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Lightnin'

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Amsterdamned
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Lightnin'
Anyone that has followed MT's career a little bit, knows he was fairly busy in the early 80's (touring the world with Mayall and the "reunited Bluesbreakers", then studio work and European Tour with Dylan)
He had to keep working to pay his bills. The fees he was paid for these projects enabled him to do that.



As Mathijs stated some time ago: Mick still gets his monthly Rolling Stones cheque bigger than ours.. Maybe he can shine a more detailed light on it?

Amsterdamned: As if he knows anything about the cheques that MT receives... You do know that when MT gets sent royalty cheques they do not get forwarded by Mathijs or anyone else on this board, don't you ?

I was quoting Mathijs,and he gave an indication....It can be found on this site..If someone knows what kind of pick a Stone member used in a certain area,why shouldn't he know other things,like MT cheques?

I would have thought Mick's income from Stones records (where he is still getting income); income from performnce/airplay; income from his own compositions;income from his recordings since 1975;income from his concerts all told would be more than acceptable, by most peoples standards.
Providing you look after the cash flow and have a good Accountant, of course.

I think everyone who quit a job 34 years ago deserves a small but loyal group of supporters who are there for them after all this time. Worrying about whether management and the current employees remember how valuable they were. Worrying about whether the old-timer's profit share is really as large as it should be. Most of all, if the guy that replaced him has held down the same position for 34 years now (as opposed to the old guy who was great, but only stayed five years), I hope they remember to treat him like crap and let him know he'll never be as good no matter how many years he sticks around. What a world it would be if everyone could look back on mistakes they made and think, "Yeah, but those guys on the company messageboard are on my side. They'll never forget what I did." Sorta brings a tear to your eye, doesn't it?

Keep in mind that artists only receive those royalties from bars etc... that PARTICIPATE in ASCAP/BMI. A lot of places do not. When we play a bar in Mississippi or Alabama or Louisiana or all the other states we play and play a cover, like Sweet Virginia, Mick and Keith do not make a penny because of us playing the song. That does happen in some venues but I am not aware of ONE venue we have played - from the House Of Blues, Tipitinas, The Wharf, Penuches, Fitzgerald's, that participate in that.

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Lightnin'
You're right about that MCDDTLC, it's still an enormous source of discontent for Taylor and at times he gets very bitter about not getting paid a penny for the work he's most widely recognised for (by the fans, at least).
This is also why it can be such a drag for him to get people coming up to him everywhere he goes with Stones CD's that they want his autograph on.
I know that he sometimes makes comments to people in his circle (when the fans are out of earshot) about wanting to burn those albums or that he won't sign another copy until he gets paid for the CD's he played on.
Knowing this it makes it all the more remarkable that he doesn't let on about his real feelings when he's taking the time to meet fans after a gig, he's always courteous and patient with them (as long as they show some manners, that is).

Lightnin', I didn't read all of your posts as they're just too long to concentrate, but: you are dead wrong on several accounts, but the main one is: the Stones never ever stopped paying Taylor anything. It is not within the power of the Stones et al to stop just copyright and mechanical right payments. By Dutch law, Promopub BV is legally obliged to pay all entitled to any rights. If Promopub wants to refrain from paying someone who is entitled to copyrights or mechanical rights they have to go to Dutch court and prove that Mr. X did in fact not play on the recording OR that Mr. X sold all his rights to Promopub BV, which Taylor never did.

Second, Taylor has mentioned several times that he should have received royalties for some tracks, but he never complained about not receiving any royalties. And in all reality: the Stones royalties is what has paid his bills to date. He didn't do any real touring from '73 to '81 and no recording from '74 to '79, with his solo album on '79 being a commercial failure. During this period his income was sufficient to sustain his drug habit. He did quite some work from '81 to '85, and the again went into a drug recluse. During this time he moved from London to LA to New York, which is not something you do when you don't have money.

And to be honest: from '85 to date Taylor does not have a real career of his own, at least nothing substantial, while he still is living a good live.

The main grudge for Taylor and Wyman seems to be the amount of money the royalties amount to: you would expect a lot more. For us mortals receiving $100.000 a year on royalties would be fantastic, but when the singer and the guitarist at the same time earn $15 million a year on songwriting royalties alone it can piss you off.

Mathijs

Thought as much.It's hard to imagine someone makes a living playing in a club
for 50 people hanging around there anyway.
Playing the same set list for 35 years can hardly be called working.

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Rocky Dijon
The truth is that none of us know the facts. We know what we've been told or what we've read. We choose what to believe and what not to believe. If Mr. Taylor mysteriously stopped getting his checks one day, why didn't the introverted, but very intelligent man see a solicitor and speak to the press about it?

Actually, am I corect in believing that Mick did resort to legal action after TY was released- and he wasn't given a credit for those tracks which he'd played on?

Given credit in what way? Acknowledgment that he played on them? It was admitted but I don't recall ever seeing any official anything about who did what on that album.

