Before you start to read, please note that I'm a really big fan of the Stones and that I will still attend their shows, when they come to Europe.

But...

After listening a lot to ABB, I can say that this is an album with a very good instrumental background, but with horrible, really horrible lyrics.
Oh my god, Jagger is worth approx. 350 million dollars and 62 years old and sings about an affair he has with a working class girl (Rain Fall Down) or refers to oral sex (Rough Justice).
Sure that there are 62 year old granpas who @#$%& the shit outta 20 year hot dolls, but hey, no one wants to know details.
These lyrics show me that especially Jagger only keeps the Stones rolling for the money, also for fun, but mostly for money.
There are only 3 songs without sex or love (Neocon, BOMH, Driving Too Fast), while I think that Keith's Infamy is very decent (best song on the album, I think) and Rough Justice and ONNYA have enough drive to forget about these silly phrases in the songs.
They wrote JJF or Tumbling Dice without any cheap and ugly reference when they were all young and had sex all the time.
Now they are old and rich and seem to write and sing (esp. Jagger) about things which took place 35 years ago.
They can write about love and sex, but not in every song.
Just change the lyrics for the next(?) album a bit, and I will be happy.
Keith can stick with his "one love"-theme, he's more authentic as a lover and sings so wonderful and bluesy nowadays.

love the Mickster...but sometimes he tries too hard to be young (and he's good at it)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-11-17 22:07 by Leonard Keringer.

I agree completely. I was embarrassed for them on numerous tunes on the album, just because of the damn lyrics. Great riffs and rhythm on most, the production isn't my cup of tea however.

Driving too Fast is about sex.. Hanns I here what you are saying but I don't think the Stones will ever change or mature so to speak. Unlike Dylan who could write emotional songs about getting old or losing his grip on things, I can't see Mick ever writing songs or singing songs about something that someone his age would experience. Maybe the first step is for Mick to come stage and sing... what a drag it is getting old...

What other topics for rock and roll songs would you expect?

I understand your arguement, but I disagree. ONNYA has some of my favorite lyrics on the album, especially the thrid verse. He may be 62, but he can relate to someone a little more than a third of his age perfectly. The rooster / cocks in RJ is hilarious. LWTCDI is also has great lyrics. All the lyrics on the album are interesting and well written. Refrences to love in lyrics are almost to avoid. The vast majority of songs are about love or sex. Yes, Jagger is old. However, he certainly has a sex life. He just writes about what he does. Some may not like it, and that's fine. As for this 22 year old, I thinks its awesome.

Josh
np: LIND

wtf?! LoFL!
the Stones' primary message - musically, lyrically, visually, kinesthetically and every old which way - has always been "let's have sex" -
and a freakin glorious message it is, all down the line! bring it on, i say.


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith

I just have to add the the lyrics to Dangerous Beauty are f'ing awesome!!

Josh
np: take a guess...

Never have been a problem for me;
as I´m more into music, harmonies. melodies,
arrangements & sound(s) than lyrics.

I get your points, Hanns; but nevertheless I think
that also old geezer´s sex life may be of interest.
We live in a rapidly changing Western world; where gay´s sex
and old woman´s sex now are politically correct to reveal
& expose, but not white anglosachsian 'protestant' men´s.

I dont prefer netiher´s: And I have always likes Jagger´s
- and Richards´s lyrics. Still, your words, Hanns, can be
a useful alarm clock.

rolling stones change their album to appease hanns


new edition:FOR OLD PEOPLE

rough prostate
on no not hemmerhoids again
driving too slow(in the left lane)
it will take long
i fall down

I'm getting pretty tired that people accuse him for only doing it for the money while he is the only one that works for his money in the stones. His songs, his ideas, his everything... even 'his' stones these days. And when the stones are non active, he works on other things... I don't believe he does it all for the money... he does it because he likes working.
It's not Keiths band anymore... I can't defend Keith anymore. It's sad.
Mick is giving the best of himself every concert... he's the only one worth watching these days. Ron & Keith are lazy in everything they 'do'.

Don't forget that maybe 80% of all the music on ABB is written by Mick... so the instrumental background you referring to is probably directed by Mick.
Ok, if the lyrics sound a bit weird for a 62 year old man... but I don't care. To me he's not a 62 year old man, but Mick Jagger, singer in a rock and roll band... don't care about his age.
He deserves much more respect these days than Keith.

Hanns Rainsch Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Keith's Infamy is very decent (best song on the album, I think.


