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jumpontopofmebaby

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Kerryann
Can I suggest to anyone with refundable hotel deals to cancel and get your refunds asap. This virus is really hurting the travel and hospitality industries and there will be casualties. If your agent goes bust, there may not be refunds to be had.
Also just hoping that ticketmaster is solid, as I imagine they will be issuing mega amounts of refunds from cancelled events at the moment. Thats why I hope the stones cancel asap so that we can get our refunds back into our accounts. The longer they delay, the less the chance we will see our money again.

At this time Ticketmaster is not refunding postponed and rescheduled events like they used to. They changed their policy a few days ago. I do not have the link but a few pages back there is one to a Ticketmaster blog.

Not sure how well this alleged new policy will hold up if challenged legally. The policy should be the one that was in place when any tickets were purchased as that was what was agreed to during the transaction. They can make up whatever policy they want after the fact and most consumers wouldn’t even know and that isn’t legit.

Meanwhile David Crosby is concerned that if his up coming tour is cancelled he may 'lose his home'.
Says he has no savings.
Surely income though from CSNY days?

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Hairball

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georgie48

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Hairball
Now there's been mention of the possibility of domestic travel restrictions within the US....
Would that mean from state to state? Or county to county? Or city to city?
Or ultimately complete lockdown within your home?
Strange days.............

Strange days indeed, Hairball.
In the Netherlands people haven been "raping" supermarkets in the past days like mad. Watching Belgium TV the behavior there is similar. The Belgium prime minister insisted on showing warehouses on TV to prove to the people that they are filled to the top (only distribution takes two or three days longer, because normally the delivery pace is based on normal shopping behavior), but still people act like sheep, one following te other like a robot without conscious thinking. Toilet paper??? Ridiculous. It may happen in the USA too pretty soon.
Right now I enjoy listening to Aftermath with some typical human behavior kind of lyrics.

It already has started here georgie48 - people stocking up/hoarding lots of stuff including toilet paper.
I drove by a Costco yesterday which is a warehouse type massive market to buy items in bulk, and there was literally a line that went as far as the eye could see with people standing with their carts outside in the rain waiting to get in.
Even some of the regular sized markets are being tested with shelves emptied....everything from toilet paper, water, rice, pasta. etc., etc., etc....it's near chaos.

It's a shame I don't know how to put a YouTube link here, but the other day a Dutch man working in a huge storage place, filmed himself while driving on his forklift machine around the storage place ..... loaded with toiletpaper! And he, while laughing, says "shortage???". Airline companies may suffer badly, but household production companies on the other hand must be very happy
No real panic in NL yet, but today there is a "war" between the Governmental Health Department and the medical specialists body about closing schools. The latter will very likely win ... all schools closed, maybe already tomorrow.

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dcba
Op-ed : "China Bought the West Time. The West Squandered It."
[www.nytimes.com]

(personal opinion : what if the widely-discussed shift of power between the West and China was just happening right now. They handled the disease we just can't. They prevailed, we are just entering epidemic Hell).

Our loss is their loss. Our inability to control it is just going to bounce right back at them at some point.

In other news, I note that the current number of cases crossing the 160000 mark worldwide means that there'll be more cases outside of China than within China for the first time.

[www.worldometers.info]

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jlowe
Meanwhile David Crosby is concerned that if his up coming tour is cancelled he may 'lose his home'.
Says he has no savings.
Surely income though from CSNY days?

Welcome to the club. He would not be the first homeless.
I bet his royalties from "Heart Of Gold" will pay for a shack somewhere.

Bjornulf

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bv

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jlowe
Meanwhile David Crosby is concerned that if his up coming tour is cancelled he may 'lose his home'.
Says he has no savings.
Surely income though from CSNY days?

Welcome to the club. He would not be the first homeless.
I bet his royalties from "Heart Of Gold" will pay for a shack somewhere.

One slight problem.
Heart of Gold was written by Neil Young.
And these old exponents of peace and love don't get on with each other anymore!

