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TravelinMan
HMS, Jagger, Richards, and Watts are irreplaceable. Anybody else is, although it isn’t the same without Bill.

They are all replaceable. Every person can be replaced and music can continue to be made. Whether you or the public likes or accepts the replacements is another matter.

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Rockman
Ronnie could also be replaced.

with who ???? ….. Ted Nugent....????????? ….. Who ?????

Jagger was purported to have asked George Thorogood if he would be willing to step in and replace Ron during the 1981-2 tour when George was opening some gigs and Ron was out of his mind with his freebase habit. Read that many years ago--wonder how THAT would have sounded??!!

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His Majesty

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TravelinMan
HMS, Jagger, Richards, and Watts are irreplaceable. Anybody else is, although it isn’t the same without Bill.

They are all replaceable. Every person can be replaced and music can continue to be made. Whether you or the public likes or accepts the replacements is another matter.

The Stones will not continue without Richards or Jagger, maybe Watts. We’ll see who’s right!

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His Majesty

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TravelinMan
HMS, Jagger, Richards, and Watts are irreplaceable. Anybody else is, although it isn’t the same without Bill.

They are all replaceable. Every person can be replaced and music can continue to be made. Whether you or the public likes or accepts the replacements is another matter.

Jagger would be the last option though. Nothing as personal as the human voice.

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TravelinMan


The Stones will not continue without Richards or Jagger, maybe Watts. We’ll see who’s right!

That doesn't mean they aren't replaceable.

They have all been replaced in studio at differing times for example... Mick is replaced when Keith does his solo slot. Keith is the singer of the band at that point.

They may say lovely words, but were Charlie to have left earlier like Bill, they would have continued. The cash is just too good to turn down.

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SomeGuy

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DandelionPowderman

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SomeGuy
Ronnie a song writer? Mick Taylor co-wrote more on one album (3 songs on Exile according to my copy) than Ronnie did, 0.3 songs per album is not a lot and that was decades ago.

You have a unique copy, seemingly

And I suggest you check Ronnie's writing credits with The Stones.

Ok, maybe I didn't quite remember the numbers correctly and I know that some later Exile reissues didn't have the writing credits to Taylor anymore, but both my lp and the '94 cd remaster do. Also Taylor claims to have written songs on IORR as well. Whatever the contributions of Taylor to writing were or weren't, fact is anyway that Wood is by no means a songwriter to the Stones, except on the so much loved Dirty Work, the highlight of songwriting skills indeed.
I checked my collection for Ronnie Wood credits:
A Bigger Bang: zero songs
Bridges to Babylon: zero songs
Voodoo Lounge: zero songs
Steel Wheels: zero songs
Dirty Work: 4 co-writing credits
Undercover: 1 co-writing credit
Tattoo You: 2 co-writing credits
Emotional Rescue: 1 co-writing credit
Some Girls: zero songs
Black And Blue: zero songs, 1 'inspiration' credit
It's Only Rock 'n' Roll: 1 'inspiration' credit
Net result is: 0.27 songs per album (counting the 'inspiration' credits), even slightly less than I had guessed. So, I tend to agree with Charlie here

Taylor has one credit: Ventilator Blues.

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DandelionPowderman

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SomeGuy

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DandelionPowderman

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SomeGuy
Ronnie a song writer? Mick Taylor co-wrote more on one album (3 songs on Exile according to my copy) than Ronnie did, 0.3 songs per album is not a lot and that was decades ago.

You have a unique copy, seemingly

And I suggest you check Ronnie's writing credits with The Stones.

Ok, maybe I didn't quite remember the numbers correctly and I know that some later Exile reissues didn't have the writing credits to Taylor anymore, but both my lp and the '94 cd remaster do. Also Taylor claims to have written songs on IORR as well. Whatever the contributions of Taylor to writing were or weren't, fact is anyway that Wood is by no means a songwriter to the Stones, except on the so much loved Dirty Work, the highlight of songwriting skills indeed.
I checked my collection for Ronnie Wood credits:
A Bigger Bang: zero songs
Bridges to Babylon: zero songs
Voodoo Lounge: zero songs
Steel Wheels: zero songs
Dirty Work: 4 co-writing credits
Undercover: 1 co-writing credit
Tattoo You: 2 co-writing credits
Emotional Rescue: 1 co-writing credit
Some Girls: zero songs
Black And Blue: zero songs, 1 'inspiration' credit
It's Only Rock 'n' Roll: 1 'inspiration' credit
Net result is: 0.27 songs per album (counting the 'inspiration' credits), even slightly less than I had guessed. So, I tend to agree with Charlie here

Taylor has one credit: Ventilator Blues.

