I've been in Frankfurt several times the last weeks and there is NO BUZZ at all regarding the Stones concert.

The concert is in less than 2 weeks.

The arena seems to be about 65% full, but it is strangely quiet in town regarding the concert. Normally, when the Stones tour, the energy is palpable...posters everywhere...Stones music on the radio...now...little to nothing.

There are some pitiful-looking posters on several subway and train stations...posters that look EXACTLY like the ones from last year's canceled concert...therefore they just look like old posters that weren't taken down. But that seems to be the extent of it.

There is little to no publicity going on...and I'm in the entertainment / advertising business, so I usually know what is going on. Hmmm...

Can Cohl be such a dunce? The world's greatest band is coming to town for the first time in 17 years...and this is the effort his vaunted organization puts forth?

*The Düsseldorf and Hamburg ticket sales are going very slow - both are less than half full - but those concerts are in 2 and 1/2 months...so there is plenty of time. [Although it must be said that those concert dates are SMACK in the middle of August - the quietest/emptiest time of the year in Germany - when any German that can rub a few cents together is away from home] I was at the German concerts last year in Cologne [23rd of July] and Stuttgart [3rd of August...before most people leave on vacation]. Cologne was almost full. Stuttgart was amazing...totally full...and Stuttgart was in August, so...maybe my fears for Hamburg and Düsseldorf are ungrounded.

I've seen the Stones over 25 times in Germany the last 17 years...and I have never encountered such indifference. Several people I have spoken to in Frankfurt mention last year's cancellation as a reason that they won't be going...I guess they have no patience...or no trust that this will REALLY happen. I don't know.

The feeling seems to be different in the U.K. and Ireland. Also in Spain and Scandinavia there seems to be more buzz. Eastern Europe looks like it will be great.

I'll be in Munich this weekend and I'll be in Frankfurt again next week...hopefully Cohl's publicity machine for Frankfurt will be in full gear...the concert will be a week away!

I'm really a little afraid of a 'smallish' crowd in Frankfurt. Perhaps they should have visited the Eastern part of Germany more on this tour...seems the Western part is kinda indifferent to another Stones pass-through...we'll see.

I will enjoy the concert in Frankfurt whether there are 25,000 or 45,000 people in the Commerzbank Arena [capacity circa 50,000...been there several times]. And I have a feeling that there will be a good walk-up crowd the day of the concert and will pretty much fill up the arena...especially if the weather is good.

But Cohl should ramp up the publicity...it hurts my [foolish?] pride a bit to think that the Stones won't sell out and that the effort to publicize the concert is unprofessional and/or not commensurate with the bands' status.

There's nothing better in the world than rocking to the Stones live with a full house roaring at the stage!

Diamond rings, Vaseline, you gave me disease, well, I lost a lot of love over you.

Went back right now from Frankfurt....I'll bet that the stadium will be packed up to 85 %.
But in anyway, I Know a lot of people who don't wanna go there, due to the extrem high ticket prices.

Keep on rollin'
Gangster

Hamburg holidays are over end of July so everything can happen until August

Well, actually the sales might be lower than expected because of no info (posters etc.) in the city. Last year I talked to some people who at the time were living in the cities where The Stones played and they didn't know there was a concert!!!!! And I've seen no signs of it happening either.

One of the reasons why Stuttgart was full last year was that many of the Frankfurt ticketholders (like me) went there since it was in the holidays AND the prices for the "exchange" tickets were significantly reduced, so many of the fans who are no die-hards will think twice before they go and see them again within less than a year
for a higher price.

What strikes me is that apart from the few posters I also mentioned in the other thread there is no promtion at all on TV or radio, like Turd rightly says.

For the last tours they had important sponsors such as the German telecom with lots of TV spots etc., I dont even know whether there IS a major sponsor this time, at all (came to think of this as I just watched a new telecom TV spot using "Paint It Black")

They will fill it up with hot-shots, dont they?

I've been to a concert in the Batschkapp last September and on the main street around the corner there was a poster announcing the scheduled concert...

> The arena seems to be about 65% full, but it is
> strangely quiet in town regarding the concert.


Where do you take this 65% figure from? Actually eventim hat "only" 6100 seats unsold which would be about 85% full by now.


> *The Düsseldorf and Hamburg ticket sales are going
> very slow - both are less than half full - but
> those concerts are in 2 and 1/2 months...so there
> is plenty of time. I was at the German concerts
> last year in Cologne [23rd of July] and Stuttgart
> [3rd of August...before most people leave on
> vacation]. Cologne was almost full. Stuttgart was
> amazing...totally full...and Stuttgart was in
> August, so...maybe my fears for Hamburg and
> Düsseldorf are ungrounded.

Düsseldorf and Hamburg sales aren't near as bad as you make them. By looking at the Saalplanbuchung at eventim.de both are full to 80%, maybe even more.

and sales here in berlin are just terrible; apparently NO TICKETS WHATSOEVER have been sold!

