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OT: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson
Posted by: ChelseaDrugstore ()
Date: April 25, 2007 15:34

I have a Q: do you people love the Beach Boys. Have this revernce for Brian Wilson? And see "Pet Sounds" (or is it "Smile"? I get them confused) as a work of genius that always has to be at the top of every list of Best Album with Sgt Pepper?
There are a few Beach Boys songs that are fun. And I see all the harmony stacking, the strong songwriting etc. But I feel like Brian Wilson gets talked about in these hushed tones. Would that be the cse if he hadn't such a mysterious side to his story? Which to me doesn't sound real mysterious. He ate too much, stayed upstairs and did too much acid that I think he still hasn't quite come back from.
I go and buy Smile/Pet Sounds (even the new redone, special expanded version) and try to 'get it'. I know I am missing something big. Just like "OK Computer" where the rest of the world hears it and I don't. But I just don't see it.

BTW You guys are probably tired of me posting so much lately. Been bored to death as of late. But tomorrow I go back out. Just thankful that I am allowed to talk so much Stones here in the meantime.

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2024-02-17 13:39 by bv.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: Gazza ()
Date: April 25, 2007 15:48

ChelseaDrugstore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have a Q: do you people love the Beach Boys.

yes


> Have this revernce for Brian Wilson?

yes

And see "Pet
> Sounds" (or is it "Smile"? I get them confused) as
> a work of genius that always has to be at the top
> of every list of Best Album with Sgt Pepper?

yes, only Pet Sounds is better. 'Smile' has its flaws but has some moments of sheer brilliance



> There are a few Beach Boys songs that are fun. And
> I see all the harmony stacking, the strong
> songwriting etc. But I feel like Brian Wilson gets
> talked about in these hushed tones. Would that be
> the cse if he hadn't such a mysterious side to his
> story? Which to me doesn't sound real mysterious.
> He ate too much, stayed upstairs and did too much
> acid that I think he still hasn't quite come back
> from.

Its probably because of this silly rock/pop prejudice that a lot of fans have to hide behind, where whats perceived as "pop" is considered culturally somewhat lightweight. Which is of course nonsense. Wilson was simply ahead of his time and with too many ideas bursting out of his head for his own good. As a craftsman of melodies and harmonies he has few equals.

That, plus the fact that a lot of the Beach Boys work is so inconsistent.



> I go and buy Smile/Pet Sounds (even the new
> redone, special expanded version) and try to 'get
> it'. I know I am missing something big. Just like
> "OK Computer" where the rest of the world hears it
> and I don't. But I just don't see it.

you and me both, mate.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: Mr Jimmy ()
Date: April 25, 2007 15:49

Great post, I have to go out to work, so can't talk for long, but, briefly:

I am a huge Brian Wilson / Beach Boys fan.

I really dig SMiLE, and Pet Sounds. When I bought smile I loved it straight away, I just 'got it'.

Pet Sounds took me a while though. I first bought it about 3 years ago, before smile was released and as I was getting into the BB's for the first time, and I didn't get it. Thought it was a little dull, i dunno...

Then went back to it after smile, and it blew me away. The lyrics are great, but for me, what makes it special is the harmonys, the melodies... Example: 'you still believe in me'. And especially 'dont talk put your head on my shoulder'. When he sings, 'and listen to my heart.... beat...' that is like angels singing... absolutely beautiful...

He really is a tortured genius. I just fell in love with the music, the myth, and those damn harmonies. Surfer girl, breakaway are two of my favourites. I have always been a sucker for melody etc, i love the beatles. So i think it is more common for a beatle fan to dig the BB's. If you love beatles and stones then no problem, but if you are stones crazy and not a fan of the beatles, it's perhaps less likely that you'll dig the beach boys...? IMHO.

To be continued, gotta go!

_____________________________________________________

What's your favourite flavour?...........Cherry Red!!

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: JumpingKentFlash ()
Date: April 25, 2007 15:50

I like The Beach Boys. Let me rephrase that. I like SOME of The Beach Boys' stuff. There's some incredible things in there and I think that they probably were the best ever to arrange choirs (Runner up: The Beatles).

JumpingKentFlash

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: ChelseaDrugstore ()
Date: April 25, 2007 15:57

Thanks guys. I learned a few things. That there are actually two seperate albums. And just from the people posting I gather that I just haven't gotten it yet. I am a big sucker for melodies; sappy melodies. I can do Anita Baker, Terence trent Darby, Starsailor all day. McCartney!
It's th e inconsistency that confuses me. "Wouldn't it be nice" and "Rhonda" I love like the rest of the world. But some of the jewels like "In my room" or even "God only knows"...I will try again.

