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Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: September 22, 2022 06:48

Quote
Spud
Dirty Work certainly ain't the best album they ever made...

but for me , one reason so many folks think its the worst is Steve Lillywhite's horrible production.

[ To be fair to him ..it was endemic in the '80s ]

It absolutely was not on Steve Lillywhite.

Given his experience, the times of what was going on... just not a good time period.

His prior work... substantial.

How it was mixed... and mastered ie post production - a whole other world.

As with any Stones recording, we don't get to hear everything that was done, recording wise in the mix, or editing wise. Bill said there were 240 some or more master tapes used. A lot of covers.

Lillywhite can be blamed for the outcome as a producer, which has some good moments, but it's really beyond him. It falls on Mick, period.

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: skytrench ()
Date: September 22, 2022 11:15

Don't know if Steve was Mick's choice, but it was strange to use him as a producer for a rock n roll band. His CV is filled with the typical early 80's pop sound that seems innappropriate for the Stones. Maybe due to Undercover's relative lack of success they persued a modern producer that could turn the songs towards U2, Talking Heads, Peter Gabriel.

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Date: September 22, 2022 11:19

U2 and Talking Heads didn't really have that "80s pop sound", did they?

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: Spud ()
Date: September 22, 2022 11:32

Quote
GasLightStreet
Quote
Spud
Dirty Work certainly ain't the best album they ever made...

but for me , one reason so many folks think its the worst is Steve Lillywhite's horrible production.

[ To be fair to him ..it was endemic in the '80s ]

It absolutely was not on Steve Lillywhite.

Given his experience, the times of what was going on... just not a good time period.

His prior work... substantial.


How it was mixed... and mastered ie post production - a whole other world.

As with any Stones recording, we don't get to hear everything that was done, recording wise in the mix, or editing wise. Bill said there were 240 some or more master tapes used. A lot of covers.

Lillywhite can be blamed for the outcome as a producer, which has some good moments, but it's really beyond him. It falls on Mick, period.


Fair comment

...but it's the sound of the album , the cold sterility and those horrible 80s drum sounds . There's no air , no atmosphere in the production.
It could make the greatest of songs sound like throw away filler !

Both Undercover an Steel Wheels had far more character in the production and a vibe that made them hang together as albums .

DW doesn't ... I do like some of the songs on it but they could have sounded so much better .

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: skytrench ()
Date: September 22, 2022 12:40

Quote
DandelionPowderman
U2 and Talking Heads didn't really have that "80s pop sound", did they?

Less synths, but they are still a kind of new wave pop. The playing style of their songs and what makes them tick is different from classic Stones. A stripped down sound with more emptyness/space, like Back to Zero. Less reverb?

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Date: September 22, 2022 13:55

Quote
skytrench
Quote
DandelionPowderman
U2 and Talking Heads didn't really have that "80s pop sound", did they?

Less synths, but they are still a kind of new wave pop. The playing style of their songs and what makes them tick is different from classic Stones. A stripped down sound with more emptyness/space, like Back to Zero. Less reverb?

I would call both of those bands rock, only with a different style. And there isn't really anything 80s-sounding about Boy, War and October.

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: September 22, 2022 17:21

Quote
Hairball
Quote
liddas
When the occasional anti-DW thread pops up here, I feel an urge to play my old worn out LP bought on release date: I still enjoy it a lot, I still love the cover art (sooner or later I will by myself one of those suits!) I still can't nail Keith's guitar fills on Sleep Tonight (one of his best ballads). I don't even skip winning ugly and back to zero anymore

It's no Exile, but I like it!

C

It's not as bad as some people think...

And when compared to the current alternative which is nothing...zero...zilch...I think Dirty Work is actually quite good.

Well it would actually be both the BEST and WORST album of new material in the last 16 years, if released now. So there's that.

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: rogerriffin ()
Date: September 22, 2022 17:33

One Hit and Harlem Shuffle singles were released in Red Vinyl in Mexico!




Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: Honestman ()
Date: September 22, 2022 18:52

I'd always loved their cover of Harlem Shuffle, and the two extended mix versions as well.
As a huge fan of Tex Avery, I also like the spirit of the cartoon that was made for the official clip.





