Trying to build up a good Stones CD collection, but I'm confused by all the similar products on the market.

I've got a couple of the ABKCO DSD (Direct Stream Digital) remasters, but am having a VERY hard time finding more.

I don't know if ABKCO's DSD remastered discs are still being printed, or if they've been replaced by something else.

I was wondering if there is an actual difference between the CDs marked DSD remastered and the other remastered series--the ABKCO ones in cardboard sleaves.

I am assuming the "American Collection" discs aren't remastered in any way?

The sound on the DSD remasters I have is incredible; I really hope I can find other DSD discs soon.

Thanks to anyone who understands what I'm going on about and can help me better understand what ABKCO is doing with (apparently) two different series of remasters.

The cardboard-type packages are called digipacks. Go into a Best Buy, and the racks are full of them. Some have a sticker telling you it's a remaster, some are missing the sticker. That, and the cardboard packaging, had kinda scared me off—I wanted to be sure I as getting remasted CDs, not the same crap I had bought back in the 80's.

The DSD Remastered discs come in a clear jewel case. DSD Remastered is visible along the left front of the case. Inside, there is a rundown on the remastering process. You're told that DSD (Direct Stream Digital) is used to make SACD discs; however, the CD in the case is a normal CD, as far as I can tell. Nothing explicitly says it's SACD or a hybrid SACD/CD disc. It plays in a normal CD player.

Actually, nothing on the digipacks mentions SACD or hybrid SACD/CD, either. But from what I've gathered on the Internet, the digipacks are hybrid SACD/CD.

This is really one confusing mess. I don't know what to buy. I've got a couple DSD Remastered discs. I'd like to get more, but they are impossible to find. Go online, and retailers make no mention of them. They list SACD discs, but are they hybrids or pure SACDs, which can only be played in special SACD players?

If I buy the digipacks, am I getting the same quality remasters I have with these DSD Remastered discs? I don't mean to sound obsessed, but the sound is really awesome on the DSD Remastered discs I have, and I don't want to pay for anything less.

The real bitch is that ABKCO is ignoring the confusion their marketing has created. They could clear the whole damn thing up with a paragraph on their web site. Salespeople in the stores are completely ignorant. I have to do my own research, and what's out there is spotty and confused.

i'm confused. :E
by "the American collection" you mean the post-ABKCO albums, right? as far as i know they're the same Virgin CDs:
an improvement over the CBS versions, but nothing new except that they're in a "souvenir" type sleeve.
only the ABKCO catalog has been re-issued as SACD hybrids (so far, anyway), and as far as i know they're all easy to find,
at least from online sources like amazon, badlands, etc.; yes they (a) sound great and (b) can be played in normal CD players.
but i have no idea if that has anything to do with what you're asking.



"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-02-19 19:21 by with sssoul.

What is the difference between SACD and DSD, or just what are they?

Tim from Montana

SACD is a new audio format designed for 5.1 surround sound and requires a special SACD player. The format isn't really taking off, probably because people aren't willing to re-purchase their CD collections just for 5.1. An alterior motive for moving to the new format is that publishers can employ advanced copy-protection schemes with SACD to prevent fair use by consumers.

DSD (Direct Stream Digital) is a new method for encoding audio with extremely high fidelity and wider dynamic range than traditional methods. While intended to be used for SACD production, the data can be processed for normal stereo CDs, too, giving you CDs that sound fantastic.

The ABKCO cardboard digipacks are all remasters, whether they have the sticker or not. And they are all SACD/CD hybrids, although it makes no mention of this on the outside of the packaging.

I am assuming ABKCO abandoned the DSD Remastered CDs and went to hybrids to cut production costs.

Inside the digipacks, it is explained that both the SACD and CD layers benefit from Direct Stream Processing. I know they sound great in my car's CD player; there are audio details in the recordings I've never heard before, and the dynamic range is noticeably improved.

I was just kinda wondering why anyone would buy Virgin's USA Collection CDs, if ABKCO has these incredible remasters. That's why I asked if Virgin remastered them. I'm also curious as to whether or not the Stones plan to remaster the CDs they actually own the rights to, because they sound like crap compared to what ABKCO has done with the old stuff.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-02-20 03:07 by tehroxxors.