Situation wordwide in numbers:
European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control (ECDC)
Johns Hopkins University (including total recovered)

Numbers change every few hours...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-03-15 15:08 by MAF.

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PinballWizard23

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jumpontopofmebaby

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Kerryann
Can I suggest to anyone with refundable hotel deals to cancel and get your refunds asap. This virus is really hurting the travel and hospitality industries and there will be casualties. If your agent goes bust, there may not be refunds to be had.
Also just hoping that ticketmaster is solid, as I imagine they will be issuing mega amounts of refunds from cancelled events at the moment. Thats why I hope the stones cancel asap so that we can get our refunds back into our accounts. The longer they delay, the less the chance we will see our money again.

At this time Ticketmaster is not refunding postponed and rescheduled events like they used to. They changed their policy a few days ago. I do not have the link but a few pages back there is one to a Ticketmaster blog.

Not sure how well this alleged new policy will hold up if challenged legally. The policy should be the one that was in place when any tickets were purchased as that was what was agreed to during the transaction. They can make up whatever policy they want after the fact and most consumers wouldn’t even know and that isn’t legit.

Good luck with collecting enough people together to run a court hearing about something non-essential at the moment!

UK now suggesting that all over-70s will be asked to self-quarantine for their own protection "within weeks". So if any of the band are still in the UK by then, that's a definite end to tour prospects (or indeed the hypothetical recording sessions).

Back to the Virus.
The Center for Diseases and Prevention (CDC) predict that between 2.4 and 21 million people in the US could require hospitalisation.
Presumably this is to reflect best case (measures taken) and no measures (ignore).
If I was producing an Academic paper on the subject I would get it sent back. Why not just say 'We don't know'. Because in our 24/7 media age they cannot it seems so have to come up with something.
A more factual statement: There are 925,000 hospital beds and 10% available for the critically ill. That is worrying.
A Dr Lawler says his best guess is that 96 million US citizens will get affected.

One thing for sure, is that like economic predictions, no one will be mulling over these predictions to see how accurate or not they were in a few years time.

DO THE FIVE.
Help stop coronavirus

1 HANDS Wash them often
2 ELBOW Cough & Sneeze into it
3 FACE Don't touch it
4 SPACE Keep safe distance
5 FEEL SICK? Stay home



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2020-03-21 02:08 by schillid.

If you have an airline ticket and you are not going to travel but the flight is still operating then most airlines are now offering the option to either change to a later date or take a voucher for future use however if you can then it is advisable to wait for the airline to cancel the flight as you would then be able to claim a full cash refund.
The big national airlines will most certainly survive either because they are very healthy financially or governments will have to bail them out but many of the smaller airlines will go bust and if you are holding a voucher or booking when they do then you can kiss your money goodbye.

Nate

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schillid

Help stop coronavirus

Helps also against Influenza (and similar) ....

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jlowe

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bv

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jlowe
Meanwhile David Crosby is concerned that if his up coming tour is cancelled he may 'lose his home'.
Says he has no savings.
Surely income though from CSNY days?

Welcome to the club. He would not be the first homeless.
I bet his royalties from "Heart Of Gold" will pay for a shack somewhere.

One slight problem.
Heart of Gold was written by Neil Young.
And these old exponents of peace and love don't get on with each other anymore!

Sorry my mistake. I mixed up Neil Young with David Crosby in my mind, of course, having my mind in the CSNY mode for a while... I don't even know the difference between left or wright always, when asked, unless I think for a while, checking out where the arm I hold my pen in is. At least I have never mixed up Mick and Keith when talking or writing, that is a beginning.

Bjornulf

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Nate
If you have an airline ticket and you are not going to travel but the flight is still operating then most airlines are now offering the option to either change to a later date or take a voucher for future use however if you can then it is advisable to wait for the airline to cancel the flight as you would then be able to claim a full cash refund.
The big national airlines will most certainly survive either because they are very healthy financially or governments will have to bail them out but many of the smaller airlines will go bust and if you are holding a voucher or booking when they do then you can kiss your money goodbye.