This has got to be a typo. Infamy is simply dreadful and a plain filler IMO. By far the WORST track of the album and I always skip it nowadays.
A contributing factor that I genuinely dislike Infamy may be the fact that Keith insists on playing it constantly.
Keith's "The Worst" is a masterpiece compared to Infamy.






Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-11-17 23:38 by The Stones.

Of course, the great irony of all this is that "Exile" is primarily about sexual dysfunction ("Rocks Off") impotence ("Loving Cup") decay ("Torn & Frayed") doubt ("Just Wanna See His Face") and death ("Shine A Light").

Those guys were willing to talk about (to romaticize?) aging and infirmity as they approached thirty...not as they passed sixty.

Why on earth would Jagger deliver anything besides a cartoonish party-boy stance? By his analysis, he only connects when delivering "Brown Sugar" and the like. "Successful Rolling Stones" has been boiled down pretty much to that. Can you imagine the contempt he has for what he sees as an audience that only wants to be reminded of its own past? And only the most broadly commercial aspects of that past? Can you imagine the contempt they must have for themselves sometimes? It used to be that "following Chuck Berry's lead" was a good thing. Now, I wonder if they don't also see themselves as peddlers of (a much more lucrative) nostalgia.

I don't see the Stones as being as cynical as so many others do, just incredibly trapped--and complicit--in their own giganticism. That's what distresses me about the shows...not that I want to hear this or that particular song.

What's about Muddy Waters who sang "Hoochie Coochie Man" in the age of 80?

I think part of the problem is the vocal level in the mix--Mick's way out in front and he's enunciating everything. You go back to their classic stuff-especially early 70s and the vocals are lower and Mick slurred more--on purpose. I think that made for a more fun listen--not catching the filthiness until after a few listens. Like Star Star.

But I do think it is creepy and not necessary for Mick to deliberately be so crude at his age. He has written many, many great songs that weren't so potty-like. And I've had my fill of hearing Mick the old man sing about getting dumped or dumping some chick.

Keith's lyrics, over the last few years, have been much more grown up.

A Bigger Bang still makes the last few albums irrelevant if you ask me, though.

Another thing:

Keith's solo songs seem to come from someone who is at piece w/ themselves as opposed to where Mick seems to still be trying to prove something to someone or live up to a reputation which I find very sad for someone his age.

gee, a bunch of you seem to be suffering assorted anxieties. i'm sorry for you (within reason!) but the Stones aren't the cause of it.
(and by the way ... if those interpretations of those Exile tracks resonate with you, Reverend, that's no skin off my nose,
but they're not be-all-and-end-all interpretations.)


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith

The knee-jerk reactions here are missing Hanns's point that many of the band's great songs in the past, when they were much younger, were not about sex. Sure, "Satisfaction" is, but we're surely glad in this case that in that era one had to find a euphemism.

"JJF" has at best an indirect connection to sex -- if we take JJF's painful experiences to be a rite of passage, perhaps part of the "gas gas gas" is now the chance to have adult sex. But that's a stretch.

"Tumbling Dice" is partly about women, but more just about being a ramblin gamblin man.

"IORR" is about the performer/audience dynamic. It is brilliant and seems like an academic article compared to what they've been writing.

I thought all the songs on Sticky Fingers were about drugs. Let's get some more of those.

I do like the lyrics to "Dangerous Beauty," though. And "Rain Fall Down" has some offbeat lines which are nice.

cc

J.J.Flash Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> rolling stones change their album to appease
> hanns
>
>
> new edition:FOR OLD PEOPLE
>
> rough prostate
> on no not hemmerhoids again
> driving too slow(in the left lane)
> it will take long
> i fall down
>

LOL! My thoughts exactly. What do people want them to start singing about, changing adult diapers or something? Give me a break.

Chas Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Another thing:
>
> Keith's solo songs seem to come from someone who
> is at piece w/ themselves as opposed to where Mick
> seems to still be trying to prove something to
> someone or live up to a reputation which I find
> very sad for someone his age.

Keith is at peace with himself. Mick is just trying to get a piece. He's a wandering spirit, that's for sure.

we can all list tracks from every phase of the Stones' work that are/aren't "about" sex.
and there are tracks on ABB that are not "about" sex, especially if all you're considering is the lyrics. so?
the Stones have always been gloriously raunchy, and the lyrics are just a tiny part of it.
and there have always been people who want to stifle that glorious raunchinness. too bad.


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-11-18 00:27 by with sssoul.

ohnonotyouagain Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> LOL! My thoughts exactly. What do people want them
> to start singing about, changing adult diapers or
> something? Give me a break.

