Rip This Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> hey Radio Marv............it sounds like you are
> struggling with the episode(s) so here's something
> maybe that will help wrap it up for
> you..........it's from AP writer Jocelyn Noveck.
> Hope this helps..........
>


Golly thanks

but why the heck do you think I am stuggling with it? I don't need help with it?
I am actaully very pleased with it. what did I say to imply I was in any way unhappy with the episode?

I am certian Chase intended the viewer to feel Tonys death. I undertand art and open endings, and I dig this one. MY conclusion is that Tony died and I presented a good case to support that theory... present a strong case that supports a different ending and I will entertain that as a possible ending. But with the themes of this season I think its over for Tony and he was killed. Heck, I only gave 5 reasons why I believe in this thoery, I have more (like the bell ringing just as it cuts to black, I would say the bell tolls for Tony) but wouldn't care to beat a dead horse.

The actor who played Agent Harris might also shed some more light on this theory.
follow this link
[tinyurl.com]

he says the scene as origionaly cut had the creepy Members Only guy coming out of the bathroom and on Tony before the cut to black. It was cut longer and with a more solid feeling of Tony getting killed.

I think Tony is dead until David Chase says he is not, and then I will gladly watch more adventures in the world of the Sopranos.
but that aint gonna happen cuz TONY IS DEAD

Yeah Tony's dead until they come with the dvd for the last season that has 5 different endings.

RadioMarv Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Rip This Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > hey Radio Marv............it sounds like you
> are
> > struggling with the episode(s) so here's
> something
> > maybe that will help wrap it up for
> > you..........it's from AP writer Jocelyn
> Noveck.
> > Hope this helps..........
> >
>
>
> Golly thanks
>
> but why the heck do you think I am stuggling with
> it? I don't need help with it?
> I am actaully very pleased with it. what did I say
> to imply I was in any way unhappy with the
> episode?
>
> I am certian Chase intended the viewer to feel
> Tonys death. I undertand art and open endings,
> and I dig this one. MY conclusion is that Tony
> died and I presented a good case to support that
> theory... present a strong case that supports a
> different ending and I will entertain that as a
> possible ending. But with the themes of this
> season I think its over for Tony and he was
> killed. Heck, I only gave 5 reasons why I believe
> in this thoery, I have more (like the bell ringing
> just as it cuts to black, I would say the bell
> tolls for Tony) but wouldn't care to beat a dead
> horse.
>
> The actor who played Agent Harris might also shed
> some more light on this theory.
> follow this link
> [tinyurl.com]
>
> he says the scene as origionaly cut had the creepy
> Members Only guy coming out of the bathroom and on
> Tony before the cut to black. It was cut longer
> and with a more solid feeling of Tony getting
> killed.
>
> I think Tony is dead until David Chase says he is
> not, and then I will gladly watch more adventures
> in the world of the Sopranos.
> but that aint gonna happen cuz TONY IS DEAD

Well you can believe that and we may never know one way or the other but at least half the newspaper writers and people in other forums don't believe he died. When you take the scene as is and don't let your imagination run away regarding all the scary guys in the diner, there is no reason to believe he died.

Your link was interesting but that isn't the ending they went with. He supposedly filmed three different endings- maybe one made it clear Tony lived, one made it clear he died and the one they decided to go with was unclear one way or the other.

Instead of digging for abstract clues like bells, look at it logically. What hit man would go into a bathroom and waste time when he could have shot Tony on the way to the bathroom? He hangs around the diner for ten minutes so everyone can get a good look at him, then goes right past Tony into the bathroom, THEN comes out and shoots him? Makes no sense. Unless he was waiting for Tony to order onion rings so he can grab them on the way out the door and not have to pay for them lol.

.....in the end I think whatever floats your boat is OK with me...but the beauty of the Sopranos is/was that Chase never judged them(the characters); he created space for them to evolve...good,....bad.........killers......whatever......which was wonderful and you could take those characters yourself wherever you wanted to take them........BUT he certainly never ever tied up any episodes neatly.....ever.........ever....ever........in fact he confounded both critics and viewers alike equally......in the end the show stayed true to it's characters and to itself.............and the final message was.......life just keeps going on..........deal with that as you will........

if the dude was gonna wack tony he would have walked right in and wacked him, like they always do, why linger around for no reason and wait, this was classic chase screwing with our heads, there will be a movie count on it

From day one he left us wanting more and now after the supposed finale we still want more. In that regard Chase is a genius.

but chase is the one that left the door open for a movie , not us, if he really wanted it to be over we would have seen tony die

melillo Wrote:
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> but chase is the one that left the door open for a
> movie , not us, if he really wanted it to be over
> we would have seen tony die


Exactly.

I would expect something in a few years, not right away. Maybe a two hour HBO movie or maybe something on the big screen.

Gandolfini doesn't want to play Tony anymore but in a few years he may miss the character and shooting one film is a lot easier than shooting one season of the Sopranos.

I have been thinking a lot about this"You never hear the one that gets you" thing! I think that sums it all up pretty damn well! I now like the ending! It sure Pissed me off last night but I had not thought about it that way!

Thanks for helping me see it another way!

Fred Hardin
Pleased to meet you........

big pussy heard his coming so that kills that theory

melillo Wrote:
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> big pussy heard his coming so that kills that
> theory


Well, I hope you see the difference between having guys stand in front of you and telling you they are going to kill you and having a guy sneak up next to you and pull the trigger next to your head.

