200.000$ for a couple of silent and (probably) very fragmentary amateur videos and a few already circulating (!) extras is just silly.
70 mins worth of footage filmed over three days - I doubt the MSG´72 footage has more than two or three complete songs.

This price would only be appropriate if this would be material with the potential for an official release (e.g. previously unsurfaced complete multitrack recordings or a multi-cam pro shot of a full show) which I don´t see here.

Good luck finding the idiot who pays 200.000$ for these videos.

Thanks for the perspective T&F.

Someone else posted on this forum a long time ago that he had footage from one of these shows and was looking for audio to dub it. I don't know what ever happened to that request.

Also, there is a report of a dubbed film from London '73:

730909B 9th September: London, Wembley Empire Pool
Note: Soundboard recording was made. A private film with dubbed sound from one of the Wembley-gigs exists.

[I do not know whether it is synched, though.]

wonder why this hasnt been done with the aussie 73 footage from rage, those boots are around in sbd could easily be dubbed in i would think

The MSG film is not as fragmentary as you would think. In all fairness, it is def not complete songs but in the right hands there could be some fine sequences produced. I would venture to say that you could produce something very exceptional for a particular purpose, if you needed something unique. The LA Forum 1969 film is 15 minutes complete and unfragmented footage. A piece like the MSG film could appeal to someone close to the Stones if for anything else the July 26th show which does contain the entire birthday cake sequence with Stevie Wonder and it is captured brilliantly. You have to keep in mind what value things like this have maybe not for the moment but certainly down the line. There will one day be a premium placed on stuff like this, especially because the quality of this footage is truly stunning. You haven't seen it in it's full glory.

shroomy wrote:

>The licensing rights are worth anywhere between $1500-$3000 per minute plus a few points on the release. How many documentaries and movies do you think will probably be made about the Stones in the future?

-It's gotta take a lot of minutes + documentarys before one reach $200,000



Greenblues wrote:

>Shroomy might be the rightful owner of the footage, fair enough - but that doesn't necessarily mean he's entitled to release or distribute it. In fact, I doubt anybody else would be, without approval of the Stones.

-The Stones have stopped the release of footage from Madison '72 before, in much better quality, and with audio (Dick Cavett Show 25/7 '72), though Jagger later on gave the project green light, after basicly editing out the Taylor parts.

shroomy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The MSG film is not as fragmentary as you would
> think. In all fairness, it is def not complete
> songs but in the right hands there could be some
> fine sequences produced. I would venture to say
> that you could produce something very exceptional
> for a particular purpose, if you needed something
> unique. The LA Forum 1969 film is 15 minutes
> complete and unfragmented footage. A piece like
> the MSG film could appeal to someone close to the
> Stones if for anything else the July 26th show
> which does contain the entire birthday cake
> sequence with Stevie Wonder and it is captured
> brilliantly. You have to keep in mind what value
> things like this have maybe not for the moment but
> certainly down the line. There will one day be a
> premium placed on stuff like this, especially
> because the quality of this footage is truly
> stunning. You haven't seen it in it's full glory.



Maybe not, but you're living in a dream world if you think its worth anything remotely approaching what youre asking. Keep convincing yourself though, by all means.

This has got to be one of the most ridiculous posts I have read on this board. This footage is not worth half of what you are asking. I have seen much more rare recordings sell for much less, and those recordings were just about flawless quality wise. Have fun with your video.

There 1:15 of Brown Sugar from the '72 bday show on youtube.

I have been collecting since '75. Recently I found a Mick Taylor show in my collection that was not even listed on Nico's site. The first thing I did (without hesitation) was to upload this show to dimeadozen. It is clowns like shroomy that can (and some may say..has) taken alot of the fun out of collecting stones material, I have narrowed my collecting down to just the MT period and have a pretty complete collection, if I came across any'72 material that I thought no one else had I would share without hesitation and without trying regard to monetary benefit. I am in my 50's now and in a few years will probably no longer collect, if this clown thinks that anyone is going to pay $200,000.00 for this choppy video he is a bigger fool than most of us already think he is. Shroomy, collectors like you,... wait a minute, you are not a collector..you are a money grubbing clown, ruin this HOBBY!!!!

<<Recently I found a Mick Taylor show in my collection that was not even listed on Nico's site. The first thing I did (without hesitation) was to upload this show to dimeadozen.>>

You're a good man!

