Often times I find a Dylan lyric comes to mind when digesting current events.

Man thinks because he rules the earth he can do with it as he please
And if things don’t change soon, he will
Oh, man has invented his doom
First step was touching the moon

On January 6 it was:

In the home of the brave,
Jefferson turning over in his grave

Regarding the Trump presidency it was:

They say that patriotism is the last refuge
To which a scoundrel clings
Steal a little and they throw you in jail
Steal a lot and they make you king

There have been others as well.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-12 17:14 by JimmyTheSaint.

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Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-20 17:45 by Irix.

Branson, Bezos and others have nothing on these critters. True space pioneers.

[www.monkeyinspace.net]

[en.wikipedia.org]

Sorry but what a bunch of bullshit. Envy runs deep, that is obvious. He remains one of my true heroes in this fked up world. Quoting Bob Marley is a new low.

You do know who Richard Branson is and his (musical) history, right?

Everybody thinks its great that old mickey there goes to some sports tourney in his thousand dollar plastic jacket and designer face mask, but hey, make a private space flight and thats just a piece of PR nonsense and a waste of (someone else's) funds.

Never mind. Sorry I even brought it up. Back to arguing with dolts about whether one should risk a scary little vax.

jb

Envy, no, just calling out Branson's foolish obsession. It was good you brought this up, so we could discuss this here. There really is no reason for him to go to space and waste all those resources, it's disrespectful. I'm pretty sure Bob would agree!

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jbwelda
So f'in awesome.


jb

Very cool!

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Irix

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georgie48

Maybe an additional suggestion to sir Richard: free condoms for everyone to bring down the global population to what it was before the Industrial Revolution.

It's the other way round: Industrial Revolution (and the contraceptive pill) brought down the population numbers in the Western World while the insecure living conditions in the 3rd World still require many offsprings.

That, Irix, was much, much later, after WW 2. The start of the Industrial Revolution dates back to the late 1700s and early 1800s. During the later 1800s and the first half of the 20st Century both "western" and "eastern" people were producing offsprings like rabbits. Only when comfort entered the life of western people they became more selfish and family size went down, where in the 3rd world it was both a requirement and a "nothing else to do" and yes, no pills to start with (as of 1960, when I was already 12 years of age ).
The world population was still just under 1 billion in 1800. Imagine that! What a wonderful world that would be now ...

I'm a GHOST living in a ghost town

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treaclefingers

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TheflyingDutchman
This looks far more adventurous to me:

I'm sure that is still to come, as an 'add-on' for $300,000.

I remember watching this live. It was INSANE! I could never! LOL

Article from the Atlantic magazine:

[www.theatlantic.com]

Space Billionaires, Please Read the Room

Jeff Bezos and Richard Branson are choosing a terrible time to leave Earth.
By Shannon Stirone
The Atlantic
July 7, 2021

Dear billionaires, no one cares whom you beat to space.

After Jeff Bezos, the world’s richest person, announced that he would join the first crewed flight by his rocket company, Blue Origin, later this month, Richard Branson just couldn’t let himself be outdone.* So now Branson, merely the world’s 589th richest person, is joining the crew of his next Virgin Galactic flight on Sunday, nine days before Bezos goes vertical.

All of this to go to “space.” Branson will go only about 50 miles up, where the military says space starts. Bezos will go 12 miles higher, just past the internationally recognized Karman Line, but he’ll be there for only four minutes.

Could there be a worse time for two über-rich rocket owners to take a quick jaunt toward the dark? Especially in the United States, the climate crisis is now actually starting to feel like a crisis. The western U.S. is in the thick of fire season, experiencing record-breaking drought and temperatures. Last week, Bezos’s hometown of Seattle hit 108 degrees. Hurricane season is starting early, and a once-in-200-years flood just ravaged northern Mississippi. Oh yeah, then there’s the pandemic that is very much still not over. Anyone would want a break from this planet, but the billionaires are virtually the only ones who are able to leave.

Leaving Earth right now isn’t just bad optics; it’s almost a scene out of a twisted B-list thriller: The world is drowning and scorching, and two of the wealthiest men decide to ... race in their private rocket ships to see who can get to space a few days before the other. If this were a movie, these men would be Gordon Gekko and Hal 9000—both venerated and hated. Maybe, I don’t know, delay the missions a bit until people around the world are no longer desperately waiting for vaccines to save them from a deadly virus.

