I know Beggers was released a full year before Let It Bleed, but I think I read somewhere that most of the tracks on Let It Bleed were recorded at the same time as Beggers, March-June, 1968. Is that true? Is there a good source that documents Stones recording sessions, listing the dates specific tracks were recorded?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-08-24 08:44 by tatters.

Some of the songs were recorded or at least demos of tracks that appeared on Bleed. They were recording the majority of Bleed in the spring/early summer of 69. Keith was mainly getting Bleed together as MJ was away filming Ned Kelly for a bit. There is some overlap.

Milo, NYC
C'mon, simmer down and treat me sweet and cool

Maybe the same way SG and ER were recorded ast same time

ChelseaDrugstore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Maybe the same way SG and ER were recorded ast
> same time

Right, but whereas SG is a much stronger record than ER, LIB is as strong if not stronger than Beggers. Is it possible they actually could have left tracks like MR or GS in the can for nearly two years? We know YCAGWYW has to be vintage '68 because they played it at Rock and Roll Circus. Could be their "Everytime we make an album there's always enough left over for another album that would have been just as good" mythology begins here.

tatters Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ChelseaDrugstore Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Maybe the same way SG and ER were recorded
> ast
> > same time
>
> Right, but whereas SG is a much stronger record
> than ER, LIB is as strong if not stronger than
> Beggers. Is it possible they actually could have
> left tracks like MR or GS in the can for nearly
> two years? We know YCAGWYW has to be vintage '68
> because they played it at Rock and Roll Circus.
> Could be their "Everytime we make an album there's
> always enough left over for another album that
> would have been just as good" mythology begins
> here.



I don't think so Tatters, would need to refer to Martin Elliott's book, but off the top of my head, these are the rough recording dates for Let It Bleed. (off course, songs may have been knocking arouind for a while, but pretty sure thay wereen't recorded. I think these are the rough dates when recording on album tracks began, althoguh there were still overdubs being added as latr as October 1969.

Nov 1968: YCAGWYW (basic track, chior/horn overdubbed later. Memo from Turner alsos recorded around this time)

Feb/Mar 1969: You Got The Silver, Gimme Shelter, Honky Tonk Women, Let It Bleed (known as If You Need Someone at the time), Midnight Rambler.

Late March 1969: Love In Vain/Sister Morphine with Ry Cooder

April 1969: Monkey Man

May 1969: Country Honk

Late May 1969: Live With Me (MT's first session)

Casino Boogie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> tatters Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > ChelseaDrugstore Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Maybe the same way SG and ER were
> recorded
> > ast
> > > same time
> >
> > Right, but whereas SG is a much stronger
> record
> > than ER, LIB is as strong if not stronger
> than
> > Beggers. Is it possible they actually could
> have
> > left tracks like MR or GS in the can for
> nearly
> > two years? We know YCAGWYW has to be vintage
> '68
> > because they played it at Rock and Roll
> Circus.
> > Could be their "Everytime we make an album
> there's
> > always enough left over for another album
> that
> > would have been just as good" mythology
> begins
> > here.
>
>
>
> I don't think so Tatters, would need to refer to
> Martin Elliott's book, but off the top of my head,
> these are the rough recording dates for Let It
> Bleed. (off course, songs may have been knocking
> arouind for a while, but pretty sure thay wereen't
> recorded. I think these are the rough dates when
> recording on album tracks began, althoguh there
> were still overdubs being added as latr as October
> 1969.
>
> Nov 1968: YCAGWYW (basic track, chior/horn
> overdubbed later. Memo from Turner alsos recorded
> around this time)
>
> Feb/Mar 1969: You Got The Silver, Gimme Shelter,
> Honky Tonk Women, Let It Bleed (known as If You
> Need Someone at the time), Midnight Rambler.
>
> Late March 1969: Love In Vain/Sister Morphine with
> Ry Cooder
>
> April 1969: Monkey Man
>
> May 1969: Country Honk
>
> Late May 1969: Live With Me (MT's first session)

The liner notes for the London Years Singles Collection put Memo From Turner at March '68, YCAGWYW at March/June '68, and Honky Tonk Women (with MT) at May '69.

And here's something else. The LIB notes say Brian played on YGTS and MR. I seriously doubt that Brian, who barely plays on Beggers, even set foot in the studio in '69. Most likely, the last time he played any music at all was at Rock and Roll Circus. I doubt he even SAW the boys much after that, except for one or two photo shoots.

I think the liner notes must contain a typo for Memo From Turner, can't see that it can have been recorded as early as March 1968....