Hey guys, thanks for the information.

Nico

__________________________

So what is the out come guys. I've seen both kinds at Best Buy. In a blind fold test of the same CD which would sound better. A SACD or a DSD?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-02-20 03:35 by WNY Stones.

WNY Stones Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So what is the out come guys. I've seen both kinds
> at Best Buy. In a blind fold test of the same CD
> which would sound better. A SACD or a DSD?
>
>
>
> Edited 1 times. Last edit at 02/20/06 03:35 by WNY
> Stones.


SACD should be better as long as your player is sacd capable.DSD encoding improves the sound of BOTH cd and SACD but the latter is much better than regular cd. Your player NEEDS to be appropriate however.

The new ABKCO releases in the regular CD jewel cases are not hybrid SACD/CD's. They're regular CD's but they have the new DSD encoding.
Any regular CD is sampled at at 44.1khz rate, which means the digital information is sampled 44100 times per second. SACD's are different technology and are sampled at a rate of around 2800000 times per second.

As far as I know, the new Virgin US (and Canada) Collection CD's aren't newly remastered again, but the same remasters that came out in the mid 90's. Virgin probably re-released them to take advantage of the Stones tour.

If you're looking to purchase the ABKCO releases, buy the digipaks.

WNY Stones Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So what is the out come guys. I've seen both kinds
> at Best Buy. In a blind fold test of the same CD
> which would sound better. A SACD or a DSD?
>
>
>
> Edited 1 times. Last edit at 02/20/06 03:35 by WNY
> Stones.


You can't play a SACD in anything but a SACD player. SACD is supposed to sound better than regular CD.

DSD isn't a CD format; it's an encoding format or technique. It's how information is read from masters. That information can then be used to make either SACD or CD discs.

As far as the Stones remasters, the SACD layer would sound better than the regular CD layer. Although both take advantage of DSD technology, the SACD format remains higher fidelity and spreads sound over more channels. Again, you need a special player and a 5.1 speaker setup to enjoy it.

Personally, I don't get the appeal of 5.1, besides its use for gaming. It's positional audio meant to improve immersion. Stereo sound seems more naturally suited for music, to my mind.

>> I was just kinda wondering why anyone would buy Virgin's USA Collection CDs, if ABKCO has these incredible remasters. <<

because they're different albums. ABKCO re-released the ABKCO catalog (from the beginning through through Let It Bleed);
Virgin re-released the post-ABKCO catalog (ie from Sticky Fingers onwards). neither company has the rights to the other material.

>> the new Virgin US (and Canada) Collection CD's aren't newly remastered again, but the same remasters that came out in the mid 90's. <<

right. and they aren't SACD hybrids, but they sound better than the CBS releases from the 80s.

>> You can't play a SACD in anything but a SACD player. <<

yeah, but you can play SACD hybrids in a regular CD player, and they sound great.


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith

The stones SACDs are just stereo and NOT 5.1 discs.

I mentioned here in a recent post that the Sympathy for the Devil CD single is a hybrid SACD single and it has a 5.1 version of the song that is awesome.

DSD is developed by Sony/ Philips who also developed the CD player and SACD.

It seems that quite a bit of classical music is being released in SACD format but it hasn't really caught on with mainstream rock music. I think if the format is to survive, they have to release SACD's as hybrids so they can also be played on regular CD players, unlike DVD Audio formats.

I have a SACD player and the Stones remasters
sound great on it, but the regular layer
sounds pretty good on a cd player too.
I suspect SACD came too late or it might
well have been a better industry standard.
Fortunately, as it seems to be disappearing
as a format, perhaps going the way of the
8 track, the dual layer Stones cd discs should
still be playable for years to come.

I've collected the full set, many of them in the
used racks now, for pretty cheap and plan to hang
onto them. Maybe they'll be a collectable someday?

It's a shame. CD format is roughly 25 years old now and it seams to be going out the window. With I Pods and digital downloads all Media Play Stores in the USA are now closed. Basically they said that CD sales where so bad that they had to close all stores accross the country. All the guys on this subject seam pretty bright. One more question. How would you compare the quality of a digital downloads with a store bought CD. If it is inferior why do people do it? Just for cost?