Considering the name of the song is 'Rough Justice,' I urge my fellow IORR-ers to PROVE (law-court style) to me why this is a "good song," or a "classic" as it's so often called on this board. To me it sounds derivative and boring. After a promising beginning (very 'Faces-sounding), it just fails to go anywhere. And the lyrics: just horrendous. "you know i'll never break your heart?" BOOOORING. Even the abysmal cock line is better than that! And let's not even mention how bad it sounds live . . . oh, whoops, I think I just mentioned it!

Before I get flamed (RJ style), let me just say the requisite, "I'm a huge Stones fan." I'm just wondering why so many of my fellow fans like this song, which I really consider only a step or two above "heartbreaker."

Roll on, Madrid! (but please play RFD, IWTL, or BOMH instead of RJ!)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-07-03 20:15 by nikkibong.

You think Heartbreaker sucks??

afraid so, lizard. it's on my bottom 20 Stones songs list . . .



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2006-07-03 20:22 by nikkibong.

Ok.

Then I don't think there's hope for you liking Rough Justice.

I agree the lyrics are cheesy. But the overall feel is alright. But, if this is the supposed highlight of the album..

well everybody knows that SSMC, IWTL, RFD, and BOMH are the highlights of the album. everybody that's enlightened, that is . . .

Alright, Nikki, I'll bite.

I love Rough Justice and Rough Justice Pt. II (aka Oh No Not You Again) not for the songs themselves or the lyrics but for the delivery. They rock like nothing since the early '80s.

Let's break it down:

Mick - way up in the mix to the point where it sounds like he's overloaded. Sneering, rude . . . basically doing a "Mick Jagger", but who does it better? He also hasn't sounded that young in years.

Keith - Chuck-ing it up big time. Great loud guitar tones.

Ronnie - Invoking his Faces past. Great slide, too. The roller coaster is cresting!

Charlie - Holy Mother of God is he rocking.

All the soul and funk and reggae and groove stuff they've put out over the last few albums has been great, but they haven't full-on, flat-out rocked like this since, what - Neighbors? No back-up singers, no horns, no polish - it's quintessential Stones without sounding like another exercise in open G.

JuanTCB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> Ronnie- The roller coaster is cresting!
>



Thanks, Juan. Though I would say that many tracks on UC, SW, and VL rock as well as neighbours. (a song i truly love, by the way!)

He's right.

i'll assume 'he' means nikkibong . . .

okay i'll bite - but first let's go back back back in time to that day - remember? when we were all hovering here waiting to hear the new single for the first time -
remember that? and the collective dazed "uhhh" when what it turned out to be was Streets of Love?
and then how like ten minutes later while we were still reeling from that they spun around and smashed us in the head with Rough Justice
and it was ohhhhh let me hear you say ~*YEAH!*~
~*it's the Rolling Stones!*~

but anyway! a case for Rough Justice, or a start of one anyway:

~ the opening is so fierce and gritty like some nasty little predator ripping at something
~ it's got that great big bossy sound, all down the line, it just goes thundering past, roaring and clanging
with whoa-nelly yikes and yelps and those cool "ghost vocals" buried in it
~ hear that guitar?! that is Keith Richards, baby - no one else!
~ and listen to Ronnie go! that slide is a joy, a witty mad commentary
~ the lyric is a riot, and the Mick spits it real mean just like he should

(oh and wouldn't it be interesting to know when they changed the lyric?
from "you know i'm gonna" to "you know i'll never"?)


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2006-07-03 21:01 by with sssoul.

>> Ronnie- The roller coaster is cresting! <<

smile: ~*YEAH!*~
nice case you make there, JuanTCB! i truly didn't read yours before posting mine,
i just write slow. :E


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith

Well stated Juan. I think RJ makes the case for itself. It is a very solid song. A classic Stones rocker that anyone would instantly recognize as a Stones song.
They skipped this type of song on B2B so I think the last of these was You Got Me Rocking. SW had Sad ..., Rock N a Hard Place that were this type of song that they got carried away with horns and backup vocals. DW & UC had several each.
I agree it is not the best of ABB but it is easy to see why this was the opener to ABB and the first single.

I forgot about SOL being the first single. I had successfully blocked this one out of my mind and will try to do so again!

oh yeah and one more thing:
the lyrics of RJ lie right on the beat - none of that emPHAsis on an unnaTURal syLAble stuff -
it's a fine point, but it ~*rocks*~


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith

>Thanks, Juan. Though I would say that many tracks on UC, SW, and VL rock as well as >neighbours. (a song i truly love, by the way!)

True dat, Nikki! I should have been clearer - I was talking more about the production/sound of RJ as opposed to the rockers on the last few. It sounds so raw compared to the boominess of DW, the sterlie SW, and, even though I love 'em, both VL and B2B are really dry-sounding.

