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i suppose you're right in general , but not about the fifth member, from beggars on there was really no fifth member until sticky exploded on the scene .( with a new guitarist)
but what strikes me in particular is the unique rhythm style MT plays on one of his first tracks live with me which shows a completely different approach to support keiths playing and surely got him the gig.
i dont agree with people that say he is no rhythm player, that is a masterpiece.
BTW even keith thought they'd have two ,two and a half years and that was in the early sixties!
Imo if Taylor would have stayed,the Stones would have kicked as until at least 1981.(Black & Blue and Some Girls life on stage) By the time they released Some Girls they where running out of inspiration, and started to be a parody on their own style and image.
You should read Jack Bruce,"composing himself",chapter 11.
In 81 Ronnie was fooling around on-stage drunk. If I remember well Mick was almost ready to kick him out.
A pity Micks solo career didn't work.I never understood why he returned to the Stones.
[thepowergoats.com]
I think you are dead right, riverrat. Taylor is a musician primarily, and not a rock star. In John Mayall's Bluesbreakers he was able to keep a low profile, and musically the Bluesbreakers were perhaps less in keeping with contemporary rock, and more about indulging in those blues (and occasionally jazz) influences. I think it's true that Taylor was one of a breed of players, like Clapton, Green, Page, etc. but i wouldn't quite agree with Doxa's view that any of those blues influenced players would have fitted in equally as well. I believe Taylor has an individual style of playing, even if those initial blues influences are the same, and for me his playing is a little less dry than, certainly, Clapton and Green (a little more jazzy too). I don't doubt there may have been a little jealousy on the part of Keith too, which may have made things uncomfortable. Ultimately, i do think Taylor's decision to leave was down to the fact that Mick and Keith, especially, were the dominant personalities, whether it was relating to songwriting credits, or just generally Taylor's feeling part of the group in social terms, Taylor just struggled to fit in. He is a far more sensitive character, i believe, than the rest of the Stones. He may have shared Bill and Charlie's more passive personality traits, but i believe those two were much stronger individuals, where the rigours of being a rock star, was concerned.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-01-02 10:00 by Edward Twining.
Yeah, but avoid at all costs checking out that abysmal music Taylor and Bruce did right after Mick left the Stones. No wonder he dropped out of circulation for a few years.
Does your time machine go backward as well? I would like to see the 1969 & 1972 tours.
So are the Keith Richards and Ron Wood of 1974. They aren't coming back either, neither are the 1990 or 2002 versions. Yet dozens here still pine for a new tour.
Unfortunately it was not just drunk. It was far worse.
As Wood states it, Stu called the studio where The Small Faces where rehearsing to ask if Ronnie would join the Stones. They answered that Ronnie Lane would not leave the Small Faces.
It sounds unbelievable as Lane wasn't a pro guitarist.
Mathijs
If that call took place it must have took place during Quiet Melon sessions towards the end of May 1969.
Lucky error imo, as we all enjoyed the Taylor era.
Talk about your favorite band.
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Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
alimente
()
Date: December 31, 2010 16:37
Well, to pursue msically more demanding solo projects there was plenty of time even in the 70s as a Rolling Stones member - relatively short tours, and no excessive studio sessions either. So he could have stayed and having fun with solo projects at the same time. I am pretty sure that if he had envisioned the Stones as the money-making machine the band became in the years to follow, he would have stayed. He may have been bored or unsatisfied with this and that, but I am sure he left because he thought the Stones were more or less finished anyways.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
loog droog
()
Date: December 31, 2010 17:08
The thing that I always wonder is, if Mick T. hadn't left when he did (just as the band was about to start sessions for the next album) and the Stones didn't have to go through the whole audition-a-new-guitarist scene, would the record that became Black and Blue have been completed and released before the '75 tour, since they usually hit the road with new product?
I think it would have really changed the dynamic of the '75 shows to have heard "Hot Stuff" (or maybe "Worried About You" ) a year (or six) earlier.
Perhaps with Taylor they would have even played "Time Waits For No One" which got a lot of airplay on the FM Rock stations when IORR came out.
As far as his regrets, it has to be said that no one, I mean NO ONE back then ever imagined that the Stones would be Rolling this long, and that there could be another tour in 2011. That would have been dismissed as a joke, something impossible.
I think it would have really changed the dynamic of the '75 shows to have heard "Hot Stuff" (or maybe "Worried About You" ) a year (or six) earlier.
