"Goats Head Soup" has always been this "great mess of a slow burning aftermath" a year after highlight Exile On Main St.

I always thought the album had more potential with a different track order more in the vein of "Sticky Fingers".

Info on the sessions reveals Keith Richards was pretty out of it on smack and didn't come with much material and this is really clear when it comes to the opening track… Where is THAT great Keith riff from these sessions?

"Dancing With Mr. D" has never cut it for me - it is not one of Keith's great riff's - among the remaining tracks there is little to choose from - remember the kind of track we are looking for is in the league of Sympathy for The Devil, Gimme Shelter, Brown Sugar, Rocks Off...

Star Star (@#$%&) has the attitude and the lyrics that has that provoking nastiness that Stones album opener was expected to have - but for me it's a little to traditional basic rock'n'roll number -music wise - to open up with - then there is "Silver Train" it has the energy - the great slide guitar work - Jaggers vocals are strong- but it's a close cousin' to "All Down The Line" and the band actually discovered upon playing them both live they cancelled each other out by similarity…

Then there is "Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo (Heartbreaker)" which is the most commercial rock song on the album but it lacks the Keith riff - he plays bass on it - so no dice…

Then there is the outtake "Criss Cross Man (Save Me)" it has a Keith riff from the intro which build really well it has the mid tempo percussion-driven groove that swings that Stones way… It's not in the league of the before mentioned opening songs it seems a little under developed - but it does has the cool nasty lyrics "I think I need a blood transfusion" which can be understood all kinds of ways - Keith needs to get off drugs - the band needs his songwriting input - From Micks point of view the words "Save Me" can be understood quite literally - his songwriting partner is out cold at it starts to seriously affect his ability and i doing so the bands songwriting ability…

From that point of view it is not optimal - but the one-two-punch of
"Criss Cross Man (Save Me)" on to "Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo (Heartbreaker)" does work quite well the on to "Wild Horses" of the record "Angie" - from the big regret of missing "Angie" on to the opening line of "Baby I've been so sad since you've been gone back to NYC where you do belong" right back back to the nasty side of things with "Star star" kind of what happened after "Angie" left... and ending side 1 of with the blues piano song "Hide Your Love" rounding out the love gone wrong cycle...

Then for opening side 2 - we've just had a "traditional" rock'n'roll song and a blues song - so breaking it up with the album's second big ballad "Winter" which lyrically looks forward to new things and summer and gives a surprise kind of dynamic switch. Then getting in the groove with a blues rocker" "Silver Train" and then the opening three songs from the original track order to round things out - the "Silver train" could have gone to New Orleans looking for dirty adventures and finding that Dr. John groove that isn't quite developed but still a cool song "Dancing With Mr. D" - "100 years Ago" gives that melodically older Stones feeling back to "Aftermath"/ "Between the Buttons" era and builds to a great climax before Keith's confession song the big third ballad "Coming Down Again" ends the album with lyrics about the Marocco trip with Brian Jones & Anita Pallenberg where Keith tries to justify his involvement with Anita Pallenberg "Slip my tongue in someone else's pie tasting' better every time" but "Being hungry ain't no crime"
And then the conclusion "Coming Down Again"… which is the state Keith suffers from in the 70's…

Yes I never liked "Can You Hear The Music" in the context of "Goats Head Soup" it already has enough slow songs so a b-side for that one…

Criss Cross Man (Save Me)
Doo doo doo Doo Doo (Heartbreaker)
Angie
Star Star
Hide Your Love

Winter
Silver Train
Dancing With Mr. D
100 Years Ago
Coming Down Again

Well Anybody out there who agrees/disagrees can come up with something better?

Yes agree.... Dancing with Mr D is not their best albumopener. A problem really.


But My favourite part of the album is the Winter/can You Hear the Music....

So cant take CYHTM off thealbum. Important tune..

They phoned this album in, and the next one. It's understandable why Mick Taylor quit, the Stones weren't really trying any more.

This is a band that gets lazy when they have nothing prove (e.g. mid 70s, all of the 90s and 00s) but that rises to the occasion when it's all on the line (with BB after the satanic majesty's debacle, in 69 with first tour in 3 years, in 77/78 with keith's bust and punk rock, in 89 after WWIII, in 2013-2015 with the 50th anniversary and doubts around health.)

Can You Hear The Music:
Love is a mystery I can't demystify, oh no ....
(I'd leave this one on the disc, I like this song very much)

"Waiting On a Friend" would have made a good closer on side two,
just as it did on "Tattoo You" .....

"Hide Your Love" could have been left off ....

Maybe they could have included "Leather Jacket" somewhere on side B.

But, when I come to think of the running order, I'm really not sure where
to place it.

