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dcba
For R and others a little link :
[www.businessinsider.com]

Try not to cry looking at the maps and remember California's no worse than the rest of the country. And in terms of intellectual openness and literacy it's far above the rest

Also true! And yes I do live in the SF Bay Area!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-02-24 03:59 by No Expectations.

What is the basis of this thread? An article in the Sunday paper about rock Music from the 70's? That's more than just a little bit of a stretch.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2011-02-24 04:26 by ryanpow.

Is New York stuck in the 80's? Is London stuck in the 60's....Is Europe stuck in never,never land? Yet another odd thread started from across the pond.

"It's just some friends of mine and they're busting down the door"

yes, they are still into hairy pussy.

Where are you from, Wanton Witch?

Rather than being stuck, San Francisco is usually on the cutting edge of things.


plexi

My first contact with San Francisco was in the military. He was Navy from San Francisco and I was Army from the Midwest. I remember him getting annoyed if you called it 'Frisco'. "Man, call it San Francisco, or The City." Whatever.

I first went there in 1975. I went to Golden Gate Park and it was filled with hippies. I was thinking maybe they hadn't heard the 60s ended. It's almost like hippies are an industry there.

But it's really a great city. A great walking city. I actually like its 50s roots better, like Ferlinghetti's City Lights Bookstore and that whole district.

Now that I'm an L.A. resident there's supposed to be a rivalry between the two cities. One writer summed it up by saying that people in San Francisco think of people in L.A. all the time, and people in L.A. never give San Francisco a second thought.

And as for the guy who thinks the U.S. wants to get rid of California, I'd love to know where he's from. Times are indeed bad in California, as they are for ALL States. I'm one of those that wishes we could secede from the other 49. We prop up a lot of loser states in the South with the tax dollars we give to the Federal government. We grow our own food. We have great ports. Great weather. And San Bernardino went wild at the first Rolling Stones concert in the U.S. in 1964.

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24FPS
As for the guy who thinks the U.S. wants to get rid of California, I'd love to know where he's from. Times are indeed bad in California, as they are for ALL States. I'm one of those that wishes we could secede from the other 49. We prop up a lot of loser states in the South with the tax dollars we give to the Federal government. We grow our own food. We have great ports. Great weather

Also don't forget to add - Great Wine, Beautiful Women (home to Hollywood/acting and the modeling industry, some very nice beaches, Great ski-ing 2 hours from LA, the Desert (Palm Springs - 2 hour drive), No snow to fight (like a lot of the rest of the country - storm EVERY few days in most places it seems). California may not be nirvana , but it sure beats most of the deep South (where a lot of Fathers are also their own brothers and their IQ hardly tops their shoe size). Compared to most of the rest of the troubled, not-very-bright hillbilly country I'll take California ANY TIME !!!

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CrissCrossMind

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24FPS
As for the guy who thinks the U.S. wants to get rid of California, I'd love to know where he's from. Times are indeed bad in California, as they are for ALL States. I'm one of those that wishes we could secede from the other 49. We prop up a lot of loser states in the South with the tax dollars we give to the Federal government. We grow our own food. We have great ports. Great weather

California may not be nirvana , but it sure beats most of the deep South (where a lot of Fathers are also their own brothers and their IQ hardly tops their shoe size). Compared to most of the rest of the troubled, not-very-bright hillbilly country I'll take California ANY TIME !!!

And you actually believe that Southern stereotype? Pretty simple-minded on your part. Your mind is pretty criss-crossed.

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timbernardis
Where are you from, Wanton Witch?

Rather than being stuck, San Francisco is usually on the cutting edge of things.


plexi

Cutting edge of things? They can't even cut butter. After living here for close to 5 years, I think it's the smugness that bothers me. The "only in San Francisco can you do this" mentality. For instance, after a gig I played, somebody lit up a joint in the back of a car and pontificated "Only in SF can you smoke a joint in a car." I said, "Well, no, I did that years ago in LA." Of course that went over like a led zeppelin. People in SF think they're really cool when in actuality they're no cooler than anybody else. I've met nicer people in Austin. And Los Angeles always had better bands than SF ever did.

Like I wrote before - it's just a joke.
Although when I read their paper online I get the impression that....

Well, I grew up in Northern Cal, so I was there during the 70s. The last time I visited SF was 4 yrs ago (briefly).

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tomk
And you actually believe that Southern stereotype? Pretty simple-minded on your part. Your mind is pretty criss-crossed.

