I want to react to the massive insults to Kanye West, Eminem or even, once, astonishingly, a few month back, to Aretha Franklin.

Find if you don't like these people's music. But I can't believe people calling Kanye West a "low-life scum". What is that, an anti-rap crusade or something? I can't even think of one performer on earth I'd use such language to describe.

Keith is no narrow-minded conservatist brain-dead retard and of course he defended Timberlake, he INVITED him in the first place!

Still kills me that the most open-minded, influence-sucking band of all times, a band that introduced so many types of music to so many people who would have never thought of paying any attention otherwise (in my case, country music for example, which I now love) can have such violent and intolerant fans.

And all the arguments I heard are plain imbecile. So he posed with a crown of thorn, now who paused in a nazy uniform, wasn't that Brian? Who had a poster "Pope declares: Keith Richars is God"? Who wrote Sympathy for the Devil?

The Stones played songs, the narrator of which screws a girl fifteen (Stray Cat Blues), another about a serial rapist (Midnight Rambler), they sung about a Crazy Mama gonna feel the bullet, about black girl's smell. They had a sense of provocation, of digging deep into our inner turmoil rather than being p.c.

Others have it now, only some, unable to take any distance or have any humour, miss the point completely. You're on the dogmatic side now, and this is so, so un-stonesy by definition.

When there was a scandal about "black girls just wanna get @#$%& all night", Jagger sent to hell those who couldn't get a joke and he was right. Now Kanye and Eminem are right and you are wrong.

There is a heavy sense of cool-to-drink-and-speak-of-sex-but-don't-@#$%&-up-my-neighbourhood (or my church) in some posts which I find truly disturbing and which it truly hurts me to find on a Stones forum.

wow anger. I love it!!!!!

here we go!!!!.............let it fly people

ggggggrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!!!!!!!!!!

and another thing......if i mentioned Barry Manilow on this site....i certainly would expect an all-out bash-fest

Go get 'em otonneau.

Can't argue with that Ottonneau but the world is full of tossers and it's not really surprising that some are going to find their way on to a Stones forum.

just more of the same liberal hogwash, otonneau.....

zzzzzzzzzzzz..........

wake me when you have something interesting to say.

#......Go ahead....Bite the Big Apple....Don't mind the Maggots.....Uh Huh...#

gut Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> just more of the same liberal hogwash,
> otonneau.....
>
> zzzzzzzzzzzz..........
>
> wake me when you have something interesting to
> say.
>
> #......Go ahead....Bite the Big Apple....Don't
> mind the Maggots.....Uh Huh...#


Well said olivier. Long overdue. By the way,"liberal" is a compliment, and maybe you shouldn't bother waking up gut.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2006-02-02 03:40 by Lukester.

I agree, while I may not listen to his music, I have heard his first album and its certainly more musical than many crappy rappers you'll see on MTV. He actually sings on many songs and there is a band on a bunch of the songs. The Roots are also band that mixes funk, jazz, hip hop and rock n roll into their music. They actually do a version of Miss You that has a 5 minute jam at the end.

otonneau,

Have you noticed Kanye's "Golddigger" is an insult to his own race? He blows as do almost all other rappers. The Rolling Stone cover is a cheap publicity stunt and one I'd hate to answer for someday. Get off my cloud, indeed!

Go to the Eminem site.

Sorry for the venom, I'm pissed off about some other stuff tonight!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-02-02 04:08 by Elmo Lewis.

I would like to take credit for being the first person to call Kanye West an IBECILE on IORR.

Hey oto- here's my issue with Kayne West he and many of the hip-hop guys and newer r&r guys have minimal talent and huge egos.

The Stones have done some over-the-top things no doubt. However, Mick and Keef can sing, write, play mutiple instrumnets well, and perform live without lip-syncing. The same can be said of The Beatles, CCR, The Who, The Kinks, The Faces, HEndrix Exp, Cream Dylan etc.


I have no issue with Alicia Keys, for example - she has talent and passes teh etst.

Lets see where Kanye West or Eminem is in five years. Kayne West does Golddigger with Jamie Fox. I have nothing against Jamie. I just don't think 35 years ago you would have seen Bob Dylan cut a song with Jerry Lewis!!!!!!!!!!

don't give me that ole one two, one two three four

I will tell you why Kayne West deserves to be bashed I normally don't like to talk about this since it does not relate to the Stones but since you want to defend him heres why. About a year and a half ago he lost out to Gretchen Wilson a country artist for best new artist of the year and he got up on stage and said it was wrong that she won and that he was the best new artist no matter what the votes said he went on to talk very bad about her which is totally wrong. Then last year he goes and bashes the president about the huricane in New Orleans saying Bush don't care about blacks. Well let me see Bush has made nummorus trips to New Orleans and the goverment is spending lots of money to help out that bad situation. I wounder how much money Mr. West has given in donations or how much time he has spent talking to them people probably not much. So he is nothing more then a fool trying to cry racisim when he loses something or he sees something he don't like even if he has no facts so in my book he is a scum bag.

