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Re: Warhorses as of 2015
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: August 2, 2015 06:52

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MidnightDevilRambler
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Stoneage
I think you are confusing me with Turner68 here, MDR!

Thanks for the clarification.thumbs up
Sorry about that. The nested quotes can get a bit confusing.

It happens. It happens to anyone. It happens here, it happens anywhere. It... huh.

Well, anyway, it happens.

Re: Warhorses as of 2015
Posted by: Turner68 ()
Date: August 2, 2015 06:58

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GasLightStreet
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MidnightDevilRambler
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Stoneage
I think you are confusing me with Turner68 here, MDR!

Thanks for the clarification.thumbs up
Sorry about that. The nested quotes can get a bit confusing.

It happens. It happens to anyone. It happens here, it happens anywhere. It... huh.

Well, anyway, it happens.

It's good to happen here... It's good to happen anywhere

Re: Warhorses as of 2015
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: August 2, 2015 07:00

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Turner68
no, it just said "as of 2015".

the term warhorse was used by keith first i believe, where he talked about how when they go on tour they "dust off the old warhorses" to play.

"i'm free" did not become a warhorse just because they played it at almost every show on the '69 tour.

YGMR was hardly played at all on the 2015 tour, so even with your framing, it still isn't a war horse.

That's strange. As of 2015 means... up to now. Not 'strictly this year'. So... YGMR is indeed a warhorse. Paint It Black, according to setlist.fm/stats/the-rolling-stones-bd6ad22, is the next warhorse, especially since 1989 even though it hasn't been played as much as YGMR.

Re: Warhorses as of 2015
Posted by: Turner68 ()
Date: August 2, 2015 07:31

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GasLightStreet
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Turner68
no, it just said "as of 2015".

the term warhorse was used by keith first i believe, where he talked about how when they go on tour they "dust off the old warhorses" to play.

"i'm free" did not become a warhorse just because they played it at almost every show on the '69 tour.

YGMR was hardly played at all on the 2015 tour, so even with your framing, it still isn't a war horse.

That's strange. As of 2015 means... up to now. Not 'strictly this year'. So... YGMR is indeed a warhorse. Paint It Black, according to setlist.fm/stats/the-rolling-stones-bd6ad22, is the next warhorse, especially since 1989 even though it hasn't been played as much as YGMR.

you must not be a native speaker. one can say "as of 2015" so that it is clear to someone reading the post in 2016 that the post was referring to 2015.

you're missing the definition of warhorse. it's a classic song that the stones have played for years and years, that their fans demand they play. Satisfaction is a warhorse. Doom and Gloom is not. It doesn't matter how much they play Doom and Gloom, or YGMR, they are not warhorses, because most people do not go to the shows year in and year out expecting to hear them. everyone goes expecting to hear satisfaction, and has been since 1965.

after keith coined the phrase warhorse, people started to use "warhorse" as short hand for the classics that the stones play every show. they even began to complain that the warhorses are played too often. notice that the definition of warhorse is *not* how often it is played, but rather whether or not it's a classic the fans demand to hear. the very fact that keith said that the "dust off the old warhorses" implies that warhorses are a) old and b) not necessarily played the most.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-08-02 07:35 by Turner68.

Re: Warhorses as of 2015
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: August 3, 2015 01:09

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Turner68
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GasLightStreet
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Turner68
no, it just said "as of 2015".

the term warhorse was used by keith first i believe, where he talked about how when they go on tour they "dust off the old warhorses" to play.

"i'm free" did not become a warhorse just because they played it at almost every show on the '69 tour.

YGMR was hardly played at all on the 2015 tour, so even with your framing, it still isn't a war horse.

That's strange. As of 2015 means... up to now. Not 'strictly this year'. So... YGMR is indeed a warhorse. Paint It Black, according to setlist.fm/stats/the-rolling-stones-bd6ad22, is the next warhorse, especially since 1989 even though it hasn't been played as much as YGMR.

you must not be a native speaker. one can say "as of 2015" so that it is clear to someone reading the post in 2016 that the post was referring to 2015.

I got that. But it says, as well, up to 2015. Which means, encompassing ALL of their years. That's my understanding of it. Just because of one tour in a year with certain songs doesn't eliminate the fact that a lot of those songs have been played for eons.

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Turner68
you're missing the definition of warhorse. it's a classic song that the stones have played for years and years, that their fans demand they play. Satisfaction is a warhorse. Doom and Gloom is not. It doesn't matter how much they play Doom and Gloom, or YGMR, they are not warhorses, because most people do not go to the shows year in and year out expecting to hear them. everyone goes expecting to hear satisfaction, and has been since 1965.


See... that's a bit off. If they play YGMR for years and years on almost every tour, it becomes a warhorse. They didn't play Satisfaction (as well as some others) on every tour - and for tours even - yet it's a warhorse. I don't think it's just what people expect to hear, it is also, unfortunately, what the Stones play. I do not elect YGMR to be a warhorse, the Stones have made it one. It's not a hit. It's not a classic. Yet... they play it on every goddamn tour.


Quote
Turner68
after keith coined the phrase warhorse, people started to use "warhorse" as short hand for the classics that the stones play every show. they even began to complain that the warhorses are played too often. notice that the definition of warhorse is *not* how often it is played, but rather whether or not it's a classic the fans demand to hear. the very fact that keith said that the "dust off the old warhorses" implies that warhorses are a) old and b) not necessarily played the most.