Ventilator Blues is the only one he actually received a credit on.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-06-16 22:30 by boogaloojef.

Right. Maybe we should adopt a new concept of the phenomenon and will have to call Dave Davies 'songwriter for The Kinks', and Ian Hill 'one of the writers for Judas Priest'. Bun E. Carlos wrote a song for Cheap Trick so he's a songwriter too. Never mind that the other 199 songs were written by someone else.
But hey! It would explain why this new Stones album is taking so long: they must have asked Ron to write the songs!

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SomeGuy
Right. Maybe we should adopt a new concept of the phenomenon and will have to call Dave Davies 'songwriter for The Kinks', and Ian Hill 'one of the writers for Judas Priest'. Bun E. Carlos wrote a song for Cheap Trick so he's a songwriter too. Never mind that the other 199 songs were written by someone else.
But hey! It would explain why this new Stones album is taking so long: they must have asked Ron to write the songs!

From 1989 and on Mick and Keith closed the shop again.

We all know that IORR, Hey Negrita and Red Eyes (later When You're Gone) were Ronnie-songs, even though they were credited as "inspiration by Ronnie Wood".

Are you saying that Ronnie isn't a songwriter? What about all the Faces-songs and his many solo albums?

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boogaloojef

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DandelionPowderman

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SomeGuy

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DandelionPowderman

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SomeGuy
Ronnie a song writer? Mick Taylor co-wrote more on one album (3 songs on Exile according to my copy) than Ronnie did, 0.3 songs per album is not a lot and that was decades ago.

You have a unique copy, seemingly

And I suggest you check Ronnie's writing credits with The Stones.

Ok, maybe I didn't quite remember the numbers correctly and I know that some later Exile reissues didn't have the writing credits to Taylor anymore, but both my lp and the '94 cd remaster do. Also Taylor claims to have written songs on IORR as well. Whatever the contributions of Taylor to writing were or weren't, fact is anyway that Wood is by no means a songwriter to the Stones, except on the so much loved Dirty Work, the highlight of songwriting skills indeed.
I checked my collection for Ronnie Wood credits:
A Bigger Bang: zero songs
Bridges to Babylon: zero songs
Voodoo Lounge: zero songs
Steel Wheels: zero songs
Dirty Work: 4 co-writing credits
Undercover: 1 co-writing credit
Tattoo You: 2 co-writing credits
Emotional Rescue: 1 co-writing credit
Some Girls: zero songs
Black And Blue: zero songs, 1 'inspiration' credit
It's Only Rock 'n' Roll: 1 'inspiration' credit
Net result is: 0.27 songs per album (counting the 'inspiration' credits), even slightly less than I had guessed. So, I tend to agree with Charlie here

Taylor has one credit: Ventilator Blues.

Ventilator Blues is the only one he actually received a credit on.

Yep. Not three songs on Exile, as claimed here.

I already admitted that I was wrong on the number of songs on Exile that Taylor was credited on. Right, it is one song only, according to my cd (I lost the lp years ago). But anyone that listens to Goat's Head Soup and It's Only Rock 'n' Roll can hear that Jagger & Richards likely could never have come up with some of the stuff on those albums. They never have before, and never have, after.
I also admit that I didn't think of the Faces, really. Probably because I don't listen to them. If Ronnie's writing is good on those albums, then that's a good thing. As for the solo albums, I own one or two of them and never play them.

What remains is the fact that I don't consider Ron Wood to be a songwriter in The Stones, any more than I consider Mick Taylor to have been a song writer in The Stones. That is not to say that they didn't contribute to the band. But to doubt Charlie's words on this issue is too far a stretch for me.

UPDATE: Hey! I found a pic of the copy that HAS three Exile songs credited to Taylor! i DID remember it correctly! WooHoo.

Now I dont know how to post pics but if you check:

[www.discogs.com]

and then click 'More Images', and look at the pic of the label of side three, you will find that tracks 3-5 are credited to Jagger/Richards/Taylor.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-06-16 23:54 by SomeGuy.

Two songs he didn't play on. Interesting

I've seen some weird credits on Stop Breaking Down and I Don't Know Why. Those are covers, though.

Mick Taylor played bass and electric guitar on them, respectively.

I vaguely remember that there was some court ruling that said they had to acknowledge the fact that Taylor wrote the songs (at least partially) at the time. Perhaps they bought him off later on? The way the label info is given doesn't suggest a typo, in my opinion.

Wood Stones era will never be the gold Stones one.
Period.