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: textmonkey ()
Date: April 25, 2007 16:17

ChelseaDrugstore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks guys. I learned a few things. That there
> are actually two seperate albums. And just from
> the people posting I gather that I just haven't
> gotten it yet. I am a big sucker for melodies;
> sappy melodies. I can do Anita Baker, Terence
> trent Darby, Starsailor all day. McCartney!
> It's th e inconsistency that confuses me.
> "Wouldn't it be nice" and "Rhonda" I love like the
> rest of the world. But some of the jewels like "In
> my room" or even "God only knows"...I will try
> again.

Do - give it another shot. I'm with you on the Radiohead thing...bloody naval-gazing students!!!

God Only Knows is one of *the* perfect original chord sequences in pop music, it' doesn't even go within shouting distance of the old reliable C F & G...

As for Wilson himself...well, in a way, he's the flip side of Keith - he just couldn't handle it, poor sod. He's conquered his demons as much as is possible, but he's still not exactly 'all there' i'd think. Except when it comes to the music. I read somewhere that his ability to put together harmonies verges on the level of genius; wish i could provide a link, but the chap who said it essentially said (and i paraphrase)

'i was in the studio, working on a track for BW to do backing vocals on. BW took one listen to the track, nipped into the booth, asked to roll the tape and sang a few ooohs. Then he did some more oooh's. And a few more. And then asked the engineer to 'put them together on top of each other like a sandwich' Of course, he'd just created perfect harmonies, on the fly, for the song in question.

i think THAT'S the deal with Brian Wilson!

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: VoodooLounge13 ()
Date: April 25, 2007 16:20

The Beach Boys I can take or leave, but Pet Sounds is quitessential! for sure. God Only Knows, Sloop John B - those are 2 of my favorite BB songs. GOK is probably my very favorite. I also like the Still Cruisin album, but overall, I can only do small doses of the BB much like the Doors and Hendrix - it's just too damn redundant for me......and this coming from someone who used to love the Beatles, and now haven't listened to them in like 3 years, so maybe there is some truth to the thought that if you love the Stones but not really the Beatles, then you may not like the BB! LOL

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: KSIE ()
Date: April 25, 2007 18:15

An interesting related disc is "Song Cycle" by Van Dyke Parks. Van Dyke was a collaborator with Brian Wilson along the time Smile was being conceived. Song Cycle is similar in a lot of ways to Smile and could arguably be considered as innovative and accomplished.

I've always liked Pet Sounds, but just consider it a "good" pop album. Smile I don't really get (really have only heard the re-do released a year or so ago).

Karl

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: cirrhosis ()
Date: April 25, 2007 19:30

-



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-12-30 21:08 by cirrhosis.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: Gazza ()
Date: April 25, 2007 20:56

What makes Brian Wilson's talent as a composer, singer, arranger and producer all the more remarkable is the fact that he's been deaf in one ear since he was a child (supposedly due to beatings from his control freak of a father). When you hear that great music, its quite something when you consider that its composer only ever hears it in mono.

"Surfs Up" is another overlooked album as well. Contains a few songs from the then abandoned "Smile" project including absolute gems like "Til I Die" and the title track.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-04-25 21:01 by Gazza.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: Gazza ()
Date: April 25, 2007 21:02

cirrhosis Wrote:
> When the Beach Boys were firing on all cyclinders,
> it was pretty damn magical. Much of it can get
> repetitive in large doses, but their harmonies
> really should be required learning- especially for
> some of our current artists.


Damn right. Always seems to put me in a good mood, for some reason. ("California" from the 'Holland' album being the best example)

Maybe I should listen more often!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-04-25 21:03 by Gazza.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: Elmo Lewis ()
Date: April 25, 2007 21:27

I'm a big fan, but not fanatic like with The Stones. Pet Sounds took repeated listenings to me.

"No Anchovies, Please"

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: Mr Jimmy ()
Date: April 26, 2007 04:59

Gazza Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What makes Brian Wilson's talent as a composer,
> singer, arranger and producer all the more
> remarkable is the fact that he's been deaf in one
> ear since he was a child (supposedly due to
> beatings from his control freak of a father). When
> you hear that great music, its quite something
> when you consider that its composer only ever
> hears it in mono.
>
> "Surfs Up" is another overlooked album as well.
> Contains a few songs from the then abandoned
> "Smile" project including absolute gems like "Til
> I Die" and the title track.