Perhaps with Taylor they would have even played "Time Waits For No One" which got a lot of airplay on the FM Rock stations when IORR came out.
As far as his regrets, it has to be said that no one, I mean NO ONE back then ever imagined that the Stones would be Rolling this long, and that there could be another tour in 2011. That would have been dismissed as a joke, something impossible.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
mckalk
()
Date: January 1, 2011 14:54
Maybe he would have stayed if he had been able to look into the proverbial crystal ball and seen the economic future of the boys. Stones have not exactly been output juggernauts over the last 35 years,so he would have had plenty of time to pursue side projects while waiting for occassional tours and albums.
There was no blue print for rock and rollers working at social security age and playing massive multi media tours, so how could he have regrets? Sounds like he was bored with the Stones and wanted to pursue other avenues, but it has to be a little like losing a winning lottery ticket. If people are honest they will tell you they do want more money.
There was no blue print for rock and rollers working at social security age and playing massive multi media tours, so how could he have regrets? Sounds like he was bored with the Stones and wanted to pursue other avenues, but it has to be a little like losing a winning lottery ticket. If people are honest they will tell you they do want more money.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
riverrat
()
Date: January 1, 2011 18:18
I'm sure it saved his life. The drugs were in such heavy use and musicians were dropping like flies back then. He could have been the next casualty.
He probably felt like an outsider in the Stones and didn't make a "love connection" with Keith, who can make anyone's life miserable if he's not FOR you. I think MJ appreciated his talent and contributions, and he's the one who said how quickly and easily MT's recording on Plundered My Soul went in the studio.
MT's a more intellectual blues musician, as he said in his interview, and the Stones just fly by the seat of their pants and feel the music and do retakes ad infinitum, trial and error, until they find what they're looking for. Maybe that style of song writing and recording drove Mick nuts. Obviously, he wasn't happy. But then again, has he been happy since?? We all have to live and learn. At least he's alive. He has certainly left a legacy. I believe he did what he felt he had to do at that time. God bless him to find Peace in HIS soul.
He probably felt like an outsider in the Stones and didn't make a "love connection" with Keith, who can make anyone's life miserable if he's not FOR you. I think MJ appreciated his talent and contributions, and he's the one who said how quickly and easily MT's recording on Plundered My Soul went in the studio.
MT's a more intellectual blues musician, as he said in his interview, and the Stones just fly by the seat of their pants and feel the music and do retakes ad infinitum, trial and error, until they find what they're looking for. Maybe that style of song writing and recording drove Mick nuts. Obviously, he wasn't happy. But then again, has he been happy since?? We all have to live and learn. At least he's alive. He has certainly left a legacy. I believe he did what he felt he had to do at that time. God bless him to find Peace in HIS soul.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Shawn20
()
Date: January 1, 2011 18:18
Taylor was probably bored with the Stones - however, Jagger stated Taylor would have had the time to pursue solo interests. He didn't have to quit to indulge his expanding tastes. Taylor might not regret it, but I do. Ronnie Wood may have helped the Stones with his amiable nature and his what me worry attitude, but he left his guitar skills at the door. Wood defenders will point to his guitar work on the 78 and 81 tours, but I think he hit his Rolling Stones' stride with the 89 tour.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
straycatblues73
()
Date: January 1, 2011 18:29
Quote
Doxa
Thanks kleermaker for that youtube interview!
Some interesting points there. The first time I hear him saying he had "always liked" them and speaking of their early blues-cover period. That is nice to hear. It is also highly interesting the way he says how much he learned of "different aspects of music and or recording" during his time with The Stones. It could be very well that he really was an amateur as far as making records go. He basically was a live musician, and the experiences he had with Mayall in a studio, might not have helped much. I guess those sessions were, like most blues recordings, just one take live at the studio kind of things. And this might the reason reason why Keith once claimed that Taylor is "useless in studio". He surely wasn't accustomed to the nerve-taking waiting to get the 'right' feel or the sound or the take The Stones, especially Keith, were accustomed at those times. This is also something to do with him finding them being such a sloppy band but still making wonderful records. The way The Stones worked surely was a new world for him.
