"As we say in England, it can get a bit trainspottery"

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stonehearted

Another look at the interior of The Red Room - Ealing Club, May 2012.

Primo, cheers for the shots StoneHearted

Shouldn't it be when they added the 'g' to Rollin'?

How come MightyStones50 & His Banned isn't whooping this one up?

Though the classic Rolling Stones lineup first played onstage 12 January 1963 at Ealing Jazz Club, there would be several gigs yet before Wyman and Watts were made full and permanent members. Wyman and Watts played their first gig as permanent members at the Red Lion Pub in Sutton, Surrey, on Wednesday 23 January.


The Red Lion Pub, 265 High Street, Cheam, SM1 1LD Sutton, Surrey.

Set list for The Rolling Stones at the Red Lion Pub on 7 December 1962.

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stonehearted
In the right-hand side of the photo below, you will notice the letters ABC--for the Aerated Bread Company tea shop. Ealing Jazz Club was located in the basement of the ABC building.


Ealing Broadway Station opposite the Ealing Jazz Club.


Doorway of Ealing Jazz Club.

You've mixed up buildings, it wasn't the basement of the ABC tea shop building.

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His Majesty

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stonehearted
In the right-hand side of the photo below, you will notice the letters ABC--for the Aerated Bread Company tea shop. Ealing Jazz Club was located in the basement of the ABC building.


Ealing Broadway Station opposite the Ealing Jazz Club.


Doorway of Ealing Jazz Club.

You've mixed up buildings, it wasn't the basement of the ABC tea shop building.

Are you sure? Every online source I've looked up says there was an ABC tea shop at 42 The Broadway, as in the following article:

London's first R&B venue and where Keith got a taste of gigging

Location: 42A The Broadway, Ealing, W5 2NP

Description: Opening in January 1959, 'The Ealing Club' was situated in a basement below an Aerated Bread Company tea shop, (now an Estate Agent) opposite Ealing Broadway station.

It was reached by descending the narrow steps of the alley that leads to Haven Place, between the tea shop and what at the time was a jeweller's shop.

On 17 March 1962, known as The Ealing Club, it became London's first regular R&B venue with a performance by the seminal Alexis Korner and Cyril Davies band Blues Incorporated.

'The club held only 200 when you packed them all in' Korner recalled, 'and there was only about 100 people in all of London that were into the blues and all of them showed up at the club that first night'.

The club is also noteworthy as the place where on 7 April 1962, Alexis Korner introduced Mick Jagger and Keith Richards to Brian Jones, and the nucleus of The Rolling Stones first came together.

In fact it was here that Keith Richards had one of his first tastes of playing live on stage, after Alexis Korner invited him up on stage to jam.

A Blue Plaque now marks the spot for Alexis Korner and Cyril Davies starting R&B here!

Source: www.shadyoldlady.com/location.php?loc=2515

Good news for Stones fans who wish to visit sites of historical significance associated with the band: As of 2011, the building that housed the Red Lion Pub [now The Winning Post] has been placed on the heritage list of protected local landmarks. Below is an article dated 13 May 2011.

A pub which helped The Rolling Stones on their road has been added to a list of protected buildings in Sutton.

The Winning Post was among 170 buildings and landmarks that have been added to the Local List, that helps to identify and preserve structures with local significance, after an appeal by Sutton Council.

The Sutton High Street pub, was where the Rolling Stones were spotted early in their careers playing a gig, when the venue was named the Red Lion.

Councillor Jayne McCoy, a council spokesman on planning, said: “The high number of nominations that we’ve received shows how proud Sutton residents are of the area’s heritage.

“The nominations for the Local List highlight the borough’s unique and diverse history, from its rural beginnings to its innovative modern buildings such as the BedZED sustainable development.”

For more information visit sutton.gov.uk/heritage

From: www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/news/local/topstories/9020674._Rolling_Stones_pub_joins_heritage_list/

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stonehearted

Are you sure?