Believe the STEREOTYPE? Naw, I'm into deeper verification than just some jive ass sh*t blowin' in the wind from some big mouth, know - nothin' radio yapper. Have done numerous, more than many drives through the deep South. From New Orleans (Great town), thru Mississippi (stopped at a steakhouse in Jackson. Tons of guys in white shirts and black ties with their bibles - spooky vibe - blind faith, speaking in tongues - or was it just bad grammar? Both my Girl Friend and I were Freaking out a bit - it was OBVIOUS these people were a bit misguided, a bit too gullible), to Memphis (Great town), Orlando (actually started in Miami/Key West - great towns/places) to New Orleans - always great (more spooky stuff - the Panhandle - not the center of Genius thinking). Atlanta to New Orleans. Atlanta, whoa (super spooky stuff) !!! Through South Carolina - ground zero for sure (but then what would you call Alabama? Ground Zero Dos?).

Crissed crossed? I think hanging poor, innocent black people from trees (AKA Lynching) because of the color of their skin is pretty f*cked up, sick, criss cross behavior, don't you? Only ended half a century ago (by force and the laws) in the Deep South (is lynching a Stereotype too?). Somethings are just too hot to slither away from.... I'm not saying the people aren't nice, they're super nice (but just not that bright or sophisticated - Nascar? Anti Gay? Anti - Anybody not like them? Red States when the party is all and ONLY about the top 2% super richest in the land, Military, and super big business? (has nothing to do with 99.9% of them) Religious extremists (Christians, born again) That's pretty effing simple minded criss cross thinking(?) if you ask me... (but it's just all IMHO anyway. With that said it is my experiences and it is historically factual. Sorry but I didn't invent the behavior or beliefs - I believe in "live and let Live" personally. But that's a liberal concept not too popular down south)

Ladies & Gentlemen let me introduce you to "Smugness Personified" in the form of "Criss Cross Mind"! Although I've never lived there, my mother did and summed it up years ago, saying, "the earth shifted and the nuts rolled out".

Were you born morally superior or did you have to move to San Francisco to become better than an entire region of the country?

As much as I don't want to even open the opportunity to debate your arrogance/smugness, I will go out on a limb and speak on behalf of many southerners, saying that we are more than happy to live and let live (actually a Christian belief you could discover if you weren't so afraid of the Bible - also adopted by nearly all Libertarians) if only arrogant, moral supremacists would agree to do the same.

Peace,
Mr DJA


PS: In advance, I apologize if I have offended anyone with this post. I have re-read it and hope that no one, including Criss Cross Mind, takes any direct offense. I try to avoid the political conversations on the board (though I find them interesting to read) but I was offended by this one attacking me and my neighbors and just wanted to take a moment to say a few words. Again, sorry in advance, sometimes things just need to be said.

TOMK - My particular feeling about the South is complex. I actually lived there as a teenager, and have spent time in many Southern states. I stayed in Mobile, Alabama for a couple weeks after Hurricane Katrina, and saw first hand the devastation in New Orleans, Slidell and surrounding areas within a week of the disaster. The South is the first and only time I heard someone use the term 'nigra'. The word had the horror of the plantation all over it.

That being said, I interacted with black people in the south more than I did in the North, where segregation was more subtle. In the South I witnessed voters (Dixiecrats) abandon the Democratic Party when Johnson gave Black Americans the rights they should have had all along. Those Dixiecrats swarmed into the Republican Party, who accepted these racists with open arms.

As recently as a few years ago someone was visiting L.A. from McComb, Mississippi. I asked them how things were in McComb, and they said it was okay, except for the 'sand niggers'. They were referring to Indians (the country) who owned a few hotels in the area. I was not only shocked by the reference, but that they thought I would think nothing of their blatant racism.

As long as I'm mentioning racism, the U.K. chimed in a couple years ago when I was at an outdoor cafe in Amsterdam. (Near where Chet Baker fell out the window to his death). A charming, older British man and wife were sitting there and I struck up a conversation. I have many close Indian (once again, the country) friends and I was going to go visit some in London. I asked them how they felt about Indians in England, and this sweet couple suddenly turned virulent. "The Indians aren't the problem, it's the damn PACKIES!"

