need to listen to this:



what a groove! he's got the touch.

Technicall not a great drummer of course (like Charlie).
But nevertheless a very good, tastful and versatile drummer . . !

And btw. I always liked much of L. Russel's gospel influenced stuff, like Stranger in a strange land, Humingbird,etc. or with Cockers Mad Dogs tour or even his JJF version from the Bangla D. concert.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-03-12 04:52 by CousinC.

I still think :
- he sucks
- he's the luckiest Brit of the 20th century...

Gonna see him in Randers/DK in June. Can´t wait.
My second Beatle (after McC).

I´m not a Beatles fan at all, btw.

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dcba
I still think :
- he sucks
- he's the luckiest Brit of the 20th century...

A foolish comment.

A drummer in a good band is more than his technical ability. When the Beatles were emerging as the great studio band they would become, Ringo was a key component. He was able to sit there and go through hours and hours of developing ideas with the songwriters and making the arrangements come alive. His playing was always what the song needed - no more, no less, and often brilliant. Anyone who listens to the body of work and concludes "he sucks"...well, you get my drift.

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dcba
I still think :
- he sucks
- he's the luckiest Brit of the 20th century...

I'm almost inclined to agree. For a truly great "beat group" drummer listen to Bobby Elliott in The Hollies, & imagine how much better The Beatles would've sounded with him (& how much worse The Hollies would've sounded with Ringo).

...having said that, I used to think that Bill Wyman was the 2nd luckiest Brit of the 20th Century, but in recent years I've grown to appreciate just what a genius he was / is.

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Sleepy City

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dcba
I still think :
- he sucks
- he's the luckiest Brit of the 20th century...

I'm almost inclined to agree. For a truly great "beat group" drummer listen to Bobby Elliott in The Hollies, & imagine how much better The Beatles would've sounded with him (& how much worse The Hollies would've sounded with Ringo).

...having said that, I used to think that Bill Wyman was the 2nd luckiest Brit of the 20th Century, but in recent years I've grown to appreciate just what a genius he was / is.

Yeah, whenever I want to judge the Beatles and their music I always use the standard of the Hollies to compare them to.

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Sleepy City

Quote
dcba
I still think :
- he sucks
- he's the luckiest Brit of the 20th century...

I'm almost inclined to agree. For a truly great "beat group" drummer listen to Bobby Elliott in The Hollies, & imagine how much better The Beatles would've sounded with him (& how much worse The Hollies would've sounded with Ringo).

...having said that, I used to think that Bill Wyman was the 2nd luckiest Brit of the 20th Century, but in recent years I've grown to appreciate just what a genius he was / is.

Yes, entirely myopic short sighted comments. There is a great thread about Favorite Drummers, and I can't recall who, but published an incredible retort of quote from dozens of famous drummers lauding Ringo. Ringo was the right man for the job that created the famous backbeat. Used roto toms for the first time on rock records, and never was into pretentious drum solos, and added a crisp total back beat on his only solo on The End. Ring had tons of feel and was poorly recorded in the early sixties, which is why the Mono versions of their early stuff is essential. But you are still skeptical then listen to Long Tall Sally off the Beatles at the BEEB. And Rain. Man if that doesn't sway you, then there is no use.

Ringo wouldn't have lasted a week with The Rolling Stones (even Mick Avory wasn't good enough for Keith).

His drums always sounded like he was hitting Chase And Sandborn coffee cans. Maybe not his fault but yes he was lucky.

I'm sorry, I can't believe the ignorance here about Ringo.

Maybe he WAS totally fitting the Beatles sound. With his ballroom 1940's drumming style he never let the listener be aware of the beat in a Fab Four song. Therefore people concentrated on the melodic aspects of Beatles songs and marvelled at them.

The Stones drumming WAS sexy almost from Day One. It was dangerous, infectious and corrupting as was the Stones themselves.

The Beatles's music was silly gentle harmless powerless, and the drumming was fitting all this...

His ability as a drummer is very underrated. There are far more drummers who is inspired by his drumming than, say, Charlie Watts.

Listen to Rain or A Day In The Life. I would like to see any drummer copy that!

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71Tele

Quote
dcba
I still think :
- he sucks
- he's the luckiest Brit of the 20th century...

A foolish comment.

A drummer in a good band is more than his technical ability. When the Beatles were emerging as the great studio band they would become, Ringo was a key component. He was able to sit there and go through hours and hours of developing ideas with the songwriters and making the arrangements come alive. His playing was always what the song needed - no more, no less, and often brilliant. Anyone who listens to the body of work and concludes "he sucks"...well, you get my drift.

