Tell Me :
Talk
Lol.
Thank you.
It also explains why the Stones selected Ronnie. Wayne Perkins and Harvey Mandel didn't have the same sense of humour as Keith, Mick, Charlie, and Bill. Ronnie did though.
That is complete nonsense. With Faces, he was the band leader. Freedom to slack off is more like it.
Lester Bangs said it best when he described Woody joining the Stones as him taking a "civil service job."
one of the all-time best
Written by Ronnie Laine, funnily enough.
Five Guys is a great boxed set, I hasten to add. I think Ian McLagan had input in compiling it.
I think Mac had more than just 'input' compiling it.
Tomcasagrande, you mention several interesting points:
Why do you call "Overtures.." shocking?
And what do you mean by 'Ronnie Lane's fight to be on albums a la George Harrison'?
I didnt know that Rod had them bring along Jesse Ed Davis and strings for the last Faces tour? Did they have a different string section that they hired out in each city? I wonder if it caused resentment towards J.E.Davis himself from the band members.
I too had mixed feelings towards "Ooh La La" the album at some point, but realized this was insane. Yes there is "Fly in the Ointment" but doesnt every Faces album have one like it?
When sober, and maybe on his own. Increasingly rarely with The Stones. He seemed to really play with The Faces reunion. But I have spent a lot of Stones shows cringing (or laughing...depending on if I paid for the ticket) watching him solo.
Darn!!! I was really pissed when I read this while downloading UFC 155 a couple of days ago when I didn't know the outcome of the fight. I tried to avoid several newspapers on the internet in order not to get any spoilers and thought it would be a safe bet to check out iorr 'cause people here mostly moan about setlists and the fact that Jack Black thinks Zeppelin is the best rock band ever....man, was I wrong or what. Having said that, I think Junior Dos Santos will be back this year, stronger and better than ever.
Thanks TomCG. I agree re Overtures. I used to always think that it was not even a real Faces album; that either it was some Muzak type music, or it was the Faces but put out sort of like "No Stone Unturned" or "Metamorphosis". terrible album
I never saw it that Ronnie had a hard time getting his songs on an album. Most likely he could put whatever he want on there. The hard part might have been letting go of them, and seeing Rod sing them. On "Ooh LaLa" there's a few of those.
I think Overtures also isn't that well regarded amongst the Faces themselves. It has remained deleted for a long period of time.
However, I can remember, and it wasn't that long ago, circa 1992, when the only Faces cds available were a rather pricy Snakes & Ladders Japanese import, and Overtures & Beginners.
Talk about your favorite band.
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Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
Title5Take1
()
Date: December 30, 2012 17:58
I saw in an old Rolling Stone Magazine in the library in which the Stones were pushing Emotional Rescue, Mick—Woody was with him—said to the journalist (paraphrase), "I was once with Rod Stewart before a show, and the band had a trailer, but Rod took one whole half of the trailer and the rest of the band got the other half. He was treating them like sh*t and they didn't even see it."
Woody said, "He once let me change my trousers in his half of the trailer."
Woody said, "He once let me change my trousers in his half of the trailer."
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
whitem8
()
Date: December 30, 2012 18:13
I wouldn't say those were necessarily "natural points" of ending. It all seemed to implode when Rod realized he was the lead singer. And felt he was the main attraction. The others were marginalized. This is what Ronnie Lain warned of before hiring Stewart. He was very wary of having a "lead" singer. And he became more marginalized and less interested in Rod's solo stuff. Ronnie is a happy chap and naturally adept at smoothing over the rough patches in human relationships. But Rod was getting the consistent message, from the record company, tour promotors, and management that he was the "star". ANd the band descended into one person seeing them as a vehicle for "his" music, and the others partying like drunken sailors trying to ignore all the slights from the "lead singer". Ronnie is then courted by The Stones to "fill" in. They give him a lot of encouragement on his solo album, hanging out talking music, partying, and Ronnie, naturally feels appreciated and loves the party with The Stones. No brainer. Enter The Rolling Stones.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
tomcasagranda
()
Date: December 30, 2012 19:57
There's another few factors:
1. Andy Johns, the engineer on Goats Head Soup and It's Only Rock n Roll, said to Mick Taylor that he was greater than the other Stones, and that he was a virtuoso, and that he should leave the Stones, and strike out with a new band.
2. Rose Taylor also felt that Mick was due more songwriting credits than he got.
Therefore, you have outside pressure eating away at Mick Taylor.
3. After the European Tour of 1973, Keith was getting fed up of being harassed by the police. He became friendly, initially, with Crissie Wood, Ronnie's first wife, and then Ronnie. Ronnie offered Keith a place to stay, plus an opportunity, after years in France and Switzerland, and Jamaica, to reconnect with English musicians, and old mates from the 60s.
