is it really that good? All these reviews written about it claim that its' an upgrade. I've got like three different versions of this show, including the Devil's Breath version. Is this one really that much better that I need to acquire a copy?

There are (at least) three versions of this absolutely wonderful show and I believe they are all from the same source. This is a fine, fine audience recording and a stunning performance. Belladonna On A Toussaint Night by Sister Morph has a drop out just when Taylor gets going on his GS solo. There is one called Timeless 73 by VGP, I believe, that splices in the drop out on GS from another and inferior source. It's a nicely done splice, but a splice nonetheless. The Sister Morph version is a bit more "juiced up" on the EQ-ing. Both are good. It depends on what your ears like.

Perhaps the Timeless 73 version prompted the surfacing of the complete version which more recently appeared, again presumably from the original source. It is interesting and obvious (to me) that the taper "marked" his recording with the GS drop out, then somehow the full show appeared some 30+ years later. If anyone knows the story behind this one, I'd be happy to hear it, but that is my guess about what happened.

If the version you are talking about is the "complete" version (meaning no GS drop out or splice) and you do not have one, then, yes, get it.

This show features what I think is Taylor's longest stage solo with the band, the YCAGWYW solo sans a sax solo. Taylor will play as long as you like; or should I say as long as Jagger likes. He got a good one in during this show. There are a couple of notes in there that shimmer like gold.

An essential recording from the '73 tour, IMO. Those Wembley show were sumthin'.

It sure was a great show. I was there. And yup, the recent version came out because it was cleaned up, beefing up Mick Taylor's guitar sound. Nuff said.

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pmk251
There are (at least) This show features what I think is Taylor's longest stage solo with the band, the YCAGWYW solo sans a sax solo. Taylor will play as long as you like; or should I say as long as Jagger likes. He got a good one in during this show. There are a couple of notes in there that shimmer like gold.

An essential recording from the '73 tour, IMO. Those Wembley show were sumthin'.

I'd rank that one in the all time top 5, to be honest. An incredible show.

Really interesting reading all your comments about the Sept 8th early show. It's actually my tape. I knew about the Devil's Breath CD which got a great write up in Hot Wacks when it came out last summer. Since then it has obviously been tweaked and re-released on the SODD label which I haven't heard yet. It's amazing how a bootleg gets bootlegged these days.

The Devil's Breath version I know all about. That already boosted the top end so there was more clarity on Mick Taylor's guitar. I'm chuffed that it has got such favourable praise. It was languishing in my cupboard for years and I actually never thought it was that good quality, at least compared to the Nasty Music, Brussels Affair or Bedspring Symphony vinyl boots around at that time.

It was a really great show and was the first time I ever saw the Stones. I've now seen them over 30 times but that night was definitely the best version of Midnight Rambler I ever heard. Jagger was still whipping the stage with his belt during the middle bit in those days too. The band had calmed down a tad from the frenetic 100 mph versions played on the US 72 tour. As I remember, they used dry ice for Dancing With Mr D. And yes, that was an incredible Taylor solo on YCAGWYW.
Anyway, though I'd just put the record straight.

Silver Dagger, congratulations making the one of the finest RS audience recordings of the early 70s.

So you think your tape sounds better than the Devils Breath/Dogs&Cats release ?
...the only difference between those 2 is that DAC runs in correct speed, and has a bit of more bassy sound. SODD rehash once more.

Oh....of course would love to hear the tape as it was meant to be.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2008-01-16 01:14 by Erik_Snow.

<Really interesting reading all your comments about the Sept 8th early show. It's actually my tape.>

Dude! You preserved something that could have been lost forever. You done good! Thank You!

Hi Erik,

My tape is the Dragon's Breath version. That's why I'm amazed that someone has tweaked that and re-enhanced the sound. It's amazing what good sound equipment can achieve these days.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-01-16 16:07 by Silver Dagger.

Oh, I misunderstood - well it's certainly nice that it saw the light of day, terrific recording you did.

Even before the 'tweaking' the sound quality is superb for a 1973 audience tape. Great work, Silver Dagger,

So the Devil's Breath version comes closest to the original tapesource. It's a mighty fine recording of a great show. Only downside is that it's not running at the correct speed (which can be easily fixed). Thanx for recording and making it available Silverdagger!

Any pictures of this show ?

Nope - I didn't get any pix that time. Anyone who has the Dragon's Breath CD can see two very fine shots taken, I believe, at Wembley, which I got from the WEA office when they were still in Sackville Street, Piccadilly in 73.
I did take some nice shots of the Stones at Earl's Ct in 76 - I went to 5 of the 6 nights, only missing one to see Jeff Beck at The Roundhouse! I aim to put some of these on the Tell Me site along with the hilarious story of how I came to take them. Stay tuned.

I think it's one of the best shows from that tour. All of the UK shows were really really good that year.

