. It's a nice mood piece, but somehow misses the mark compared to Keith’s great ballads. There’s really not much of a melody here, and that booming ‘80s production doesn’t help matters.

Drew

Yep, this is where the divide amongst Stones fans starts, with those who dig the torch-song ballad Keith, and those, like me, who don't care much for the make it up as you go lyric style and demo-type feel to the tracks. Slipping Away is the keeper from the later era for me.

And this one?

For me, the post-1983 Keith keepers are Slipping Away and Thief in the Night. Both are real songs ... and unforgettable.

Drew

And of course Thru And Thru.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-08-11 23:04 by Silver Dagger.

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treaclefingers

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Doxa

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treaclefingers
and even still, you'd agree it's the best song on Dirty Work.

Hmm... not far, but I still would give that title to the song, which follows it....

- Doxa

so true

Doxa answered your question for me, treacle

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Doxa

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DandelionPowderman
Then Happy (Exile's second single) tells the same story

?

Is Ronnie playing the drums there as well?><

No, I think Jagger was rather pleased with that song, since it actually is a terrific song, single A-side material, and he sings background vocals there as well... Besides "Happy", despite having just technically speaking the Twins there, nothing but vital and energetic Rolling Stones. Miller, seemingly, had an ear how the drums should sound in a context like that. Whereas "Sleep Tonight" sounds like a bunch of old and tired drunks trying to do a cliche-full by-numbers nightclub number whose audience had already passed out... Maestro Wood's amateur-like over-playing of drums icing the cake beautifully. If that's Keef's idea how the Stones AD 1986 supposed to sound like, good luck... Tough times those deep 80's years were...

I also think that "Sleep Tonight" is Keith's worst vocal performance ever in a Rolling Stones recording. There Keith trying to sound like Keef-character took over his natural delivery, which used to be so convincing ("You Got The Silver", "Coming Down Again", "All About You").

I seemingly don't like very much this number...

- Doxa

I was referring to the number of actual band members participating - re calling it a Stones number

There are only two on both tunes...

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Doxa
"Sleep Tonight" sounds like a bunch of old and tired drunks trying to do a cliche-full by-numbers nightclub number whose audience had already passed out.

- Doxa

Very well put, and also happens to describe every Tom Waits track I've ever heard. In fact, I blame Tom Waits for corrupting Keith's sound. Stuff like "That Feel" is just unlistenable to me.

I would also venture to guess that people who dig Tom Waits will almost certainly dig "Sleep Tonight" and people who don't, won't.

Drew

Thanks MingSubu for that clip - never seen it before. I actually like that relaxed, loose version better than the over-produced way too busy studio version. No Woody's tasteless drumming and also Keith sings better. More soulful and natural warm voice, not that 'over-interpretative drunken pirate crooner meets Tom Waits' one. Actually not so far from those classical Toronto tapes. There is also still that fresh vitality in his performance and presence.

- Doxa