I totally agree with you, otonneau. Well said! (And sorry if I just repeat a lot of what you've already said.)

There are a number of posters on IORR who love the Stones' edginess and exploration of musical genres besides traditional rock n' roll, but at the same time bash rappers for being too edgy and not being real musicians. Sorry, folks, but there's undeniably talent both in rapping (e.g., Eminem) and producing rap music (e.g., Kanye West, who I think is a much better producer than a rapper). Rap might not be your cup of tea, but that doesn't justify bashing it as an inferior form of music. I can't stand jazz, but I don't go around ripping jazz musicians because they don't follow a score.

Sad to say, there is often an undercurrent of racism in the anti-rap posts, too.

That being said, it's perfectly understandable that conservatives dislike Kanye West for speaking his mind about President Bush. But you should try to divorce that from your views on rap music as a whole, unless you screen all your favorite musicians on the basis of politics.

Oh, and as for his opinions being "liberal hogwash," also keep in mind that Kanye West is in the American political MAJORITY in being upset with President Bush's performance: in the latest poll, only 39% of respondents approved of Bush's performance, whereas 54% disapproved of it (admittedly, that's just one poll, but Bush's approval rating has not been above 50% in ANY poll since at least last September). Suck on that.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2006-02-02 08:37 by Treesnake2000.

Don't worry, another rapper will shoot him dead within 18 months. Let him enjoy grabbing his crotch and spitting venom while he can.

I'm with bigfrankie on all his points.

Also, Alicia Keys looks pretty good too!

Hey BigFrankie, although I don't agree that the capacity to play an instrument is a criteria - which is like blaming a photographer for not being able to paint, but I did that before - I have no problem with your opinion. If that's what makes him an imbecile, well that's not in too strong a sense of the word.

Now I just wonder, what would have been wrong with Dylan cutting a track with Jerry Lee Lewis? Or is it that he shouldn't have turned electric either? Didn't get that one...

As for the test of time, I could'nt care less. As a matter of fact, while I think Marshall Mathers may well be THE absolute masterpiece of the last ten years, I don't care much at all for what Eminem does today, it seems he ran out of breath. Satisfaction killed inspiration in his case, true: but then again that also applies to the Sex Pistols for instance, and nobody minors their influence and quality for that reason, would you? By the way, there is infinitely more craft in Marshall Mathers than in Nevermind the bollocks, technically speaking.

As for grabbing one's crotch, lucky ones do it everytime they wash their hair.

oto,

While you are certainly entitled to your opinion, I can't see Eminem (Marshall Mathers) as a masterpiece of any ten year period. The ability to gripe and curse doesn't equal talent, it only qualifies one to post on this board.

bigfrankie said: "I just don't think 35 years ago you would have seen Bob Dylan cut a song with Jerry Lewis!!!!!!!!!!"

But just as weird, Bob DID cut some tracks with Tiny Tim 35 years ago. They can be found on various 'Basement Tapes' bootlegs.

I'm not gojng to bother going on making sure someone else is convinced that I do like Rap etc. That I have been into it for years. Don't have to justify nothing. To me Kanye West is a conceited, arrogant, greedy, small fool. I almost hate it that I think his tracks are some of the very best stuff put out the last years. Eminem is one of the cleverst rhymers out there.
To be honest I have seen very little ignorant Rap-bashing here.

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

CD, I always value your opinion - very knowledgable about the Stones, etc., but I must admit to being an ignorant rap-basher. I just can't get into it, and hey, I've tried.

Kanye West is worthless and idiotic, devoid of redemption. Any thread started by his apologists is the same.

Don't be shy, gut. Tell us how you really feel.

====Don't be shy, gut. Tell us how you really feel====

I guess I can be accused of many things, but hiding my feelings on that fool Kanye West is not one of them! LOL

I literally despise the guy because he is so full of hatred himself. He music is crap because he is crap himself.

#......Go ahead....Bite the Big Apple....Don't mind the Maggots.....Uh Huh...#

just checked out some primo-vintage eminem from '99.......sounds like a 10 year old spewing pedestrian rhymes with a monotonous back-beat to top it off........classic stuff

In the words of teh great Muddy Waters (a man with talent): I hear ya, I hear ya!

In the words of the great Muddy Waters (a man with talent): I hear ya, I hear ya!

God, I miss Muddy. A true gentleman. You would have never seen him acting the fool that those two crappers continually make themselves to be.

#......Go ahead....Bite the Big Apple....Don't mind the Maggots.....Uh Huh...#

gut Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> God, I miss Muddy. A true gentleman. You would
> have never seen him acting the fool that those two
> crappers continually make themselves to be.
>
> #......Go ahead....Bite the Big Apple....Don't
> mind the Maggots.....Uh Huh...#


aw Gut....those two are just cashing in.....if farting were the trend, they'd be loading up on the beans as we type

-===if farting were the trend, they'd be loading up on the beans as we type====

Very good analogy, Leonard. Farting is a good description since they talk out of their ass most of the time. The "music" is about as vapid too.

#......Go ahead....Bite the Big Apple....Don't mind the Maggots.....Uh Huh...#