To their credit, the two billionaires aren’t totally oblivious. In recent years, Branson has proposed a climate dividend, while Bezos has pledged to spend $10 billion on climate efforts, though we still don’t know where most of that money will go. But given what humanity has been through in the past year and a half, I can’t help but wonder, what are they thinking? (I reached out to both Blue Origin and Virgin Galactic for comment and neither company responded. Branson has insisted that he is not in a competition with Bezos.)

And it’s not just them that make this display feel so gross. Their fellow billionaire Elon Musk (currently the No. 2 richest person, if you’re keeping track) may not be far behind in his own space travels and is in the midst of ruining the night sky with his mega-constellation of satellites. While Bezos and Branson will be in space—I mean, “space”—for just a few minutes, their departure is yet another reminder of all the other earthly things they can avoid that the rest of us can’t. Billionaires have purchased private islands, built underground bunkers, and gotten LASIK to prepare for not having glasses during the climate apocalypse. They can’t truly escape Earth now, and they likely never will, but they can avoid helping make this planet better.

However, even after their trip past the atmosphere, the space billionaires still have to come back here and face the world. When they are pushed upward into the sky, they will live-stream their experience, their bodies briefly floating, staring out at the curvature of our delicate and beautiful planet, all of us invisible. Will leaving Earth change them?

This is one of the universal sentiments that astronauts express once setting foot back on the ground: Looking at Earth, from up above, gives you a different perspective, enough to shift something inside. “The thing that really surprised me was that [Earth] projected an air of fragility,” the Apollo 11 astronaut Michael Collins said. “And why, I don’t know. I don’t know to this day. I had a feeling it’s tiny, it’s shiny, it’s beautiful, it’s home, and it’s fragile.” Maybe this quick trip really will change the billionaires, but I’m not counting on it. After all, they’re only going to “space.”

*This article previously misstated that Jeff Bezos and Richard Branson are vying to become the first billionaires in space. In fact, at least one billionaire, Charles Simonyi, has already traveled to space.

Drew

Reading through this thread again brought back a comment I once heard: The more money they have the more expensive their toys. Regarding the flight(s)....

[www.youtube.com]

(BTW...this is from one of the Byrds better albums.)

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Irix
Wildfires in California, severe hurricanes in Florida, 130 °F extreme heat -- do we really need space tourism ?

The last major hurricane in Florida was in October of 2018 (category 5 Michael). Prior to that, 2017 (category 4 Irma). Prior to that, 2005 (category 3 Dennis and Wilma).

So it's not as bad as people think, Florida and hurricanes. And so far in 2021, zero.

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Irix

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treaclefingers

Well besides a completely different design and the fact that it is a private and not government achievement, I think the real point of this being momentous is that it marks the start of a new space race and creating a tourism industry there, whatever one may think of that.

No, the basics are the same (like the Sänger). A newly, privately developed Concorde would be then a "momentous achievement" too? New tourism industry: yeah, just give everyone his private Jet-Set via new Concorde - the Earth has eternal resources for this kind of fun.

You're making no sense. You're disagreeing on why I believe it to be momentous. You can feel free to do that, but you can't say I can't believe that just because your belief is different. I'm not saying you have to agree with it being momentous. All I was doing was explaining a position.

Your 'earth eternal resources' argument is an entirely separate issue altogether. I did state in my original comment, "whatever one may think of that".

Concentrate and try to come up with a coherent argument and come back and let's chat.

Oh, and if you're annoyed by my dismissive tone, now you know how it feels.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-13 00:10 by treaclefingers.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-14 12:15 by Irix.

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skytrench
Envy, no, just calling out Branson's foolish obsession. It was good you brought this up, so we could discuss this here. There really is no reason for him to go to space and waste all those resources, it's disrespectful. I'm pretty sure Bob would agree!

Bob Marley already agreed.

the song is called "So Much Trouble"....the lyrics are quite clear.

[www.youtube.com]

Great song..

Not sure why quoting this would be a "new low"....I mean, the lyrics seem pretty literal to me, but maybe I am slow.

Regardless, Branson can do what he wants and people can call him Their Hero if they want...the Chinese are the ones I'd keep my eye on

Bob Marley rules.