4. Ronnie's house, The Wick, was a bolt-hole for Keith, and a place for jams and songs to be written. The Stewart / Wood dynamic was now upset, as Wood was writing with other musicians, c.f. I've Got My Own Album.
5. The First Barbarians gig 1974 at Shepherds Bush, London. You could see Keith had a new best friend, and that Rod was concerned that Ronnie would be lured away.
6. Merck cocaine. It was a known fact that the Stones had better cocaine than the Faces, and better travel.
1. Andy Johns, the engineer on Goats Head Soup and It's Only Rock n Roll, said to Mick Taylor that he was greater than the other Stones, and that he was a virtuoso, and that he should leave the Stones, and strike out with a new band.
2. Rose Taylor also felt that Mick was due more songwriting credits than he got.
Therefore, you have outside pressure eating away at Mick Taylor.
3. After the European Tour of 1973, Keith was getting fed up of being harassed by the police. He became friendly, initially, with Crissie Wood, Ronnie's first wife, and then Ronnie. Ronnie offered Keith a place to stay, plus an opportunity, after years in France and Switzerland, and Jamaica, to reconnect with English musicians, and old mates from the 60s.
4. Ronnie's house, The Wick, was a bolt-hole for Keith, and a place for jams and songs to be written. The Stewart / Wood dynamic was now upset, as Wood was writing with other musicians, c.f. I've Got My Own Album.
5. The First Barbarians gig 1974 at Shepherds Bush, London. You could see Keith had a new best friend, and that Rod was concerned that Ronnie would be lured away.
6. Merck cocaine. It was a known fact that the Stones had better cocaine than the Faces, and better travel.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
VT22
()
Date: December 30, 2012 20:10
Quote
tomcasagranda
There's another few factors:
1. Andy Johns, the engineer on Goats Head Soup and It's Only Rock n Roll, said to Mick Taylor that he was greater than the other Stones, and that he was a virtuoso, and that he should leave the Stones, and strike out with a new band.
2. Rose Taylor also felt that Mick was due more songwriting credits than he got.
Therefore, you have outside pressure eating away at Mick Taylor.
3. After the European Tour of 1973, Keith was getting fed up of being harassed by the police. He became friendly, initially, with Crissie Wood, Ronnie's first wife, and then Ronnie. Ronnie offered Keith a place to stay, plus an opportunity, after years in France and Switzerland, and Jamaica, to reconnect with English musicians, and old mates from the 60s.
4. Ronnie's house, The Wick, was a bolt-hole for Keith, and a place for jams and songs to be written. The Stewart / Wood dynamic was now upset, as Wood was writing with other musicians, c.f. I've Got My Own Album.
5. The First Barbarians gig 1974 at Shepherds Bush, London. You could see Keith had a new best friend, and that Rod was concerned that Ronnie would be lured away.
6. Merck cocaine. It was a known fact that the Stones had better cocaine than the Faces, and better travel.
Lol.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
whitem8
()
Date: December 30, 2012 20:25
Great post tomcasagranda! Love the merck connection. Life, I am sure, looked a tad more glamorous with The Stones than sharing a cramped dressing room with the other three band members, while Rod had his own estate. Also, I like the connection of two guitarists coming together with very similar back grounds, and the common gypsy attitude towards life. A new collaborator, that shared more than just music, as opposed to Ronnie having to follow Rod's lead. Yet when Ronnie would strike out and create great melodies, guitar parts, and songs, to be met by the singer's indifference, due to his ego and insecurities. It was bound to happen.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
tomcasagranda
()
Date: December 30, 2012 20:29
Quote
whitem8
Great post tomcasagranda! Love the merck connection. Life, I am sure, looked a tad more glamorous with The Stones than sharing a cramped dressing room with the other three band members, while Rod had his own estate. Also, I like the connection of two guitarists coming together with very similar back grounds, and the common gypsy attitude towards life. A new collaborator, that shared more than just music, as opposed to Ronnie having to follow Rod's lead. Yet when Ronnie would strike out and create great melodies, guitar parts, and songs, to be met by the singer's indifference, due to his ego and insecurities. It was bound to happen.
Thank you.
It also explains why the Stones selected Ronnie. Wayne Perkins and Harvey Mandel didn't have the same sense of humour as Keith, Mick, Charlie, and Bill. Ronnie did though.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
Elmo Lewis
()
Date: December 30, 2012 20:32
In truth, Rod was THE attraction. The other Faces couldn't have drawn a decent crowd anywhere with out Rod. I love'em but Rod's name sold the tickets.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
DoomandGloom
()
Date: December 30, 2012 20:34
Funny thing is 2 LV's fighting over guitarist Ronnie..
