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pmk251

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lettingitbleed
How bout Jagger after Satisfaction: "There have been a few hangups but generally...you've been beauutifulll."

Yes, several beatings and a murder..just a few hangups, but other than that..good times!

Again, Jagger's cluelessness mischaracterizes much of what happened in front of him. Keith had it right. Jagger didn't. After the violent spasms before and during UMT the concert did calm down, but the movie was not interested in that. I am not sure what the term "end of sixties" means or is meant to mean, but the term grates me. I did not see any hippies fighting in that movie. High, sure. Too high, sure. But they were getting beat on by thugs in a poorly planned, self serving event and a self aggrandizing movie.

Like you say, it was self-serving and self-aggrandizing. Symbolically, the Stones were ushering in the 1970s Me Generation, and with that, the end of the sixties.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-15 05:47 by tatters.

More reason for the Stones to perform a make up show for the Altamont people on the next tour.

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The Sicilian
More reason for the Stones to perform a make up show for the Altamont people on the next tour.

The Altamont people? You mean the actual people who were there on Dec. 6, 1969? Man, that would be one ELDERLY rock and roll crowd. The show would have to start by 4 pm at the latest. Early to bed, early to rise, you know.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-15 06:32 by tatters.

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lettingitbleed
How bout Jagger after Satisfaction: "There have been a few hangups but generally...you've been beauutifulll."

Yes, several beatings and a murder..just a few hangups, but other than that..good times!

To be far to Mick, and indeed the rest of the band, he did the best he could under extremely stressful circumstances. He carried on with the show despite the chaos around him. I imagine the scene would have been worse had the Stones decided to do a runner...

The audience portions of this recording are scary and fascinating at the same time. Never heard it before. Thanks for posting!

Just for the record, here are my original notes on how I put this all together. Watchit/gottogo99 should also get credit for first circulating some of the new sources.

---

The Rolling Stones
1969-12-06
(Dick Carter's) Altamont Speedway
Livermore
California

01 Sam Cutler Intro and Crowd 01:39.1 mono
02 Jumpin Jack Flash 04:20.0+ mono
03 Carol 03:47.4+ mono (fades into single stereo audience source at about 2'24" )
04 Sympathy For the Devil (1) 01:44.1
05 Disturbance (1) 01:17.5
06 Sympathy For The Devil 2 07:28.5* (fades into single stereo audience source at 6'07" )
07 Disturbance (2) 02:55.3
08 The Sun Is Shining 04:05.6
09 Stray Cat Blues 03:47.3
10 Love In Vain 05:41.2
11 Under My Thumb (1) 00:43.3
12 Disturbance (3) 02:31.1
13 Under My Thumb (2) 03:40.3*
14 Intro To Brown Sugar 00:58.0
15 Brown Sugar 03:24.5
16 Intro To Midnight Rambler 01:30.2
17 Midnight Rambler 08:06.5
18 Intro to Live With Me 00:59.2
19 Live With Me 03:21.3
20 Gimme Shelter 04:41.3*
21 Little Queenie 04:14.3
22 Satisfaction 06:33.2
23 Intro to Honky Tonk Women 00:47.6
24 Honky Tonk Women 03:57.1
25 Street Fighting Man 04:09.7

+ True blends of the 'master aud tape' and the recently circulated audience tape recorded for radio broadcast from Watchit/gottogo99 (thank you!) at Dime and The Trader's Den.
* True blends of the audience and soundboard recordings.

By true blend, I mean that the two sources were run simultaneously and mixed to a new track.

Total length: 86mins 26sec

CD 1 Tracks 1-15 (48'06" )
CD 2 Tracks 16-25 (38'23" )


Background

One of the most storied recordings in Rolling Stones history. Apart from the obvious crowd problems (MJ: Well, there've been a few hang ups. But generally, ... you've been beautiful!), this was a pretty strong performance. The audience taping of the entire show must be--given the very difficult conditions--one of the most heroic recordings ever made.

Many versions of this recordings have circulated over the years, including the well-known bootleg The Killer Festival, Altamont 1969 (VGP-113). I think the best version of the audience tape currently available is the one gottogo99 posted at The Trader's Den in December 2008 (http://www.thetradersden.org/forums/showthread.php?t=67697). Please check over there for details. It's still running if you want the pure version of this tape.

What do we have here?

This version is true blend (or matrix) of as much of the show as is available from five different sources. Note that none of them had all the pieces. The idea was to get the best possible sound for each track, but retain all the crowd noise, reactions, etc. in the recording. The crowd was obviously an integral part of this event, I've kept all of that from all the sources.

Sources (in the order of the amount I used)

1) A (possible) copy of the master tape. Supplied lineage: master > 1st gen > CDR. This purports to be a lo-gen copy of the master tape, but it has a fade-in at the beginning of Jumping Jack Flash that is not on VGP 113. There are also other small edits and odd drop outs that are not present on VGP-113. This source also ran fast, and it has been pitch-speed corrected for the current version. I used the soundboard files as reference. This source has less hiss than VGP 113. And like all other versions of this source, it is stereo, most likely fake. I used this source as the base for my edits.