Undercover, though, yeah - that was the last one with the raunch.

"I'm just wondering why so many of my fellow fans like this song, which I really consider only a step or two above "heartbreaker."

Uh, Nik? 2 steps above Heartbreaker might be classic in most folks book.

For me Rough Justice is remarkable in the fact you have Charlie (in his mid-sixties) with his drum kit just in your face, Mick snarling like a wildcat, Ronnie is loose like a cannon with his slide and of course you have Keith being Keith. I absolutely dare you to show me another rock band that can lay it down (when they're in their sixties) with the power exhibited on Rough Justice. This thought truly gives me pause when I think about the Rolling Stones and their longevity.

rough justice is a good hard-rocking song. Loud guitars. Its fun and catchy. too early to say if its classic

Heartbreaker is a good song too an I think a classic. its catchy as well. Billy preston makes it it funky. MT lead gituar is good and KR on Wa Wa pedal is cool. plus socialy relevent lyrics.

with sssoul Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> okay i'll bite - but first let's go back back back
> in time to that day - remember? when we were all
> hovering here waiting to hear the new single for
> the first time -
> remember that? and the collective dazed "uhhh"
> when what it turned out to be was Streets of Love?
>
> and then how like ten minutes later while we were
> still reeling from that they spun around and
> smashed us in the head with Rough Justice
> and it was ohhhhh let me hear you say ~*YEAH!*~
> ~*it's the Rolling Stones!*~
>
> but anyway! a case for Rough Justice, or a start
> of one anyway:
>
> ~ the opening is so fierce and gritty like some
> nasty little predator ripping at something
> ~ it's got that great big bossy sound, all down
> the line, it just goes thundering past, roaring
> and clanging
> with whoa-nelly yikes and yelps and those cool
> "ghost vocals" buried in it
> ~ hear that guitar?! that is Keith Richards, baby
> - no one else!
> ~ and listen to Ronnie go! that slide is a joy, a
> witty mad commentary
> ~ the lyric is a riot, and the Mick spits it real
> mean just like he should
>
> (oh and wouldn't it be interesting to know when
> they changed the lyric?
> from "you know i'm gonna" to "you know i'll
> never"?)

I agree completely, and you said it much better than I ever could.

ohnonotyouagain Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> with sssoul Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> (.....)
> I agree completely, and you said it much better
> than I ever could.

She does that towards me too. It's her trade mark.

livewithme Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Well stated Juan. I think RJ makes the case for
> itself. It is a very solid song. A classic
> Stones rocker that anyone would instantly
> recognize as a Stones song.

> They skipped this type of song on B2B so I think
> the last of these was You Got Me Rocking.

Skipped this type of song on B2B? Too Tight? Flip The Switch?
Play Too Tight loud and it will rattle your bones!

"....ONLY a step or two above "heartbreaker." as in 'only a bit better than a GREAT song?!? ouch. so why do you need anyone to justify a song that you think is better than Heartbreaker?!?! as one of the regular stoners on the board, i'm going to have to revoke the "bong" from your nickname. sorry. (i'll give it back when i'm done)

for all pertinant comments i have about RJ, see juan's post. RJ is not a hall-of-famer; it and ONNYA are simply the most flat-out rockers we've been given in 20 years.

-winterbong

winter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
i'm going to
> have to revoke the "bong" from your nickname.
> sorry. (i'll give it back when i'm done)
>
> -winterbong

LOL! Great idea. Hmmm, pass that over here for a second, would you? I want to inspect it for dangerous carcinogenics. Can't be too careful you know. Thanks!

onnyabong

Played the B-Bang album this week, nothing wrong with the songs.
I think the problem is the mix, most the harder songs have that same background sound, bit messy and not clear in my opinion.

__________________________

Once upon a time!!!I really like this song and I will always do...it cooks!!R&R foreevah!!

I think its good live but I dont think it needs back up vocals. Just the basic band doing it would be better.

Yeah!! mr Woody and mr Richards!!

I am afraid I cannot help make any kind of case.


I dont like the chicken song .

If they would drop the stupid lyrics then musically ok

but that is it.

Seriously gets on my nerves.


IMHO best song on the album is

Back of my Hand

Also like

Rain Fall down

and think it is perfect for the B- Stage.

The lyrics are damm fine!!They work out allright on the farm anyway!

the Riff on ruff justice reminds me of something the black crowes would do. has anyone else ever thought that?

with sssoul Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> (oh and wouldn't it be interesting to know when
> they changed the lyric?
> from "you know i'm gonna" to "you know i'll
> never"?)

artfully worded defense of RJ, with sssoul.

where did you read that they changed the lyric?

drew