The part about the adult diapers made me totally lose my appetite.
@#$%&' gross!!!!

Hanns....good post, man...

but ya GOTTA love "It Won't Take Long", no?

not so much about "sex" per se as "bitterness over relationships gone sour"....at least that's my take...and I think this is relevant at any age...

besides, I kind of like the fact that Mick is a scumbag at heart...."now I'm just one of your cocks"...

nice!

but, yeah....I suppose it's hard to retain your social-relevance with the masses when you are worth a few hundred million.....

sex always sells, though.

Rev. Robert W. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Of course, the great irony of all this is that
> "Exile" is primarily about sexual dysfunction
> ("Rocks Off") impotence ("Loving Cup") decay
> ("Torn & Frayed") doubt ("Just Wanna See His
> Face") and death ("Shine A Light").
>
withssoul replied:

gee, a bunch of you seem to be suffering assorted anxieties. i'm sorry for you (within reason!) but the Stones aren't the cause of it.
(and by the way ... if those interpretations of those Exile tracks resonate with you, Reverend, that's no skin off my nose,
but they're not be-all-and-end-all interpretations.)

And Rev. asks...

withssoul:

Well, what say you? By all means, tell me what the songs are about.

Not about sexual dysfunction? Help me understand:

"I'm always hearing voices on the street
I want to shout but I can't hardly speak
I was making love last night
To a dancer friend of mine
I can't seem to stay in step
'Cause she comes every time
Then she pirouettes--over me"

But I only get my rocks off while I'm sleeping
I only get my rocks off when I'm dreaming (from "Rocks Off")

Not about impotence and, um...oral sex as a substitute? You tell me:

"I'm the man on the mountain, come on up
I'm the plowman in the valley with a face full of sand
Yes, I'm fumbling and I know my car don't start
Yes, I'm fumbling and I know I play a bad guitar

Give me a little drink from your loving cup" (from "Loving Cup")

Not about physical decay (from opiates)?:

"Well his coat is torn and frayed
It's seen much better days
Just as long as the guitar plays
Let it steal your heart away

Joe's got a cough
Sounds kind of rough
Yeah, and the coedine to fix it
Doctor prescribes
Drugstore supplies
Who's gonna help him to kick it? (from "Torn And Frayed")

Not about doubt?

"Sometimes you ain't got nobody and you want
somebody to love
Then you don't want to walk and talk about Jesus
You just want to see His face" (from "Just Wanna See His Face")

Not about death (specifically the deceased founder of the band)?:

"Angels beating all their wings in time
With smiles on their faces
And a gleam in their eyes
Thought I heard one sigh for you
Come on up, come on up, now
Come on up, now

May the Good Lord shine a light on you..." (from "Shine A Light")

What are your counter-interpretations, withssoul? What am I missing in "Exile?"




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-11-18 00:36 by Rev. Robert W..

Its the moral panic all over again.
Plus the dispute on the Pope´s beard.
Noone knows what a text´s about except its writer.

It'll be hard to carry on this debate if it will be taken to be about censorship, which no one would say they are in favor of.

I guess there are a lot of fans who are coming from the let's-party/hedonism side, and that's fine. No doubt that's a large part of the stones' impact, particularly in the 60s. But I don't think that camp should insist on monopolizing what the band means, when they're missing quite a lot.

cc



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-11-18 00:43 by cc.

peace, Reverend - if that's what resonates with you, it's no skin off my nose.
all the lyrics you've quoted are very evocative of course, and
i know you already know great lyrics are great because they have many layers of meaning.


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith

cc:

If "we" do represent a "let's-party/hedonism side"...
What´s you others "------- - side"´s name?

And I just stated noone knows what a text is about
except that text´s writer.
Who is monopolizin?
Some invisible demons or windmills whirlin round & round here,
arent they?

and/or maybe glorious raunch is a deeply beautiful gift to a world that needs it.
at the very end of the beautiful documentary let It Bleed, Victor Bockris, of all people, makes this very impassioned statement:
"The Stones are religious - they're priests, they're the only priests we have!
We lived through a situation in the 40s when 100 million people got killed in like six years because of insane greed.
And the Rolling Stones came along and they wiped out the hate and horror and fear that came after the Second World War,
and they put something positive on the plate. They said: 'Hey!' They said: 'Let's have sex!'
And people are gonna try to put that down?!?"


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-11-18 01:03 by with sssoul.

Impotence is used as a metaphor on Exile, one that recurs even in their choice of Robert Johnson's "Stop Breaking Down."