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alimente

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Munichhilton
I'm looking forward to the next greatest hits compilation...it's been awhile...

Absolutely! What's really missing in my collection is a "Greatest Hits Of The New Millennium-collection", consisting of "Don't Stop", "Streets Of Love" and "Doom & Gloom". A 3 track EP, could be cheap for a change! Plus the Super Deluxe Edition with the b-sides, "Plundered My Soul" and "No Spare Parts" and a giant poster showing Mick and Keith sharing the same mic from the Beacon Theatre show for us sentimental superfans - not so cheap, but we're used to it by now.

If I never hear "Don't Stop" again, it's too soon. We won't even go to "Streets of Love".

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DandelionPowderman

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Doxa

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Mathijs

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alimente
They have written 5 songs since A Bigger Bang (nearly a decade ago!), 2 of them were already used on GRRRR! and they need to save the other three new ones for their next studio album which will (apart from these three) consist of studio remakes of their classic hits.

One Last Shot is a Talk is Cheap outtake, not a 'new' track.

Mathijs

Does that go so far back? Mamma mia...

Mick: "Okay, we need two new tracks to spice up the collection. I just made a few to warm up myself for the tour, and I think one is suitable for that. Keith, you had any?"

Keith: "Surely, mate. The antenna's out all the time."

[Then flies back home to check the vaults... "damn, nothing here or here... A BIGGER BANG? what was that?.. did I do anything? Seemingly not...LICKS... some unworked jams and Ronnie's stuff....shit,there must be something more .. no.. BRIDGES.. no... VOODOO.. no no.... MAIN OFFENDER... oh no fvck no.... yes! dammit! there is it, one from TALK IS CHEAP sessions. I knew it! I knew it! There had to be something!"]



- Doxa

He didn't bother using one of his NEW tracks he cut with Steve Jordan, tracks that some people here at IORR actually have heard, and thought sounded great

Well, don't know if that is a good or bad thing (to use secondary damn old solo material to a Stones project, and leave the better, more recent stuff to solo projects)... But have anyone ever hearing something 'secret, not yet released recent stuff' that is described nothing less than great...

I hope we will get some day to hear these gems by our own ears to form an opinion...

- Doxa

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Doxa

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DandelionPowderman

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Doxa

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Mathijs

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alimente
They have written 5 songs since A Bigger Bang (nearly a decade ago!), 2 of them were already used on GRRRR! and they need to save the other three new ones for their next studio album which will (apart from these three) consist of studio remakes of their classic hits.

One Last Shot is a Talk is Cheap outtake, not a 'new' track.

Mathijs

Does that go so far back? Mamma mia...

Mick: "Okay, we need two new tracks to spice up the collection. I just made a few to warm up myself for the tour, and I think one is suitable for that. Keith, you had any?"

Keith: "Surely, mate. The antenna's out all the time."

[Then flies back home to check the vaults... "damn, nothing here or here... A BIGGER BANG? what was that?.. did I do anything? Seemingly not...LICKS... some unworked jams and Ronnie's stuff....shit,there must be something more .. no.. BRIDGES.. no... VOODOO.. no no.... MAIN OFFENDER... oh no fvck no.... yes! dammit! there is it, one from TALK IS CHEAP sessions. I knew it! I knew it! There had to be something!"]



- Doxa

He didn't bother using one of his NEW tracks he cut with Steve Jordan, tracks that some people here at IORR actually have heard, and thought sounded great

Well, don't know if that is a good or bad thing (to use secondary damn old solo material to a Stones project, and leave the better, more recent stuff to solo projects)... But have anyone ever hearing something 'secret, not yet released recent stuff' that is described nothing less than great...

I hope we will get some day to hear these gems by our own ears to form an opinion...

- Doxa

These guys were supposedly outside his studio listening to them playing the new songs. They probably would have been blinded by the experience anyhow, that's right - I'm sure I would have

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stonehearted
If One More Shot comes from Talk Is Cheap, then that just shows how TIC would not have worked as a Stones album--at the very least, it would have ended up as Talk Is At A Super Discounted Rate, because in Mick Jagger's hands and at his stubborn insistence, tracks like Take It So Hard would have wound up overproduced what with being drenched in those late 80s production values Mick was so fond of at the time.

Compare the sounds and production of Primitive Cool with Talk Is Cheap and ask yourself, how do you really want a Stones album to sound--gutsy and raw, or gimmicky flavor of the month?

I think both PRIMITIVE COOL and TALK IS CHEAP are good as they are. Both Mick and Keith were able to do an album in which to follow their muse without any compromises, both going in extreme (and get that out of their system). For example, a Stones album would never sound so archaic than TALK IS CHEAP does. I think both albums are more interesting and challenging than any Stones album ever since, which to me are way too obvious and compromise-sounding mostly.

- Doxa

<without any compromises>

I believe Mick desperately wanted a hit album, with his second try. It is so slickly produced, and... well, Let's Work is in there. If he insisted on having that track as it wound up, and didn't compromise, I'll question his judgement.