It's exciting to hear there is some Forum '69 footage available. If it is the 2nd show, I was there. Maybe I'll get to see it before I die. I feel the same way about the often noted '69-'73 performances the video or sbd of which exist, but has never surfaced. Will it ever see the light of day for those of us who care the most about seeing or listening to it?

Speaking of De-Taylorizing things, didn't they airbrush him out of that sailors in a bubbly tent video?

Sure, just give the stuff away, after you paid 20 or 30 thousand for it...I dont think so...

JR

no way he paid that much, bullocks

You obviously dont know any really heavy collectors...

JR

yeah your right, 70 min of grainy silent footage of incomplete songs is a treasure my mistake

No, you are missing my point...some of us DO pay for stuff like this....and I think more than a few...most are anonymous collectors, but, when you have things that are unique, and pay thousands for them, you cant just give them away....you save them to trade for other things equally as unique....its called "dancin' on the rings of Saturn...."...the Stones being the planet, and the collectors trying to figure out how to get closer....

No hostility meant, its just the way it is...

JR

So I'm a clown now? That's ok, I have a sense of humor! Just don't put me in the same clown category as John Wayne Gacy! I thought the comment about 70 minutes of grainy video was clever, seeing as how you've only seen a super compressed .wmv file uploaded for YouTube purposes. Everyone speculates, that's the job of the garden variety downloader/collector. On the other hand, people like me and some others out there who shall remain anonymous operate on the "rings of Saturn" as so eloquently put by mr. Stone-Relics. Stone my man you have a grip, so I leave it to you to set some of these guys straight about what is involved here. Oh yeah, business lesson #001 is do not ask for what you expect to get, you always inflate the asking price to allow for the inevitable haggling. I'm not hoarding my films babies, I'm offering them to you! Like I said, go get some money and buy the film so you can put it up on dime a dozen. I'm sure the original owners of the footage you gave away were thanking you warmly. Are you going to lambast the owners of the Rock and Roll circus movie now? Why not? They are auctioning it for big bucks..damn those clowns!

Well, I thought about it and I have decided to sweeten the pot a little. As part of the film and video sale, I will toss in my footage of Detroit 1969. It's about 10 minutes, pretty rough quality but it has its moments. Shot by a tv news crew on 1/2" open reel video. It's pretty rare, I would be a little surprised if anyone claims to have it. Does anyone have this?

shroomy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A big thank you goes out to the fellow who came
> through with the other audio recordings. Now the
> arduous task of sound syncing can begin. In answer
> to the questions over the value of the film, let's
> put it in proper perspective here. Should the film
> or portions of it find their way into a home video
> release, the number of units sold would more than
> justify the asking price. The licensing rights are
> worth anywhere between $1500-$3000 per minute plus
> a few points on the release. How many
> documentaries and movies do you think will
> probably be made about the Stones in the future?
> This film is an investement, the new owner would
> have many options available to him to recoup his
> costs should he decide to go that route. I suppose
> he can also decide to give it to you guys for
> nothing. I don't care! If I don't get my price I
> do not sell the film and that's just fine too,
> because I know what the film is worth and what it
> will be worth later. I can't be swayed by
> complainers, I have no desire to give this away
> because someone wants to see it. Truth is I don't
> care at all who wants to see it, the price is 200K
> if you wanna play.

Sorry to burst your buble. There is no way on god's earth you will ever be able to license anything from this movie. The music and image rights for releasing this in any way lies with Allen Klein and Promopub BV. They must personally grant you the rights to do anything with it, and that will never ever happen. The only legal release this film will ever see is short clips (shorter than 40 seconds image and 30 seconds sound) in TV or documentary's, as this short material is free from rights (that's why we have 50 times 40 seconds from Under My Thumb from the '81 tour: news channels were able to broadcast that for free).

The only thing you can do is bootleg it on to a DVD. In this world of internet you will probably be able to sell around 500 DVD's for $20 each. take $5 costs, so this film is worth $7500, but you have to take a risk as it is illigal, especially in the US.

Mathijs

melillo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> wonder why this hasnt been done with the aussie
> 73 footage from rage, those boots are around in
> sbd could easily be dubbed in i would think


not quite, they are very good audience recordings, and I know someone who has done a good job on exactly what u mention...