it just sucks to see them go out this way. i have never seen or heard of so many #$%^# ups plaguing a rock and roll tour.

maybe they shouldn't have come back to play the states....or maybe they should have taken a longer break before starting up again.

i truly hope this is not the end for this amazing band which has brought all of us so much joy for so many years. i want to see them try to tour again.....i dream of a 50th anniversary tour.....as i am sure many others do.

but after all of the turmoil they have faced during this grueling tour you wonder if they shouldn't change things up a bit.

if they ever decide to tour again.....how can anyone feel safe investing in tickets? much less hotel rooms and airfare...etc...etc...etc...

apologists on this and other boards may try to make excuses...but those excuses are lame. it just is not fair to put your loyal fans through this. spending thousands and thousands of dollars and then crossing your fingers hoping the show will go off as planned is just not right...and it certainly is not acceptable.

people should not have to risk losing so much just to go to a concert.

of course the stones are only human...and they are getting old....hell they have been old for a long time now....so maybe the band and their mangagement should just accept these truths and plan for this in the future.

i think this band should not be playing every other night....or anything close to it. a show once a week would be fine with me....if it would ensure that they have the health and energy to perform EVERY time they are scheduled to do so.

the tour...as it currently stands would be difficult for someone in their 20's to pull off......much less someone many times that age.

so let's take it easy on these guys.....and make it possible for them to continue to play for as long as they can....

They got greedy. After Keith's fall..things got really messy and really fast. The cancelling of Europe dates was the beginning of the end. Thinking they could make a good thing out of a losing situation....they got deeper in the hole. Probably not so much financially "in the hole" but in terms of morale. They lost a lot of steam from their fans in the last couple months.

Let's just say that we're not in good terms with the band right now....

The Stones do what they want and don't care as much about their fans as they do themselves, which is/was their downfall. They have so much and forget that their fans love and adore the shit out of them, and yet they cancel gigs because of "other plans"(beacon). True heartlessness on the Stones end. They have put icing on the cake of self destruction and the end is coming, It's a shame they had to botch it up like this though.

So far, nothing but voices of reason on this thread, all great comments. IMO, They better put the brakes on fast before they get all of us more and more pissed off to the point where people stop bying there DVD, CD's etc. I've seen it happen with a few artists. My GF was a big Madonna fan but finally had it with all her funky stunts. I know it's different than the Stones but everybody has a totally feed up point.... would be a shame if they went out with a super bad rep, who would haave EVER expected that.....

Good thread, good posts. The Stones are pissing more and more fans off this time around. Time to change the routine: put the music first, not the money. Stop touring the world on this scale, tune it down, don't take risks that could end up affecting loyal fans that spend thousands of dollars. And work on the way you communicate with your fans and ticket holders. It would be awfull to see the Stones go on touring like this, loosing credibility and looking greedier every year.

Lots of people are upset, okay, let's move on! The Stones now need to record, and record fast. And not any more of the same. Although I enjoyed A Bigger Bang I'm now ready for something different and I want it sooner than later! Another seven years and I'll be long gone.

2007:- meet their Euro touring commitments in 2007.

get in the studio with either Ethan Johns, Jack White, Rick Rubin
(take your pick) and record a rootsy/bluesy/back to basics album
and stun us (the hardcore), the music press and casual fans, alike.

iamthedj Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Lots of people are upset, okay, let's move on!
> The Stones now need to record, and record fast.
> And not any more of the same. Although I enjoyed
> A Bigger Bang I'm now ready for something
> different and I want it sooner than later!
> Another seven years and I'll be long gone.


I won't be long gone in 7 years I think, but I completely agree that they should do another album.

JumpingKentFlash

actually the band should focus on two great studio albums a year apart and not worry about sales. If the shit is good, it will be critically acclaimed. Then hit the road once more in 2009. We only had about 20 month break between Licks and ABB- peoples wallets are tapped out.
Take a hint from Dylan and focus on creating some great studio stuff.