Nate

The trouble is that if Governments bail out the big airlines then where does it stop? Why should they be more worthy of a bailout than any other type of business in trouble? Most people and businesses live hand to mouth and are 2 or 3 monthly salaries from oblivion.

A possible solution (or part of it) is banks, supported by Governments foregoing loan interest until the struggling businesses are back on their feet. But businesses and people have other expenses too so with reduced income there will certainly be problems. There will certainly be a recession after all this, with many weaker businesses going bust and those which survive picking up the slack and thriving when things pick up again.

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jlowe
Meanwhile David Crosby is concerned that if his up coming tour is cancelled he may 'lose his home'.
Says he has no savings.
Surely income though from CSNY days?

probably be a good idea for him to cut down on the weed consumption. i watched the documentary on him & he said he spends thousands of dollars a month on marijuana. pretty sure not a healthy habit in those quantities & with his medical history. not saying that weed is bad but am saying him complaining about going broke with that factor seems a bit disingenuous. all good things in moderation....
he probably is in the high risk category due to his age & underlying medical such as liver transplant & heart trouble. staying home would seem to be the prudent choice for him.

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jlowe
Meanwhile David Crosby is concerned that if his up coming tour is cancelled he may 'lose his home'.
Says he has no savings.
Surely income though from CSNY days?

When I was on the Stones tour in USA last summer I remember David Crosby had quite a few interviews around in papers, inflight magazines etc. Then when I was in Phoenix for the Stones-show in Glendale, the "David Crosby: Remember My Name" was screening in Tempe at 4pm or so in the afternoon. I wanted to see it but unfortunately I did not have time.

I am sure he could pick up some money if he went on tour on his own, but it all depends on his habits and how big bugs he is in need of for his life style. Most of us will not have much income for a while anyway, as business and the world close down while the virus is around for the next few months.

Bjornulf

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grzegorz67

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Nate
If you have an airline ticket and you are not going to travel but the flight is still operating then most airlines are now offering the option to either change to a later date or take a voucher for future use however if you can then it is advisable to wait for the airline to cancel the flight as you would then be able to claim a full cash refund.
The big national airlines will most certainly survive either because they are very healthy financially or governments will have to bail them out but many of the smaller airlines will go bust and if you are holding a voucher or booking when they do then you can kiss your money goodbye.

Nate

The trouble is that if Governments bail out the big airlines then where does it stop? Why should they be more worthy of a bailout than any other type of business in trouble? Most people and businesses live hand to mouth and are 2 or 3 monthly salaries from oblivion.

A possible solution (or part of it) is banks, supported by Governments foregoing loan interest until the struggling businesses are back on their feet. But businesses and people have other expenses too so with reduced income there will certainly be problems. There will certainly be a recession after all this, with many weaker businesses going bust and those which survive picking up the slack and thriving when things pick up again.

National airlines are of great importance to not only their own but also the global economy.When things start to get back to normality then people will need to be moving around the world again.It goes without saying that of course British Airways and other flag carriers should take precedence over smaller operators.
The Trump ban on travel from the UK could potentially kill Virgin Atlantic as the vast majority of their routes are transatlantic.

Nate

Plus 800 new cases in Switzerland in one day... slowly some cantons are closing down, but the federal government is way too passive.

sjouke

These times will do a terrible blow to the economies, both for private, corporate and government economies. In Norway they say 8 of 10 companies plan to reduce manpower due to the virus shutdown. Rich people will not be able to do that many holidays, expensive cars and luxury items. Low income people will struggle with having food on the table. The governments need to come up with crisis packages for companies and private people. This reminds me a bit about the movie "Darkest Hour". Very important decisions, with great importance to a lot of us, are now in the hands of our leaders.