There are some small promotion posters in Frankfurt and the radio stations are playing during the day more warhorses than usual.
One reason for the low sales could be the following fact:
As I can remember, I heard an statement on the radio after the tour announcement, that the Frankfurt concert is definitely nearly sold out, because it was mentioed that it's just a rescheduled concert and most of the tickets were sold last year.
What a bullshit, I thought as I heard that!

Keep on rollin'
Gangster

Turd On The Run Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

Perhaps they should have visited
> the Eastern part of Germany more on this
> tour...seems the Western part is kinda indifferent
> to another Stones pass-through...we'll see.

That's what I say. If they'd booked the Steigerwaldstadion Erfurt (25.000 capacity) and the "RHCP-venue" in Dresden (same size) ´both shows would have been sell outs within weeks. I don't know what's going on in Cohl's brain, actually. West Germany is just way TOO overplayed, that's it. They didn't play in Frankfurt for 17 years, but don't forget Mannheim/Hockenheim, Nuremberg, Cologne etc. were all pretty close.

The mean problem is, that they just wanna play stadiums an not arenas anymore.
Last time they played an arena show in Germany (exept Munich in 2003) was Frankrt in 1981! Pretty poor I think...if you have a look on the north american tour...

Keep on rollin'
Gangster

Gangster wrote: "But in anyway, I Know a lot of people who don't wanna go there, due to the extrem high ticket prices."

Yes...several people mentioned to me that the tickets are just too expensive for their budget. They ARE really expensive...but I'm a hopeless addict...

lodge wrote: "Hamburg holidays are over end of July so everything can happen until August"

No...Hamburg holidays start July 12 and end August 22. The Stones concert is the 15th of August...in the middle of the holiday.

Baboon Bro wrote: "They will fill it up with hot-shots, dont they?"

Not really. Basically working stiffs who are BIG Stones fans and travel from far away to see their band...and hopefully a lot of other people who want to see the best rock and roll band ever.

ThatsWhatISay wrote: "Where do you take this 65% figure from? Actually eventim hat "only" 6100 seats unsold which would be about 85% full by now. Düsseldorf and Hamburg sales aren't near as bad as you make them. By looking at the Saalplanbuchung at eventim.de both are full to 80%, maybe even more."

The sources I have say that Frankfurt is still quite open...around 30-35% of the seats still available - this with less than 2 weeks to the show. An entire swath of the northwest corner is nearly empty - top to bottom. But I think [hope!] walk-up traffic will fill it up on the day of the show.

Düsseldorf and Hamburg are also look around 50% sold...but I'm sure sales will pick up...I just hope the German holidays don't damage attendance too badly.

C'mon Cohl! Pick up the promotion and let's have some Stones fever in Germany...wake the citizens UP! HIDE YOUR WALLETS! THE STONES ARE COMING! THE STONES ARE COMING!

Frankfurt is a big city. That is why... I remember seeing the Stones four - 4 - shows at Shea Stadium in NYC USA 1989. When taking the taxi to the show the taxi driver asked: What is on up there. We said the Stones are in town. He said oh really, I saw them in LA some weeks ago. Then he ofered us a joint. I refused kindly.

When the Stones are playing big cities you would not even notice. One show or 5 shows does not matter at all. London in August would not make any notice of 3 shows and 60,000 people seeing the Stones at the O2. It's just another show. Anbd another. In a big city.

If you want some crazy days with the Stones in town then go to Oslo, Gothenburg, Copenhagen, El Ejido, San Sebastian, Leuven, you know, one of these cities where you know it is packed with Stones fans and everybvody knows what is going on.

Bjornulf



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-05-24 21:16 by bv.

Please have a look at eventim booking system (Saalplanbuchung)

Ticket seems to be 85 % sold.

I think in 14 days this show will be sold 95 - 100 % !!

Grüsse

Gerhard

Frankfurt is a very special situation. Remember last years cancellation, the fans were told that the show was canceled due to Keith' accident. But on the very same day they played a rescheduled show in Vienna (if i remember right), a lot of people i know were very very pissed. It was so obvious that it was a lie and that the cancellation was due to bad sales caused by high ticket prices and the football world cup. The ticket prices last year were already high with around 130 Euro for FOS, but this time it's around 190 Euros, an increase of 50% in only one years time. I know a lot of people who said they are not willing to pay that much because of what happend last year.
Regarding the missing buzz in Franfurt, i have a close friend who is a radio host at HR3. He told me that the people at his station were also very pissed cause they invested a lot of money and time. They are simply not willing to invest that again.

@ThatsWhatISay
You're still sticking to this figure 6100?? I thought we had talked it over in the other thread.

@Gangster-of-love
If you'd like to see the Stones in an indoors arena in Germany ticket prices would be somewhere around 350 EUR or so.

@latvianinexile
Fact is there are ~6100 free seats for sale at eventim. Everything else concerning sections not made available yet is speculation. You can't know how many seats are made unavailable just by looking at eventim.
Or what are your sources?