Yeah, Murray/Murrey Wilson was an a*shole. Basically a frustrated and unsuccessful musician who was in equal parts delighted and jealous at his son's success / talent. They actually fired him at some point around 65/66. They just couldn't take it with him in the studio shouting this and that...

The documentary "Beautiful Dreamer" which is a good 100 mins and on the smile DVD, is absolutely amazing. It shows BW talking very candidly about his drug use, about the other members of the BB rejecting Pet sounds and smile, his awe of the beatles, despite the fact that Brian Wilson is Paul McCartney and George Martin rolled into one giant ball of melody/harmony/arrangement/production.

He talks very honestly about the exact reasons that 'smile' was aborted, and shows that, despite thr fact that he is still struggling with demons, when he is in the studio, or in front of a piano, he is f*cking dynamite. Examples being his beautiful renditions of Gershwins 'Rhapsody in Blue' and him showing how he learnt to play rock 'n' roll piano. His fingers are moving like lightning across the keyboard...

Other highlights are post-concert audience footage from the world premiere of Smile, including some very moving footage of an american man diagnosed with cancer days before he was due to make the trip over to london for the concert. It really is moving stuff.

Chelseadrugstore: 'In my room' is an absolute beauty of a song, partly because it is 100% autobiographical of brian wilson. Other fantastic songs that are less well known are 'Add some music to your day', 'Marcella', 'Please let me wonder', 'The little girl I once knew'...

The live CD 'Brian Wilson Live at the Roxy' is a great collection of songs from the two shows he performed they a few years ago.

_____________________________________________________

What's your favourite flavour?...........Cherry Red!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-04-26 05:08 by Mr Jimmy.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: soundcheck ()
Date: April 26, 2007 07:29

... keeno has the stones doing 'i get around' back in '65 on some boot,,

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: Gazza ()
Date: April 26, 2007 12:13

soundcheck Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ... keeno has the stones doing 'i get around' back
> in '65 on some boot,,


that would be Mick with the Andrew Loog oldham Orchestra in 1964.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: jeff14 ()
Date: April 26, 2007 12:24

wasn't there an issue with murray being fired and them turning around and selling the beach boys songs for $150.000, which was a lot of money back in 1965. but i read somewhere that the cataloge is worth millions today.
if anything get the beach boys in concert album, brian doesn't play on it but it showed that they could rock out.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: Gazza ()
Date: April 26, 2007 12:33

It was a little bit later than that as I recall. Murray sold Brian's 'Sea of Tunes' publishing rights in the late 60's for what was a relatively piddling amount, in the belief that his work would soon be forgotten and that there was no money in it in the long term.

To make matters worse, he made the arrangement without Brian even being aware of it.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: Zack ()
Date: April 26, 2007 13:29

First I am fairly sure the correct spelling of Brian's father is Murry. The sale of Sea of Tunes was more like $500,000, which was a heck of a lot of money. The point being he stole Brian's songs, which resulted a decade later in "I'm pickin' up good vibrations/Sunkist orange soda taste sensations."

The Beach Boys, until 1967, were pretty much peerless, when you consider Brian Wilson was competing singlehandedly against Lennon/McCartney AND George Martin, and Mick and Keith had pros like Dave Hassinger and Jack Nitzche in their stable. No band has more cringe-inducing songs ("Amusement Parks, USA" anyone?) but also the most sublimely beautful songs ever produced. Beyond Pet Sounds and Smile, there's stuff like In My Room, Hushabye, and She Knows Me Too Well, to name three, all of which can make you weep with their beauty if they get you at the right moment.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: Gazza ()
Date: April 26, 2007 13:39


Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: JumpingKentFlash ()
Date: April 27, 2007 13:31

I never read about Murrey Wilson, but I have two views of him. These views come from movies. One is the VERY controlling father from Summer Dreams and the other being the controlling yet mellow to a point Murrey from The Beach Boys: An American Family.

JumpingKentFlash

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: keithfan64 ()
Date: May 2, 2007 04:35

Oddly enough my favorite BB album is Little Deuce Coupe. Brian was at his pre-substance abuse peak. So what if all the songs are about cars except Be True To Your School? From the pure rock and roll of the title song to the Doo Wop of Cherry Cherry Coupe to the incredible beauty of Spirit Of America [the name of the jet powered car that broke the land speed record] Brian and the Boys were in a zone where everything was working to perfection. Maybe the recent return of Al Jardine had something to do with it. But who can resist lyrics like "Door handles are off but you know I'll never miss 'em. They open themselves up with a solenoid system"? One of the greatest rock and roll albums ever made, every song is a gem.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: Beelyboy ()
Date: May 2, 2007 06:56