But I really think he did it to make a hit, not necessarily to follow his muse.

Keith's album, on the other hand, is almost too raw and dirty for a mass market. I don't believe he wanted it THAT raw himself - I rather believe the record label people saying: "we want this as primitive as it gets, Keith, beyond with warts and all.

These are just my assumptions, of course

Hmm... rather strong assumptions.

In the case of Mick I don't think it is possible to distinguish between 'following a muse', 'trying to have a hit', or 'liking the contemporary trends'. My assumption is that all of those go hand in hand for Mick. And they have always been going on. What he did solo was the same thing he did earlier with the Stones - when that band was his vehicle of expression. It is with his later Stones works I have find him being not very much any longer driven by muse, or that he uses the Stones as his primal vehicle of expression.

I mean, the way I see Jagger is that he truely loves/loved the contemporary music, or what is going on in any given time, with an open heart, not as calculating that 'I need to follow that genre in order to stay trendy or have a hit'. He, for example, wants to make dance music, because I think he truely loves that. He once said that he could do a country&western album and it would sell good, but he simply isn't interested in that sort of thing. Boring to him.

To me PRIMITIVE COOL is as genuine Mick Jagger album as it ever can get. That was it was what Mick Jagger was in 1987. Sad for him that the world wasn't too impressed.

- Doxa



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-09-10 14:18 by Doxa.

You may be right, Doxa. That is, if Mick really has a weak spot for songs like Let's Work and Charmed Life, and felt that making and recording those songs took him to the next level artistically. If so, he followed his muse...

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treaclefingers

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alimente

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treaclefingers

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alimente
They have written 5 songs since A Bigger Bang (nearly a decade ago!), 2 of them were already used on GRRRR! and they need to save the other three new ones for their next studio album which will (apart from these three) consist of studio remakes of their classic hits.

WTF?

How do you know this or are you speculating. Studio remakes of classic hits, why would they do that?

Well, they sold us enough live remakes of their classic hits so far, so why not studio remakes for a change?

Nice. But why not just remove the audience noise from the live recording and call it a new studio remake? It would save them a lot of time.

You mean as opposed to basically rerecording the live stuff in the studio and then releasing it as a live album like they do now? that would be a new twist they have not tried.

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DandelionPowderman
You may be right, Doxa. That is, if Mick really has a weak spot for songs like Let's Work and Charmed Life, and felt that making and recording those songs took him to the next level artistically. If so, he followed his muse...

I believe he did.... Jagger seemingly has always loved dancing and any, usually black American based music, which make you move... That he dug Prince or Michael Jackson during the 80's, was I guess nothing different to him once digging Bo Diddley or James Brown. And using any given sounds the day's trendy technology allow to do, was something he had always done.

But I also believe that Mick got the 'message' right back in the 80's, and realized that he wasn't that convincing any longer. He kind of accepted his own limitations, or the 'burden' of his own ahcievements by then, which simply don't allow him to vary too much. Since then his flirting with 'trendy' things has been rather marginal. I mean, if he had followed his old habits we would have a Mick Jagger hiphop album by now...

To put this other way: Mick Jagger as a creative, forward going artist died in the 80's.

- Doxa



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-09-10 15:09 by Doxa.

<realized that he wasn't that convincing any longer>

That's where I believe the desperation of trying to stay relevant kicked in (Let's Work), as opposed to accepting his limitations and just make great music that he enjoyed himself.

6 years later he would do that successfully. Sweet Thing was contemporary too, but in a way more sincere and authentic way (Authentic Mick Jagger, that is). I believe it was his biggest solo hit to date - on an album packed with simple, but brilliant retro-Stones rock/r&b/soul/country/pop.

Yeah, in WANDERING SPIRIT Mick is in his home vocabulary (again) and it is easily the best and most vital Stones-style album since TATTOO YOU or UNDERCOVER, made either by the band or its key members. It was so damn good and fresh by that criterion that VOODOO LOUNGE sounded damn lame and half-assed effort compared to it. But in a way I have taken the album as a kind of statement by Mick: 'okay, I can do this kind of stuff as well, so there you have it'. Like in TALK IS CHEAP, where Keith wanted to "prove" his stance, Mick did it here. I think the spark and determination - which compansates the lack of more ambitious and risky attitude a'la PRIMITIVE COOL - comes from there. But at the time, he sounds more relaxed as well. His whole career was not dependent on it, since it was just a side project as the Stones were back in a track again.

- Doxa



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2013-09-10 16:40 by Doxa.

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DandelionPowderman
<realized that he wasn't that convincing any longer>

That's where I believe the desperation of trying to stay relevant kicked in (Let's Work), as opposed to accepting his limitations and just make great music that he enjoyed himself.

6 years later he would do that successfully. Sweet Thing was contemporary too, but in a way more sincere and authentic way (Authentic Mick Jagger, that is). I believe it was his biggest solo hit to date - on an album packed with simple, but brilliant retro-Stones rock/r&b/soul/country/pop.