My source is my almost daily checking out the eventim seating chart and seeing how they make rows in certain sections available that have not been available earlier. I tried to explain here: [www.iorr.org]

BTW, you wrote this yesterday:
"They made most of the upper and lower blocks unavailable. Does Cohl's papering start now?"

I'll buy you a beer in Frankfurt if your theory is closer to reality than mine, OK? You'll find me in A4, row 3, seat 7. Cheers!

>>You'll find me in A4, row 3, seat 7.<<

hey yeah, we'll be sittin' next to you - seat 5 & 6.

see ya there.

OK

High ticket prices and predictable set lists,and a saturated market.

I think the Net has changed everything. There is no more mystery and awe when a band arrives because we all know every detail way in advance.
The last few tours the buzz was gone in the cities I saw them in. Nothing at all compared to 78, 81 and even 89. With VL id was calming down. What else are the papers going to say that thye haven't said many times before? And the audience has grown older, calmer. No way there is going to be a frenzy.

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

C'mon Cohl! Pick up the promotion and let's have some Stones fever in Germany...wake the citizens UP! HIDE YOUR WALLETS! THE STONES ARE COMING! THE STONES ARE COMING!
------------------------

Cohl is not responsible for promotions. All he does is to sell the shows to the promoter who is willing to pay a guaranteed sum.

To be honest I don't remember times where it was neccessary to make big promotions for a Stones tour. They sold out even mostly 2 shows per city. But times they are changing! With these high ticket prices you don't need any promotion, as only more or less hardcore fans will pay and go.

bv Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Frankfurt is a big city. That is why... I remember
> seeing the Stones four - 4 - shows at Shea Stadium
> in NYC USA 1989. When taking the taxi to the show
> the taxi driver asked: What is on up there. We
> said the Stones are in town. He said oh really, I
> saw them in LA some weeks ago. Then he ofered us a
> joint. I refused kindly.

> > If you want some crazy days with the Stones in
> town then go to Oslo, Gothenburg, Copenhagen, El
> Ejido, San Sebastian, Leuven, you know, one of
> these cities where you know it is packed with
> Stones fans and everybvody knows what is going on.

Point of Order: Frankfurt is nowhere near the size of New York or London. Its only the fifth biggest city in GERMANY! Frankfurt's population is about 600,000 - NYs is 8 million. As for those other cities you mentioned as counterexamples, Oslo and Copenhagen are roughly the same size as Frankfurt.

Thus, Turd's point about the lack of buzz stands . . .

That's true, Frankfurt is smaller than it seems. About 660.000 inhabitants, 25% foreigners. Due to the very large number (in comparison) of commuters there are over 1 million people in town during daytime.

ChelseaDrugstore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think the Net has changed everything.

E X A C T L Y

I don't see the whole town plastered with tour posters anymore.
Back in the days you couldn't overlook a big concert coming up.

Today it happens that I find out (to late) that The Who or Bob Dylan WAS in town.
as a casual fan, you don't look up their sites regulary.
You could get detailed info from the web, if you only knew there's something up....

with the net, I get more international music related news than local.

rknuth wrote:

(A) "To be honest I don't remember times where it was neccessary to make big promotions for a Stones tour."

I remember a bit different situation... Since 1981/82, when "stadiums era" was dawning, they always have big enough promotion on their side. Promotion hasn't bacically to do with convincing people that the Stones, the most attractive live act in the world, is worth seeing -and hearing- it. Promotion has to do, first of all, with informing people. "Hey, the Stones are coming", as Turd On The Run says. And after it, promotion has to do with making, less or more, a nice atmosphere. That was always neccessary. So, if the Stones are to filling up the stadium in Frankfurt (or everywhere else), without having a big promotion's help, that will be good for them. And remarkable.


( "With these high ticket prices you don't need any promotion, as only more or less hardcore fans will pay and go."

Unfortunately, prices are everywhere high. So must we believe that on ABB tour the Stones have played, for the time beeing, in front of 3,600.000 "hardcore fans"?? Do you think the number of the so called "hardcore fans" is that huge? I' don't think so. During this tour the Stones are drawing more people that the 1981/82 attendance, so i can't accept your conclusion about a "hardcore fans" tour...

Rknuth, think about a serious factor: the high frequency of the Stones tours in the last years. And, talking about the speed of the sales, don't draw comparisons between the present and time when the Stones were visiting the same countries after 8 years (1989/90) and 6 years (Europe 1981). Or when they were playing small venues and doing much fewer gigs. That would be a groundless comparison, IMHO.

latvianinexile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That's true, Frankfurt is smaller than it seems.
> About 660.000 inhabitants, 25% foreigners. Due to
> the very large number (in comparison) of commuters
> there are over 1 million people in town during
> daytime.

Frankfurt area is the second largest region in germany with a population of 5.8 million. Frankfurt itself is not so big, but there is a large number of mid-size towns nearby, like Wiesbaden, Mainz, Offenbach, Darmstadt...
See [de.wikipedia.org] (in german only, sorry)

....I dunno.........but since when did a 65% vs 85% to capacity discussion become something other than what it really is???.........a huge disappointment.