Bjornulf

Germany will close the borders to Austria, Switzerland and France tomorrow morning. Details to be announced.

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PinballWizard23

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jumpontopofmebaby

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Kerryann
Can I suggest to anyone with refundable hotel deals to cancel and get your refunds asap. This virus is really hurting the travel and hospitality industries and there will be casualties. If your agent goes bust, there may not be refunds to be had.
Also just hoping that ticketmaster is solid, as I imagine they will be issuing mega amounts of refunds from cancelled events at the moment. Thats why I hope the stones cancel asap so that we can get our refunds back into our accounts. The longer they delay, the less the chance we will see our money again.

At this time Ticketmaster is not refunding postponed and rescheduled events like they used to. They changed their policy a few days ago. I do not have the link but a few pages back there is one to a Ticketmaster blog.

Not sure how well this alleged new policy will hold up if challenged legally. The policy should be the one that was in place when any tickets were purchased as that was what was agreed to during the transaction. They can make up whatever policy they want after the fact and most consumers wouldn’t even know and that isn’t legit.

Ticketmaster is owned by live nation who is a large concert promoter like
AEG etc. In addition Live Nation owns other companies all of which would
appear to be in the entertainment business and seem very much at risk with
the current crisis. So I think this development with Ticketmaster is cause
for concern.

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Nate

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grzegorz67

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Nate
If you have an airline ticket and you are not going to travel but the flight is still operating then most airlines are now offering the option to either change to a later date or take a voucher for future use however if you can then it is advisable to wait for the airline to cancel the flight as you would then be able to claim a full cash refund.
The big national airlines will most certainly survive either because they are very healthy financially or governments will have to bail them out but many of the smaller airlines will go bust and if you are holding a voucher or booking when they do then you can kiss your money goodbye.

Nate

The trouble is that if Governments bail out the big airlines then where does it stop? Why should they be more worthy of a bailout than any other type of business in trouble? Most people and businesses live hand to mouth and are 2 or 3 monthly salaries from oblivion.

A possible solution (or part of it) is banks, supported by Governments foregoing loan interest until the struggling businesses are back on their feet. But businesses and people have other expenses too so with reduced income there will certainly be problems. There will certainly be a recession after all this, with many weaker businesses going bust and those which survive picking up the slack and thriving when things pick up again.

National airlines are of great importance to not only their own but also the global economy.When things start to get back to normality then people will need to be moving around the world again.It goes without saying that of course British Airways and other flag carriers should take precedence over smaller operators.
The Trump ban on travel from the UK could potentially kill Virgin Atlantic as the vast majority of their routes are transatlantic.

Nate

I agree about the national importance for business and For what it’s worth, I do think there will be a bailout of some sort, limited to National Carriers only such as BA for ourselves, Lufthansa for Germany etc. The last time we did a big bailout, i.e. the banks in 2008, National Debt was under 50% of GDP so we could afford it then, even though the banks’ problems were through their own greed and stupidity. National Debt is now over 80% so much less wiggle room this time.

The airlines’ bailout will probably come with preconditions such as the recipient has to downsize drastically because demand is likely to be reduced for a long time afterwards, before they can build themselves up again. If they don’t downsize, they’ll just run up more debts.

I agree that Virgin could be in bother. They’ve been privately owned since the outset and aren’t a national carrier as such. 49% owned by Delta, who’ve asked their own government for a bailout. They’re also 30% owned by Air France-KLM so I they probably won’t be getting anything from the U.K. Government. It will be a great pity if they do go down because over the years they’ve done a good job in putting a brake on BA’s prices.

There will be other big businesses asking for bailouts too and resources are thin.

It is a time for national leaders all around the World to actually show leadership. Petty party politics and blame needs to take a back seat for a while .

Good news from Codogno, Italy!

Codogno in the north of Italy, is the "ground zero" of the coronavirus in Italy. Codogna had the first coronavirus death in Italy in Feb, some 4-5 weeks ago. By then, the virus had been in Codogna without any knew about it for at least a couple of weeks.