yeh i really like the early stuff too; they were a good self contained band with brian on bass, those striped shirts and all...i mean they showed up and put it over and drove 'em wild live; a total gas...dennis had his surf beat down after all...if the rhythm and release of 'i get around' dosen't move somebody, then they are not likely to appreciate what i would consider spectacular series of early, and Rocking, hits in a row.
and to also mention carl...a brother band...carl was the only one there from the band with brian at all the production sessions, not just vocal sessions...carl had perhaps the sweetest most distinctly out of this world lovely voice...brian is effin' mozart, right up there with ray davies winking smiley
i still miss dennis...keith moon, the most dangerous drummer ever to walk the face of the earth lived for surf music, 'barbara ann' etc...i like the beach boys version of 'rock and roll music'...i think mike love is a real sick twisted dude...not exactly a good commercial for meditation...forever the sub-solieri to brian's mozart and carl's operatic twin connection to brian.

i'm gettin' bugged walkin' up and down the same old strip..
da da da da da dahhh dah da da da d adaaah dah dah
i'm gonna find a new place where the kids are hip...

well my buddies and me we're gettin' real well known
da da da da da dahhh da h da ....
yeh the bad guys know us and they leave us alone...

then that swirling chorus; jeeze louise...

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: wineaux ()
Date: May 2, 2007 06:58

Interesting bit of Beach Boys / Stones-related history.... Blondie Chaplin played with the Beach Boys for a few years back in the 60's. And believe it or not, he did the solo on Sail on Sailor!!

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: keithfan64 ()
Date: May 2, 2007 07:17

You have got to give Mike credit for making those teen age lyrics so believable with his nasal delivery. He also had a major role in writing the big hits. Sure he's crazy but in a humorous sort of way. His Hall of Fame speech is classic rock and roll, like putting Jerry Lee Lewis and Little Richard in the same room and locking the door. Lets just be thankful that he does meditate!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-05-02 07:20 by keithfan64.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: cirrhosis ()
Date: May 2, 2007 08:15

-



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-12-30 21:10 by cirrhosis.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: marianna ()
Date: May 2, 2007 08:16

I think there's something about the Beach Boys vocal sound, in particular, that either turns people on or completely off. I adore the Beach Boys, to the point of listening to their stuff at least once a week. And I mean everything, from the early stuff to "Beach Boys Love You." I know other people that just cannot get into them at all, no matter what the album in question is. Their sound can be perceived as either ethereal or abrasive. I respect the people I know that just cannot get into the Beach Boys, because they have otherwise great taste. As I'm sure the other non-Beach Boys lovers on this board do. A lot of truly great musicians are Beach Boys/Brian Wilson fanatics, but I'm sure there are also prominent musicians who, while they respect the craft and skill of Brian Wilson, just can't get into the overall sound.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: keithfan64 ()
Date: May 2, 2007 09:08

Summer In Paradise,the song, is the Beach Boys most unrecognised great single. A plea for enviornmental salvation to a catchy melody and rockin' beat. People can put Mike Love down all they want but lets see them tour every year for 40 years and see how sane they end up. I just watched his Hall Of Fame speech on YouTube and it is pretty scarry I'll admit, but the guy has brought a lot of joy to this world and should be recognised for it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-05-02 09:12 by keithfan64.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: soundcheck ()
Date: May 2, 2007 09:10

.... well, to keep it going.....

''we always take my car cause its never been beat/
and we've never missed yet with the girls we meet

''none of the guys go steady cause it wouldn't be right/
to leave the best girls home on a saturday night.................

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: Beelyboy ()
Date: May 2, 2007 10:11

Round round get around
I get around
Yeah
Get around round round I get around
Get around round round I get around
Wah wa ooo
Get around round round I get around
Oooo ooo ooo
Get around round round I get around
Ahh ooo ooo

gosh do you remember rock and roll radio; get this stuff and the stones and wilson pickett and the temps animals kinks 4 seasons martha and the vandellas and hundreds of others all on the same am radio station...for me it was wabc am 77 on your dial in nyc with The Good Guys...this music was revolutionary.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-05-02 10:14 by Beelyboy.

Re: Beach Boys/Brian Wilson??
Posted by: ChelseaDrugstore ()
Date: May 2, 2007 10:16

I got these friends who love to make fun of white boy music; they'll sing it with exagerrated "white accents". It's funny as hell. And one of the lines they always do is
"We always take my car cause it's never been beat.." LOL
Another is the Joe Walsh tune that goes
"I go to parties..." That is some fun sh*t when you see a bunch of homeboys sqeaking like Alvin "Aiih go tu paurtieiees.."

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

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