I'm indebted to the South I knew for an introduction to the blues. I saw the original Allman Brothers in Atlanta, and got turned on to Johnny Winter and T-Bone Walker. Fantastic. But I'm tired of trying to move forward in America and you have states like South Carolina denying that slavery was the cause of the Civil War, when their own documents from the 1860s state that it was the reason. I'm tired of 'Pride in the Confederacy'. They were traitors who lost a war with America. Over slavery.

That being said, I love Little Rock, Arkansas. I lived two years in Atlanta and have fond memories. Tennessee girls have the sweetest accents. But I'm tired of them trying to pull us back to a time that never existed. I noticed the minute the GOTeaParty got in power in Congress they started trying to pass anti-abortion laws. We need jobs, not that crap.

As a southerner, I usually ignore this kinda crap - Beverly Hillbillies, Dukes of Hazzard, "Southern Man",etc.. But I gotta say stereotyping southerners is no more accurate than any other stereotype.

For sure, there are some redneck hick types around, but lots of well-educated, (mostly) reasonable people too.

I don't come on here and label people from any other area, race, religion, etc. although I'm sure ALL of us are guilty of this at some time in some shape, form, or fashion.

I could give examples but why imflame things.

Proud Southerner!

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mr_dja
Were you born morally superior or did you have to move to San Francisco to become better than an entire region of the country?

Doesn't sound like the Bay Area I know. Just because some might feel superior to others based on where they live doesn't mean everyone does. Regional pride is not limited to the Bay Area or California as a whole...

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ChrisM

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mr_dja
Were you born morally superior or did you have to move to San Francisco to become better than an entire region of the country?

Doesn't sound like the Bay Area I know. Just because some might feel superior to others based on where they live doesn't mean everyone does. Regional pride is not limited to the Bay Area or California as a whole...

Regional pride is a sweet topping for denial, it's prevalent everywhere.
I know a guy who was NYC this and NYC that for 50 years, never traveled. His brother passed away in Santa Barbara, he went out to tend to all the business, and
moved there within 3 months....now all he talks about is how much he hates NY.

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ChrisM

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mr_dja
Were you born morally superior or did you have to move to San Francisco to become better than an entire region of the country?

Doesn't sound like the Bay Area I know. Just because some might feel superior to others based on where they live doesn't mean everyone does. Regional pride is not limited to the Bay Area or California as a whole...

Exactly Chris. Everybody should be proud of where they live....If not,what the hell are you doing living there?

"It's just some friends of mine and they're busting down the door"

i have a brother who lives (by choice) in bismarck, nd and swears it's heaven on earth. and this is a guy, like me, who's lived all over the world. just goes to show you...

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ChrisM
California along with most states in the union are in dire financial straits. It's not a question s of people not paying property taxes, it's a case of spending more money that is being taking in along with the small matter of the financial meltdown that drained the coffers of many state governments. So despite 'R's and mickscarey's thoughtful and intelligent commentary on this matter California is in the same situation as many states and countries in the world right now.

California, like their 'progressive' brethren in Illinois and Conneticut are in a much worse "situation than many states and countries in the world right now" because they won't deal realistically with the problems they have. Think Greece. They just keep spending and spending and going back to the taxpayer for more. Hell, I live in Michigan where we've been scraping the bottom of the barrel for a decade now. We're used it and we finally elected people who are going to legitimately deal with it. Numerous other states have done the same but not so California. Their attitude is that the Federal gov't will bail them out which means, while my neighbors and I are trying to keep heart and soul together here, we are also expected to prop up the "Golden State." In return we are dismissed as provincial rubes.

As mentioned, the 'Golden State', when times were good, gave more to the Federal Government than it got back, with that money going to less productive states. The boom of the 1990s was fueld by California's Silicon Valley. And although we are going through some hard times, mostly caused by the idiotic Real Estate bubble of the 2000s, we will deal with our problems and come out okay. It's our very openness to new ideas that will help us guide whatever the next wave in American innnovation is. And anyone who thinks California is a state of 'fruits and nuts' should know that more Californians gave their lives in Iraq and Afghanistan than any other state. It's a great social incubator out here, with millions of hard working people. And the medical marijuana is fantastic.


Thank you, for your wine, California...................



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-02-25 04:32 by 24FPS.

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CrissCrossMind

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tomk
And you actually believe that Southern stereotype? Pretty simple-minded on your part. Your mind is pretty criss-crossed.