Thanks 71Tele. + 100 %

Quote
dcba
Maybe he WAS totally fitting the Beatles sound. With his ballroom 1940's drumming style he never let the listener be aware of the beat in a Fab Four song. Therefore people concentrated on the melodic aspects of Beatles songs and marvelled at them.

The Stones drumming WAS sexy almost from Day One. It was dangerous, infectious and corrupting as was the Stones themselves.

The Beatles's music was silly gentle harmless powerless, and the drumming was fitting all this...

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whitem8
There is a great thread about Favorite Drummers, and I can't recall who, but published an incredible retort of quote from dozens of famous drummers lauding Ringo.

here you go, whitem8!

Kenny Arnoff -- "I consider him one of the greatest innovators of rock drumming and believe that he has been one of the greatest influences on rock drumming today... Ringo has influenced drummers more than they will ever realize or admit. Ringo laid down the fundamental rock beat that drummers are playing today and they probably don't even realize it. (Modern Drummer,Oct. 1987) . . Ringo always approached the song more like a songwriter than a drummer. He always served the music." (Modern Drummer, Dec. 1987)

Max Weinberg -- "D. J. Fontana had introduced me to the power of the big beat. Ringo convinced me just how powerful that rhythm could be. Ringo's beat was heard around the world and he drew the spotlight toward rock and roll drummer. From ;his matched grip style to his pioneering use of staggered tom tom fills, his influence in rock drumming was as important and wide spread as Gene Krupa's had been in jazz." (The Big Beat, 1984)

Jim Keltner -- "I will always be there to support him. He's more than a dear friend. He's like an idol. He's everything to me. I still think of him musically every time I sit down and play drums. He's a very important guy to me. (Discoveries magazine, April 1993)

Phil Collins, drummer for Genesis -- "I think he's vastly underrated. The drum fills on A Day In The Life are very complex things. You could take a great drummer today and say, 'I want it like that.' They wouldn't know what to do." (interview for The Making of Sgt. Pepper, 1992)

Alex Van Halen -- " One of the most interesting things about Ringo is how he manage to maintain a level of self-esteem -- in addition to being a great player, of course. But he wasn't overshadowed as a human being by McCartney, Lennon or Harrison. I think he did a wonderful thing for drums because drummers would see him and think, "Hey, he's part of it, too." (Modern Drummer magazine, July 1993)

Andy Sturmer, drummer for Jellyfish -- "Ringo is a great guy and really amazing drummer. He has that feel that's between a shuffle and straight eights -- Ringo territory that nobody else can do. He played some amazing stuff on that (Time Takes Time) album." ( Modern Drummer, Aug. 1993)

D. J. Fontana -- "I was playing maracas or something behind him, just listening to him. I swear he never varied the tempo. He played that back beat and never got off it. Man, you couldn't have moved him with a crane. It was amazing. He played a hell of a back beat, Man, and that's where it's at." (interview for The Big Beat by Max Weinberg)

Don Was -- "As a drummer, he influenced three generations of rock drummers. It's not very flashy playing, but it's very musical. Instead of just counting the bars, he's playing the song, and he puts fills in unusual places that are directed by the vocal." (The St. Louis Post Dispatch, 1992)

George Martin -- "Ringo always got and still gets a unique sound out of his drums, as sound as distinctive as his voice. ... Ringo gets a looser deeper sound out of his drums that is unique. ...This detailed attention to the tone of his drums is one of the reasons for Ringo's brilliance. Another is that although Ringo does not keep time with a metronome accuracy, he has unrivaled feel for a song. If his timing fluctuates, it invariably does so in the right place at the right time, keep the right atmosphere going on the track and give it a rock solid foundation. This held true for every single Beatles number Richie played ... Ringo also was a great tom tom player." ( Summer of Love, 1994)

Mike Finkelstein -- "If you have ever been in a band where you had to recreate Beatle songs, you would have realized that Ringo Starr was no slouch. Those drum parts were very tricky and subtle. He did have a special ability to create interesting rhythmic structures within the music. This gave the Beatles a unique sound without loosing that distinctive drive in rock and roll. ... Ringo moved smoothly from verse to chorus without loosing the groove by subtly changing a texture in the rhythm. Ringo is an important drummer to study well." (Teach Yourself Rock Drumming, 1979)

