I'm going to start a new thread, dovetailing off the "new north american gig" e-mail:


Gazza Wrote:
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> very stupid e-mail to send...what kind of fan club
> sends out correspondence that says that a show may
> "potentially" be announced in the next few days?
>

Yeah, it was kind of a ridiculous e-mail, bordering on spam really...

Even IF there's one more North American gig, why not wait until you're ready to announce then send it out...

It would be different if there were a DOZEN new venues... then they could tease you with "get ready for 10 new dates to be announced in the U.S."... but just one new "potential" date... it's almost like the e-mail guy didn't have anything to do so he sends out this spam.

AGAIN... all this crap is not being run by the Stones themselves. This crassly commercial obtuse fan club pre-sale crap is all by tour management. The tour seems to be running efficiently, but the "image" of it is not positive.

On this topic, they could have created an image of a "legendary blues rock band" playing better than ever. Unusual duos with "special guests" stuff like that... instead we're treated to a "corporate spam fest".

The Super Bowl is just the icing on the cake of this... taking great musicians and turning them into "corporate promoters".

Shame, because they could have used the ABB CD itself as sort of a "back to the basic roots" launching pad. Play Back of My Hand more often, emphasize the blues a bit, have special guests almost every nite... AND ABOVE ALL AVOID THE IMAGE OF BEING CORPORATE MONEY WHORES... exactly the image Cohl has created for them.

The saving grace of the tour is that the music is pretty good. NOW, they're gonna have to have another tour around 2009-2010 just to say they played another decade AND to clear up this "spam stink" of ABB.

"It's just that demon life has got me in it's sway..."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-12-24 23:58 by BornOnTheBayou.

We all keep assuming that we know what image the Stones want to project and that it is of the legendary blues rock band.

But wait...Mick took the Knighhood. Keith is building another Carribean hideaway out in the Turks, islands so ritzy most of us have not even heard of them.

Charlie has his race horses and gentleman's farm.

We also clamour that they need to scale it back...what better way to do it then to appeal to the class of people that they have become, the landed wealthy. Be careful what you wish for, maybe the next tour the Stones will play smaller venues, clubs and theaters, but only to crowds that can afford it. Who is to say that this is not the image they want?! They are international business men and performers, not avatars of an altrusitic society. And what then? If they play small clubs and perform rarities and blues numbers like we all scream for, but then charge a $1000 per ticket, do we praise them or curse them?

And before anyone gets crappy about that, if you can't handle the fact that artists are doing it for the money, stop and realize that if they do not adjust they end up like Kurt Cobain. Mozart Died poor, but not because he wanted to. Robert Johnson would have sung the blues from a million dollar home in the Hollywood hills if he could have. Maybe the Stones as they get older enjoy being "the vintage wine" of the performing arts. Perhaps they have no problem being the equivalent of a $1000 bottle of cognac, something that only a few can afford. In a world where $15-$20 cocktails with name brand vodkas are now chic and trendy, maybe the Stones see appealing to a small priveledged group of people as their niche now.

Honestly, I think they would make MORE TOTAL DOLLARS and keep their "brand image" more valuable by STICKING TO THE MUSIC and not to silly gigs at the Super Bowl and e-mail spam...

In the end, they'd make more money, I've got no problem with any professional maximizing their worth. I think this fan club shit is just maximizing the income of the leeches and bureaucrats in Cohl's organization, not maximizing the value of the Stones.

"It's just that demon life has got me in it's sway..."

Cohl isn't some evil mastermind, he is just another hired hand doing what exactly what the band wants him to. I don't think the Stones care about whatever ridiculous image we would like to project on them, they just want their money and as much of it as they can squeeze out of us. And look at the sales of A Bigger Bang - just the music doesn't sell anymore.

Dan Wrote:
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> Cohl isn't some evil mastermind, he is just
> another hired hand doing what exactly what the
> band wants him to.

Do you think that the band gave Cohl specific instructions to set up this fan club, and run the memberships ?

Do you think they gave hims specific instructions to send out a lame e-mail announcing "an upcoming POSSIBLE new gig" in north america?


I don't think the Stones care
> about whatever ridiculous image we would like to
> project on them, they just want their money and as
> much of it as they can squeeze out of us.

It's hard to believe that artists of any sort... musicians, painters, writers, etc. just care about money only and don't give a damn about their finished product or their image to their fans.





"It's just that demon life has got me in it's sway..."

C'mon....