When Taylor says that Mick and Keith had an unique way to write, I think he also refers - not just to blues origins - to the recording techniques. They all seemed to go hand in hand in those days. Rememer, Keith saw his profession primaly as "making records" at the time and that was a big and long process. It started perhaps from listening authentic blues and c&w, making guitar experiments, song sketches, then arranging, changing, deveoloping them in the studio, and ending up mixing the stuff, etc. This method - that also included the pleasure and privilege to spend a lot of useless hours in the expensive studio - to work surely was news to Taylor at the time. He was wittnessing Mick and Keith in their creative peak - a peak that was partly only possible having the luxury of the status and the means they had at the time. I'm with teh poster who says that any capable blues guitarist at the time could have done the contribution he did in most of the classical pieces the Stones were then producing, such as "Honky Tonk Women", "Brown Sugar", etc. All in all, the quality of the golden period from BEGGARS to EXILE does not change whoever the 'fifth' Stone in studio is. As far as the standard of quality goes one can not even notice the band changing one member.
Like Keith, I would say that the true Mick Taylor contribution, his greatness and especially uniqueness as a guitar player is to be heard live. That's was the realm where Taylor's importance and great musicianship was really shown to the Stones sound. But this does not mean that I claim that Taylor was not significiant in studio as well, of course he was - but the difference of his role within the band and making contribution to their sound was such a huge one between studio and live. One can listen almost any studio version of the song and compare it to its live version to see it. But of course, this has much to do the band thinking the songs with a different approach when recorded in studio and when played live - even though those two aspects came closer each other as the years go by.
But I am sure that ever pragmatic Jagger loved the way Taylor worked not just on stage but in studio as well. Namely, as some technician once has said, Taylor always did his part just in one or two takes. He was very quick and didn't make mistakes. A pro guy.
- Doxa
i suppose you're right in general , but not about the fifth member, from beggars on there was really no fifth member until sticky exploded on the scene .( with a new guitarist)
but what strikes me in particular is the unique rhythm style MT plays on one of his first tracks live with me which shows a completely different approach to support keiths playing and surely got him the gig.
i dont agree with people that say he is no rhythm player, that is a masterpiece.
BTW even keith thought they'd have two ,two and a half years and that was in the early sixties!
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Anonymous User
()
Date: January 1, 2011 19:18
Quote
loog droog
The thing that I always wonder is, if Mick T. hadn't left when he did (just as the band was about to start sessions for the next album) and the Stones didn't have to go through the whole audition-a-new-guitarist scene, would the record that became Black and Blue have been completed and released before the '75 tour, since they usually hit the road with new product?
I think it would have really changed the dynamic of the '75 shows to have heard "Hot Stuff" (or maybe "Worried About You" ) a year (or six) earlier.
Perhaps with Taylor they would have even played "Time Waits For No One" which got a lot of airplay on the FM Rock stations when IORR came out.
As far as his regrets, it has to be said that no one, I mean NO ONE back then ever imagined that the Stones would be Rolling this long, and that there could be another tour in 2011. That would have been dismissed as a joke, something impossible.
Imo if Taylor would have stayed,the Stones would have kicked as until at least 1981.(Black & Blue and Some Girls life on stage) By the time they released Some Girls they where running out of inspiration, and started to be a parody on their own style and image.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Anonymous User
()
Date: January 1, 2011 20:03
Quote
His Majesty
Leaving the band was the right thing to do for a number of reasons, staying alive being one. That's good survival instincts.
You should read Jack Bruce,"composing himself",chapter 11.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
mtaylor
()
Date: January 1, 2011 21:03
Quote
Shawn20
Taylor was probably bored with the Stones - however, Jagger stated Taylor would have had the time to pursue solo interests. He didn't have to quit to indulge his expanding tastes. Taylor might not regret it, but I do. Ronnie Wood may have helped the Stones with his amiable nature and his what me worry attitude, but he left his guitar skills at the door. Wood defenders will point to his guitar work on the 78 and 81 tours, but I think he hit his Rolling Stones' stride with the 89 tour.
In 81 Ronnie was fooling around on-stage drunk. If I remember well Mick was almost ready to kick him out.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Anonymous User
()
Date: January 1, 2011 21:14
Quote
mtaylorQuote
Shawn20
Taylor was probably bored with the Stones - however, Jagger stated Taylor would have had the time to pursue solo interests. He didn't have to quit to indulge his expanding tastes. Taylor might not regret it, but I do. Ronnie Wood may have helped the Stones with his amiable nature and his what me worry attitude, but he left his guitar skills at the door. Wood defenders will point to his guitar work on the 78 and 81 tours, but I think he hit his Rolling Stones' stride with the 89 tour.
In 81 Ronnie was fooling around on-stage drunk. If I remember well Mick was almost ready to kick him out.