Bob Cianci -- "He must have done something right. People today still look for people who play like Ringo. If you don't believe me, just check the musical ads. On top of all this, he certainly inspired countless millions of teenagers worldwide to learn drums. There's no doubt it, Ringo's a very important rock drummer. ... What Ringo does on the most basic of terms is make the music feel good. He refers to his playing as being fraught with silly fills due to his self-admitted lack of technique, but he says it proudly. ... Sometimes chops do not a real drummer make." (Great Rock Drummers of the 60s, 1989)

Peter Blake -- "Ringo is one of the most important drummers of the 20th century. While he hasn't got any technique to speak of, he realizes how important It is for a song to feel good. His feel is absolutely tremendous. He got some great sounds on the Beatles records. It wasn't all production and microphones, a lot of it was down to the way he tuned them. ... He has tremendous basic ability. Obviously there were people playing in a straight-forward manner before him, but he had a definite feel and he changed pop drumming around. He changed the sound from hat of the high-pitched jazz drummers. I think he's tremendous." (Speaking Words of Wisdom)

Mark Lewisohn -- "It is true that on only a handful of occasions during all of the several hundred session tapes and thousands of recording hours can Ringo be heard to have made a mistake or wavered in his beat. His work was remarkably consistent and excellent, from 1962 right through 1970." ( The Beatles Recording Sessions, 1988)

George Martin -- "Ringo has a tremendous feel for a song and he always helped us hit the right tempo the first time. He was rock solid. This made the recording of all the Beatle songs so much easier." (interviewed in 1988 for The Beatles Recording Sessions by Mark Lewisohn)

Tim Riley -- "Ringo wanted to serve the songs rather than show off. As a song writer's drummer, Ringo was the type of musician who could follow instructions as he completed the overall sound. His commitment to the music was bigger than his ego." ( Tell Me Why, 1988)

Kenny Aronoff -- "He consistently came up with new ideas that always seemed perfect for the song, but it wasn't just a matter of him picking a basic beat for a song, because lots of drummers could do that. Ringo definitely had the right kind of personality and creative ideas for The Beatles music. You will rarely find a Beatles song without something noticeable that Ringo played or didn't play." (Modern Drummer magazine, Oct. 1987)

Al Kooper -- "Sgt. Pepper was the album that changed drumming more than anything else. Before that album, drum fills in rock and roll were pretty rudimentary, all much the same, and this record had what I call space fills where they would leave a tremendous amount of air. It was most appealing to me musically and the sound of the drums got much better. What I had to figure out now was what am I going to do to get drums to sound like that." (Summer of Love by George Martin, 1994)

Martin Torgoff -- "If I could think of a single passage in which Ringo's quintessential style as a drummer is most identifiable, it could well be something as, say, the drumming behind George's guitar solo in Paul's "Let It Be" after the organ trails off. There, in simple 4-4 time, Ringo comes in with a trademark thump of his base drum, clear tattering snare, and his insistent smashing of the high hat, unvarying, unyielding, yet distinctively Ringo, and you can't help but smile not for its banality but because it is so perfectly adequate and because one can readily envision Ringo behind his kit as he plays, his beringed fingers clutching his sticks, swaying beatifically from side to side as he gets on with his work, blinking those astonishingly saturnine blue eyes." (The Compleat Beatles, 1985)

Dino Danelli, drummer for The Rascals -- "I liked him. He had great style. I never saw anyone play the way he did. I liked his simplicity. (1984 interview for The Big Beat by Max Weinberg)

George Martin -- "I did quickly realize that Ringo was an excellent drummer for what was required. He's not a technical drummer. Men like Buddy Rich and Gene Krupa would run rings around him, but he is a good solid rock drummer with a steady beat, and he knows how to get the right sound out of his drums. Above all, he does have an individual sound. You can tell Ringo's drums from anyone else's and that character was a definite asset to the Beatles' early recordings." (All You Need Is Ears, 1979)

Mike McCartney -- "There were quite a few drummers around Liverpool and I used to go home and tell Paul about Ringo. I often saw him play with Rory Storm. ...With Rory he was a very inventive drummer. He goes around the drums like crazy. He doesn't just hit them -- he invents sounds." (1983 interview for The Beatles: A Celebration by Geoffrey Guilliano, 1992)

Max Weinberg -- "More than any other drummer, Ringo Starr changed my life. The impact and memory of that band on Ed Sullivan Show in 1964 will never leave me. I can still see Ringo in the back moving that beat with his whole body, his right hand swinging off his sock cymbal while his left hand pounds the snare. He was fantastic, but I think what got to me the most was his smile. I knew he was having the time of his life." (The Big Beat, 1984)

