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The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: bv ()
Date: March 11, 2014 01:26

There has been questions about the arena stage as used during the "14 On Fire" tour. As it made its debut in Macau, I will open up for discussions and comments in this separate thread here, rather than doing it in the Macau thread. Thanks to Limbostone for bringing up the question, related to my news entry on IORR saying the arena stage is the same as in 2012-2013. It is not. But it is by far the same as seen from the fans, and in some ways even better. I will explain...

I knew the original arena stage takes 30 large trucks to carry, because I have seen them all and counted them, like in Newark. So I was worried they would strip down and degenerate the arena experience. But not so!

The most important part of the arena stage is the tongue pit. Visually you do only see the upper lip part before the show, as part of the backdrop screeen decorations. I think they drop the upper lips before show start, but I am not sure. I simply don't remember. Version 2 i.e. the Far East and Down Under arena stage is actually a low price improvement, because they have a larger screen that is improving the visuals for the fans all over the arena, while it does not look so "mouth & tongue" like vs the original.

So when I am saying the arena stage is back, I mean in the way it is working for the fans. Truely it is not identical visual nor physical, but anyone who went to an arena show in 2012 or 2013 would experience the same feel of the arena tongue shape, which is the good news for all of the arena shows that are to come. I.e. the designers managed to improve the stage without loosing any parts of the basic function.

On a side note, I think they got rid of some of the side ramps, that probably saved a few trucks, but unless 2/3 of the trucks were steel and stage fundaments, I really don't know how they manage to scale 30 trucks down into something that fits into airplane cargo!

I am sure we can add some pictures here soon, but the good news are the arena stage is great! And no worries if you invested a lot in a pit ticket - or simply an arena ticket in general - you are in for a treat, and you will not regret it.

And finally, for those who have been reading the Tokyo Dome reports, even if your show does not have the arena stage, that would not be the biggest problem of the tour - they are simply ... On Fire!

Bjornulf

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: bv ()
Date: March 11, 2014 01:31

A copy of the post by Irix from the Macau thread:

From [Twitter.com] - dismantling of the stage in Macau:



Bjornulf

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: bv ()
Date: March 11, 2014 01:33

A copy of the post by latvianinexile from the Macau thread:

Quote
Limbostone
Quote
iorr.org news
The Rolling Stones performed the first arena show of the 14 On Fire tour tonight in Macau, China, featuring the same arena stage as used during the 2012-2013 shows.

This of course is not entirely the case. The 'upper lip' is missing, as you can see in the JJF video. In 2012/2013 the upper lip was there for the first few songs. The idea of the circular ramp forming a part of the tongue-and-lip design logo is way less clear this way.

Off course, not bringing the upper lip is cheaper. And naturally, ticketprices of arenashows give every reason to cut costs.

Here's what I mean:
source: the iorr.org O2/1 review page.

Being in the venue I thought there maybe wasn't enough space for the upper lip. But if you compare thes photos you see there would have been.



Bjornulf

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: March 11, 2014 01:52

Thanks for the detailed info, I think latvianinexile meant the "upper teeth" instead of the "upper lip" though for the first few songs in 2012/2013, after that it looked like this :



The 2014 arena stage may be more "functional" but the 2012/2013 was "grander" I think, for lack of a better word...and served as a justification (Ronnie and Mick) for the high cost of the first 5 shows, see [www.iorr.org]

I can't see how the 2012/2013 stage would need 30 trucks and the 2014 one a lot less...there must be options to either loan the whole "setup" and then move it around or just carry the basics (in this case the floor possibly, mixing desk, lightning) and have the local promoters figure out the rest.

It doesn't seem like there is the "circular lightning" on the ceiling this time around either? Here's what it looked like at the O2:





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-03-11 01:55 by gotdablouse.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: KeefRichards88 ()
Date: March 11, 2014 05:10

The 2012/2013 stage featured a half oval truss to hold lights which hung over the circumference of the tongue There was also three trusses over the the main part of the stage the closest one to the audience was at an angle like this "^" - That one held lights which shined on the lips.

When the band did the song Paint It Black the lips were not lit and towards the end of the song the end of the lips would fold up and the whole thing would rise up into the rafters and deflate. This give a half circle visual of the video screen. When the band played Midnight Rambler the truss that was bent in a half circle at the bottom of the gold curtain would fold up into a straight line creating a giant square video screen.

For the 2014 arena shows There are only three trusses above the stage and as you can see in the photos above there are just a steel silver color. Before they were painted black so a lot of the trusses for this tour were designed and probably built in the far east so all of the original trusses did not have to be shipped over. There is a different curtain used as well and they probably do not have as many on the crew unlike the US/UK shows where you can have all the extra gadgets to operate on the stage. In 2014 you can also see steel scaffolding on both sides of the stage as well which holds more lights.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: latvianinexile ()
Date: March 11, 2014 06:02

Quote
gotdablouse
Thanks for the detailed info, I think latvianinexile meant the "upper teeth" instead of the "upper lip" though for the first few songs in 2012/2013, after that it looked like this (...)