Believe the STEREOTYPE? Naw, I'm into deeper verification than just some jive ass sh*t blowin' in the wind from some big mouth, know - nothin' radio yapper. Have done numerous, more than many drives through the deep South. From New Orleans (Great town), thru Mississippi (stopped at a steakhouse in Jackson. Tons of guys in white shirts and black ties with their bibles - spooky vibe - blind faith, speaking in tongues - or was it just bad grammar? Both my Girl Friend and I were Freaking out a bit - it was OBVIOUS these people were a bit misguided, a bit too gullible), to Memphis (Great town), Orlando (actually started in Miami/Key West - great towns/places) to New Orleans - always great (more spooky stuff - the Panhandle - not the center of Genius thinking). Atlanta to New Orleans. Atlanta, whoa (super spooky stuff) !!! Through South Carolina - ground zero for sure (but then what would you call Alabama? Ground Zero Dos?).

Crissed crossed? I think hanging poor, innocent black people from trees (AKA Lynching) because of the color of their skin is pretty f*cked up, sick, criss cross behavior, don't you? Only ended half a century ago (by force and the laws) in the Deep South (is lynching a Stereotype too?). Somethings are just too hot to slither away from.... I'm not saying the people aren't nice, they're super nice (but just not that bright or sophisticated - Nascar? Anti Gay? Anti - Anybody not like them? Red States when the party is all and ONLY about the top 2% super richest in the land, Military, and super big business? (has nothing to do with 99.9% of them) Religious extremists (Christians, born again) That's pretty effing simple minded criss cross thinking(?) if you ask me... (but it's just all IMHO anyway. With that said it is my experiences and it is historically factual. Sorry but I didn't invent the behavior or beliefs - I believe in "live and let Live" personally. But that's a liberal concept not too popular down south)

keith always looks so disheveled

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CrissCrossMind

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24FPS
As for the guy who thinks the U.S. wants to get rid of California, I'd love to know where he's from. Times are indeed bad in California, as they are for ALL States. I'm one of those that wishes we could secede from the other 49. We prop up a lot of loser states in the South with the tax dollars we give to the Federal government. We grow our own food. We have great ports. Great weather

Also don't forget to add - Great Wine, Beautiful Women (home to Hollywood/acting and the modeling industry, some very nice beaches, Great ski-ing 2 hours from LA, the Desert (Palm Springs - 2 hour drive), No snow to fight (like a lot of the rest of the country - storm EVERY few days in most places it seems). California may not be nirvana , but it sure beats most of the deep South (where a lot of Fathers are also their own brothers and their IQ hardly tops their shoe size). Compared to most of the rest of the troubled, not-very-bright hillbilly country I'll take California ANY TIME !!!

No need to get snobby or elitist about this.


plexi

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tomk


Cutting edge of things? They can't even cut butter. After living here for close to 5 years, I think it's the smugness that bothers me. The "only in San Francisco can you do this" mentality. For instance, after a gig I played, somebody lit up a joint in the back of a car and pontificated "Only in SF can you smoke a joint in a car." I said, "Well, no, I did that years ago in LA." Of course that went over like a led zeppelin. People in SF think they're really cool when in actuality they're no cooler than anybody else. I've met nicer people in Austin. And Los Angeles always had better bands than SF ever did.

So, so true!

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BluzDude

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tomk


Cutting edge of things? They can't even cut butter. After living here for close to 5 years, I think it's the smugness that bothers me. The "only in San Francisco can you do this" mentality. For instance, after a gig I played, somebody lit up a joint in the back of a car and pontificated "Only in SF can you smoke a joint in a car." I said, "Well, no, I did that years ago in LA." Of course that went over like a led zeppelin. People in SF think they're really cool when in actuality they're no cooler than anybody else. I've met nicer people in Austin. And Los Angeles always had better bands than SF ever did.

So, so true!

Yeah, I saw a lot of that when I lived in SF.
Herb Caen (columnist) tried in vain to make SF the center of the universe,
and every other sentence blaring out of KFOG (radio station) was "from the
greatest city in the world" blah blah blah..... I think it's a nice city, but it wouldn't make my top 30 in the world, of the ones I have been to.