***
I'm just a Bad Boy Boogie

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SomeGuy
Mick Taylor played bass and electric guitar on them, respectively.

I vaguely remember that there was some court ruling that said they had to acknowledge the fact that Taylor wrote the songs (at least partially) at the time. Perhaps they bought him off later on? The way the label info is given doesn't suggest a typo, in my opinion.

I Just Wanna See His Face:

Probable line-up:

Drums: Charlie Watts 
Upright acoustic double bass: Bill Plummer 
Lead vocal: Mick Jagger 
Background vocals: Clydie King, Venetta Fields & Jesse Kirkland 
Electric piano: Keith Richards and Nicky Hopkins (Bobby Whitlock claims he played - my comment)
Maracas: Jimmy Miller
Tambourine: Jimmy Miller 

Let It Loose:

Drums: Charlie Watts 
Bass: Bill Wyman 
Electric guitar: Keith Richards 
Lead vocals: Mick Jagger 
Background vocals: Mick Jagger, Keith Richards, Tamiya Lynn, Dr. John, Clydie King, Venetta Fields, Sherlie Matthews & Joe Green 
Piano: Nicky Hopkins 
Mellotron: Nicky Hopkins 
Saxophone: Bobby Keys 
Trumpet: Jim Price 

[timeisonourside.com]

[www.keno.org]

UST WANT TO SEE HIS FACE

Recorded between December 1971 and March, 1972. Released on Exile On Main Street in 1972.
Lead Vocal: Mick Jagger Backing Vocals: Clydie King, Vanetta Fields, Jerry Kirkland Piano: Keith Richards Bass: Mick Taylor & Bill Plummer Drums: Charlie Watts Percussion: Jimmy Miller

LET IT LOOSE

Recorded between December 1971 and March, 1972. Released on Exile On Main Street in 1972.
Lead Vocal: Mick Jagger Backing Vocals: Tamiya Lynn, Shirley Goodman, Dr. John, Clydie King, Venetta Field & Joe Green Electric Guitars: Keith Richards & Mick Taylor Bass: Bill Wyman Drums: Charlie Watts Piano: Dr. John Saxophone: Bobby Keys Trumpet & Trombone: Jim Price Mellotron: Nicky Hopkins

There is only one guitar on Let It Loose.

I will check then. Wikipedia however, says this:

Recording began in December 1971 and continued through March 1972, with some recording taking place at Nellcôte using the Rolling Stones Mobile Studio. With Jagger on lead vocals, backing vocals are provided by Tami Lynn, Dr. John, Clydie King, Venetta Fields, Shirley Goodman and Joe Greene. Electric guitars were performed by Richards and Mick Taylor, and played through a Leslie speaker. Bass is performed by Bill Wyman, Charlie Watts on drums, Nicky Hopkins on piano, Bobby Keys on tenor saxophone, and Jim Price plays both trombone and trumpet.

You know, wikipedia is totally free and unchecked, so it MUST be true!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-06-17 00:53 by SomeGuy.

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DandelionPowderman


I've seen some weird credits on Stop Breaking Down and I Don't Know Why. Those are covers, though.

As is with "Love In Vain" and "Don't You Lie to Me", all credited to Jagger/Richards at some point. However, the case of those two METAMORPHOSIS cuts might be that of human error (sloppiness) or intentional fraud by ABKCO (I wouldn't be surprised by the latter). But what goes for those two Robert Johnson numbers, ABKCO (which own rights for both Stones recordings) interpreted those being in the Public Domain. It took until 2000 the court decided that they were not PD, but belong to the Robert Johnson Estate. However, I recall even before that (2000) some EXILE versions already giving credition to Robert Johnson. Was that just semantics (putting Johnson's name on sleeve/record but still collecting the royalties to own pockets) or The Stones already wanting to do the right thing, despite what Klein was thinking and especially doing, no idea.

Yep, I have also a vague recollection that I've seen Taylor's name added to "Stop Breaking Down" credits.

- Doxa



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2019-06-17 01:15 by Doxa.

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DandelionPowderman

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SomeGuy
Mick Taylor played bass and electric guitar on them, respectively.

I vaguely remember that there was some court ruling that said they had to acknowledge the fact that Taylor wrote the songs (at least partially) at the time. Perhaps they bought him off later on? The way the label info is given doesn't suggest a typo, in my opinion.