I can't see how the 2012/2013 stage would need 30 trucks and the 2014 one a lot less...there must be options to either loan the whole "setup" and then move it around or just carry the basics (in this case the floor possibly, mixing desk, lightning) and have the local promoters figure out the rest.

I actually meant the upper lip not just the teeth. On the pictures you see that the width of the upper lip does not exceed the 2 side elements of the lower lip. So width and height wise the upper lip would have fit into the Macau arena.

I also can't see they would need 30 trucks for either of the stage versions. Maybe they dragged a lot of scaffolding rods about in the US, where it is cheaper to use local material if you have to fly somewhere. Another detail about Macau is that they did not hang all the PA from the ceiling. For the outer pair of PA speakers scaffoldings were built (not visible any more on the pic, where dismantling has started).

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: bonddm ()
Date: March 11, 2014 07:00

Gee,the punters on this leg are getting a good deal-a downscaled production and 3/4 fewer songs for the same price as 2013!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-03-11 07:01 by bonddm.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: Grison ()
Date: March 11, 2014 08:41

the teeth had been different from the 5 concerts in 2012 to 2013. They skipped the blow teeth and only had them done on the screen. I can't recall all changes, but I am sure that their had done some changes from 12 to 13 to optimize the travel through the US/CA.
I also assume that now all roofs can take such a load of PA systems. For that reason they might have taken the scaffoldings. Compare to the former Tonguepit and only judging from the photos the stage looks plain and less enclosed like a theatre style stage.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: TornAndFried ()
Date: March 11, 2014 09:10

Compared to the tongue stage they used in 2012/13 the stage they are using now in Asia & Australia is simpler in design but looks a little cheap, IMO. It appears to be cobbled together from pieces of the original one along with some generic-looking platforms, ramps, truss and scaffolding. I realize they had to scale down on the show's production to make it easier and more cost-effective to travel with, but for the Stones it's not as fancy as you would come to expect...especially given the high ticket prices. However, I think they will probably go back to using the "lips and teeth" stage for the European dates this summer as they can more easily and cheaply transport it in trucks rather than by plane.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2014-03-11 10:23 by TornAndFried.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: drbryant ()
Date: March 11, 2014 09:54

I actually prefer the stage without the "lips and teeth". For one thing, they serve no purpose except as a backdrop for a pre-show picture and second, they don't really look much like the real tongue logo. I also think that the intro is improved over the 50 and Counting Tour. The new approach, which just uses the pulsating red visual, is great - it builds anticipation for just the right amount of time and then the Stones hit the stage. I think it works. On the previous tour, the film plus the drums against a darkened stage backdrop just went on for too long in my view.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: TornAndFried ()
Date: March 11, 2014 10:16

Quote
drbryant
I also think that the intro is improved over the 50 and Counting Tour. The new approach, which just uses the pulsating red visual, is great - it builds anticipation for just the right amount of time and then the Stones hit the stage. I think it works. On the previous tour, the film plus the drums against a darkened stage backdrop just went on for too long in my view.

I haven't seen a video of the opening sequence for any of the Asian shows gets but I'll check it out. I also thought the opening for the 2012/13 shows went on too long and it was a little anti-climactic when the band finally came onstage. Glad to hear they streamlined that. Now if they could only improve on the dull setlists!



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 2014-03-11 16:21 by TornAndFried.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: Monkeytonkman ()
Date: March 11, 2014 10:17

Lips and teeth for Europe please!!!!!!

\m/cool smiley\m/


Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: MingSubu ()
Date: March 11, 2014 14:52

Quote
Monkeytonkman
Lips and teeth for Europe please!!!!!!

\m/cool smiley\m/

I agree!!!

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: March 11, 2014 18:28

Would they be in storage in the US at this point?

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: harald2002 ()
Date: March 11, 2014 20:16

Yes. Tounge and Lips & Teeth for Europe please! Please not the stage like in Abu-Dhabi!

In Abu Dhabi front row looked view was like this:



no Lips, stage to high...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-03-13 04:30 by bv.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: Limbostone ()
Date: March 11, 2014 21:44

Thanks for separating this subject off into a separate thread. I feel it's worth discussing, for it might add to the value for money part, for as much as possible that is, if we lobby for it for Europe.
For the festival, stadium and outdoor gigs however, they'll probably not use the lips anyway.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: MingSubu ()
Date: March 11, 2014 21:55

Yowza harald2002, they should of dished out some stilts.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: TornAndFried ()
Date: March 11, 2014 23:31

Quote
gotdablouse
Would they be in storage in the US at this point?

It's very likely the tongue and lips stage will see more action this summer in Europe - at least for any arena shows. That stage was custom-built and cost millions of dollars. And it's practically new having only been used for about 20 shows so far so my guess is it will be around for the rest of the Stones' touring days.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 2014-03-13 06:37 by TornAndFried.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: mickijaggeroo ()
Date: March 12, 2014 00:50

Quote
Monkeytonkman
Lips and teeth for Europe please!!!!!!