Quote
HearTheWindHowl
Can You Hear The Music:
Love is a mystery I can't demystify, oh no ....
(I'd leave this one on the disc, I like this song very much)

"Waiting On a Friend" would have made a good closer on side two,
just as it did on "Tattoo You" .....

"Hide Your Love" could have been left off ....

Maybe they could have included "Leather Jacket" somewhere on side B.

But, when I come to think of the running order, I'm really not sure where
to place it.

Or maybe as a b-side...

I agree that Can You Hear the Music has to stay on... on at least get on TY in 8 years.

1. Start Star
2. 100 Years Ago
3. Can't You Hear The Music
4. Coming Down Again
5. Hide Your Love
6. Winter
7. Silver Train
8. Angie
9. Dancing With Mr. D
10. Heartbreaker

This order is good enough for me if they play the whole thing in concert like with SF. Live versions of 100 Years Ago and Silver Train from Vienna 1973 in EX Soundboard could be bonus tracks for the Deluxe edition.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-06-29 21:59 by EasterMan.

I've always held that this was a soupy, voodoo-y, mysterious sounding album that just needed one more good uptempo rocker to put it over the top for the general public to like it as much as some of us do anyways. Putting on Save Me would have accomplished that but then the album hits 51:30, which might have been pushing the vinyl format. This also may have musically been their most ambitious batch of songs, due in no small part to the maestros onboard: MT, Preston, Nicky, Bobby and the arrangers. Only Star Star and Silver Train were really basic songs; -half of the songs really push the envelope of what we would expect from a band that grew up on blues and Chuck Berry.

Because of the preponderance of slower and more mysterious sounding songs, I thought that they should have let people know right at the beginning that this was a different kind of album. When I've fiddled around with the playing order of GHS, I usually put CYHTM as the opener, except I lop off the first 0:15 (very important to do) so that the album starts with that almost unidentifiable guitar thru Leslie speaker riff, suddenly snaking thru the air. I also like putting another of the voodoo-y sounding songs to start side 2 (Mr D), and ending with Coming Down Again, which is an honest and logical end to anyone's high times. In a way, it's almost the follow up to TSMR in terms of a 'psychedelic' RS album, except with better drugs, sounds, musicianship, etc but with some jaded jet set debauchery in evidence as well. Billy Preston and MT really rubbed off on MJ's vocals here too. His loose melodic singing, lyrical imagery and delivery are spot on.

Can You Hear The Music
Hide Your Love
Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo
Save Me
Star Star

Dancing With Mr. D
Winter
100 Years Ago
Angie
Silver Train
Coming Down Again



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-06-29 23:19 by winter.

Criss Cross Man (Save Me)
Doo doo doo Doo Doo (Heartbreaker)
Angie
Star Star
Hide Your Love

Dancing With Mr. D
100 Years Ago
Winter
Silver Train
Coming Down Again

Heartbreaker
100 Years Ago
Criss Cross Man
Coming Down Again
Angie

Dancing with Mr D
Hide Your Love
Winter
Can You Hear Yhe Music
Star Star

Quote
njet
"Goats Head Soup" has always been this "great mess of a slow burning aftermath" a year after highlight Exile On Main St.

I always thought the album had more potential with a different track order more in the vein of "Sticky Fingers".

Info on the sessions reveals Keith Richards was pretty out of it on smack and didn't come with much material and this is really clear when it comes to the opening track… Where is THAT great Keith riff from these sessions?

"Dancing With Mr. D" has never cut it for me - it is not one of Keith's great riff's - among the remaining tracks there is little to choose from - remember the kind of track we are looking for is in the league of Sympathy for The Devil, Gimme Shelter, Brown Sugar, Rocks Off...

Star Star (@#$%&) has the attitude and the lyrics that has that provoking nastiness that Stones album opener was expected to have - but for me it's a little to traditional basic rock'n'roll number -music wise - to open up with - then there is "Silver Train" it has the energy - the great slide guitar work - Jaggers vocals are strong- but it's a close cousin' to "All Down The Line" and the band actually discovered upon playing them both live they cancelled each other out by similarity…

Then there is "Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo (Heartbreaker)" which is the most commercial rock song on the album but it lacks the Keith riff - he plays bass on it - so no dice…

Then there is the outtake "Criss Cross Man (Save Me)" it has a Keith riff from the intro which build really well it has the mid tempo percussion-driven groove that swings that Stones way… It's not in the league of the before mentioned opening songs it seems a little under developed - but it does has the cool nasty lyrics "I think I need a blood transfusion" which can be understood all kinds of ways - Keith needs to get off drugs - the band needs his songwriting input - From Micks point of view the words "Save Me" can be understood quite literally - his songwriting partner is out cold at it starts to seriously affect his ability and i doing so the bands songwriting ability…

From that point of view it is not optimal - but the one-two-punch of
"Criss Cross Man (Save Me)" on to "Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo (Heartbreaker)" does work quite well the on to "Wild Horses" of the record "Angie" - from the big regret of missing "Angie" on to the opening line of "Baby I've been so sad since you've been gone back to NYC where you do belong" right back back to the nasty side of things with "Star star" kind of what happened after "Angie" left... and ending side 1 of with the blues piano song "Hide Your Love" rounding out the love gone wrong cycle...

