It seems rushed. And Keith can't lock in that groove...

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Loudei
It seems rushed. And Keith can't lock in that groove...

Same problem with Under my Thumb. Keith is ok, though.

Keith is NOT okay on this song. What happens nowadays is, during the last outro, as the song is winding up to the climax, Keith always STOPS PLAYING THE RIFF and starts soloing discordantly, often with little regard to the music going on around him. In the old days he would LOCK IN with Charlie on that ending, and build it up and carry the song home, the repetition of the riff was part of the song's signature.

NOW, once the repeating riff is removed, Keith starts posing for the cameras or walking aimlessly around the stage, the whole song sounds weird and disjointed and thin.

Go back and listen to the ending on ANY older version of Tumbling Dice -- LA Friday, Brussells Affair, or any '72, '75, '81/'82 version....the outro of the song has a churning, building groove, that grows as Mick ad libs over the repeating riff at the end, and it picks up momentum.

THEN listen to a recent one, and right when the song starts to "levitate" or pick up steam, you will hear Keith's rhythm guitar suddenly STOP and his avant-garde noodlings begin, twank, twang, plink plink, leaving Ronnie to cover for him, which he can't do properly because his guitar is in standard E, not open G....this song is a trainwreck in pretty much any modern incarnation.

Plus Ronnie Wood's solo these days is incredibly LOUD and over-the-top, drowning out almost the entire band...why? To cover for Keith.

Oddly, they've slowed down JJF and Street Fighting Man considerably in the last couple of years. Those used to be played at breakneck speed.

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Turning To Gold
Keith is NOT okay on this song. What happens nowadays is, during the last outro, as the song is winding up to the climax, Keith always STOPS PLAYING THE RIFF and starts soloing discordantly, often with little regard to the music going on around him. In the old days he would LOCK IN with Charlie on that ending, and build it up and carry the song home, the repetition of the riff was part of the song's signature.

NOW, once the repeating riff is removed, Keith starts posing for the cameras or walking aimlessly around the stage, the whole song sounds weird and disjointed and thin.

Go back and listen to the ending on ANY older version of Tumbling Dice -- LA Friday, Brussells Affair, or any '72, '75, '81/'82 version....the outro of the song has a churning, building groove, that grows as Mick ad libs over the repeating riff at the end, and it picks up momentum.

THEN listen to a recent one, and right when the song starts to "levitate" or pick up steam, you will hear Keith's rhythm guitar suddenly STOP and his avant-garde noodlings begin, twank, twang, plink plink, leaving Ronnie to cover for him, which he can't do properly because his guitar is in standard E, not open G....this song is a trainwreck in pretty much any modern incarnation.

Plus Ronnie Wood's solo these days is incredibly LOUD and over-the-top, drowning out almost the entire band...why? To cover for Keith.

+1

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drbryant
Oddly, they've slowed down JJF and Street Fighting Man considerably in the last couple of years. Those used to be played at breakneck speed.

Yea, just compare these two:

2012 sloooooow....





2003 Fast and thight!

Keith doesnt drive the song and this is one of those songs he has to be in charge. But thank God it isnt slow because the slow never ending Vegas-era versions are the worst. I think the tempo is much better now. Of course nothing comes close to the Taylor-era versions.

But I prefer this to any other version since 1981. video: [www.youtube.com]

+1 : good sens.

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Redhotcarpet

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Turning To Gold
Keith is NOT okay on this song. What happens nowadays is, during the last outro, as the song is winding up to the climax, Keith always STOPS PLAYING THE RIFF and starts soloing discordantly, often with little regard to the music going on around him. In the old days he would LOCK IN with Charlie on that ending, and build it up and carry the song home, the repetition of the riff was part of the song's signature.

NOW, once the repeating riff is removed, Keith starts posing for the cameras or walking aimlessly around the stage, the whole song sounds weird and disjointed and thin.

Go back and listen to the ending on ANY older version of Tumbling Dice -- LA Friday, Brussells Affair, or any '72, '75, '81/'82 version....the outro of the song has a churning, building groove, that grows as Mick ad libs over the repeating riff at the end, and it picks up momentum.

THEN listen to a recent one, and right when the song starts to "levitate" or pick up steam, you will hear Keith's rhythm guitar suddenly STOP and his avant-garde noodlings begin, twank, twang, plink plink, leaving Ronnie to cover for him, which he can't do properly because his guitar is in standard E, not open G....this song is a trainwreck in pretty much any modern incarnation.

Plus Ronnie Wood's solo these days is incredibly LOUD and over-the-top, drowning out almost the entire band...why? To cover for Keith.

+1

***
I'm just a Bad Boy Boogie

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Redhotcarpet
Keith doesnt drive the song and this is one of those songs he has to be in charge. But thank God it isnt slow because the slow never ending Vegas-era versions are the worst. I think the tempo is much better now. Of course nothing comes close to the Taylor-era versions.

But I prefer this to any other version since 1981. video: [www.youtube.com]

All the versions from 1989 and on are faster than the 72/73-versions, if you're talking about TD.

I quess we ought to be happy their still playing at all. Keith hasn't been much of a player for years and it beats me why people still pay a fortune to see him. Nostalga I quess?

..... awwwwwww didn't know ya felt that way ... okay maybe best ya stay in ya room ...hhAAheee



ROCKMAN

Keith once said that he prefers the slower version of TD but Mick likes it fast.

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DandelionPowderman

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Redhotcarpet
Keith doesnt drive the song and this is one of those songs he has to be in charge. But thank God it isnt slow because the slow never ending Vegas-era versions are the worst. I think the tempo is much better now. Of course nothing comes close to the Taylor-era versions.

But I prefer this to any other version since 1981. video: [www.youtube.com]

All the versions from 1989 and on are faster than the 72/73-versions, if you're talking about TD.