MicksBrain Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So far, nothing but voices of reason on this
> thread, all great comments. IMO, They better put
> the brakes on fast before they get all of us more
> and more pissed off to the point where people stop
> bying there DVD, CD's etc. I've seen it happen
> with a few artists. My GF was a big Madonna fan
> but finally had it with all her funky stunts. I
> know it's different than the Stones but everybody
> has a totally feed up point.... would be a shame
> if they went out with a super bad rep, who would
> haave EVER expected that.....

Good point. But I am afraid that for a lot of fans, the "totally fed up point" as you name it has already been reached. I already mentioned in other threads that a lot of my contacts in the Stones fan world have already turned their backs on them ... not in a way that they have erased the Stones from their lives - they still listen to Stones music of the past but show now interest in their current activities anymore and that includes going to shows.

The Stones fan community is getting smaller, and the recent reactions on boards like this can only be interpreted in a way that the band now even pisses off even the majority of the die-hards.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2006-11-01 12:37 by retired_dog.

Good producers they may be Adrian, but the Stones are not The White Stripes or Kings Of Leon. I would like to see a more stripped down album though. Problem is, stripped down for the Stones in the 21st centuary = Rough Justice or dull blues numbers like Back Of My Hand.

MicksBrain Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Would be a shame
> if they went out with a super bad rep, who would
> haave EVER expected that.....


The bad boys of rock 'n roll going out with a bad rep? Gee, what a travesty.

JumpingKentFlash

JumpingKentFlash Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The bad boys of rock 'n roll going out with a bad
> rep? Gee, what a travesty.

Yes, but a bad reputation amongst their most loyal fans is a different thing.

In my opinion, it gets more difficult for them from year to year to go on tour in the old scheme, 100 gigs in 12 months or so.
Why don't the make several, national tours, let's say, in 2008 some months in North America, but with much longer breaks between the shows. Then some months off, and than a national tour in a country like Germany, also with bigger breaks, and different types of shows - stadiums, arenas and maybe some theaters. Then, after a while, a tour througn England, later Japan and so on.
And here and then a new album, like in the 70ies, every two or so years, not one album in 7 years.

retired_dog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes, but a bad reputation amongst their most loyal
> fans is a different thing.


Sure it is. But wy should they care about us? I never got that.

JumpingKentFlash

Amazing to read the threads. Out of how many shows the canceled how many? Please guys do some mathematics. How they treat their fans? I broke my finger early this year and i had terrible flue in summer. I'm actually very much healthy and much younger than the boys, but shit happens
I think it is just normal you get sick and not being able to go to work!
By the way I think nowadays they do treat their fans much better than in the second half of the 70s.

I am having serious doubts as to whether the boys could really produce another great album. They don't have that fluency that made the older stuff great. I honestly think that when they enter the studio they say "We need 5 fast rockers, 4 mid-tempo songs and 3 ballads to flesh this thing out". They don't seem to want to challenge themselves anymore. I'd love nothing more than to think that they are gonna give us some f**king incredible records in the future. Any thoughts?

JumpingKentFlash Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> retired_dog Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Yes, but a bad reputation amongst their most
> loyal
> > fans is a different thing.
>
>
> Sure it is. But wy should they care about us? I
> never got that.

If you think in economical terms, there surely is no need for them to care about us. They are rich enough for their next five or six lives so they could give a shit about what we are thinking of them.

But for me there is one thing I call "respect". If a band does not show any respect for their fans, why should their fans respect them?

iamthedj Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am having serious doubts as to whether the boys
> could really produce another great album. They
> don't have that fluency that made the older stuff
> great. I honestly think that when they enter the
> studio they say "We need 5 fast rockers, 4
> mid-tempo songs and 3 ballads to flesh this thing
> out". They don't seem to want to challenge
> themselves anymore. I'd love nothing more than to
> think that they are gonna give us some f**king
> incredible records in the future. Any thoughts?