A pity Micks solo career didn't work.I never understood why he returned to the Stones.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
jamesfdouglas
()
Date: January 1, 2011 22:32
I feel the same way, AND Keith was very, very good on this tour too still. Sure the sound was glossier, but the actual playing was very, very cool. Their guitars still had the power to excite 1n 89/90.Quote
Shawn20
...but I think he hit his Rolling Stones' stride with the 89 tour.
[thepowergoats.com]
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Midnight Toker
()
Date: January 2, 2011 01:54
Only his accountant and manager are pissed that he quit. Goodbye income. Deep down, you know MT has his regrets. He can't afford to hire someone to mow the lawn at his modest English home and clean off the moss on the turd bucket car parked in his driveway. MT blew it but I am thankful to have studied his style of playing and I love his musicianship and his contributions on all of the Stones recordings. Those were the best albums that the boys ever recorded.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Edward Twining
()
Date: January 2, 2011 09:56
Quote
riverrat
I'm sure it saved his life. The drugs were in such heavy use and musicians were dropping like flies back then. He could have been the next casualty.
He probably felt like an outsider in the Stones and didn't make a "love connection" with Keith, who can make anyone's life miserable if he's not FOR you. I think MJ appreciated his talent and contributions, and he's the one who said how quickly and easily MT's recording on Plundered My Soul went in the studio.
MT's a more intellectual blues musician, as he said in his interview, and the Stones just fly by the seat of their pants and feel the music and do retakes ad infinitum, trial and error, until they find what they're looking for. Maybe that style of song writing and recording drove Mick nuts. Obviously, he wasn't happy. But then again, has he been happy since?? We all have to live and learn. At least he's alive. He has certainly left a legacy. I believe he did what he felt he had to do at that time. God bless him to find Peace in HIS soul.
I think you are dead right, riverrat. Taylor is a musician primarily, and not a rock star. In John Mayall's Bluesbreakers he was able to keep a low profile, and musically the Bluesbreakers were perhaps less in keeping with contemporary rock, and more about indulging in those blues (and occasionally jazz) influences. I think it's true that Taylor was one of a breed of players, like Clapton, Green, Page, etc. but i wouldn't quite agree with Doxa's view that any of those blues influenced players would have fitted in equally as well. I believe Taylor has an individual style of playing, even if those initial blues influences are the same, and for me his playing is a little less dry than, certainly, Clapton and Green (a little more jazzy too). I don't doubt there may have been a little jealousy on the part of Keith too, which may have made things uncomfortable. Ultimately, i do think Taylor's decision to leave was down to the fact that Mick and Keith, especially, were the dominant personalities, whether it was relating to songwriting credits, or just generally Taylor's feeling part of the group in social terms, Taylor just struggled to fit in. He is a far more sensitive character, i believe, than the rest of the Stones. He may have shared Bill and Charlie's more passive personality traits, but i believe those two were much stronger individuals, where the rigours of being a rock star, was concerned.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-01-02 10:00 by Edward Twining.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Doxa
()
Date: January 2, 2011 13:27
Edward, to be exact, I didn't claim that any of those British blues guitar players could have fit so well as Taylor did. No, I think, Taylor was perfect, and I don't think they could have had any better choice. For many reasons.
First of all, it is, of course, Taylor's own idiosyncratic and unique sound that enrichened the Stones sound perfectly, especially live. The Stones were extremely lucky to have that particular ace there. In live surroundings it is a necessary elemnet in creating the sound of the "greatest rock and roll band in the world". But that was not the case in studio, which in those days lived under the rules and guidance of its own.
My claim was that it was not exactly Mick Taylor who made the most well-known or profilic songs from his era, like "Honky Tonky Tonk Women", "Brown Sugar", "Wild Horses", ""Tumblin' Dice", "Happy", "Angie", "I's Only R&R", recognizable hits. Almost any decent guitarist availabe would have fitted there when Mick and Keith were in the top of their creativity. Yeah, Taylor would largely shape some of their studio material - "Sway", Moonlight Mile", "Winter" ec. - but I guess having another kind of top guitarist available, those kind of things would have sounded different, or they would have enlargended their musical scope differently. My point is that STICKY FINGERS and EXILE ON MAIN STREET would have been masterpieces even despite having another great guitarist. They would have sounded a bit different, for sure, but still great. My conviction simply is that Mick and Keith just couldn't do wrong in those 1968-72 years. The argument of Taylor's necessity in making STICKY and EXILE a masterpiece would be like, if it is up to Nicky Hopkins that "She's A Rainow", or "Sympathy For the Devil" or Angie" would have sounded so great as they do. Or if any other great pianist could have done it more or less the same, and the songs would be classics as they are. I think the latter is the right answer. In this sense I think Taylor was more like Nicky Hopkins - or Brian Jones to some extent - in the studio. Not like Mick or Keith. What make The Stones unique and different to anyone else, derives from those two guys.