It's just a business, they do it quite well.

If the shows are too expensive for you, wait till a DVD comes out...a DVD costs about the price of 3 Venue beers or Parking at a venue.

If they tour again in a couple years, you can bet the tickets will be more expensive.

BornOnTheBayou Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Dan Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Cohl isn't some evil mastermind, he is just
> > another hired hand doing what exactly what
> the
> > band wants him to.
>
> Do you think that the band gave Cohl specific
> instructions to set up this fan club, and run the
> memberships ?

Maybe, maybe not but I am sure he got their approval before proceeding in 2002 when coming up with a way to maximize their profits.


>
> Do you think they gave hims specific instructions
> to send out a lame e-mail announcing "an upcoming
> POSSIBLE new gig" in north america?
>

I am sure it was approved at the highest levels (i.e. Mick, Keith, Charlie) as a way to sell more fan club memberships.


>
> I don't think the Stones care
> > about whatever ridiculous image we would like
> to
> > project on them, they just want their money
> and as
> > much of it as they can squeeze out of us.
>
> It's hard to believe that artists of any sort...
> musicians, painters, writers, etc. just care about
> money only and don't give a damn about their
> finished product or their image to their fans.
>
>


Ask Mick, Keith and Charlie if they consider themselves artists. I think the most appropriate description is "virtual corporation" and thats out of Keith's mouth, not mine.

Does anyone care about an additional show in the US ? They played there 55 shows.
I think it is more appropriate to announce a Tour in Australia, New-Zealand and Japan. Because every band is going there and I think local in those 3 countries will not have enough money to attend a Stones Show.

1) As for the image mistake, I agree - but it touches only hardcore fans - average audience do not receive email from the RS fan club.

2) This vague post referring to a mysterious show to be announced soon is not stupid. The old bastards play a sort of subliminal trick. It means in short "keep your money for us and don't spend to much in silly, expensive gift and food for Christmas" - You know why ? I bet the show is yet scheduled, but they have still to set up a few thing before to announce it. Smart move.

The sad thing is that if the promotion and website were being managed in a professional manner they would be making even more money. Look at how much they are still making given the jackasses pissing everyone off. The fact is they have lost a lot of repeat business from fans who just don't want to deal with being disrespected any further.

The CD is decent enough, the shows are still entertaining, it is the CD promotion, tour promotion, ticket sales, website, and all things business related that are underperforming. Cohl is an idiot, has no understanding of custromer service, and frankly too distracted by U2.

The Stones should have dumped him and gotten someone fully dedicated to their business interests.

I would have gone to Europe for a half dozen more shows, but frankly didn't like how the sales were handled and just walked away.

Cohl makes money for the Stones. If he did the same for me I would not give rats ass about my image. Sad but true... Life is a bitch and one day you marry one.
That´s why I love Stones tours. It´s better to drink with the boys at Mustang Harry´s than take sh*t from wife at home. I have the albums the bootlegs if I want to hear good music. When I travel I want to rock my ass off and have beers with my friends.
It´s only rock´n´roll....

JK Wrote:
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> Cohl makes money for the Stones. If he did the
> same for me I would not give rats ass about my
> image.

Are you an artist ?



"It's just that demon life has got me in it's sway..."

No, I´m not an artist but I´d rather be rich than have a good image:-)
And yes, I would give money to charity.

Many people blame Cohl, but I have a feeling Mick is happy with him. Otherwise he would have been gone for a long time. Maybe the Stones are happy with their current image.... Each of us has a vision about the "real/ultimate Stones" and when they don´t match it we blame the Stones. The fact is that they are 60-years old rich men who have hired Cohl to work the way they (Keith included) want him to- Also rs.com does what they want. Many people say tickets are too expensive... Maybe they are not interested in people who can´t afford current prices. If I remember correct Cohl has said something like "it´s better to sell 20.000 tickets at 450$ than 50.000 at 100$".
Even if they had their "old image" and cheaper tickets Robbie Williams would propably sell more tickets, but that´s the way of life. If you think about the Stones they really haven´t changed that much, but the world around them and many of us have changed. Klein got them a top record deal, 1970 people were rioting in Helsinki "because the tickets were too expensive". They were 3,4€....
I don´t think that the Stones are dangerous anymore, but I think that even at the age of 60 they still are the greatest r´n´r band in the world. And they owe us nothing.

The business part has always been bigger than the music part of the "music business", Stoneswise and otherwise.