After reading this thread I grabbed the disc this morning and listened to the Devil's Breath version of this show on the drive to Oakland. What a pleasure! It is one of those recordings to which your ears adjust, then it sounds just fine. Again, probably my favorite YCAGWYW. I love how Taylor brings the solo to a peak, then back down with those long sustained notes. He can play them notes in a hurry, but he also knows how to put "space" in the lines so you can savor that tone. As Jagger says "Sweet!"

Again, thanks!

Many, many thanks Silver Dagger!!

My first ever Stones show was on the Sunday (9th) and that was incredible, but the Manchester gig, two days later, was better still!!

Memories, memories.

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LOGIE
Many, many thanks Silver Dagger!!

My first ever Stones show was on the Sunday (9th) and that was incredible, but the Manchester gig, two days later, was better still!!

Memories, memories.

Ooh... tell us everything you remember!!!

Just compared the Devils Breath version with the SODD release.
And surprise: They both still run a little fast.... Which might explain why they both sound brighter than the DAC release (which most probably runs at the correct speed). The SODD release has enhanced the sound by adding some compression rather than simply adjusting the EQ. So the best version would be a speedcorrected version of the Devil's Breath release (which will probably end up sounding like the DAC version).

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Britney
So the best version would be a speedcorrected version of the Devil's Breath release (which will probably end up sounding like the DAC version).

Yes they are both very close. I expected DAC to somewhat degrade this recording, but they didn't. It's just a bit heavier soundwise - but not in a negative way at all. Maybe they were inspired by the WTNY transfer, which is disc 2 of that release...

Furthermore the Devils Breath appears to be stereo where Timeless 73 (VGP) was in mono.

I also have the sodd version which is nice because of the complete GS, i have the bad wizard version also which is a very good one also , but not the complete GS on that one

To put the record straight - I recorded the show on a Sony TC124CS stereo cassette recorder. It was on a TDK 90 minute cassette. It came with a mike with two separate mikes inside the casing and was capable of getting an adequate stereo sound proving you sat somewhere in the middle of the auditorium and the band panned their sound. That was pretty much state of the art for that time. I know of a guy who used to record Floyd and Zepp shows in Europe using a Uher reel to reel. God knows how he got away with that. The Sony recorder was 1ftx6 ins and although fairly big was easy enough to hide inside a big coat. I used to hang it over my back and I never got caught luckily.

As I said before the cassette sat around in my attic for over 30 years before I listened to it again. A friend remarked that it was pretty historic but that's all I thought it ever was - a nice momento from my first Stones show. I lent it to a contact who I believe might have brought out a version behind my back in about 2003.

Last year I lent the tape to another contact in the business who boosted the treble to give an edge to Mick Taylor's guitar and thus the Devil's Breath version came out. Regarding the speed, that's something I aim to work on.
I'm chuffed that it has had so many nice comments from IORR members. Thank you so much.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-01-19 14:18 by Silver Dagger.

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HEILOOBAAS

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LOGIE
Many, many thanks Silver Dagger!!

My first ever Stones show was on the Sunday (9th) and that was incredible, but the Manchester gig, two days later, was better still!!

Memories, memories.

Ooh... tell us everything you remember!!!

Here's an extract from something I put on IORR about a year ago:

I was fortunate enough to have attended the Wembley, September 9th show, as well as the first of the two Manchester gigs a couple of days later, and regard them to this day, as two of the finest concerts that I have ever seen.

My first recollection of that Wembley Empire Pool gig was the unbelievable air of excitement and expectation outside the venue itself, and even with Billy Preston’s support spot well under way, the number of people looking for tickets, must surely have been in the thousands. The word had clearly got out that this was something to behold, and those wanting a last minute piece of the action were no doubt swelled further by the droves of awestruck, disbelieving souls who had come back for more of the same.

Catching the last few songs from Billy Preston’s set, it’s worth recalling that in terms of getting a crowd off its collective feet and creating an atmosphere, there has probably been no better warm-up artiste ever, and to his eternal credit, he worked that audience as impressively as anyone I’d ever seen before, or have witnessed since (Springsteen included).

In contrast to Preston’s cheerful, animated personae, the Stones onstage presence at that time seemed somewhat dark and menacing; almost like they had come along for some serious business and were not going to be distracted from getting on with it. They looked like they were the coolest guys on the planet. They probably WERE the coolest guys on the planet.

It’s worth pointing out at this stage, that audiences back in the early seventies were very much different, behaviour wise, from what we have become accustomed to at modern day gigs, and the Stones crowd on this particular night were certainly no exception to that rule. It was possible to count on two hands, the number of people who would be out of their seats at any one time, while the remainder sat back, listening intently to the incredible musicianship on offer, and applauding (almost jazz-like) at the conclusion of every guitar solo. It’s fair to say that we were all well and truly mesmerised by the performance that night, but almost to the point where people couldn’t quite get their heads round it. It sounded like nothing from the Ya Yas era, yet despite featuring an impressive brass section, was far too guitar laden to have any of the feel of Exile. This was something else altogether, and it was incredible. Almost like they’d moved into brand new territory, and shifted up a gear without any advance warning.