The following links are reports some 3 weeks apart. The first one two days ago, reporting on the virus curve almost at zero. The second one three weeks ago, reporting on the first case. Codogno is an example of how shutdown may work in three weeks time, if everyone are extremely loyal to the rules and shutdown.

.....

In the town of 16,000 located near the Po River about 60 kilometers (40 miles) southwest of Milan, most everyone knows someone among the nearly 200 infected with the virus, or the 34 who have died.

When news went out this week that there had been zero new infections in the previous 24 hours, media hopes of eradication were exaggerated. But the trend appears to be real — and one of the reasons that led Premier Giuseppe Conte to impose a series of draconian new measures across the countries this week.

.....


Mar 13, 2020 - Charlotte Observer:
Italy’s coronavirus ground zero sets virtuous example

Feb 21: France24:
[www.france24.com]

Bjornulf

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grzegorz67

It is a time for national leaders all around the World to actually show leadership. Petty party politics and blame needs to take a back seat for a while .

Totally agree also include the media we just want good and accurate information until we get through this crisis. With all the business and government shut downs we could also shut down Thunderdome call the current fight a Draw. Put down the the chainsaws, spiked balls, dog whistles, etc. Come together for the truce and Eradicate the virus. When that’s accomplished set the rematch open up Thunderdome to a pay-per view event and let the blame game , sniping , name calling begin or anything nasty they can think of no holds barred. Back to the everyday Bullshit.
You can donate or bet on which ever fighter want. All the proceeds can go to further research and helping small businesses which will be hurt the most.


Who runs Barter town?

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jlowe
Meanwhile David Crosby is concerned that if his up coming tour is cancelled he may 'lose his home'.
Says he has no savings.
Surely income though from CSNY days?

All his CSNY proceeds went up his nose.

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swimtothemoon

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PinballWizard23

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jumpontopofmebaby

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Kerryann
Can I suggest to anyone with refundable hotel deals to cancel and get your refunds asap. This virus is really hurting the travel and hospitality industries and there will be casualties. If your agent goes bust, there may not be refunds to be had.
Also just hoping that ticketmaster is solid, as I imagine they will be issuing mega amounts of refunds from cancelled events at the moment. Thats why I hope the stones cancel asap so that we can get our refunds back into our accounts. The longer they delay, the less the chance we will see our money again.

At this time Ticketmaster is not refunding postponed and rescheduled events like they used to. They changed their policy a few days ago. I do not have the link but a few pages back there is one to a Ticketmaster blog.

Not sure how well this alleged new policy will hold up if challenged legally. The policy should be the one that was in place when any tickets were purchased as that was what was agreed to during the transaction. They can make up whatever policy they want after the fact and most consumers wouldn’t even know and that isn’t legit.

Ticketmaster is owned by live nation who is a large concert promoter like
AEG etc. In addition Live Nation owns other companies all of which would
appear to be in the entertainment business and seem very much at risk with
the current crisis. So I think this development with Ticketmaster is cause
for concern.

Live Nation will be a stock to buy in a few months. Sitting on sideline but looking at Delta, Marriott, Live Nation and stocks that will rebound.

Maybe the situation has turned the corner in Italy. ????
Fingers crossed!

Here in Minnesota (Minneapolis), things are only beginning. The governor announced today that schools would close beginning Wednesday. The state currently has identified 35 positives. One week ago, Minnesota had 1 positive.
The state of Minnesota has a population of 5+ million. To date, 1,422 have been tested. [www.health.state.mn.us]

My observations of daily life: the stores are crowded with shoppers preparing, people continue to go to work, the highways/roads/streets appear normal.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-03-15 19:23 by cmc.

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cmc
Anybody else getting “Phorum Database Errors”?

From the link on the IORR home page:

Forum links
of interest

Phorum Database Error - problem solving

Bjornulf