2) The soundboard recordings used for the Gimme Shelter movie. Supplied lineage: Gimme Shelter > Remastered (unknown label) > CD > aiff (xACT). I used Sympathy For The Devil (2) and Under My Thumb (2) from this source, and Gimme Shelter from A Shot of Salvation (Scorpio OM 90-64-17) to blend in with the aud recording. I like the sound of these blends; others may not. I think the Altamont Sympathy For The Devil is one of the best ever live versions, but it was extensively edited for the soundtrack. The beginning was badly edited, and Mick Taylor's solo was almost completely cut out (shame!). Keith's solo is very distant on the audience recording, but is now much higher in the mix. The audience "accompaniments" really add atmosphere. Under My Thumb (2) and Gimme Shelter were unedited on the soundboard recording, so the blends flow quite well.

Note that NONE of the tracks here are the original soundboard files that are commercially available.

3) The recently surfaced files supplied by Watchit/gottogo99 (http://www.thetradersden.org/forums/showthread.php?t=78161). I used this for the Sam Cutler Intro, Jumpin Jack Flash, and most of Carol. After that the tape speed problems really kick in.

4) A 4th gen recording. Supplied lineage: Singlepoint stereo mic (possibly a Sony) > portable mini reel to reel > 3rd or 4th gen tape > U2A AD converter > Dell Inspiron 3500 > cool Edit pro > Cdwav > cdr > EAC > SHN. This was the only lineage that was specific about the recording apparatus, but who knows whether it was correct or not. The taper photos from Gimme Shelter (see the Watchit files at TTD) and Ethan Russell's book suggests that neither of the known recorders were reel-to-reel. This source had the extra 1.30 mins introduction to Midnight Rambler.

5) The well known VGP-113 boot. The Killer Festival, Altamont 1969 (VGP-113): Silvers > EAC > Wav > Flac Frontend > flac 8. This commonly circulated source has significant tape hiss not present on the other sources I used, probably from crudely boosting the higher frequencies. It sounds way over processed to me. I used this for bits of audience reaction, tape noise etc. that was missing elsewhere.


How did I put this together?

I used source 1) as my foundation. This was speed corrected to approximate the 3 soundboard tracks, and had other manipulations added using Logic Pro 7 (Apple). The other sources were mixed in as required using Logic Pro's multitrack capability. I used hundreds of edits to produce the final version, but in particular: multiband compression, parametric equalization, linear phase equalization, gain adjustment, and cross fades between channels and songs. All of these edits were applied as minimally as possible, and each track was treated separately. In some cases an 8 track mix was used to get the best balance of gain and equalization across a particular song. No noise reduction was used at any point.

Final lineage: Mixing (Logic Pro 7)> bounced to aiff > track splitting on sector boundaries (Amadeus Pro) > Flac and SBE check (xACT).

The final recording does not sound as harsh as VGP 113; I prefer the balance and the overall sound. I think the blended tracks really add a new dimension to the recording. Others may prefer the unedited audience recording; but there you go--you don't have to keep this one.

Thanks to the many people who helped out with trades, info, and who took the time to answer my emails. Thanks also to siege72 at Dime for invaluable help with speed/pitch corrections.

bigtyke66
January, 2010

i'm late to the dance i'm sure with this one - but the maysles grabbed the "we leave you to kiss each other goodbye" bite from altamont and cut it into the garden footage? For me, time is not kind to that movie - they took so many out of context liberties to create their own drama that it really doesn't hold up for me anymore - the live footage is killer - the storytelling sucks-

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hbwriter
i'm late to the dance i'm sure with this one - but the maysles grabbed the "we leave you to kiss each other goodbye" bite from altamont and cut it into the garden footage? For me, time is not kind to that movie - they took so many out of context liberties to create their own drama that it really doesn't hold up for me anymore - the live footage is killer - the storytelling sucks-

that particular edit is one of hundreds in the film. Satisfaction is an amalgam of 2 different performances, there are visual bits of some songs spliced into JJF, the between song banter at Altamont is rearranged, Love In Vain features NO actual performance footgae of the song, and on and on...that is the marvel of good editing.
The Stones do much the same every time they overdub in the studio, or anytime a producer splices a bit of one song into another. IMHO Gimme Shelter is very well edited and does an amazing amount of exposition in 90 minutes.

"well it just goes to show,
things are not what they seem..."

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thkbeercan

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hbwriter
i'm late to the dance i'm sure with this one - but the maysles grabbed the "we leave you to kiss each other goodbye" bite from altamont and cut it into the garden footage? For me, time is not kind to that movie - they took so many out of context liberties to create their own drama that it really doesn't hold up for me anymore - the live footage is killer - the storytelling sucks-

that particular edit is one of hundreds in the film. Satisfaction is an amalgam of 2 different performances, there are visual bits of some songs spliced into JJF, the between song banter at Altamont is rearranged, Love In Vain features NO actual performance footgae of the song, and on and on...that is the marvel of good editing.
The Stones do much the same every time they overdub in the studio, or anytime a producer splices a bit of one song into another. IMHO Gimme Shelter is very well edited and does an amazing amount of exposition in 90 minutes.

It's how concert films and live albums are made. The editing in Gimme Shelter is brilliant. It's a big part of why Altamont transcended the Rolling Stones, rock and roll, or entertainment in general, and became a part of 20th century world history.

why the heck would you yell sit down after hours and hours of waiting are freaking kidding me!!!!!!!!!!!!!