I think Just Another Night was his biggest solo hit, or Dancing In The Street with Bowie, if that counts.

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DandelionPowderman

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Doxa

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Mathijs

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alimente
They have written 5 songs since A Bigger Bang (nearly a decade ago!), 2 of them were already used on GRRRR! and they need to save the other three new ones for their next studio album which will (apart from these three) consist of studio remakes of their classic hits.

One Last Shot is a Talk is Cheap outtake, not a 'new' track.

Mathijs

Does that go so far back? Mamma mia...

Mick: "Okay, we need two new tracks to spice up the collection. I just made a few to warm up myself for the tour, and I think one is suitable for that. Keith, you had any?"

Keith: "Surely, mate. The antenna's out all the time."

[Then flies back home to check the vaults... "damn, nothing here or here... A BIGGER BANG? what was that?.. did I do anything? Seemingly not...LICKS... some unworked jams and Ronnie's stuff....shit,there must be something more .. no.. BRIDGES.. no... VOODOO.. no no.... MAIN OFFENDER... oh no fvck no.... yes! dammit! there is it, one from TALK IS CHEAP sessions. I knew it! I knew it! There had to be something!"]



- Doxa

He didn't bother using one of his NEW tracks he cut with Steve Jordan, tracks that some people here at IORR actually have heard, and thought sounded great

No, he wanted to save those for his real band.

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Doxa
Hmm... rather strong assumptions.

To me PRIMITIVE COOL is as genuine Mick Jagger album as it ever can get. That was it was what Mick Jagger was in 1987. Sad for him that the world wasn't too impressed.

- Doxa

That sounds as though it's our issue then. If so, Let's Work at it.

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Doxa
Yeah, WANDERING SPIRIT Mick is in his home vocabulary and it is easily the best and most vital Stones-style album since TATTOO YOU or UNDERCOVER, made either by the band or its key members. It was so damn good and fresh by that criterion that VOODOO LOUNGE sounded damn lame and half-assed effort compared to it. But in a way I have taken the album as a kind of statement by Mick: 'okay, I can do this kind of stuff as well, so there you have it'. Like in TALK IS CHEAP, where Keith wanted to "prove" his stance, Mick did it here. I think the spark and determination - which compansates the lack of more ambitious and risky attitude a'la PRIMITIVE COOL - comes from there. But at the time, he sounds more relaxed as well. His not whole career was not dependent on it, since it was just a side project as the Stones were back in a track again.

- Doxa

Good observation. But it should not be forgotten that Wandering Spirit was the result of his record company not accepting his Red Devils sessions of Blues covers as a solo album under contractual terms, so he had to come up with "something" original, not a covers album.

Basically, "Wandering Spirit" was a contract filler album. By the time, I think he had accepted the fact that a solo career in the (commercial) steps of Michael Jackson would be out of reach for him, so he did not even try anymore and just gave his company an album that they obviously expected from him: Catchy songs, not too far removed from his Rolling Stones personae/image.

No wonder why it sounded so relaxed - Mick was doing simply what he could do best. And that's the reason why it sounded so convincing and genuine at the same time.

This very same mindset should work for the Stones, too. They've got nothing left to prove, there's no need for them to sound "contemporary" if it does not flow out of them naturally, if it doesn't come from the heart.

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Mathijs

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alimente
They have written 5 songs since A Bigger Bang (nearly a decade ago!), 2 of them were already used on GRRRR! and they need to save the other three new ones for their next studio album which will (apart from these three) consist of studio remakes of their classic hits.

One Last Shot is a Talk is Cheap outtake, not a 'new' track.

Mathijs

Are you sure Mathijs? Who's your source?

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treaclefingers

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DandelionPowderman

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Doxa

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Mathijs

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alimente
They have written 5 songs since A Bigger Bang (nearly a decade ago!), 2 of them were already used on GRRRR! and they need to save the other three new ones for their next studio album which will (apart from these three) consist of studio remakes of their classic hits.

One Last Shot is a Talk is Cheap outtake, not a 'new' track.

Mathijs

Does that go so far back? Mamma mia...

Mick: "Okay, we need two new tracks to spice up the collection. I just made a few to warm up myself for the tour, and I think one is suitable for that. Keith, you had any?"

Keith: "Surely, mate. The antenna's out all the time."

[Then flies back home to check the vaults... "damn, nothing here or here... A BIGGER BANG? what was that?.. did I do anything? Seemingly not...LICKS... some unworked jams and Ronnie's stuff....shit,there must be something more .. no.. BRIDGES.. no... VOODOO.. no no.... MAIN OFFENDER... oh no fvck no.... yes! dammit! there is it, one from TALK IS CHEAP sessions. I knew it! I knew it! There had to be something!"]



- Doxa

He didn't bother using one of his NEW tracks he cut with Steve Jordan, tracks that some people here at IORR actually have heard, and thought sounded great

No, he wanted to save those for his real band.

My point was Im not so sure it was a TIC outtake