I agree with that. It's just... well, what I said about YGMR! In that case Paint It Black and Street Fighting Man are warhorses. YGMR? It's become a warhorse because they've made it one. They dust it off for every tour. It's 2015. It came out in 1994. It's 21 years old. Consider Honky Tonk Women in 1978... a song they have to play, sure, but they also liked playing it. It wasn't even 10 years old yet. Somehow they feel that way about YGMR it seems.

So they didn't play it nearly as much on the 2015 tour. It's still a warhorse. In the name of tours anyway. A modern warhorse - whatever.

Re: Warhorses as of 2015
Posted by: Turner68 ()
Date: August 3, 2015 01:13

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GasLightStreet
Quote
Turner68
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GasLightStreet
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Turner68
no, it just said "as of 2015".

the term warhorse was used by keith first i believe, where he talked about how when they go on tour they "dust off the old warhorses" to play.

"i'm free" did not become a warhorse just because they played it at almost every show on the '69 tour.

YGMR was hardly played at all on the 2015 tour, so even with your framing, it still isn't a war horse.

That's strange. As of 2015 means... up to now. Not 'strictly this year'. So... YGMR is indeed a warhorse. Paint It Black, according to setlist.fm/stats/the-rolling-stones-bd6ad22, is the next warhorse, especially since 1989 even though it hasn't been played as much as YGMR.

you must not be a native speaker. one can say "as of 2015" so that it is clear to someone reading the post in 2016 that the post was referring to 2015.

I got that. But it says, as well, up to 2015. Which means, encompassing ALL of their years. That's my understanding of it. Just because of one tour in a year with certain songs doesn't eliminate the fact that a lot of those songs have been played for eons.

Quote
Turner68
you're missing the definition of warhorse. it's a classic song that the stones have played for years and years, that their fans demand they play. Satisfaction is a warhorse. Doom and Gloom is not. It doesn't matter how much they play Doom and Gloom, or YGMR, they are not warhorses, because most people do not go to the shows year in and year out expecting to hear them. everyone goes expecting to hear satisfaction, and has been since 1965.


See... that's a bit off. If they play YGMR for years and years on almost every tour, it becomes a warhorse. They didn't play Satisfaction (as well as some others) on every tour - and for tours even - yet it's a warhorse. I don't think it's just what people expect to hear, it is also, unfortunately, what the Stones play. I do not elect YGMR to be a warhorse, the Stones have made it one. It's not a hit. It's not a classic. Yet... they play it on every goddamn tour.


Quote
Turner68
after keith coined the phrase warhorse, people started to use "warhorse" as short hand for the classics that the stones play every show. they even began to complain that the warhorses are played too often. notice that the definition of warhorse is *not* how often it is played, but rather whether or not it's a classic the fans demand to hear. the very fact that keith said that the "dust off the old warhorses" implies that warhorses are a) old and b) not necessarily played the most.

I agree with that. It's just... well, what I said about YGMR! In that case Paint It Black and Street Fighting Man are warhorses. YGMR? It's become a warhorse because they've made it one. They dust it off for every tour. It's 2015. It came out in 1994. It's 21 years old. Consider Honky Tonk Women in 1978... a song they have to play, sure, but they also liked playing it. It wasn't even 10 years old yet. Somehow they feel that way about YGMR it seems.

So they didn't play it nearly as much on the 2015 tour. It's still a warhorse. In the name of tours anyway. A modern warhorse - whatever.

fair enough, we only really disagree on the definition of warhorse. to me, it means one of their classic songs, which YGMR will never be, since it's not very good. to you, it means a song they play all the time. to quote naturalist, "peace". :-)

Re: Warhorses as of 2015
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: August 3, 2015 04:15

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Turner68
fair enough, we only really disagree on the definition of warhorse. to me, it means one of their classic songs, which YGMR will never be, since it's not very good. to you, it means a song they play all the time. to quote naturalist, "peace". :-)

HA HA! Ya see? You just figured out the other half of it. As I stated, I agree with you. I'm not sure where you draw the line but for me, Start Me Up is the last warhorse regarding hits songs. It's just that... the Stones, let's say, have forced YGMR to become a live warhorse (it could be argued that UOTN and RAAHP have become 'modern day' warhorses, where as Waiting On A Friend hasn't).

Perhaps you've brought up an interesting aspect - what exactly is a warhorse.

Songs they have to play?
Songs they should play?
Songs they play too much?
Songs they play too much that people don't want to hear because there are better ones to play instead even though the Stones insist on playing it?

I think that's where YGMR fits in, that last one.

Re: Warhorses as of 2015
Posted by: Stoneage ()
Date: August 3, 2015 14:47

Of course you could define a warhorse in many different ways (besides its original meaning). I would go for "most frequently songs played live on tour". The top 15 live songs on Setlist.fm
would certainly qualify as warhorses on my list. And a song like You Got Me Rocking is, in fact, more frequently played than Satisfaction if you divide the rotation number with number of tours or years.

Re: Warhorses as of 2015
Posted by: mgguy ()
Date: August 3, 2015 23:03

Maybe they should write a song for the new album titled "warhorse".

Re: Warhorses as of 2015
Posted by: HMS ()
Date: August 3, 2015 23:19

Warhorses couldn't drag me away

Re: Warhorses as of 2015
Posted by: mgguy ()
Date: August 3, 2015 23:34

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HMS
Warhorses couldn't drag me away
HA! I like it.
I know I sang you, along time ago...

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