Secondly, I think having such a "new" boy, with no big ego, was also a perfect choice. Having a big name, and an ego to go with it, onboard, such as Clapton or Beck, would have made some internal difficulties to the band chemistry, for sure. Taylor was as good, if not better, than those guys, but without the ego. There was musical differences between him and Mick/Keith but I guess not so bad that that would effected negatively. Quite the contrary. Anyway, as I hinted in my first point, perhaps getting bored with the Stones, or frustrated to the role he had in it, might have been the reason for his depature. Maybe there a bit of ego problems in the end there, too, a'la "I'm too good to waste my time and talent with these spoiled lazy bastards who, any way. will sink soon. Besides I can make better songs by my own now"...
- Doxa
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2011-01-02 13:33 by Doxa.
First of all, it is, of course, Taylor's own idiosyncratic and unique sound that enrichened the Stones sound perfectly, especially live. The Stones were extremely lucky to have that particular ace there. In live surroundings it is a necessary elemnet in creating the sound of the "greatest rock and roll band in the world". But that was not the case in studio, which in those days lived under the rules and guidance of its own.
My claim was that it was not exactly Mick Taylor who made the most well-known or profilic songs from his era, like "Honky Tonky Tonk Women", "Brown Sugar", "Wild Horses", ""Tumblin' Dice", "Happy", "Angie", "I's Only R&R", recognizable hits. Almost any decent guitarist availabe would have fitted there when Mick and Keith were in the top of their creativity. Yeah, Taylor would largely shape some of their studio material - "Sway", Moonlight Mile", "Winter" ec. - but I guess having another kind of top guitarist available, those kind of things would have sounded different, or they would have enlargended their musical scope differently. My point is that STICKY FINGERS and EXILE ON MAIN STREET would have been masterpieces even despite having another great guitarist. They would have sounded a bit different, for sure, but still great. My conviction simply is that Mick and Keith just couldn't do wrong in those 1968-72 years. The argument of Taylor's necessity in making STICKY and EXILE a masterpiece would be like, if it is up to Nicky Hopkins that "She's A Rainow", or "Sympathy For the Devil" or Angie" would have sounded so great as they do. Or if any other great pianist could have done it more or less the same, and the songs would be classics as they are. I think the latter is the right answer. In this sense I think Taylor was more like Nicky Hopkins - or Brian Jones to some extent - in the studio. Not like Mick or Keith. What make The Stones unique and different to anyone else, derives from those two guys.
Secondly, I think having such a "new" boy, with no big ego, was also a perfect choice. Having a big name, and an ego to go with it, onboard, such as Clapton or Beck, would have made some internal difficulties to the band chemistry, for sure. Taylor was as good, if not better, than those guys, but without the ego. There was musical differences between him and Mick/Keith but I guess not so bad that that would effected negatively. Quite the contrary. Anyway, as I hinted in my first point, perhaps getting bored with the Stones, or frustrated to the role he had in it, might have been the reason for his depature. Maybe there a bit of ego problems in the end there, too, a'la "I'm too good to waste my time and talent with these spoiled lazy bastards who, any way. will sink soon. Besides I can make better songs by my own now"...
- Doxa
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2011-01-02 13:33 by Doxa.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
JMARKO
()
Date: January 2, 2011 21:57
Quote
AmsterdamnedQuote
His Majesty
Leaving the band was the right thing to do for a number of reasons, staying alive being one. That's good survival instincts.
You should read Jack Bruce,"composing himself",chapter 11.
Yeah, but avoid at all costs checking out that abysmal music Taylor and Bruce did right after Mick left the Stones. No wonder he dropped out of circulation for a few years.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Mathijs
()
Date: January 3, 2011 00:37
"Sure I've could have done some solo projects aside the Stones, you know, like Bill Wyman did, and like Wood did, and Richards did, and Jagger did, And even Watts did. Oh yeah, even Hopkins did, and Keys did, and MacLagan did. What the hell, even Ian Stewart did solo projects! I could have made some albums, do some guest spots, and in the meantime earn three hundred million dollars with the Stones. Instead I choose to have no carreer at all, sit on the couch and indulge in drugs and alcohol, then do some tour with Dylan, and then sit on the couch again, do lots more drugs and indulge in kentucky Fried Chicken. Now I do my solo show, singing and playing the same lame 10 songs since 1992".