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stonehearted

Entrance to alleyway leading to the site of Ealing Jazz Club, now The Red Room nightclub.

The plaque is on the building(jeweller/solicitor/auctioneer) to the left at the top of the alley/stairway. The Ealing club is at the bottom of the stairwell on the left underneath the same building.

Maybe the ABC was in that building in 1962/63, but it's further up the road on the right in that black and white photo.

Dunno why they choose to say it was in the basement of the ABC. According to the black and white pic, The ABC would have been where the 8 Treasures is in this modern day photo...

[freshonthenet.co.uk]







Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2013-01-09 21:29 by His Majesty.

Site of the Red Lion Pub [now The Winning Post] on High Street in Sutton as it stands today and for posterity as a local protected heritage landmark.

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uhbuhgullayew

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stonehearted
As Keith has pointed out, the true 50th anniversary of The Rolling Stones is marked by the first time Charlie joined the band onstage to round out the classic lineup at Ealing Jazz Club on Saturday 12 January 1963.

Works for me.

yes...and i think Mick J said as much when it didn't look like there'd be any anniversary shows in 2012.
(back when the tiny todger story was in the press)


IORR............but I like it!

If January 12, 1963 is going to be Keith's 50 years then January 11th, 2013 is the celebratory day of 50 years. In two more days it will be exactly 50 years since Charlie played his first gig as a Rollin' Stone.

So when did they become The Rolling Stones? I don't remember that one.

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GasLightStreet
If January 12, 1963 is going to be Keith's 50 years then January 11th, 2013 is the celebratory day of 50 years. In two more days it will be exactly 50 years since Charlie played his first gig as a Rollin' Stone.

So is New Year's Day really DEC 31?

And New Year's Eve DEC 30?

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GasLightStreet
If January 12, 1963 is going to be Keith's 50 years then January 11th, 2013 is the celebratory day of 50 years. In two more days it will be exactly 50 years since Charlie played his first gig as a Rollin' Stone.

So when did they become The Rolling Stones? I don't remember that one.

Friday 11 January 1963 is the date of the last gig that Tony Chapman played with The Rolling Stones at the Ricky Tick in Windsor. By the way, the days of the week in 2013 are the same as they were in 1963--Friday 11 January now was also Friday 11 January then.

To answer your question about the "g" in Rolling, most sources agree that this change seems to have come about at the same time Keith Richards had the "s" dropped from his surname--that is, at the behest of Andrew Loog Oldham as soon as he took the reigns of manager in May 1963. Here's an overview from an online source:

The Rolling Stones Cut a Record Deal

In 1963, the Rollin’ Stones signed with a manager named Andrew Oldham, who had been helping to promote the Beatles. Oldham saw the Rollin’ Stones as the “anti-Beatles” and decided to promote their bad-boy image to the press. Oldham also changed the spelling of the band’s name by adding a “g,” making it “Rolling Stones” and changed Richards’ last name to Richard (which Richard later changed back to Richards).

Taken from: history1900s.about.com/od/people/a/Rolling-Stones.htm

Another article from 2011 detailing steps taken to preserve former 'Rolling Stones
pub' the Red Lion in Sutton [now The Winning Post] as a heritage landmark. Of significance, it was at Red Lion gigs where The Stones first met two hey figures: Giorgio Gomelski and Glyn Johns.

Pub home to music legends is preserved
Friday, May 13, 2011 This is Croydon
A CELEBRATED music pub which helped the Rolling Stones on their road to fame will be preserved for posterity.

High Street pub The Winning Post is one place on a list of landmarks which will be singled out for care and respect.

The venue used to be called The Red Lion, and hosted the young Rolling Stones back in 1963 when as few as 30 people showed up.

But one person in the audience that night was bigwig promoter Giorgio Gomelski, who signed the Stones up for a residency at Richmond's iconic Crawdaddy Club, just months before they hit the charts and became overnight stars.