I Just Wanna See His Face:

Probable line-up:

Drums: Charlie Watts 
Upright acoustic double bass: Bill Plummer 
Lead vocal: Mick Jagger 
Background vocals: Clydie King, Venetta Fields & Jesse Kirkland 
Electric piano: Keith Richards and Nicky Hopkins (Bobby Whitlock claims he played - my comment)
Maracas: Jimmy Miller
Tambourine: Jimmy Miller 

Let It Loose:

Drums: Charlie Watts 
Bass: Bill Wyman 
Electric guitar: Keith Richards 
Lead vocals: Mick Jagger 
Background vocals: Mick Jagger, Keith Richards, Tamiya Lynn, Dr. John, Clydie King, Venetta Fields, Sherlie Matthews & Joe Green 
Piano: Nicky Hopkins 
Mellotron: Nicky Hopkins 
Saxophone: Bobby Keys 
Trumpet: Jim Price 

[timeisonourside.com]

Elliott's book The Complete Recording Sessions and the Rolling Stones All The Songs both say Taylor added electric bass to I Just Wanna See His Face.

The original release of Metamorphosis credited Taylor on I'm Going Down. The credits were changed on later releases.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-06-17 01:05 by boogaloojef.

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boogaloojef

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DandelionPowderman

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SomeGuy
Mick Taylor played bass and electric guitar on them, respectively.

I vaguely remember that there was some court ruling that said they had to acknowledge the fact that Taylor wrote the songs (at least partially) at the time. Perhaps they bought him off later on? The way the label info is given doesn't suggest a typo, in my opinion.

I Just Wanna See His Face:

Probable line-up:

Drums: Charlie Watts 
Upright acoustic double bass: Bill Plummer 
Lead vocal: Mick Jagger 
Background vocals: Clydie King, Venetta Fields & Jesse Kirkland 
Electric piano: Keith Richards and Nicky Hopkins (Bobby Whitlock claims he played - my comment)
Maracas: Jimmy Miller
Tambourine: Jimmy Miller 

Let It Loose:

Drums: Charlie Watts 
Bass: Bill Wyman 
Electric guitar: Keith Richards 
Lead vocals: Mick Jagger 
Background vocals: Mick Jagger, Keith Richards, Tamiya Lynn, Dr. John, Clydie King, Venetta Fields, Sherlie Matthews & Joe Green 
Piano: Nicky Hopkins 
Mellotron: Nicky Hopkins 
Saxophone: Bobby Keys 
Trumpet: Jim Price 

[timeisonourside.com]

Elliott's book The Complete Recording Sessions and the Rolling Stones All The Songs both say Taylor added electric bass to I Just Wanna See His Face.

The original release of Metamorphosis credited Taylor on I'm Going Down. The credits were changed on later releases.

Taylor was also credited on I Don't Know Why on Metamorphosis. It was also changed.

D*rn! Keith wiped my tracks again!

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SomeGuy
I will check then. Wikipedia however, says this:

Recording began in December 1971 and continued through March 1972, with some recording taking place at Nellcôte using the Rolling Stones Mobile Studio. With Jagger on lead vocals, backing vocals are provided by Tami Lynn, Dr. John, Clydie King, Venetta Fields, Shirley Goodman and Joe Greene. Electric guitars were performed by Richards and Mick Taylor, and played through a Leslie speaker. Bass is performed by Bill Wyman, Charlie Watts on drums, Nicky Hopkins on piano, Bobby Keys on tenor saxophone, and Jim Price plays both trombone and trumpet.

You know, wikipedia is totally free and unchecked, so it MUST be true!

Still only Keith's guitar on it, though

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powerage78
Wood Stones era will never be the gold Stones one.
Period.

This concisely sums it all up.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

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iraq0708

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Rockman
Ronnie could also be replaced.

with who ???? ….. Ted Nugent....????????? ….. Who ?????

Jagger was purported to have asked George Thorogood if he would be willing to step in and replace Ron during the 1981-2 tour when George was opening some gigs and Ron was out of his mind with his freebase habit. Read that many years ago--wonder how THAT would have sounded??!!

That reminds me that Mick Taylor said MJ asked him to help/rejoin for the tour when KR was busted in Toronto before the tour started. MT said he told MJ he would help out but it would not the Rolling Stones without KR.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-06-17 01:43 by PhillyFAN.

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Hairball

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powerage78
Wood Stones era will never be the gold Stones one.
Period.

This concisely sums it all up.

Agreed.

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DandelionPowderman

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boogaloojef

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DandelionPowderman

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SomeGuy
Mick Taylor played bass and electric guitar on them, respectively.

I vaguely remember that there was some court ruling that said they had to acknowledge the fact that Taylor wrote the songs (at least partially) at the time. Perhaps they bought him off later on? The way the label info is given doesn't suggest a typo, in my opinion.