- Mick Taylor, 20111.
- Mick Taylor, 20111.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
dancingmisterd
()
Date: January 3, 2011 00:39
Quote
Mathijs
"Sure I've could have done some solo projects aside the Stones, you know, like Bill Wyman did, and like Wood did, and Richards did, and Jagger did, And even Watts did. Oh yeah, even Hopkins did, and Keys did, and MacLagan did. What the hell, even Ian Stewart did solo projects! I could have made some albums, do some guest spots, and in the meantime earn three hundred million dollars with the Stones. Instead I choose to have no carreer at all, sit on the couch and indulge in drugs and alcohol, then do some tour with Dylan, and then sit on the couch again, do lots more drugs and indulge in kentucky Fried Chicken. Now I do my solo show, singing and playing the same lame 10 songs since 1992".
- Mick Taylor, 20111.
Does your time machine go backward as well? I would like to see the 1969 & 1972 tours.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
riverrat
()
Date: January 3, 2011 02:32
Tell Mick Taylor a lot of Stones fans DO regret his quitting.
It's our loss in the songs Mick and Mick could have continued to write together. Till The Next Goodbye and Time Waits For No One are great songs. They should try writing together again to see what they come up with.
It's our loss in the songs Mick and Mick could have continued to write together. Till The Next Goodbye and Time Waits For No One are great songs. They should try writing together again to see what they come up with.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
mitchflorida
()
Date: January 3, 2011 04:18
The Mick Taylor who existed in 1974 is long gone . and he isn't coming back again.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
71Tele
()
Date: January 3, 2011 04:49
Quote
mitchflorida
The Mick Taylor who existed in 1974 is long gone . and he isn't coming back again.
So are the Keith Richards and Ron Wood of 1974. They aren't coming back either, neither are the 1990 or 2002 versions. Yet dozens here still pine for a new tour.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
71Tele
()
Date: January 3, 2011 04:51
His wife nagged him to leave, he had a serious drug problem, Keith made his life miserable, he was musically frustrated, and it was not at all apparent at the time the band would even be around much longer. Yes, in hindsight it looks like the worst career move in show business history, but give the guy a break already.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-01-03 05:33 by 71Tele.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-01-03 05:33 by 71Tele.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
71Tele
()
Date: January 3, 2011 05:03
Quote
mtaylorQuote
Shawn20
Taylor was probably bored with the Stones - however, Jagger stated Taylor would have had the time to pursue solo interests. He didn't have to quit to indulge his expanding tastes. Taylor might not regret it, but I do. Ronnie Wood may have helped the Stones with his amiable nature and his what me worry attitude, but he left his guitar skills at the door. Wood defenders will point to his guitar work on the 78 and 81 tours, but I think he hit his Rolling Stones' stride with the 89 tour.
In 81 Ronnie was fooling around on-stage drunk. If I remember well Mick was almost ready to kick him out.
Unfortunately it was not just drunk. It was far worse.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Sighunt
()
Date: January 3, 2011 05:40
In the later 1980's, Mick Taylor came to my hometown of Rochester, NY for some music event and stopped into our well known local record store- the House of Guitars. As Taylor's appearance was not well publicized, not very many people showed up or knew who Mick was. Anyway, he signed my copy of Get Yer Ya Yas Out. I asked him point blank: Do you have any regrets about leaving? From my recollection, his comment was something like: "No, it was the right thing to do." I also made a comment to him that I thought that the Stones best work was when he was with them, and he looked away shyly, (most likely embarassed by being in the presence of yet another star struck fan meaning me) and said something to the affect like: "That's awfully kind, but I don't think so." At the time, I was thinking to myself, why on earth would you walk away from the greatest gig in your life? I have realized over the years that as an outsider, it was probably easy for me to think something like that. Like, Mick, how could you disappoint me and ruin my world by leaving the Stones (LOL)? For whatever reason that Mick left, whether it was lack of writing credits, boredom, stifled creativity, etc, etc, the older and wiser me knows that it probably took BALLS for Mick Taylor to walk away from the Stones. My respect for Mick Taylor over the years has grown....