My understanding was that it was written for Performance, filming didn't start until autumn 68 and Jagger's role in it wasn't announced until about June 68. Allegedly, Keith, unhappy at Mick's fling with Anita during filming, tried to sabotage the recording and the version on the Performance sound track and Singles collection features session musicians inc Ry Cooder, Steve Winwood, Jim Capaldi etc to finish the track. All this places it as late 1968, or possibly early 1969.


Pretty well documented that YCAGWYW was first recorded in Nov '68 (eg Bill's book), although the choir was apparently recorded 15 March '69. Per Al Kooper's own recollection, he added a horn section to the track about after the original session (ie sometime before single release in July 1969), although The Stones elected to use only the french horn and ditch the saxes and trumpets.

Honky Tonk Women took a while to record apparently, but I think the track was there or there abouts by the time Mick Taylor turned up, in his own words, "I added some guitars to it...... the country kind of influence on the licks between the verses"

tatters Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And here's something else. The LIB notes say Brian
> played on YGTS and MR. I seriously doubt that
> Brian, who barely plays on Beggers, even set foot
> in the studio in '69. Most likely, the last time
> he played any music at all was at Rock and Roll
> Circus. I doubt he even SAW the boys much after
> that, except for one or two photo shoots.


I've always been a bit sceptical about Brian's credits on Let It Bleed. From memory, they were for percussion on Midnight Rambler and autoharp on You Got The Silver?

I don't really hear any percussion on Midnight Ramber, although engineer George Chkiantz does back up Brian plawying on YGTS. No reason to doubt his recollection, but I think it's more liklely that Brian was at a session for it in '69 and contributed, rather than it being recorded during Beggars Banquet sessions and left on the shelf, it's hardly a big contribution.

My guess is that Brian turned up at a handful of Let it Bleed sessions in 1969, and either didn't play a note and just hung around for a bit and left, or he played some very minor parts that are either lost in the mix or wiped. I think the One plus One documentary gives a pretty clear indication of Brian's role in the studio towards the end, strumming an acoustic you can't even here.

Except for Summer Romance,Emotional Rescue (album) was written a year + after Some Girls was released.

Thief is right, Chelsea - ER tunes were mostly written and recorded in 1979 - SG tunes all date to recordings done in 1977.

.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-08-25 02:09 by Gazza.

Before they make me run comes from the Paris 78 session, but otherwise its all from Oct-Dec 1977, although a couple of songs were finished in the '78 session

All of ER actually was recorded in 1979. "Summer romance" was indeed recorded in Paris in early 78 for Some Girls and again later in the year in the LA session after the tour ended, but the ER version comes from Paris in summer 1979

yes right, but in my world those Paris sessions are just one long outporing of songs. Interrupted at one point to dump of the first batch of songs (=Some Girls) a quick tour and then back and pick right back up. Listening to all those studio outtake boots they have very m,uch the same feel.
In my first post I was quoting metaphorically haha

I believe the source of this belief "both Lp's were recorded at the same time" comes from a lengthy Mick Jagger interview in Rolling Stone a few years ago. Jann Wenner conducted the interview and basically takes Mick through the years from the very beginning asking about the various recordings/events in the band's history.

Jann asked about a particular song (Midnight Rambler, I believe) and Mick responded "What album was that on?" and explained that "Beggar's Banquet" and "Let It Bleed" were recorded together or at the same time or something like that.

They were indeed recorded at the same time if "at the same time" means spring 1968 through fall 1969.

Mick Jagger, never known as a meticulous note keeper, can be forgiven his vague recollections about chronology given the intense situations among the band's personnel (Brian's death, Mick Taylor's coming onboard), performance pressures (NME May 1968, R&R Circus December 1968, Hyde Park July 1969, plans for US tour 1969) as well as incredible productivity in the studio which not only produced two of their finest albums (BB and LI but also two of their finest singles (JJF & HTW), Jagger's solo single (Memo From Turner), songs for future albums (Sister Morphine ended up on Sticky Fingers), material which ended up on Metamorphosis and Jamming With Edward, and many out-takes which are readily available on assorted bootlegs-all occuring within an 18 month time frame!
Moreover, from the very beginning of the Stones recording career, studio chronology never equaled release chronology, with songs ending up on different LP's in different countries at different times. Even after the departure of Andrew Loog Oldham, this remained the case. "Loving Cup", for example, was introduced by Mick at the Hyde Park concert as being "from our new album" (the as yet unreleased "Let It Bleed") but it did not surface on an LP, in a different version, until 3 years later, on "Exile on Main St."