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
tomcasagranda
()
Date: December 30, 2012 20:35
Agreed - Rod was the attraction, but his work, post Faces, has been a mess to say the least.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
donvis
()
Date: December 30, 2012 21:34
I remember hearing a quote on album rock radio saying Rod Stewart left the Faces because he could "no longer be in a group whose guitar player was on permanent loan to the Rolling Stones." I have always thought he used that as an excuse to leave himself. His heart was never in the Faces. He saved his best stuff for his solo career, and Atlantic Crossing was recorded without any of the Faces. It was an easy way out for Rod.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
71Tele
()
Date: December 30, 2012 21:39
Rod did have a solo career parellel to The Faces. Woody was deeply involved in those records (Exhibit A: Maggie Mae). It has been reported that the solo Rod albums were given a bigger budget than the Faces LP's, and that led to some resentment from other band members. Ronnie Lane got off the bus when he (rightly) figured things were moving toward "Rod Stewart And The Faces". This is how I remember them being billed the last couple of times I saw them (including in 1975 AFTER Ronnie had toured with the Stones).
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
soulsurvivor1
()
Date: December 31, 2012 00:53
I think it was YOKO!
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
Title5Take1
()
Date: December 31, 2012 02:40
Side note: Woody said he was allowed so much more freedom in his playing with the Stones than with the Faces. (I'd have guessed the more "established line-up/legendary band" of the Stones would have been the more restrictive. But Woody says different.)
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
loog droog
()
Date: December 31, 2012 04:37
Quote
Title5Take1
Side note: Woody said he was allowed so much more freedom in his playing with the Stones than with the Faces.
That is complete nonsense. With Faces, he was the band leader. Freedom to slack off is more like it.
Lester Bangs said it best when he described Woody joining the Stones as him taking a "civil service job."
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
JimmyTheSaint
()
Date: December 31, 2012 04:44
Debris is one of my all time favorite songs.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
Rockman
()
Date: December 31, 2012 04:46
Debris .... wonderful song
ROCKMAN
ROCKMAN
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
duke richardson
()
Date: December 31, 2012 06:00
Quote
Rockman
Debris .... wonderful song
one of the all-time best
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
howled
()
Date: December 31, 2012 07:23
It was all that Cocaine up their bums.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
tomcasagranda
()
Date: December 31, 2012 12:31
Quote
duke richardsonQuote
Rockman
Debris .... wonderful song
one of the all-time best
Written by Ronnie Laine, funnily enough.
Five Guys is a great boxed set, I hasten to add. I think Ian McLagan had input in compiling it.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
Palace Revolution 2000
()
Date: December 31, 2012 13:21
Quote
tomcasagrandaQuote
duke richardsonQuote
Rockman
Debris .... wonderful song
one of the all-time best
Written by Ronnie Laine, funnily enough.
Five Guys is a great boxed set, I hasten to add. I think Ian McLagan had input in compiling it.
I think Mac had more than just 'input' compiling it.
Tomcasagrande, you mention several interesting points:
Why do you call "Overtures.." shocking?
And what do you mean by 'Ronnie Lane's fight to be on albums a la George Harrison'?
I didnt know that Rod had them bring along Jesse Ed Davis and strings for the last Faces tour? Did they have a different string section that they hired out in each city? I wonder if it caused resentment towards J.E.Davis himself from the band members.
I too had mixed feelings towards "Ooh La La" the album at some point, but realized this was insane. Yes there is "Fly in the Ointment" but doesnt every Faces album have one like it?
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
tomcasagranda
()
Date: December 31, 2012 13:30
I just feel that Overtures is a bad album, and even sloppier than usual.
Ronnie did have to fight to place tracks on Faces albums.
Ronnie did have to fight to place tracks on Faces albums.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
StonesTod
()
Date: December 31, 2012 16:18
the boxset was basically mac's project from beginning to end...except the naming of it...that was our job.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
buffalo7478
()
Date: December 31, 2012 19:12
It sounded like The Faces were imploding in the mid-70s. Ron was doing his thing, too much alcohol all around. Rod had hit after hit, the Faces had few...really just one. No real reason for Rod to stay - though I wished that he did.
He went in a direction I did not like. Kenny Jones was a bore with The Who. Mac got to party a bit with The Stones. Woody went from a guy who really played to (after 1976) a a kind of clown...posing and 'weaving' but a shadow of what he was in The Faces. I think all lost.
I think The Stones lost, as they picked a guy who was fun to be around and was more for their party image, than for someone who could continue taking the band higher.
He went in a direction I did not like. Kenny Jones was a bore with The Who. Mac got to party a bit with The Stones. Woody went from a guy who really played to (after 1976) a a kind of clown...posing and 'weaving' but a shadow of what he was in The Faces. I think all lost.
