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Great pictures from manchestereveningnews.co.uk, thank you !
Yes, and Mick Jones on drums.
I agree. It is a playback, but Mick sings live and I think it is one of his best performances ever, both vocally and visually. I don't think he has sung "Brown Sugar" so well live as he does there. Damn we don't have the other performances from the show.
- Doxa
I posted BS and WH in 2020, both recorded at the same session and broadcasted on a following (lost)
TOTP tv show. [iorr.org]
Damn, I must have missed this post at the time, the link seem to be invalid now.
- Doxa
Yeah, great video! One of the very best IMHO. I agree it's a playback with live vocals but I'm wondering if the music is different from the official studio release?
Great pics! Thanks
Interesting. I've always wondered about the music track, but didn't comment in case it was revealed to be identical to the 'usual' one thus revealing me to be an idiot with cloth ears! :-)
Who is the best expert on these things??
--
Captain Corella
60 Years a Fan
It's a long time since I've done it, but I remembered that I actually have the tools to do this sort of comparison.
OK - Take what I'll call the TOTP version, put the audio into a standard audio manipulation program and change it to Mono, then put the result into the (I used) Right channel of a fresh recording.
Then take a recent good version of Brown Sugar (I used the 2015 re-issue) and do the same, but put it into the left channel.
At this point things that are expected to be the same length are rarely so. Small difference can be due to tiny accumulating changes on tape machines. So top and tail each track, and then change the pitch of one of them so that they are the same length. (I did that with the TOTP version so as to preserve the integrity of the 2015 release). Only tiny tiny tiny changes were needed, so nothing significant.
Next play both channels and listen.
The (non vocal) track is the SAME. Spot on perfect the same.
It's really interesting to hear how Jagger's singing in both versions is so incredibly close, and apart from some vocal doodles at the end of the TOTP every word, phrase and call are the same. It's like hearing it double vocal tracked.
[I used to do this sort of stuff a lot about 20yrs back, and when the two tracks being compared are actually different (different takes, edited takes) it's VERY obvious very quickly.]
--
Captain Corella
60 Years a Fan
Of course a flaw in my work, and the posting, was the assumption that the 2105 re-release was basically the same track as the (eg) 1971 original release. Maybe I'll dip back into this one day...
--
Captain Corella
60 Years a Fan
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Manchester 1971 pictures
Posted by:
Rank Stranger
()
Date: January 28, 2022 21:19
Thanks to the Dylan fanpage expectingrain:
[www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-01-29 18:24 by Rank Stranger.
[www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-01-29 18:24 by Rank Stranger.
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
yearsinthemaking
()
Date: January 28, 2022 23:03
Great picture!!! I think that hat that Mick is wearing is the same silly hat he wears on Brown Sugar from the 7/25/72 show on Dick Cavett!!!!!
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
DaveG
()
Date: January 29, 2022 05:09
On the photos of Bob Dylan, was that Rick Danko and Robbie Robertson on bass and guitar respectively?
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
BlueTurns2Grey
()
Date: January 29, 2022 09:40
Great pictures from manchestereveningnews.co.uk, thank you !
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
Rank Stranger
()
Date: January 29, 2022 09:58
Quote
DaveG
On the photos of Bob Dylan, was that Rick Danko and Robbie Robertson on bass and guitar respectively?
Yes, and Mick Jones on drums.
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
CaptainCorella
()
Date: January 29, 2022 11:12
Is the suit that Jagger's wearing the same (pink) one he wore on TOTP for Brown Sugar?
(Great version IMHO, and obviously Jagger agreed as he ad lib's "Gor Blimey!" at the end of the take.)
--
Captain Corella
60 Years a Fan
(Great version IMHO, and obviously Jagger agreed as he ad lib's "Gor Blimey!" at the end of the take.)
--
Captain Corella
60 Years a Fan
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
Doxa
()
Date: January 29, 2022 20:27
Quote
CaptainCorella
Is the suit that Jagger's wearing the same (pink) one he wore on TOTP for Brown Sugar?
(Great version IMHO, and obviously Jagger agreed as he ad lib's "Gor Blimey!" at the end of the take.)
I agree. It is a playback, but Mick sings live and I think it is one of his best performances ever, both vocally and visually. I don't think he has sung "Brown Sugar" so well live as he does there. Damn we don't have the other performances from the show.
- Doxa
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
BlueTurns2Grey
()
Date: January 30, 2022 00:04
Quote
Doxa
Damn we don't have the other performances from the show.
- Doxa
I posted BS and WH in 2020, both recorded at the same session and broadcasted on a following (lost)
TOTP tv show. [iorr.org]
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
Doxa
()
Date: January 30, 2022 00:22
-
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-01-30 00:24 by Doxa.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-01-30 00:24 by Doxa.
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
Doxa
()
Date: January 30, 2022 00:23
Quote
BlueTurns2GreyQuote
Doxa
Damn we don't have the other performances from the show.
- Doxa
I posted BS and WH in 2020, both recorded at the same session and broadcasted on a following (lost)
TOTP tv show. [iorr.org]
Damn, I must have missed this post at the time, the link seem to be invalid now.
- Doxa
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
exilestones
()
Date: January 30, 2022 02:50
Quote
DoxaQuote
CaptainCorella
Is the suit that Jagger's wearing the same (pink) one he wore on TOTP for Brown Sugar?
(Great version IMHO, and obviously Jagger agreed as he ad lib's "Gor Blimey!" at the end of the take.)
I agree. It is a playback, but Mick sings live and I think it is one of his best performances ever, both vocally and visually. I don't think he has sung "Brown Sugar" so well live as he does there. Damn we don't have the other performances from the show.