\m/cool smiley\m/

And a Lick or two!

Vilhelm
[www.stonesvikings.com]

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: March 12, 2014 14:00

Quote
TornAndFried
Quote
gotdablouse
Would they be in storage in the US at this point?

I'm not sure where the "50 and Counting" stage is at the moment. It might be at the warehouse of the company that built it (Tait Towers in Pennsylvania, USA). Or it could be in storage somewhere in England. In any case, it's very likely it will see more action this summer in Europe - at least for the arena shows. That stage was custom-built and cost millions of dollars. And it's practically new having only been used for about 20 shows so far so it wouldn't make sense to scrap it. My guess is it will be around for the rest of the Stones' touring days.

Makes sense, someone posted here once that they still had all their older stages in storage, well maybe not the giant stadium stages? The Lotus one would be nice to see again, maybe in a museum one day? ;-)

As for the "Tongue" stage it doesn't look like it will be getting much action this summer after all, only Oslo and Cologne left in the list on 12/03/2014 and just as "rumours" : [www.iorr.org] only

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Date: March 12, 2014 14:03

Quote
gotdablouse
Quote
TornAndFried
Quote
gotdablouse
Would they be in storage in the US at this point?

I'm not sure where the "50 and Counting" stage is at the moment. It might be at the warehouse of the company that built it (Tait Towers in Pennsylvania, USA). Or it could be in storage somewhere in England. In any case, it's very likely it will see more action this summer in Europe - at least for the arena shows. That stage was custom-built and cost millions of dollars. And it's practically new having only been used for about 20 shows so far so it wouldn't make sense to scrap it. My guess is it will be around for the rest of the Stones' touring days.

Makes sense, someone posted here once that they still had all their older stages in storage, well maybe not the giant stadium stages? The Lotus one would be nice to see again, maybe in a museum one day? ;-)

As for the "Tongue" stage it doesn't look like it will be getting much action this summer after all, only Oslo and Cologne left in the list on 12/03/2014 and just as "rumours" : [www.iorr.org] only

Valle Hovin as added as an aqual option for Oslo now, and unfortunately it looks like we're getting a stadium show this time...

EDIT: Telenor Arena is now the most likely venue.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-03-12 23:44 by DandelionPowderman.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: MRAmandaJones ()
Date: March 12, 2014 14:06

Telenor Arena (Oslo) is a covered stadium. Not sure tongue stage would be used in that venue...

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: lickskeith ()
Date: March 12, 2014 14:10

Yeah...lokks loke we ll get a stadium tour... So disappointed

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: Limbostone ()
Date: March 12, 2014 15:59

Quote
TornAndFried
Quote
gotdablouse
Would they be in storage in the US at this point?

I'm not sure where the "50 and Counting" stage is at the moment.

Well, it appears to be in Shanghai winking smiley.
Why it's not used at every arena show one can only guess right now. Maybe there were problems shipping it into Macau? Or they have one set of upperlips only which can't be used everywhere due to the short interval in between shows? Or it is valued per show if it's feasible costwise? Or some other restrictions regarding importing stuff, or logistical issues, or...?

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: bye bye johnny ()
Date: March 12, 2014 17:19

Shanghai, March 12.


lillahxx

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: Monkeytonkman ()
Date: March 12, 2014 22:22

That sure is one beautiful stage! Just 'bout my favourite of All time

Keep on rollin boys!

\m/


Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: kwf ()
Date: March 12, 2014 23:35

Any pics of the sound system and FOH mix position would be great, if possible...

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: TornAndFried ()
Date: March 13, 2014 06:43

I was surprised to see the tongue and lips stage at the show in Shanghai. I'm not sure why it wasn't also used in Macau but my guess is either the arena floor there was too small to accomodate it, or the logistics of getting it in and out of Macau and fly it to Shanghai were too difficult to do in the short time they had. In any case I think it's likely we will see it again in Australia.

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: Limbostone ()
Date: March 17, 2014 11:11

So far, bv only lists 'Stadium-size' gigs in Europe, apart maybe from Waldb├╝hne which is outdoor. The rumoured arena sized gigs have been removed (like Ziggodome and Cologne Deutz). Not much use for the tongue in Europe so far! They'd better come up with a decent outdoor stage...

Re: The arena stage during "14 On Fire"
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: March 17, 2014 11:25

It's likely they'll use the same "catwalk/mini-Bstage" as at HP, Abu Dhabi, Tokyo, etc...it lets them, well mostly Mick, get a bit closer and it also works well for crowd control/filming, etc...

As for the actual stage I doubt they'll do anything better than that "fire oval" with red and white sheets stretched around the stage, I mean why would they? There hasn't really been an outcry so far in places that matter, like the media.

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