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Edward Twining
()
Date: January 3, 2011 09:27
I had a similar experience, Sighunt, at an autograph signing session after a concert. When i mentioned to Taylor about him leaving the Stones, he just turned his head away. He's naturally shy, that was the impression he gave to me, and i went away wondering how on earth he managed to remain a member of the Stones for as long as he did. I am sure drugs also played a part in him leaving, as well as him not getting along with Mick and Keith. Musical frustrations may have been an issue also, although i don't necessarily think that was primarily the reason. It is not very nice having to do something you no longer enjoy, or gain much pleasure from, however good it may look to outsiders, who don't really know what is going on behind closed doors. I really don't think Taylor owes the Stones or the fans anything, in terms of him having to justify himself. He was a magnificent addition to the Stones sound, the icing on the cake, so to speak. As a guitarist he was incredibly ingenius, in raising the Stones considerable writing and performing talents, to even greater levels. However, like Doxa remarks, it was Mick and Keith who supplied the songs, and had the real talent of purveyors of the muse within the group. They could adapt their song structures on occasion to accommodate Taylor's strengths, which they did on tracks like 'Sway', which meant it was possible to explore those new directions most convincingly. What another guitar player would have brought would have been different, and 'Sticky Fingers', 'Exile On Main Street' etc. would have been different. It is interesting to speculate how different, but it is something we will never know. We do know though, that Taylor was fundamental to certain aspects of their sound, and even on those songs that have less of his imprints on, on occasions. He could be very subtle too, in an extremely effective way, at times. My personal view of Taylor is he has always needed artists of the calibre of the Stones to supply the framework, for which for him to exist. Left to his own devices, he has all the skills of his guitar playing still intact, but no concept in which to apply them. That is why when people talk of his great artistic frustrations, i always feel a little doubtful. Yes, he can most definitely make something brilliant out of what appears pretty modest to begin with, but he needs someone to supply that initial spark. Left to his own devices, Taylor for the most part appears pretty much lacking in inspiration, just going through the motions (sometimes quite impressively) of his blues inspired repertoire. However given a little more motivation, he's still capable of coming up with some truly great things, i believe, even this late in the day.
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2011-01-03 09:41 by Edward Twining.
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2011-01-03 09:41 by Edward Twining.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Doxa
()
Date: January 3, 2011 11:08
Edward, I admit that knowing Taylor's real significance in 1969-1974 Rolling Stones is impossible to do, and the scenario that 'any great British blues guitarist would have brought the needed proferssionalism needed, and the band would have been fine' can not be testified. It is just a matter of imagination. So my take simply is that I take The Stones to be extrimely lucky. They couldn't have been any better during that era. But I would say that if they had chosen someone else than Taylor they would have survived too. Taylor's role was quite fixed - they seemingly knew what kind of guy they needed then, and they - I have understood - gave quite exact orders to look for a suitable guy (a great English blues guitarist). Only two other names I have ever seen mentioned in the context, are Ry Cooder and Ronnie Wood, and both of them seem to be just wishful thinking from their side (and neither of them does meet the criteria needed... ). Cooder claims that The Stones fooled him - gave him the wrong impression that he will be asked to join them, and Ronnie's story is just revisionist bullshit. However, in either case, thanks jesus god that they chose Taylor - there is no even contest.
I also agree with that Edward's observation that Taylor to really shine (to get best out of him) is dependent of the context, of other people' "concept", but it is diffucult to say how much this fact is based on a hindsight. It could have been that by 1974 Mick Taylor - in his mid-twenties still - might have different thoughts in his head at the time. Like he mentioned in Kleermaker's clip, he learned a lot of music and making records with the Stones. Maybe he had his - a bit too big - ideas of artistic independece by then (taking his wife - as rumoured - to whispering something like that to his ears as well). But maybe not. What he actually did after the departure was to join to Jack Bruce Band - and in here he had another given 'concept' and even more bossing boss... To me that sounds like a choice of just "doing something else for a change". A typical musician's choice. The thing that the band and - honestly - its musician's @#$%& (sorry) music sucked big time does not matter. As Taylor says in the clip, he wanted to "develop as a guitar player". As far as I know Taylor was also engaged earlier or at least interest in Mike Oldfield's projecs, and seemingly that kind musical landcapes he had in his mind. And if one actually has that kind of 'progressive' or 'ambitious' plans in one's mind, one can only imagine how frustrating and boring it might have been to mimic within the soap bubbles to "It's Only Rock and Roll"... Unfortunately for him, the times they were changing rapidly, the self-centered 'difficult' musician's music was passe, and for whatever reason, Taylor somehow lost his momentum. By 1979 when he finally got his quite ordinary blues-based solo album released, seemingly no one paid any attention.