- Doxa
Yeah, great video! One of the very best IMHO. I agree it's a playback with live vocals but I'm wondering if the music is different from the official studio release?
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
exilestones
()
Date: January 30, 2022 02:53
Quote
CaptainCorella
Is the suit that Jagger's wearing the same (pink) one he wore on TOTP for Brown Sugar?
(Great version IMHO, and obviously Jagger agreed as he ad lib's "Gor Blimey!" at the end of the take.)
Re: Manchester 1971 pictures
Posted by:
exilestones
()
Date: January 30, 2022 02:54
Great pics! Thanks
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
CaptainCorella
()
Date: January 30, 2022 03:53
Quote
exilestonesQuote
DoxaQuote
CaptainCorella
Is the suit that Jagger's wearing the same (pink) one he wore on TOTP for Brown Sugar?
(Great version IMHO, and obviously Jagger agreed as he ad lib's "Gor Blimey!" at the end of the take.)
I agree. It is a playback, but Mick sings live and I think it is one of his best performances ever, both vocally and visually. I don't think he has sung "Brown Sugar" so well live as he does there. Damn we don't have the other performances from the show.
- Doxa
Yeah, great video! One of the very best IMHO. I agree it's a playback with live vocals but I'm wondering if the music is different from the official studio release?
Interesting. I've always wondered about the music track, but didn't comment in case it was revealed to be identical to the 'usual' one thus revealing me to be an idiot with cloth ears! :-)
Who is the best expert on these things??
--
Captain Corella
60 Years a Fan
Re: Manchester 1971 picture
Posted by:
CaptainCorella
()
Date: January 30, 2022 06:35
Quote
CaptainCorella
Who is the best expert on these things??
It's a long time since I've done it, but I remembered that I actually have the tools to do this sort of comparison.
OK - Take what I'll call the TOTP version, put the audio into a standard audio manipulation program and change it to Mono, then put the result into the (I used) Right channel of a fresh recording.
Then take a recent good version of Brown Sugar (I used the 2015 re-issue) and do the same, but put it into the left channel.
At this point things that are expected to be the same length are rarely so. Small difference can be due to tiny accumulating changes on tape machines. So top and tail each track, and then change the pitch of one of them so that they are the same length. (I did that with the TOTP version so as to preserve the integrity of the 2015 release). Only tiny tiny tiny changes were needed, so nothing significant.
Next play both channels and listen.
The (non vocal) track is the SAME. Spot on perfect the same.
It's really interesting to hear how Jagger's singing in both versions is so incredibly close, and apart from some vocal doodles at the end of the TOTP every word, phrase and call are the same. It's like hearing it double vocal tracked.
[I used to do this sort of stuff a lot about 20yrs back, and when the two tracks being compared are actually different (different takes, edited takes) it's VERY obvious very quickly.]
--
Captain Corella
60 Years a Fan
Re: Manchester 1971 pictures
Posted by:
LieB
()
Date: January 30, 2022 15:55
Sounds like a fun thing to investigate.
As ya'll know, there are several versions of Brown Sugar with different guitar overdubs on the same basic backing track from Muscle Shoals. But I suppose they used the released version as the backing track for TOTP.
The Altamont recording of Brown Sugar is also very close to the original; I suppose they had it fresh in mind at that time. By 1972, it was beginning to sound quite different, with Mick singing it in his usual slurred live style.
As ya'll know, there are several versions of Brown Sugar with different guitar overdubs on the same basic backing track from Muscle Shoals. But I suppose they used the released version as the backing track for TOTP.
The Altamont recording of Brown Sugar is also very close to the original; I suppose they had it fresh in mind at that time. By 1972, it was beginning to sound quite different, with Mick singing it in his usual slurred live style.
Re: Manchester 1971 pictures
Posted by:
georgie48
()
Date: January 30, 2022 21:27
Great to see those pictures! My mind immediately went back to Bristol's Colston Hall where I saw the Stones on the 9th of March that year.
The picture that exilestones showed must have been from another concert, judging from Keith's clothes. In those days they didn't change clothes yet during a performance. In Bristol Mick jumped on stage to start with that cap on his head. Look at the stage ... life was still so simple. It was just the Rolling Stones there playing their great songs and nothing else mattered. Magic in the air
Are there any pictures from the Colston Hall show on March 9 around?
I'm a GHOST living in a ghost town
The picture that exilestones showed must have been from another concert, judging from Keith's clothes. In those days they didn't change clothes yet during a performance. In Bristol Mick jumped on stage to start with that cap on his head. Look at the stage ... life was still so simple. It was just the Rolling Stones there playing their great songs and nothing else mattered. Magic in the air
Are there any pictures from the Colston Hall show on March 9 around?
I'm a GHOST living in a ghost town
Re: Manchester 1971 pictures
Posted by:
CaptainCorella
()
Date: January 30, 2022 22:26
Quote
LieB
Sounds like a fun thing to investigate.
As ya'll know, there are several versions of Brown Sugar with different guitar overdubs on the same basic backing track from Muscle Shoals. But I suppose they used the released version as the backing track for TOTP.
The Altamont recording of Brown Sugar is also very close to the original; I suppose they had it fresh in mind at that time. By 1972, it was beginning to sound quite different, with Mick singing it in his usual slurred live style.
Of course a flaw in my work, and the posting, was the assumption that the 2105 re-release was basically the same track as the (eg) 1971 original release. Maybe I'll dip back into this one day...
--
Captain Corella
60 Years a Fan
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