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Irix

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treaclefingers

You're disagreeing on why I believe it to be momentous. You can feel free to do that, but you can't say I can't believe that just because your belief is different. I'm not saying you have to agree with it being momentous. All I was doing was explaining a position.

You can of course believe what you want. If it's momentous, then it's your opinion.

Btw: in Germany we had already in 1942 rockets (A4/V2) which reached more than 100 km (62 miles) altitude - but instead of peacefully exploring the space, they destroyed London & Antwerp.

It's all about what your believe and your starting point. Using your argument, one could argue that after 1903 any 'flight' is just a modification of the first one by the Wright Brothers.

And the Chinese had fireworks at the first millennium. Anything after that it could be argued, is just additional power/alternate fuels.

So in this case, momentous in that it ushers in a new era of space travel, tourism. You don't have to agree, but I think that's what we're talking about, not necessarily the technology.

In this case we can only hope that such a trend doesn't pick up momentum.

If I take this trip into “space”, will the miles flown count toward Elite status on my Alaska Airlines Mileage Plan account?

can't wait for the stones to go to space i mean there the only ones that can

and admit it lot those fans complaining about branson (rightfuly) would at some level love to see mick in space

>Not sure why quoting this would be a "new low"....I mean, the lyrics seem pretty literal to me, but maybe I am slow.


Well yeah except that I do not think Branson is doing it for his own ego. Now Bezos might be a different matter. But I think enough of Richard Branson to think he is being pretty driven by something other than ego. That has been his history. He ain't sailing on an ego trip. Its easy to point a finger but remember there are three more pointing back at you.

And yeah man I know about Bob Marley. Quite a bit about Bob Marley including how he wasn't such a nice fellow when the situation required it despite some lyrics to the contrary.

I think it is great he and others are wrestling space from the various governments and putting his money into doing things like this and building space stations.

The other thing is the utter bravery of the man, to ride his own spaceship on its maiden voyage is not something the average billionaire does. Of course he has a long history of records in speed, height, depth and pretty much any other measure you care to throw at him, and he mostly does this stuff himself, doesn't put the danger off on others he can hire. Compare and contrast to a certain mick who won't walk down the street without a phalanx of bodyguards. Not to say Branson can or does walk the streets by himself but he probably does at least sometimes. Probably way more dangerous than his rocket ride.

I don't know what else to say, his achievements stand on their own and he certainly does not need me to defend his honor. Its just that I detect this trend in society to blame all rich people for all the problems and then somehow think that out of shame they will dump all their resources into someone's pet project or "save the world" campaign and when they go a different direction, they are the enemy and wasteful and all that shit and they turn green with envy. I don't expect anyone to tell me how to spend my money and personally I think Branson along with a number of others including the great satan Bill Gates have realized what it is to give back to the earth and society that let them achieve what they have. And I applaud them for it. Jeff Bezos even. But Elon Musk for sure.

So, its not that big a deal, I can live with disagreeing with others, but rarely will I shut up about it.

jb

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DaveG
If I take this trip into “space”, will the miles flown count toward Elite status on my Alaska Airlines Mileage Plan account?

Probably on Virgin Air

jb

Yes, it would be sad if Branson's moment in space became a trend for more gluttony. Richard seemed happy as a kid in his rocket plane and it's sweet to see his big smile there! You won't see me on a spaceship unless the world is going under or a UFO captures me, but then I would not be one of the chosen few anyway.

Bob Marley, damn the cancer, what a standout artist.

I don't want to shame them into giving away their fortunes. I want them taxed. Not sure how it could work to tax someones income retroactively, but it's got to make up for the last 40 years.

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Nikkei
I don't want to shame them into giving away their fortunes. I want them taxed. Not sure how it could work to tax someones income retroactively, but it's got to make up for the last 40 years.

Well man, I would sure put a whole heap of people before Sir Branson in that line. One particular chump comes immediately to mind.

And I believe I read somewhere an article about how Branson proudly pays his taxes and does not go near all the way he could in legal tax evasion and reduction. Thats both his various enterprises and himself personally...I trust you understand the difference before you bring up the taxes issue, it sounds from your post like maybe you do not.