But personally I'm with the poster who says that Taylor had indeed "balls" to quit, and I also respect that! There is not many people in the business that can actually go to Mick and Keith that "sorry guys but fvck you, I had enough. I'm off". Seemingly the egos of Mick and Keith hadn't yet quite recovered from that! How dare him????!!!!!><
- Doxa
Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 2011-01-03 11:18 by Doxa.
I also agree with that Edward's observation that Taylor to really shine (to get best out of him) is dependent of the context, of other people' "concept", but it is diffucult to say how much this fact is based on a hindsight. It could have been that by 1974 Mick Taylor - in his mid-twenties still - might have different thoughts in his head at the time. Like he mentioned in Kleermaker's clip, he learned a lot of music and making records with the Stones. Maybe he had his - a bit too big - ideas of artistic independece by then (taking his wife - as rumoured - to whispering something like that to his ears as well). But maybe not. What he actually did after the departure was to join to Jack Bruce Band - and in here he had another given 'concept' and even more bossing boss... To me that sounds like a choice of just "doing something else for a change". A typical musician's choice. The thing that the band and - honestly - its musician's @#$%& (sorry) music sucked big time does not matter. As Taylor says in the clip, he wanted to "develop as a guitar player". As far as I know Taylor was also engaged earlier or at least interest in Mike Oldfield's projecs, and seemingly that kind musical landcapes he had in his mind. And if one actually has that kind of 'progressive' or 'ambitious' plans in one's mind, one can only imagine how frustrating and boring it might have been to mimic within the soap bubbles to "It's Only Rock and Roll"... Unfortunately for him, the times they were changing rapidly, the self-centered 'difficult' musician's music was passe, and for whatever reason, Taylor somehow lost his momentum. By 1979 when he finally got his quite ordinary blues-based solo album released, seemingly no one paid any attention.
But personally I'm with the poster who says that Taylor had indeed "balls" to quit, and I also respect that! There is not many people in the business that can actually go to Mick and Keith that "sorry guys but fvck you, I had enough. I'm off". Seemingly the egos of Mick and Keith hadn't yet quite recovered from that! How dare him????!!!!!>
<- Doxa
Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 2011-01-03 11:18 by Doxa.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: January 3, 2011 11:19
Stu has said he had Ronnie in mind as a replacement for Brian circa May 1969, but I think he said that after Ronnie was a member.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Mathijs
()
Date: January 3, 2011 11:40
Quote
His Majesty
Stu has said he had Ronnie in mind as a replacement for Brian circa May 1969, but I think he said that after Ronnie was a member.
As Wood states it, Stu called the studio where The Small Faces where rehearsing to ask if Ronnie would join the Stones. They answered that Ronnie Lane would not leave the Small Faces.
It sounds unbelievable as Lane wasn't a pro guitarist.
Mathijs
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: January 3, 2011 12:22
Quote
MathijsQuote
His Majesty
Stu has said he had Ronnie in mind as a replacement for Brian circa May 1969, but I think he said that after Ronnie was a member.
As Wood states it, Stu called the studio where The Small Faces where rehearsing to ask if Ronnie would join the Stones. They answered that Ronnie Lane would not leave the Small Faces.
It sounds unbelievable as Lane wasn't a pro guitarist.
Mathijs
If that call took place it must have took place during Quiet Melon sessions towards the end of May 1969.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Anonymous User
()
Date: January 3, 2011 13:09
Quote
MathijsQuote
His Majesty
Stu has said he had Ronnie in mind as a replacement for Brian circa May 1969, but I think he said that after Ronnie was a member.
As Wood states it, Stu called the studio where The Small Faces where rehearsing to ask if Ronnie would join the Stones. They answered that Ronnie Lane would not leave the Small Faces.
It sounds unbelievable as Lane wasn't a pro guitarist.
Mathijs
Lucky error imo, as we all enjoyed the Taylor era.
Re: Mick Taylor saying he doesn't regret quitting
Posted by:
Squiggle
()
Date: January 3, 2011 13:46
As I've heard it, the Stones were helping out the future Faces (Ronnie, Ronnie, Mac and Kenney) by letting them use their rehearsal space and things were just coming together (after months of post-Marriott doubt) when Stu called them to ask about Ronnie Wood maybe replacing Brian.
Ronnie Lane answered and said 'Er, I think he's quite happy where he is'.
Ronnie Lane answered and said 'Er, I think he's quite happy where he is'.
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