Do you think Phil saw or heard his coming?
NOPE, talking to the grandkids one second, the next lying dead on the ground with an SUV slowly crushing your already DEAD HEAD! LOL




people interprate art in different ways, and this show was indeed art

we may never know the artists intention, but I loved every second of this great show INCLUDING the end.

sometimes you hear it and sometimes you dont, and do you think chase wont turn this into a feature film with all the millions lurking, if chase wanted it over we would have seen tony die, case closed, besides the words to the song
suggest dont stop believing it goes on an and on



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2007-06-12 06:47 by melillo.

melillo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> sometimes you hear it and sometimes you dont, and
> do you think chase wont turn this into a feature
> film with all the millions lurking, if chase
> wanted it over we would have seen tony die, case
> closed


well thanks, great to know such a great athority as melillo can close the case

are you so trained to watch crap that when subtle texture and story telling leaves something to imagination that you can't grasp the finality of the piece?

the answers are in the show, what else can I say.
you don't have to actually SEE the murder to know it happened

ARE YOU

yeah your right VAN ZANDT said himself there will probably be a movie so i guess i should take your word over his

am i missing something? never heard of the sopranos... does it has anything to do with the stones?

Life's just a cocktail party on the street

What about the cat?...did anyone on this board already talk about the cat that spooked Paulie? Just another distraction?

FrankM Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I would expect something in a few years, not right
> away. Maybe a two hour HBO movie or maybe
> something on the big screen.
>
> Gandolfini doesn't want to play Tony anymore but
> in a few years he may miss the character and
> shooting one film is a lot easier than shooting
> one season of the Sopranos.


agree 100%, THEY WOULD BE FOOLS NOT TO0

Marcia Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What about the cat?...did anyone on this board
> already talk about the cat that spooked Paulie?
> Just another distraction?


the cat was adriana, lol

HAHAHA Good one, Melillo!

Marcia Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What about the cat?...did anyone on this board
> already talk about the cat that spooked Paulie?
> Just another distraction?


Just another metaphor for............nothing. Although the part where Pauly was sitting there sunning himself and then the cat comes walking up. That was funny.

They are going to make a spinoff with just Paulie and the cat. Should be hilarious.

Okay, here's my theory:

Meadow got whacked. The viewer saw the last moment through Meadow's eyes. The diner door closes and you hear the chimes and she sees Tony...black out. Tony was the last thing she saw.

I can't remember if it was on this forum, but I think that the person who said that Tony ironically died of a heart attack from eating too much rich food (such as onion rings, get it?), was correct.

Actually, I think that the previous episode was the perfect ending. They should have stopped right there, with perhaps the most gut-crunching episode in the whole series, with Tony lying in bed, clutching to that gun. Not knowing what will come next.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-06-12 10:30 by drbryant.

melillo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Marcia Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > What about the cat?...did anyone on this board
> > already talk about the cat that spooked Paulie?
>
> > Just another distraction?
>
>
> the cat was adriana, lol

I disagree , the cat was Christopher .

boston2006 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> melillo Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Marcia Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > What about the cat?...did anyone on this
> board
> > > already talk about the cat that spooked
> Paulie?
> >
> > > Just another distraction?
> >
> >
> > the cat was adriana, lol
>
> I disagree , the cat was Christopher .


The walrus was Paul.

I thought the cat was Big Pussy

melillo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> yeah your right VAN ZANDT said himself there will
> probably be a movie so i guess i should take your
> word over his


REALLY

where is that link or quote?
methinks you are full of it
As far as I heard he only said he didn't know


HOWEVER David Chase himself said this

"IT'S ALL THERE. IF YOU WANT TO WATCH IT, IT'S ALL THERE." - David Chase quote to Alan Sepinwall this morning, just quoted by the reporter on NBC's "Countdown with Keith Olberman."


combine that with the fact that Chase has maintained that he has known Tonys fate for years - sprinkle in a little bit of the ability to actually use your brain and the only way to look at it is that Tony was killed.

I really like the discussion this has produced around the world, but it is really showing me how uninformed/uneducated people are.

"IT'S ALL THERE. IF YOU WANT TO WATCH IT, IT'S ALL THERE." - David Chase quote



I can dump a ton of evedence to support the thoery that Tony is dead, but no piece of story telling 101 is more damning than the flashback to the talk on the boat. And while there is a TON more evedence, that alone should make it clear for the dum-dums out there.

4tylix Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It sucked ONLY if there's a movie...that means it
> was a cliffhanger disguised as a finale.
> Otherwise, it was pretty clear...he was watching
> Meadow come through the door and didn't see it
> coming when he got popped in the head...LIGHTS
> OUT!!!
>
> No need to see anyone's reaction or even the
> actual hit...it was Tony's show. We saw it the way
> he did and then he was gone...the last word was
> "stop"...it's over...
>
> If I'm wrong and there's a movie...it was a
> shameless ploy for more dollars. If I'm right, it
> will become a legendary and forever discussed
> ending.


This is the correct interpretation. The hit men were waiting for Meadow to arrive so they could take out the entire family in a bloodbath that is better left to the viewer's imagination. Of course, Meadow, standing near the doorway, could have escaped, just like Anastasia.