It was widely reported at the time that both Mick Taylor and Wayne Perkins settled out of court for their uncredited appearances on TATTOO YOU. As Skipstone noted above, the album contained no credits although its obvious that Perkins plays the solo on "Worried About You" and Mr. Taylor can be heard clearly on "Tops" and "Waiting On a Friend." That said, TATTOO YOU is really outside of what is being discussed, isn't it? We're looking at did the Stones stop paying Taylor his royalties for the music released when he was part of the band - not did they pay him for releasing tracks he cut nine years before. If the issue were does he receive royalties on TATTOO YOU, we might have a different issue than claiming he no longer receives royalties on STICKY FINGERS, EXILE, GOATS HEAD SOUP, IORR, MADE IN THE SHADE, SUCKING IN THE SEVENTIES, JUMP BACK, FORTY LICKS, RARITIES, etc.

Rocky what about LET IT BLEED and GET YER YA-YA'S OUT!? I know that's not these reissues but it's the same label. What is up with those two albums and those types of royalties? Does ABKCO even acknowledge the existence of the people that made those albums?

Mick T will be air-brushed out of the Black And Blue cover along with Bill.

Heh.

Who knows in fact what Mick T gets in royalty?
Has anybody asked him how much he gets?
Has anybody seen his bank account?
Is this all just guessing?

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bumbum
Who knows in fact what Mick T gets in royalty?
Has anybody asked him how much he gets?
Has anybody seen his bank account?
Is this all just guessing?

As the Stones put all their business into Dutch foundations and companies, they have to publish the financial numbers every year, which are available at the Dutch Chamber of Commerce, the "Kamer van Koophandel". While it does not state what each member gets, it does state the total of publishing and mechanical rights collected for that given year, and it lists all who benefit from it.

Tatto You was different in the fact that Taylor had to prove it was him playing on those two songs. They settled out of court, for I believe $150.000.

Mathijs

Mick Taylor...was...is?...one of the greatest guitarists that´s ever lived. From 69-74 he did a great job. Listen to the records. What´s the problem?

From what I thought I had read earlier in this thread - ABKCO/Decca do indeed pay Mr. Taylor royalties for LET IT BLEED, YA-YA'S, HOT ROCKS, METAMORPHOSIS, SINGLES COLLECTION, SINGLES 1968-1971, FORTY LICKS, and ROLLED GOLD. I do not have any contact with Mr. Taylor or his girlfriend, so I can only say I am skeptical regarding the claims that he receives no royalties from Promotone. I have heard of artists receiving the equivalent of an advance against royalties years after the fact to keep them solvent and that may have happened when Mr. Taylor was at his nadir personally, but I would suspect an actual buy-out was legally impossible.

Fair or not, as the tracks on TATTOO YOU featuring Mr. Taylor continued as works in progress after his departure from the group. I suspect the ruling would be that Mr. Taylor would be viewed as a session musician in this context and those two tracks would not be subject to the same royalty percentage as tracks completed and released when he was an acutal band member. In the same way, old tracks released on METAMORPHOSIS would be covered under the ABKCO/Decca royalty arrangement for the band as they were not reworked at numerous sessions over the years.

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Amsterdamned

Playing the same set list for 35 years can hardly be called working.

It's not called working it's called warhorses.

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skipstone
I don't recall ever seeing any official anything about who did what on that album.

You don't even see anything official of Bill Wyman on the Rarities cover but he claims - in contrast to Mick Taylor - to earn money of that.

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Mathijs

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bumbum
Who knows in fact what Mick T gets in royalty?
Has anybody asked him how much he gets?
Has anybody seen his bank account?
Is this all just guessing?

As the Stones put all their business into Dutch foundations and companies, they have to publish the financial numbers every year, which are available at the Dutch Chamber of Commerce, the "Kamer van Koophandel". While it does not state what each member gets, it does state the total of publishing and mechanical rights collected for that given year, and it lists all who benefit from it.

Tatto You was different in the fact that Taylor had to prove it was him playing on those two songs. They settled out of court, for I believe $150.000.

Mathijs

Has anyone seen the latest accounts for Promotone etc?
I wonderd if -in these austere times - the Directors were paying themselves a bonus this year?

If I were you, I'd sell your shares in the company.

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skipstone
Mick T will be air-brushed out of the Black And Blue cover along with Bill.

Heh.

He does not appear on Black & Blue.

He doesn't appear on BLACK AND BLUE, but the riff to "Broken Hands" becomes "Hand of Fate" and Wayne Perkins' solos on "Hand of Fate" and "Worried About You" are certainly in Mick Taylor's style.

Though I agree that Taylor and Wyman should recieve royalties neither of them were cast aside - they both left of their own accord!

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Rocky Dijon
If I were you, I'd sell your shares in the company.

I've tried on EBAY - no takers despite being at rock bottom prices..
I should have bought into ABBA !

Wow Smokey can you not get a joke. GodDAMN.

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skipstone
Wow Smokey can you not get a joke. GodDAMN.

Given his treatment at the hands of the Glimmer Twins, I thought you mistook him for the bound blonde used to advertise the album. She wasn't on the album either.

Help;
Is it true that only the songwriters get a royalty for performance income ( radio play,concerts,businesses that play songs) in the US, or do the artists get a share as well. How about in Europe, is it different?

Yeah yeah yeah I know. That's the whole point - Mick T was airbrushed off B&B.

I did read that Pete Best (Beatles drummer, pre Ringo) made a very tidy sum out of the royalties he earned from being on a couple of Anthology CD tracks.
Perhpas Macca is more generous than Mick?

Perhaps? Surely, you jest.