Then for opening side 2 - we've just had a "traditional" rock'n'roll song and a blues song - so breaking it up with the album's second big ballad "Winter" which lyrically looks forward to new things and summer and gives a surprise kind of dynamic switch. Then getting in the groove with a blues rocker" "Silver Train" and then the opening three songs from the original track order to round things out - the "Silver train" could have gone to New Orleans looking for dirty adventures and finding that Dr. John groove that isn't quite developed but still a cool song "Dancing With Mr. D" - "100 years Ago" gives that melodically older Stones feeling back to "Aftermath"/ "Between the Buttons" era and builds to a great climax before Keith's confession song the big third ballad "Coming Down Again" ends the album with lyrics about the Marocco trip with Brian Jones & Anita Pallenberg where Keith tries to justify his involvement with Anita Pallenberg "Slip my tongue in someone else's pie tasting' better every time" but "Being hungry ain't no crime"
And then the conclusion "Coming Down Again"… which is the state Keith suffers from in the 70's…

Yes I never liked "Can You Hear The Music" in the context of "Goats Head Soup" it already has enough slow songs so a b-side for that one…

Criss Cross Man (Save Me)
Doo doo doo Doo Doo (Heartbreaker)
Angie
Star Star
Hide Your Love

Winter
Silver Train
Dancing With Mr. D
100 Years Ago
Coming Down Again

Well Anybody out there who agrees/disagrees can come up with something better?

You have a LOT of extra time of your hands, eh?

half these tracks shouldn't have been released at all, until possibly a 2020 deluxe edition. the exile and sticky fingers cutting room floor songs are better than 80% of GHS

Side 1
100 Years Ago
Travelin' Man
Dancing With Mr. D
Plunder My Soul
Angie

Side 2
Star Star
Through the Lonely Nights
Coming Down Again
(Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo) Heartbreaker
Winter

I think Dancing With Mr D is a great LP opener. It sets the tone for the LP - sleeeeeeazy.


Dancing With Mr. D
100 Years Ago
Criss Cross Mind
Through The Lonely Nights
Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo (Heartbreaker)

Coming Down Again
Hide Your Love
Can You Hear The Music
Winter
Silver Train
Star Star

It suffers from following the big 4 ... other than that it's a perfectly fine album as is -- no need to change anything here, I'll take the original, as is.

Quote
LeonidP
It suffers from following the big 4 ... other than that it's a perfectly fine album as is -- no need to change anything here, I'll take the original, as is.

I really really really really really really really really really really could do with the awful Angie.

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP
It suffers from following the big 4 ... other than that it's a perfectly fine album as is -- no need to change anything here, I'll take the original, as is.

I really really really really really really really really really really could do with the awful Angie.

Corny girl-themed songs don't do it for some. Generally the same goes for me, but I still love Angie.

Quote
LeonidP

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP
It suffers from following the big 4 ... other than that it's a perfectly fine album as is -- no need to change anything here, I'll take the original, as is.

I really really really really really really really really really really could do with the awful Angie.

Corny girl-themed songs don't do it for some. Generally the same goes for me, but I still love Angie.

It's possibly their most over-played single ever. That could be a toss up between Honky Tonk Women, Miss You and... well, Angie. Perhaps Angie is the most annoying.

Had it been released in the CD era, they probably would have added Criss Cross Man and Through The Lonely Nights and we would have all been happy.

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP

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GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP
It suffers from following the big 4 ... other than that it's a perfectly fine album as is -- no need to change anything here, I'll take the original, as is.

I really really really really really really really really really really could do with the awful Angie.

Corny girl-themed songs don't do it for some. Generally the same goes for me, but I still love Angie.

It's possibly their most over-played single ever. That could be a toss up between Honky Tonk Women, Miss You and... well, Angie. Perhaps Angie is the most annoying.

If you get annoyed by beautiful music and singing, then sure.

Quote
LeonidP

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP
It suffers from following the big 4 ... other than that it's a perfectly fine album as is -- no need to change anything here, I'll take the original, as is.

I really really really really really really really really really really could do with the awful Angie.

Corny girl-themed songs don't do it for some. Generally the same goes for me, but I still love Angie.

It's possibly their most over-played single ever. That could be a toss up between Honky Tonk Women, Miss You and... well, Angie. Perhaps Angie is the most annoying.

If you get annoyed by beautiful music and singing, then sure.

Saccharine.

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP
It suffers from following the big 4 ... other than that it's a perfectly fine album as is -- no need to change anything here, I'll take the original, as is.