I think everybody has had that thought. My take on it is that if they really do that, and the results come out as VL, B2B or ABB they should just continue this way. Those are awesome albums.

JumpingKentFlash

Those albums are okay, but very limited, I feel. It can't be very satisfying to make records in the same rigid, formulaic way time and time again. Its time to shake it up!

iamthedj Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Those albums are okay, but very limited, I feel.
> It can't be very satisfying to make records in the
> same rigid, formulaic way time and time again.
> Its time to shake it up!


I don't think they will actually. At least not if the next one is the last one. And when it's this far between the albums it's OK I think. But hell, I'd take a soul album or a blues/rock album if they make one of course.

JumpingKentFlash

JumpingKentFlash:

>But wy should they care about us? I never got that.<

I see two possible answers/reasons:

- If we agree this actual relation is basically a business one, because only dishonnest people show no care of the other party in a business relation. Some of us (me included) are simply surprised to find how much they apparently - am still waiting for positive "shit to happen - do not care about their loyal fans, which are the lifetime security of their heirs.

- If on the other hand we see this from the artistic PoV, because we give them love, for them and their music, by attending their concerts (...when they do make it themselves) and showing them with applause, dancing, etc.

I'd sell my soul for a Stones Soul, Country or Blues album. It would definitely be a step in the right direction, both artistically and from a business point of view. Or am I completely wrong?

iamthedj Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'd sell my soul for a Stones Soul, Country or
> Blues album. It would definitely be a step in the
> right direction, both artistically and from a
> business point of view. Or am I completely wrong?

Not a bad idea,

They keep recording and touring. I know nothing about the logistics of touring.

But perhaps they should not have to reinvent the tour, except setlist, and stage every time, ABB, Bridges,Steel Wheels.

Just keep the stadium/areana stage as it is and keep touring indefinitely.

How to balance that whith a home life? Only they know.

Perhaps a mix of Stadium, arean, theater and club shows.

Europe in the Summer, but perhaps breaking it into two or three parts for 'going home breaks,' N America in the Fall etc.

A year in, year out, touring routine with periodical breaks to have normalcy in their lives.

All these problems that have plagued this tour is nothing compared to Keith's earlier drug problems. There was a time when he very very nearly broke the Stones up.

I tend to agree with jamesjagger's point.....If the Stones have continually let you down and pissed you off, then maybe you have reason to turn your backs......but they've had a really long career and they're old.....so things haven't gone very well after Keith's fall.......how many times has this happened in their career?

Some seem to think that this will be it. Why? The Stones live for the road and it is my hope that they will have future tours. Seriously, I hate to think of what Ronnie will be doing if there will be no more tours.

It was sad to read the many comments doubting the health of Mick Jagger.

The last week on the board really read like fans of a sports team that are eager to fire their coach, manager or star player because expectations have not been met or exceeded. However, the star player (Mick) simply went on the injured list for a short time and we should all be happy that he will return to lineup tonight.

Keep rocking Rolling Stones, in the studio and on the road!!!

Becuase of Poor Ticket Sales


Mick's Health


Poor Decisions made by the Stones Management


Thats why

Time to do their Anthology. Get Bill and Mick T involved, open their archives and tell their story once and for all. A sort of extended 25 x 5.

The Stones have never really been much of a fan friendly band. They pretty much have always done whatever what they wanted. It is the fans who have responded to them. We go along with what they do. They tour every 3-4 years we are there. Release a live albun from every tour, we buy it. This has worked pretty good for 40 years for the Stones.(and us).
But now, this is the most hostility they have ever gotten from fans. They went to the well once too often, counting on new fans coming to their shows. But the venues,ticket prices,and markets just did not work. Plus they are older than most of the other "classic" rockers who continue to tour.
As for the future. Like everybody else has said, I don't see any more large scale tours. These guys are in their mid 60's. Maybe creatively, they still have something left. As evidenced on ABB. Perhaps a small theatre show. But every thing about them now says tired.