The pub is one of 170 sights to have been added to Sutton's Local List, after residents came up with 450 suggestions of historic landmarks that help define the borough's unique character.

Other new additions to the Local List include a 1908 tennis pavilion on the corner of The Ridgway and Mayfield Road, following a campaign waged by ward councillors, and two vintage postboxes.

Cllr Jayne McCoy, executive member for planning on Sutton Council, said: "The nominations for the Local List highlight the borough's unique and diverse history, from its rural beginnings to its innovative modern buildings such as the BedZED sustainable development."

Taken from: www.thisiscroydontoday.co.uk/Pub-home-music-legends-preserved/story-11358856-detail/story.html

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uhbuhgullayew

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GasLightStreet
If January 12, 1963 is going to be Keith's 50 years then January 11th, 2013 is the celebratory day of 50 years. In two more days it will be exactly 50 years since Charlie played his first gig as a Rollin' Stone.

So is New Year's Day really DEC 31?

And New Year's Eve DEC 30?

No. Durrr. Dec 31 IS the year, the 365th day (or 366th), the day that MAKES it a year.

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stonehearted

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GasLightStreet
If January 12, 1963 is going to be Keith's 50 years then January 11th, 2013 is the celebratory day of 50 years. In two more days it will be exactly 50 years since Charlie played his first gig as a Rollin' Stone.

So when did they become The Rolling Stones? I don't remember that one.

Friday 11 January 1963 is the date of the last gig that Tony Chapman played with The Rolling Stones at the Ricky Tick in Windsor. By the way, the days of the week in 2013 are the same as they were in 1963--Friday 11 January now was also Friday 11 January then.

To answer your question about the "g" in Rolling, most sources agree that this change seems to have come about at the same time Keith Richards had the "s" dropped from his surname--that is, at the behest of Andrew Loog Oldham as soon as he took the reigns of manager in May 1963. Here's an overview from an online source:

The Rolling Stones Cut a Record Deal

In 1963, the Rollin’ Stones signed with a manager named Andrew Oldham, who had been helping to promote the Beatles. Oldham saw the Rollin’ Stones as the “anti-Beatles” and decided to promote their bad-boy image to the press. Oldham also changed the spelling of the band’s name by adding a “g,” making it “Rolling Stones” and changed Richards’ last name to Richard (which Richard later changed back to Richards).

Taken from: history1900s.about.com/od/people/a/Rolling-Stones.htm

Nice, thanks.

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His Majesty

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stonehearted

Are you sure?

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stonehearted

Entrance to alleyway leading to the site of Ealing Jazz Club, now The Red Room nightclub.

The plaque is on the building(jeweller/solicitor/auctioneer) to the left at the top of the alley/stairway. The Ealing club is at the bottom of the stairwell on the left underneath the same building.

Maybe the ABC was in that building in 1962/63, but it's further up the road on the right in that black and white photo.

Dunno why they choose to say it was in the basement of the ABC. According to the black and white pic, The ABC would have been where the 8 Treasures is in this modern day photo...

[freshonthenet.co.uk]

Many thanks for your contribution to this thread, HM. The building housing the jeweller's certainly does resemble the building above Ealing Club in other photos. So many sources seem to have the addresses for these two establishments completely reversed. In reality, the club was not even situated between the jeweller's and tea shop, because there is still another business standing between the jeweller's and tea shop: Wetherington & Whomever [Secre??].

It's Hetherington and Secrett who were Estate Agents, Auctioneers, Surveyors and Valuers - several bits of that row of shops seem to belong to them, and they might be one of the business ancestors of the present-day Haart, just as the solicitors Lambert Hale and Proctor on the floor above are now part of Montague Lambert & Co - whose website mentions that they started business in Ealing Broadway. Hetherington & Secrett have a board up over the entrance to the alley in that old picture - I wonder if the Ealing Club's premises began life as their basement?