I really really really really really really really really really really could do with the awful Angie.

Corny girl-themed songs don't do it for some. Generally the same goes for me, but I still love Angie.

It's possibly their most over-played single ever. That could be a toss up between Honky Tonk Women, Miss You and... well, Angie. Perhaps Angie is the most annoying.

If you get annoyed by beautiful music and singing, then sure.

Saccharine.

Really? It's known it is about an actual person, hinted possibly of even being about Angie Bowie.

Quote
LeonidP

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP
It suffers from following the big 4 ... other than that it's a perfectly fine album as is -- no need to change anything here, I'll take the original, as is.

I really really really really really really really really really really could do with the awful Angie.

Corny girl-themed songs don't do it for some. Generally the same goes for me, but I still love Angie.

It's possibly their most over-played single ever. That could be a toss up between Honky Tonk Women, Miss You and... well, Angie. Perhaps Angie is the most annoying.

If you get annoyed by beautiful music and singing, then sure.

Saccharine.

Really? It's known it is about an actual person, hinted possibly of even being about Angie Bowie.

Yes, really.

The hint about Angela Bowie... it's tired.

Jagger had this to say about it: "People began to say that song was written about David Bowie's wife but the truth is that Keith wrote the title. He said, 'Angie,' and I think it was to do with his daughter. She's called Angela. And then I just wrote the rest of it."

There was also speculation that Richards' girlfriend Anita Pallenberg inspired this song, but Keith cleared it up in his 2010 autobiography Life, where he wrote: "While I was in the [Vevey drug] clinic (in March-April 1972), Anita was down the road having our daughter, Angela. Once I came out of the usual trauma, I had a guitar with me and I wrote 'Angie' in an afternoon, sitting in bed, because I could finally move my fingers and put them in the right place again, and I didn't feel like I had to s--t the bed or climb the walls or feel manic anymore. I just went, 'Angie, Angie.' It was not about any particular person;

[www.songfacts.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-07-03 19:48 by GasLightStreet.

Silver Train, Coming Down Again, and Winter are great tracks. Not to mention Heartbreaker, Angie, and Dancing with Mr. D. Goats Head Soup is underrated.
d

Quote
Turner68
half these tracks shouldn't have been released at all, until possibly a 2020 deluxe edition. the exile and sticky fingers cutting room floor songs are better than 80% of GHS

Mmmmm. They're as good, let's say.

And yet. And yet.

Barring, @#$%& and Silver Train, GHS has a deeply funky groove that is an evolution of the Stones' sound. A mystic, marijuana hazed gumbo. The real Voodoo Lounge, if you will.

The acetates are the way to go.

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP

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GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP
It suffers from following the big 4 ... other than that it's a perfectly fine album as is -- no need to change anything here, I'll take the original, as is.

I really really really really really really really really really really could do with the awful Angie.

Corny girl-themed songs don't do it for some. Generally the same goes for me, but I still love Angie.

It's possibly their most over-played single ever. That could be a toss up between Honky Tonk Women, Miss You and... well, Angie. Perhaps Angie is the most annoying.

If you get annoyed by beautiful music and singing, then sure.

Saccharine.

Really? It's known it is about an actual person, hinted possibly of even being about Angie Bowie.

Yes, really.

The hint about Angela Bowie... it's tired.

?? So? I said 'hinted' ... Mick has said it's about 'someone'.

If we're playing the re-sequencing game, I'll go with the following with my preferred title renderings...


SIDE A

1.) Heartbreaker
2.) Starf*cker
3.) Hide Your Love
4.) Silver Train
5.) Dancing with Mr. D.


SIDE B

1.) Winter
2.) A Hundred Years Ago
3.) Coming Down Again
4.) Can You Hear the Music?
5.) Angie

Quote
LeonidP
Really? It's known it is about an actual person, hinted possibly of even being about Angie Bowie.

Yes, really.

The hint about Angela Bowie... it's tired.[/quote]

?? So? I said 'hinted' ... Mick has said it's about 'someone'.[/quote]

No Rolling Stone ever "hinted" it was about Angela Bowie. That's why it's "tired".

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
LeonidP
Really? It's known it is about an actual person, hinted possibly of even being about Angie Bowie.

Yes, really.

The hint about Angela Bowie... it's tired.

?? So? I said 'hinted' ... Mick has said it's about 'someone'.[/quote]

No Rolling Stone ever "hinted" it was about Angela Bowie. That's why it's "tired".[/quote]

I didn't say a Stones member hinted at it, for one ... and that has nothing to do w/ the point.

A lot of what you say has nothing to do with a point other than just saying something for the regurgitation of saying things.

Angie is about someone ... rumors is it was about angie bowie ... nonetheless, it is about someone, whether about bowie or not. That's the point. I never said a Stone said that.