Lenny Kaye -- "He was always meant to be utilitarian, a drummer to provide feisty beat. He did this directly with wit imagination and the famous Ringo personality. And his Spartan Ludwig kit showed his ability to cut economically to the heart of the rhythm." (interview for The Compleat Beatles, 1985)

Martin Torgoff -- "As a drummer, he was a natural, purely intuitive, remarkably tasteful, spirited, but always basic, a proponent of less is more school of minimal drumming. ...He had an uncanny understanding of John's rhythm and Paul's base line. Time and again, the Beatles rode his backbeat to glory. Precisely because he never overstated a beat, or over accented a phrase (unless it was appropriate) he managed to get more mileage out of his licks than most drummers could ever dream of. The results were extraordinary." (The Compleat Beatles, 1985)

Don Was -- "Ringo's drums are one of the greatest things you can have on a record."

Buddy Rich -- "Ringo Starr was adequate. No more than that." (Speaking Words of Wisdom by Spencer Leigh [Leigh's note: "Buddy Rich's opinions were as forceful as his drumming. So don't be dismayed, Ringo, he paying you a compliment."])

Dave Ballinger -- "Technically brilliant drummers do not necessary make good rock drummers. ...You don't have to be a technical Buddy Rich type drummer, you just need to be inventive. He (Ringo) did things I would never have thought of doing." (interview for Speaking Words of Wisdom)

Chris Whitten -- " I think I understand why he (Paul) loves Ringo, now after working with him. Paul loves 50s Rock 'n' Roll and Ringo is a great 50s Rock 'n' Roll drummer." (Rhythm magazine, 1990)

Hal Howland -- "It is fascinating to trace the drummer's stylistic development from rock-steady club veteran to studio innovator ... Ringo's command of an exhaustive list of arrangements and new originals is matched only by his versitility. (review for Modern Drummer magazine, June 1995)

ineedadrink! YOU DESERVE A DRINK! WOW! that is great! That is exactly what I was talking about thanks so much! I love reading all that love for Ringo! Awesome!

Buddy Rich calling Ringo "adequate" IS a compliment. I once heard him say that Ginger Baker was "pretty good".

Statements above about Ringo sucking just prove how many narrow minded people are on this board!

Sgt. Pepper has a pulse, a heartbeat, like it is a living organism. I credit Paul's bass and Ringo's drumming for that. Ringo's drumming for me is tasteful and well chosen. He fits the song. I say the same thing about Wyman's bass playing.

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dcba
The Beatles's music was silly gentle harmless powerless, and the drumming was fitting all this...

gentle? harmless? powerless?!? take a look at this performance:


especially the solo from 1:43 to 2:02. ringo is hardly playing gentle and powerless. that is ROCK. 1964 and he's hitting that cymbal like he was dave grohl in nirvana. beatles = pop? hardly.

That DC show is equivalent to the Stones' TAMI performance, prime early stuff when the energy was good, the music fun and at least for The Beatles before it got to be all too much. It is my favorite live performance from the early years. It's brilliant.

If you want to hear a white man singing 'Long Tall Sally' in 1964 with a truly hard-hitting rock drummer...





The Beatles sounded like The Carpenters in comparison.

(The drummer is Barrie Jenkins, later of The Animals).

'Good Golly Miss Molly' is even better!

@ Sleepy City

Remember hearing I Am The Walrus from Anthology 2 in Tower Records one day and was floored by the drum track, which was coming out quite loud and clear in one spot of the store.

It was brilliantly simple, steady and solidly heavy.

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slew
Statements above about Ringo sucking just prove how many narrow minded people are on this board!

Not just narrow-minded, musically inept. One more bad word about Ringo and I'll show you the blade. Now go listen to "Something" which is an incredibly complex and crafty bit of drumming.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-03-12 20:57 by 71Tele.

Ringo is a good drummer.

That being said, What I don't like is that flat, thumpy sound he (or George Martin) created about 1/2 way through the Beatles career and has stuck ever since.

i saw an interview with ringo years ago and he said he tried to get levon helm's drum sound by putting towels on his drum heads.

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BluzDude
Ringo is a good drummer.

That being said, What I don't like is that flat, thumpy sound he (or George Martin) created about 1/2 way through the Beatles career and has stuck ever since.

I love that sound. For me the best snare sound he ever got was not on a Beatles record, but on John Lennon Plastic Ono Band. One thwack of that snare and you know exactly who it is. Listen to his snare on "Isolation" and the very simple - yet perfect - fills he does.

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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2011-03-12 22:14 by 71Tele.