I Just Wanna See His Face:

Probable line-up:

Drums: Charlie Watts 
Upright acoustic double bass: Bill Plummer 
Lead vocal: Mick Jagger 
Background vocals: Clydie King, Venetta Fields & Jesse Kirkland 
Electric piano: Keith Richards and Nicky Hopkins (Bobby Whitlock claims he played - my comment)
Maracas: Jimmy Miller
Tambourine: Jimmy Miller 

Let It Loose:

Drums: Charlie Watts 
Bass: Bill Wyman 
Electric guitar: Keith Richards 
Lead vocals: Mick Jagger 
Background vocals: Mick Jagger, Keith Richards, Tamiya Lynn, Dr. John, Clydie King, Venetta Fields, Sherlie Matthews & Joe Green 
Piano: Nicky Hopkins 
Mellotron: Nicky Hopkins 
Saxophone: Bobby Keys 
Trumpet: Jim Price 

[timeisonourside.com]

Elliott's book The Complete Recording Sessions and the Rolling Stones All The Songs both say Taylor added electric bass to I Just Wanna See His Face.

The original release of Metamorphosis credited Taylor on I'm Going Down. The credits were changed on later releases.

Taylor was also credited on I Don't Know Why on Metamorphosis. It was also changed.

Yes, it was mentioned earlier so I didn't mention it again.

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SomeGuy


LET IT LOOSE

Recorded between December 1971 and March, 1972. Released on Exile On Main Street in 1972.
Lead Vocal: Mick Jagger Backing Vocals: Tamiya Lynn, Shirley Goodman, Dr. John, Clydie King, Venetta Field & Joe Green Electric Guitars: Keith Richards & Mick Taylor Bass: Bill Wyman Drums: Charlie Watts Piano: Dr. John Saxophone: Bobby Keys Trumpet & Trombone: Jim Price Mellotron: Nicky Hopkins

Let It Loose backing track was recorded at Olympic 1969/70.

Vocal overdubs in LA in 72.

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boogaloojef

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DandelionPowderman

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SomeGuy
Mick Taylor played bass and electric guitar on them, respectively.

I vaguely remember that there was some court ruling that said they had to acknowledge the fact that Taylor wrote the songs (at least partially) at the time. Perhaps they bought him off later on? The way the label info is given doesn't suggest a typo, in my opinion.

I Just Wanna See His Face:

Probable line-up:

Drums: Charlie Watts 
Upright acoustic double bass: Bill Plummer 
Lead vocal: Mick Jagger 
Background vocals: Clydie King, Venetta Fields & Jesse Kirkland 
Electric piano: Keith Richards and Nicky Hopkins (Bobby Whitlock claims he played - my comment)
Maracas: Jimmy Miller
Tambourine: Jimmy Miller 

Let It Loose:

Elliott's book The Complete Recording Sessions and the Rolling Stones All The Songs both say Taylor added electric bass to I Just Wanna See His Face.

The original release of Metamorphosis credited Taylor on I'm Going Down. The credits were changed on later releases.

Taylor didn't write anything but confirmed himself that he played bass on Just wanne see his face. Both an electric Bass and acoustic upright Bass are clearly audible . The electric piano sounds like a Fender Rhodes to me.

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TheflyingDutchman

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boogaloojef

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DandelionPowderman

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SomeGuy
Mick Taylor played bass and electric guitar on them, respectively.

I vaguely remember that there was some court ruling that said they had to acknowledge the fact that Taylor wrote the songs (at least partially) at the time. Perhaps they bought him off later on? The way the label info is given doesn't suggest a typo, in my opinion.

I Just Wanna See His Face:

Probable line-up:

Drums: Charlie Watts 
Upright acoustic double bass: Bill Plummer 
Lead vocal: Mick Jagger 
Background vocals: Clydie King, Venetta Fields & Jesse Kirkland 
Electric piano: Keith Richards and Nicky Hopkins (Bobby Whitlock claims he played - my comment)
Maracas: Jimmy Miller
Tambourine: Jimmy Miller 

Let It Loose:

Elliott's book The Complete Recording Sessions and the Rolling Stones All The Songs both say Taylor added electric bass to I Just Wanna See His Face.

The original release of Metamorphosis credited Taylor on I'm Going Down. The credits were changed on later releases.

Taylor didn't write anything but confirmed himself that he played bass on Just wanne see his face. Both an electric Bass and acoustic upright Bass are clearly audible . The electric piano sounds like a Fender Rhodes to me.

Absolutely. I’ve noticed a lot of misinformation on that site.