More to the point, Mick Taylor’s performance that night was, without any exaggeration, simply out of this world, and even from my own relatively poor vantage position towards the back of the arena, there was an impression that his guitar playing was very much a deliberately prominent “feature” of the sound, and as such, rightly turned up in the mix. However, the assertion that some of his soloing may have been more down to boredom as opposed to creativity, is not something that I would subscribe to personally. This was a time remember, when axemen such as Page, Gallagher, Santana etc. ruled the world, and any band that was unable to feature complex guitar solos in its live performances, was an act not to be taken seriously.

Should I have needed any confirmation that THIS was the greatest living band on the planet, at the peak of their pre-eminence, then the Manchester show provided it in abundance. Despite being technically flawed in many respects, this seemed a much more powerful performance than the Wembley show, and being away from the spotlight of the capital city, there was a sense that the band were more relaxed and willing to let rip, so to speak. The fact that they chose to do so in such a small theatre with probably no more than 1500 seats, made it even more impressive, and for me personally, from my seat in the sixth row, this was pure heaven.

Interestingly, I remember Nick Kent of the NME, recalling how empty he felt after the 1973 shows were finished, much of it down to the fact that he had nothing on record to match what he had heard during those incredible performances. He wasn’t the only one, and it would be a year before I got my hands on an audience recording of the Saturday night Wembley show, and a further two after that, before Nasty Music arrived at my door.

Do the radio mixes do justice to the concerts? In parts certainly, although as mentioned in an earlier post, The Stars in the Sky They Never Lie probably provides a more realistic impression, giving more prominence to the brass section, and to Billy Preston’s involvement. As such, that album provides a bolder and more rugged edge than the sometimes too-refined FM-friendly mix of Nasty Music and Brussels Affair.

As brilliant as Mick Taylor was with the Stones however, it could reasonably be argued that had he remained with the band, his virtuoso style of playing might have actually hindered their progression towards formulating their more consumer-friendly, one-size-fits-all stage production that we still see today. Conversely, it could be contested that in choosing to venture down such a road towards stadium tours and commercial mass market appeal, the Rolling Stones lost much of the musical and artistic credibility that Taylor had played such a significant part in helping them to establish.

Europe 1973...Superseded, but never bettered.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-01-17 12:36 by LOGIE.

Great recollection Logie. The 73 tour was the last time the Stones ever played with such conviction and intensity with the accent firmly on the music. After that it was the beginning of the Stadium era where props such as the star stage came into play plus Billy Preston solo spots, Jagger dancing with Billy, Jagger soaring over the audience on a rope - in other words pure showbiz.

thankyou so very much for that beautiful story LOGIE. it's so nice to get a perspective from someone who was around at the time who actually cares passionately about the music, the musicianship, the passion, the guitar soloing the performance. it's so refreshing not to have to click on some review by a music journalist who was writing a review to get paid.

you made my day with your description of Taylor's playing that night
as a side note...do you think in 73 he was right up there with any other 'guitar god', as you mention Page, Gallagher. I often think that compared to Page, Taylor is so much more fluent, precise and expressive in his live playing and not at all sloppy (99% of the time in that era!)

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Silver Dagger
Great recollection Logie. The 73 tour was the last time the Stones ever played with such conviction and intensity with the accent firmly on the music.

I would say that the '78 tour and several '81 shows weren't exactly lacking in the energy department either.

Half of the '73 shows were brilliant (mainly the UK shows and the end of the tour with Brussels, Antwerp and Berlin), but half of the tour (especially the German shows) was actually pretty bad. Slow, out of tune sloppines is a good description I think.

Mathijs

Question to Mike aka Silver Dagger,...

As far as I remember it was a Mike that recorded a lot of ´76 UK shows ,..??

Was this your great work too ???

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Silver Dagger
It sure was a great show. I was there. And yup, the recent version came out because it was cleaned up, beefing up Mick Taylor's guitar sound. Nuff said.

Thanks Logie for your recollections and perceptive comments. Very enjoyable to read. I saw the band in '69, '72 and in January of '73. On this board now is a thread showing the band's recent performance of CYHMK with Ronnie bouncing and striding across the stage during his solo. In contrast people say how stoic Taylor was. You mention an almost hostile persona of the band back then and that is completely true. Here was a band making some historic RnR music and three of them could not look more blase about it. That was before Keith became a merry jokester. Back in that era they tended toward audience abuse. Make them wait, deliver the goods, drive them into a frenzy, then say good night and leave. An encore? Forget it. It was all very exciting and very cool.

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pmk251
Here was a band making some historic RnR music and three of them could not look more blase about it.

...charlie, bill, and taylor?

The September 73 Frankfurt shows are great . here is GS . Taylor's tone is crystal and pristine

[download.yousendit.com]

play that guitar boy