Yes but the 1972 and 1973 versions were better. But ok I didnt know all the 1989- versions were faster, they felt a l o t longer and endless. This 2014 is better. More tempo.

this song has never been good live. no wonder they keep tinkering with it.

What? Are you having a laugh? It's an absolute classic. I've always loved hearing it live. One of the welcome warhorses as far as I'm concerned (I'm talking about witnessing it live, not watching it on a computer).

Two other songs I would like to hear slower - Satisfaction and IORR (non-Chuck Berrified version). Never happen tho

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Turning To Gold
Keith is NOT okay on this song. What happens nowadays is, during the last outro, as the song is winding up to the climax, Keith always STOPS PLAYING THE RIFF and starts soloing discordantly, often with little regard to the music going on around him. In the old days he would LOCK IN with Charlie on that ending, and build it up and carry the song home, the repetition of the riff was part of the song's signature.

NOW, once the repeating riff is removed, Keith starts posing for the cameras or walking aimlessly around the stage, the whole song sounds weird and disjointed and thin.

Go back and listen to the ending on ANY older version of Tumbling Dice -- LA Friday, Brussells Affair, or any '72, '75, '81/'82 version....the outro of the song has a churning, building groove, that grows as Mick ad libs over the repeating riff at the end, and it picks up momentum.

THEN listen to a recent one, and right when the song starts to "levitate" or pick up steam, you will hear Keith's rhythm guitar suddenly STOP and his avant-garde noodlings begin, twank, twang, plink plink, leaving Ronnie to cover for him, which he can't do properly because his guitar is in standard E, not open G....this song is a trainwreck in pretty much any modern incarnation.

Plus Ronnie Wood's solo these days is incredibly LOUD and over-the-top, drowning out almost the entire band...why? To cover for Keith.

Yes, I agree, but only in respect to the Bigger Bang tour. Keith's off-key-solos were horrible ... But I doubt that it is a matter of speed. In the eighties they played it even faster and nothing was wrong with it - the problem is Keith's increasing off-key-mania in the last years (on the present tour SFTD).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-06-11 12:36 by RobertJohnson.

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Redhotcarpet

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DandelionPowderman

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Redhotcarpet
Keith doesnt drive the song and this is one of those songs he has to be in charge. But thank God it isnt slow because the slow never ending Vegas-era versions are the worst. I think the tempo is much better now. Of course nothing comes close to the Taylor-era versions.

But I prefer this to any other version since 1981. video: [www.youtube.com]

All the versions from 1989 and on are faster than the 72/73-versions, if you're talking about TD.

Yes but the 1972 and 1973 versions were better. But ok I didnt know all the 1989- versions were faster, they felt a l o t longer and endless. This 2014 is better. More tempo.

Er, the 1989 version are breakneck-speed compared to 2014









And the "snail" versions:







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-06-10 17:07 by DandelionPowderman.

Yes, another favourite transformed into transport distance. Since 1989 I'm afraid. I wouldn't bother if they ditched it. But of course they won't.

Love You Live and Knebworth TD are the best. Played very bluesy then without back up singers, just good rocking BLUES.
By the way I also love the gospel Vegas versions (which are closer to the original)
Tumbling Dice IS the perfect Rolling Stones song for me.
I can't imagine a Stones concert without TD.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2014-06-10 17:36 by 1962.

LYL TD has at least one very prominent back up singer

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Stoneage
Yes, another favourite transformed into transport distance. Since 1989 I'm afraid. I wouldn't bother if they ditched it. But of course they won't.

+1 and totally agree on LYL and Knebworth, I love those versions but honestly 1973 is the one.

The Rolling Stones have many gears!

Tumbling Dice has been typed too fast.... ;-)

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Loudei
It seems rushed. And Keith can't lock in that groove...

Since he wrote the song I guess he can play it anyway he wants to...Keith is going jazz...



2 1 2 0

And the "snail" versions:





Without the 2014 intrusive backing vocals too... Love it.

***
I'm just a Bad Boy Boogie

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powerage78
And the "snail" versions:





Without the 2014 intrusive backing vocals too... Love it.

I love it, too, but I think it's dragging a bit. Not too crazy about Taylor's Esus counterplaying either. But all in all, the 73 versions were cool.

That said, I like the versions that are closer to the brilliant, unsurpassable original studio version.

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DandelionPowderman
Not too crazy about Taylor's Esus counterplaying either.

I am. Just listening to it while writing this... I think that gives the song a majestic side-kick in creating the atmopshere and emphasizing the hypnotic groove. The song never has flied on stage with such a flow. Pure genious. Transcendental. Damn, that "Dice" from BRUSSELS AFFAIR is one the peak moments in their life. Both Richards and Taylor are dropping incredible notes out of their instruments, every damn note and sound is perfect, each serving the song brilliantly. A guitar heaven with no bullshit. "Oh-la-laa" like Jagger says.

- Doxa



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2014-06-11 13:38 by Doxa.

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Doxa

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DandelionPowderman
Not too crazy about Taylor's Esus counterplaying either.

I am. Just listening to it while writing this... I think that gives the song a majestic side-kick in creating the atmopshere and emphasizing the hypnotic groove. The song never has flied on stage with such a flow. Pure genious. Transcendental. Damn, that "Dice" from BRUSSELS AFFAIR is one the peak moments in their life. Both Richards and Taylor are dropping incredible notes out of their instruments, every damn note and sound is perfect, each serving the song brilliantly. A guitar heaven with no bullshit. "Oh-la-laa" like Jagger says.

- Doxa

Luckily, how we perceive music is subjective

to me 75,78 and 81-82 version were the best,,,when keith was riding the riff,,,its rare now,,,happens sometimes.