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Green Lady
It's Hetherington and Secrett who were Estate Agents, Auctioneers, Surveyors and Valuers - several bits of that row of shops seem to belong to them, and they might be one of the business ancestors of the present-day Haart, just as the solicitors Lambert Hale and Proctor on the floor above are now part of Montague Lambert & Co - whose website mentions that they started business in Ealing Broadway. Hetherington & Secrett have a board up over the entrance to the alley in that old picture - I wonder if the Ealing Club's premises began life as their basement?

Thanks so much, Green Lady! That sign was a bit hard to make out in the fuzzy resolution of that old photo, and that's why my Google search went nowhere with the name I came up with. Would you happen to know the exact street number of the ABC tea shop? Was it ever located at number 42 The Broadway, perhaps in 1962 or 1963?

The present-day 42 is Haart, and (not being an Ealing resident) I'd say there isn't any evidence that the ABC was ever in that building (unless, of course, somebody out there knows different).

Maybe the point is that the ABC were a well-known national chain of tea-shops with a big clear shop sign, so therefore much easier to give as a landmark in directions than the unfamiliar Hetherington and Whatsit.

PS: paulywaul seems to have been a customer of the Ealing ABC...

In January 1963, the regular Friday night gig for The Rollin' Stones was played at the Ricky Tick club, an upstairs room in the Star and Garter Hotel on 133 Peascod Street in Windsor, Berkshire. They played their first gig there on 14 December 1962 [ticket price was 25p, which was one quarter of a pound, or roughly half a dollar USD], which also happens to be the date on which Bill Wyman played his first gig with The Rollin' Stones. From his book Rolling with the Stones, Wyman remembers the Ricky Tick as "a large, square room, with a small triangular stage in one corner and a bar on one side. On the walls were posters of other groups that had played at the club, including the Mann-Hugg Blues Band and Hogsnort Rupert's Band. The crowd was a mix of students and a smattering of American servicemen who knew Chicago R&B. They were impressed." The Watts and Wyman lineup first played at the Ricky Tick on 25 January.


A not-the-1960s image of the Star and Garter Hotel, right.

John Mansfield, who first booked The Rollin' Stones to play at the Ricky Tick, recalls the effect the band's music had on the club's audience:

"By the time they'd finished their first number you could tell that they'd hit the girls' musical G spot because they were all just screaming wild. It was like hypnotic music because it was a fusion between Bo Diddley and Chuck Berry - it was all pulsating rhythms."

Mansfield also remembers that future girlfriend of Mick Jagger, Chrissie Shrimpton, may have been the first person ever to crowd surf at a gig, one night in January 1963:

"Chrssie climbed onto a table and clambered into the fishnets which were dangling from the ceiling. She proceeded to crawl towards the Stones, over the heads of fans who aided her by putting their hands in the air and paddling her towards the stage."

Read a full article on Mansfield's recollections in a feature on the Ricky Tick:

www.bbc.co.uk/berkshire/content/articles/2006/11/06/ricky_tick_feature.shtml

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His Majesty

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stonehearted

Are you sure?

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stonehearted

Entrance to alleyway leading to the site of Ealing Jazz Club, now The Red Room nightclub.

The plaque is on the building(jeweller/solicitor/auctioneer) to the left at the top of the alley/stairway. The Ealing club is at the bottom of the stairwell on the left underneath the same building.

Maybe the ABC was in that building in 1962/63, but it's further up the road on the right in that black and white photo.

Dunno why they choose to say it was in the basement of the ABC. According to the black and white pic, The ABC would have been where the 8 Treasures is in this modern day photo...

[freshonthenet.co.uk]

Ah yes, the old ABC cafe. I spent many a lunchtime or afternoon in that during the years 1972/3/4 whilst at school in Ealing, remember it well. I was completely oblivious of course at THAT time of the significance of that little club tucked away in the alleyway a couple of premises along. Such is life.