For the die-hard collectors, try also to get that extended 12" cassette below, I've only seen it once and I miss it !



HMN



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-09-23 11:43 by Honestman.

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: September 22, 2022 18:56

Quote
Honestman
I'd always loved their cover of Harlem Shuffle, and the two extended mix versions as well.
As a huge fan of Tex Avery, I also like the spirit of the cartoon that was made for the official clip.





For the die-hard collectors, try also to get that extended 12" cassette below, I've only seen it once and I miss it !


Wow...that is cool, never even heard of the cassette version. I have the 12"

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: Honestman ()
Date: September 22, 2022 19:02

Quote
treaclefingers
Wow...that is cool, never even heard of the cassette version. I have the 12"

Yep you can hardly see it in Gulliano's book with some other goodies.



HMN



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-09-23 11:39 by Honestman.

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: tommyturbo76 ()
Date: September 23, 2022 02:49

2000 Light Years From Home and these two -- highlights of 1989.. haven't heard them since.

>> Harlem Shuffle was played every show of the 1989-90 tours. Same with Undercover Of The Night

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: September 23, 2022 17:52

Quote
Honestman
Quote
treaclefingers
Wow...that is cool, never even heard of the cassette version. I have the 12"

Yep you can hardly see it in Gulliano's book with some other goodies.


I have copies of all the other music items in that photo, other than the cassettes, plus I have 12" singles of that lot.

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: LeonidP ()
Date: September 23, 2022 20:17

Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
Honestman
I'd always loved their cover of Harlem Shuffle, and the two extended mix versions as well.
As a huge fan of Tex Avery, I also like the spirit of the cartoon that was made for the official clip.





For the die-hard collectors, try also to get that extended 12" cassette below, I've only seen it once and I miss it !


Wow...that is cool, never even heard of the cassette version. I have the 12"
Pretty sure it sounds the same, except for some tape hiss.

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: SomeGuy ()
Date: September 23, 2022 20:19

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Quote
skytrench
Quote
DandelionPowderman
U2 and Talking Heads didn't really have that "80s pop sound", did they?

Less synths, but they are still a kind of new wave pop. The playing style of their songs and what makes them tick is different from classic Stones. A stripped down sound with more emptyness/space, like Back to Zero. Less reverb?

I would call both of those bands rock, only with a different style. And there isn't really anything 80s-sounding about Boy, War and October.

At that time, U2 only had a few albums out, produced by Lillywhite (I think the more arty, pop style came with Eno or so I seem to remember), and those albums mentioned were indeed on the 'rock' side of things (and about the only ones I like by U2 for that matter).
I did, however, think it was a strange choice to let Lillywhite produce DW, and the outcome was certainly no typical Lillywhite sounding record. In fact, I believe he didn't achieve anything, but Keith and the band more or less 'produced' it, as it were.

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: GJV ()
Date: September 23, 2022 20:32

Quote
tommyturbo76
2000 Light Years From Home and these two -- highlights of 1989.. haven't heard them since.

>> Harlem Shuffle was played every show of the 1989-90 tours. Same with Undercover Of The Night

Undercover was only played in 1989 in the U.S., not in Japan, or in Europe in 1990.
Harlem Shuffle was played most of the time, but not at every concert in the U.S., some times it was replaced by One Hit.
Also in Europe, most of the time Harlem Shuffle was played, but not at every concert.

Re: Harlem Shuffle reconciles me with Dirty Work
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: September 23, 2022 22:36

Quote
LeonidP
Quote
treaclefingers
Quote
Honestman
I'd always loved their cover of Harlem Shuffle, and the two extended mix versions as well.
As a huge fan of Tex Avery, I also like the spirit of the cartoon that was made for the official clip.





For the die-hard collectors, try also to get that extended 12" cassette below, I've only seen it once and I miss it !


Wow...that is cool, never even heard of the cassette version. I have the 12"
Pretty sure it sounds the same, except for some tape hiss.

WOW! You're clever. You must have went to school or something...or something.

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