As an aside, these are not necessarily "toys". Think for a second about the actual uses of near space access for medicine and world survival in the face of global climate change. Not to mention a million other things. This isn't some clown doing this because hes got nothing else to do. Yes there is the commercial oh-ah about selling tickets to "near space" but like Marcus Garvey taught, sometimes you have to make money to cover expenses if you want to get where you think you need to go.


jb

His money, his life. Enjoy to the max. People said the space race in the 60s was a waste of resources but look what it gave us....1000s of new products like velcro, et al.

Fifty years from now who knows what good will come of this.

If I had a billion I'd be right up there with him.

The discourse regarding Richard Branson is ridiculous. What he's involved in is an issue? There is so much going on every day to make what he's doing or has done with "going into space", whatever, so minute, that it's ridiculous.

And if those that are contriving up such a storm of judgement, why aren't you concerned with such everyday issues?

So fake. FAKE.

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DaveG
If I take this trip into “space”, will the miles flown count toward Elite status on my Alaska Airlines Mileage Plan account?

Maybe if you flew Virgin Atlantic.

EDIT...ah..Welda beat me to it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-13 08:08 by treaclefingers.

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jbwelda

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Nikkei
I don't want to shame them into giving away their fortunes. I want them taxed. Not sure how it could work to tax someones income retroactively, but it's got to make up for the last 40 years.

Well man, I would sure put a whole heap of people before Sir Branson in that line. One particular chump comes immediately to mind.

And I believe I read somewhere an article about how Branson proudly pays his taxes and does not go near all the way he could in legal tax evasion and reduction. Thats both his various enterprises and himself personally...I trust you understand the difference before you bring up the taxes issue, it sounds from your post like maybe you do not.


As an aside, these are not necessarily "toys". Think for a second about the actual uses of near space access for medicine and world survival in the face of global climate change. Not to mention a million other things. This isn't some clown doing this because hes got nothing else to do. Yes there is the commercial oh-ah about selling tickets to "near space" but like Marcus Garvey taught, sometimes you have to make money to cover expenses if you want to get where you think you need to go.


jb

Did it ever occur to you that the increasing use of space travel will contribute to global warming? From the mining of materials to the burning of fuel, creation of space junk, etc. None of it is good for global warming or the environment in general, especially if it becomes more widely available.

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jbwelda

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Nikkei
I don't want to shame them into giving away their fortunes. I want them taxed. Not sure how it could work to tax someones income retroactively, but it's got to make up for the last 40 years.

Well man, I would sure put a whole heap of people before Sir Branson in that line. One particular chump comes immediately to mind.

Bono?

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GasLightStreet
The discourse regarding Richard Branson is ridiculous. What he's involved in is an issue? There is so much going on every day to make what he's doing or has done with "going into space", whatever, so minute, that it's ridiculous.

And if those that are contriving up such a storm of judgement, why aren't you concerned with such everyday issues?

So fake. FAKE.

Are you saying we should not discuss his "going into space" when that's the subject of the thread? Maybe you missed the point, but he's planning on developing space tourism, not just a one take.

Why don't you create some threads about everyday issues like ignorance, intolerance, arrogance or aggression...maybe these topics are less fake to you?

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marianna

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jbwelda

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Nikkei
I don't want to shame them into giving away their fortunes. I want them taxed. Not sure how it could work to tax someones income retroactively, but it's got to make up for the last 40 years.

Well man, I would sure put a whole heap of people before Sir Branson in that line. One particular chump comes immediately to mind.

And I believe I read somewhere an article about how Branson proudly pays his taxes and does not go near all the way he could in legal tax evasion and reduction. Thats both his various enterprises and himself personally...I trust you understand the difference before you bring up the taxes issue, it sounds from your post like maybe you do not.


As an aside, these are not necessarily "toys". Think for a second about the actual uses of near space access for medicine and world survival in the face of global climate change. Not to mention a million other things. This isn't some clown doing this because hes got nothing else to do. Yes there is the commercial oh-ah about selling tickets to "near space" but like Marcus Garvey taught, sometimes you have to make money to cover expenses if you want to get where you think you need to go.


jb

Did it ever occur to you that the increasing use of space travel will contribute to global warming? From the mining of materials to the burning of fuel, creation of space junk, etc. None of it is good for global warming or the environment in general, especially if it becomes more widely available.

You are right: we should just sit inside our ever increasingly hot hovels and just kind of hunker down and wait to die. Good point. That will save the planet, for sures.

jb