First off, I'm from LA, not SF (but I think SF is one of America's top 5 cities along with New Orleans, Miami, NYC, and Washington DC, all for different reasons of course. Next 5 - Chicago, Memphis, Seattle, Portland, Or.,Honolulu. Honorable Mention - San Diego, Santa Fe, Austin, Boston, St. Louis). I get accused of being neg on the Deep South when others before me said California should go back to being part of Mexico? Who wrote the first not so nice comment? R? Not me (I'm just sticking up for my state). On top of that I just can't agree with about 90% of the idea's that come out of the South these days.... sorry if anybody took it the wrong way, it's nothing personal.... (I think all the Southerners on IORR are fine people - people like Elmo Lewis and Lukester, great guys IMHO)

With that said I'm not really nuts about America in general (including California) I much prefer Europe and it's higher level of the average persons thinking/brain power. America's falling apart and the majority of it's citizens don't even truly understand why (and think everything will repair itself - WRONG). A country has to be smart or it can't survive in the long run.... I don't see America surviving in a 1950's to 1980's model. It WILL survive (but at more of a Bangladesh level, of course this will take some time but I wouldn't want to be around the USA in 2040 or 2050. That will be bomb shelter time, when the sh*t finally REALLY hits the fan).

A mixture of massive anger, ignorance, loaded guns, drugged up brains, and everybody blaming everyone else... Think Pirates off the Somalia Coast only with a lot more anger (and a lot more fire power) - would not want to be there.

WHEN YOU GOT NOTHIN' YOU GOT NOTHING TO LOSE - Bob Dylan

Everyone can judge for themselves - Peace Pipe from Le Mind

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R

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ChrisM
California along with most states in the union are in dire financial straits. It's not a question s of people not paying property taxes, it's a case of spending more money that is being taking in along with the small matter of the financial meltdown that drained the coffers of many state governments. So despite 'R's and mickscarey's thoughtful and intelligent commentary on this matter California is in the same situation as many states and countries in the world right now.

California, like their 'progressive' brethren in Illinois and Conneticut are in a much worse "situation than many states and countries in the world right now" because they won't deal realistically with the problems they have. Think Greece. They just keep spending and spending and going back to the taxpayer for more. Hell, I live in Michigan where we've been scraping the bottom of the barrel for a decade now. We're used it and we finally elected people who are going to legitimately deal with it. Numerous other states have done the same but not so California. Their attitude is that the Federal gov't will bail them out which means, while my neighbors and I are trying to keep heart and soul together here, we are also expected to prop up the "Golden State." In return we are dismissed as provincial rubes.

LOL. I forgot to mention that the useless 'progressive' governor we recently shed here in Michigan (who spent 8 years driving the state into the ditch) is now teaching at UCLA Berkeley. How apropos.

a whole lotta hatred goin' on

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tomk

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timbernardis
Where are you from, Wanton Witch?

Rather than being stuck, San Francisco is usually on the cutting edge of things.


plexi

Cutting edge of things? They can't even cut butter. After living here for close to 5 years, I think it's the smugness that bothers me. The "only in San Francisco can you do this" mentality. For instance, after a gig I played, somebody lit up a joint in the back of a car and pontificated "Only in SF can you smoke a joint in a car." I said, "Well, no, I did that years ago in LA." Of course that went over like a led zeppelin. People in SF think they're really cool when in actuality they're no cooler than anybody else. I've met nicer people in Austin. And Los Angeles always had better bands than SF ever did.

Wow,a whole 5 years huh,I've lived here for 45. I have never experineced anything like what you have talked about, Here's a thought.Maybe your the problem....and I'll take The City over LA any @#$%& day.

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R
California, like their 'progressive' brethren in Illinois and Conneticut are in a much worse "situation than many states and countries in the world right now" because they won't deal realistically with the problems they have. Think Greece. They just keep spending and spending and going back to the taxpayer for more. Hell, I live in Michigan where we've been scraping the bottom of the barrel for a decade now. We're used it and we finally elected people who are going to legitimately deal with it. Numerous other states have done the same but not so California. Their attitude is that the Federal gov't will bail them out which means, while my neighbors and I are trying to keep heart and soul together here, we are also expected to prop up the "Golden State." In return we are dismissed as provincial rubes.

I find your comments interesting in light of the fact the auto industry, arguably Michigan's largest industry, has been bailed out and subsidized by the Federal Government more than once. Is this not 'propping up' Michigan? Also to say nothing is being done to address California's budget woes is ill informed and nothing short of apocryphal. You have lumped the entire state and it's population into one neat pigeon hole that fits your Weltanshaunung but does not match up with reality. There seems to be deeper underlying issues at play here. I hope you will find the moral fibre to address them...