I think The Stones lost, as they picked a guy who was fun to be around and was more for their party image, than for someone who could continue taking the band higher.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
TheGreek
()
Date: December 31, 2012 19:19
ronnie can play his arse off!Quote
buffalo7478
It sounded like The Faces were imploding in the mid-70s. Ron was doing his thing, too much alcohol all around. Rod had hit after hit, the Faces had few...really just one. No real reason for Rod to stay - though I wished that he did.
He went in a direction I did not like. Kenny Jones was a bore with The Who. Mac got to party a bit with The Stones. Woody went from a guy who really played to (after 1976) a a kind of clown...posing and 'weaving' but a shadow of what he was in The Faces. I think all lost.
I think The Stones lost, as they picked a guy who was fun to be around and was more for their party image, than for someone who could continue taking the band higher.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
buffalo7478
()
Date: December 31, 2012 21:26
Quote
TheGreekronnie can play his arse off!Quote
buffalo7478
It sounded like The Faces were imploding in the mid-70s. Ron was doing his thing, too much alcohol all around. Rod had hit after hit, the Faces had few...really just one. No real reason for Rod to stay - though I wished that he did.
He went in a direction I did not like. Kenny Jones was a bore with The Who. Mac got to party a bit with The Stones. Woody went from a guy who really played to (after 1976) a a kind of clown...posing and 'weaving' but a shadow of what he was in The Faces. I think all lost.
I think The Stones lost, as they picked a guy who was fun to be around and was more for their party image, than for someone who could continue taking the band higher.
When sober, and maybe on his own. Increasingly rarely with The Stones. He seemed to really play with The Faces reunion. But I have spent a lot of Stones shows cringing (or laughing...depending on if I paid for the ticket) watching him solo.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
talkcheap
()
Date: December 31, 2012 22:46
Mick Taylor indirectly by leaving the Stones and Ron Wood had been thought of by the other Stones allready in 1969 when Brian was fired. And Rod Stewart was going solo.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
The Stones
()
Date: January 1, 2013 14:45
Quote
Midnight Toker
Tonight, it was Cain Velasquez.
Darn!!! I was really pissed when I read this while downloading UFC 155 a couple of days ago when I didn't know the outcome of the fight. I tried to avoid several newspapers on the internet in order not to get any spoilers and thought it would be a safe bet to check out iorr 'cause people here mostly moan about setlists and the fact that Jack Black thinks Zeppelin is the best rock band ever....man, was I wrong or what. Having said that, I think Junior Dos Santos will be back this year, stronger and better than ever.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
Palace Revolution 2000
()
Date: January 1, 2013 15:11
Quote
buffalo7478
It sounded like The Faces were imploding in the mid-70s. Ron was doing his thing, too much alcohol all around. Rod had hit after hit, the Faces had few...really just one. No real reason for Rod to stay - though I wished that he did.
He went in a direction I did not like. Kenny Jones was a bore with The Who. Mac got to party a bit with The Stones. Woody went from a guy who really played to (after 1976) a a kind of clown...posing and 'weaving' but a shadow of what he was in The Faces. I think all lost.
I think The Stones lost, as they picked a guy who was fun to be around and was more for their party image, than for someone who could continue taking the band higher.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
Palace Revolution 2000
()
Date: January 1, 2013 15:16
Quote
tomcasagranda
I just feel that Overtures is a bad album, and even sloppier than usual.
Ronnie did have to fight to place tracks on Faces albums.
Thanks TomCG. I agree re Overtures. I used to always think that it was not even a real Faces album; that either it was some Muzak type music, or it was the Faces but put out sort of like "No Stone Unturned" or "Metamorphosis". terrible album
I never saw it that Ronnie had a hard time getting his songs on an album. Most likely he could put whatever he want on there. The hard part might have been letting go of them, and seeing Rod sing them. On "Ooh LaLa" there's a few of those.
Re: Who broke up the Faces?
Posted by:
tomcasagranda
()
Date: January 1, 2013 15:36
Quote
Palace Revolution 2000Quote
tomcasagranda
I just feel that Overtures is a bad album, and even sloppier than usual.
Ronnie did have to fight to place tracks on Faces albums.
Thanks TomCG. I agree re Overtures. I used to always think that it was not even a real Faces album; that either it was some Muzak type music, or it was the Faces but put out sort of like "No Stone Unturned" or "Metamorphosis". terrible album
I never saw it that Ronnie had a hard time getting his songs on an album. Most likely he could put whatever he want on there. The hard part might have been letting go of them, and seeing Rod sing them. On "Ooh LaLa" there's a few of those.
I think Overtures also isn't that well regarded amongst the Faces themselves. It has remained deleted for a long period of time.
However, I can remember, and it wasn't that long ago, circa 1992, when the only Faces cds available were a rather pricy Snakes & Ladders Japanese import, and Overtures & Beginners.
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