I think it is GREAT that the place still exists, and that its significance in UK music history has been recognised and that it's got itself one of those English Heritage Blue Plaques.

[ I want to shout, but I can hardly speak ]

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Green Lady
The present-day 42 is Haart, and (not being an Ealing resident) I'd say there isn't any evidence that the ABC was ever in that building (unless, of course, somebody out there knows different).

Maybe the point is that the ABC were a well-known national chain of tea-shops with a big clear shop sign, so therefore much easier to give as a landmark in directions than the unfamiliar Hetherington and Whatsit.

PS: paulywaul seems to have been a customer of the Ealing ABC...

Indeed I was Green Lady, because I went to Ealing Grammar school, so the ABC Cafe was a popular very spot for us schoolchildren, mainly also due to its location directly opposite the bus stop and also Ealing Broadway train station of course. And the premises named Hetheringtons, they were an independent estate agents. Like most "independent" estate agents, long gone unfortunately. Interestingly enough, a couple of premises along (to the right of the former ABC Cafe) and on the corner of the green (Haven Green), is today occupied by a Polish delicatessen, just as it was all those years ago. It's one of Ealing's longest established Polish shops, been there since I was a child ... and I'm coming up for 58 now (gulp !!)

F**k me, now I'm thinking about it, I could REALLY do with one of those declicious jam filled doughnuts from that place, I'm salivating at the thought of it ..........

O yes, and for historians, the ABC Cafe was a chain, rather like the "Lyons Tea House" of the postwar years, the 1940s and 1950s certainly. Also long gone ...... now we've got Pret A Manger and Starbucks and Coffee this and Coffee that !!

[ I want to shout, but I can hardly speak ]

[www.ealing-club.com]


the upcoming gigs running from the 14th-16th of February should be great.

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Adrian-L
[www.ealing-club.com]


the upcoming gigs running from the 14th-16th of February should be great.

WOW ... indeed they should. Thanks for posting Adrian.

[ I want to shout, but I can hardly speak ]

The Rolling Stones played an estimated 39 gigs at the Ricky Tick club in Windsor on Fridays between 1962 and 1964. In April 1964, the club moved to a mansion on the Thames known as Clewer Mead, also in Windsor, where it remained until 1968.


Clewer Mead on Barry Avenue in Windsor, location of the Ricky Tick club from 1964 to 1968.

The Clewer Mead version of the Ricky Tick was immortalized in Antonioni's film Blow-up--at least an Elstree Studios recreation of the Ricky Tick--during the famous cameo scene of The Yardbirds.

Maybe they'll just celebrate it with an ice cream cake from Dairy Queen?

Monday night gigs for The Rolling Stones in January 1963 were played in Soho's Flamingo Jazz Club, which opened in 1952 in the basement of Mapleton Restaurant on Coventry Street but from 1957 to 1967 was located at 33-37 Wardour Street. Pictured below in the doorway of the Flamingo is a 1965 photo of Zoot Money and the Big Roll Band. On the left is George "Zoot" Money and second from right is Andy Summers--yes that Andy Summers.


The Flamingo Jazz Club, 33-37 Wardour Street, Soho, London.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-01-16 00:26 by stonehearted.

The Stones first played at the Flamingo Jazz Club on 7 January 1963. Ian Stuart recalls auditioning for what would become their regular Monday night gig in January 1963:

(H)aving seen the Stones once at the Marquee, the people who were running the scene in those days were 100% against us, and it was one bloody fight to get anywhere... I'll never forget the first time we went down to the Flamingo. We did an audition on a Sunday afternoon, and the Flamingo was a pretty smart place. It was THE modern jazz club in town, and everybody was going down in their zoot suits, white shirts, and all that. I'll never forget saying to Keith, You're not going to the Flamingo dressed like that are you? He said, What ho, Stu, I've only got one pair of @#$%& jeans!
- Ian Stewart, Stones' pianist (1962-85)