Hi Everyone,

I often heard about old Rolling Stones releases containing songs that were produced in 'fake stereo.' I've never heard fake stereo.

Is Little Red Rooster and Good Times, Bad Times in fake stereo? I'd love to have those songs or any song that I don't have in stereo, in stereo.

I've heard horrible comments about fake stereo but I'd still like to experience them for myself.

Is there anywhere to download these fake stereo tracks?

As always, thank you to all of the wonderful people on this forum who help each other.

Exile Stones



A question about stereo/mono thread
[iorr.org]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-28 13:52 by exilestones.

It would be a cool project for someone to collect all of the fake stereo tracks. It's Stones history!

just look on you tube, there are people making their own stereo versions of mono songs. I don't know how they do it but they are out there

Quote
coffeepotman
just look on you tube, there are people making their own stereo versions of mono songs. I don't know how they do it but they are out there

Thanks for the tip!

I bought "Big Hits (High Tide and Green Grass)" without noticing it was Mono Reprocessed For Stereo

Took it to a party and I was so embarrassed by how weedy it sounded.

That is when I started collecting Stones original 7" vinyl singles

Oh, I guarantee you - if you've heard Stones vinyl LPs on London/Decca, you've heard fake stereo.

My favorites ‘fake stereo’ were the ones "created" by Ruudtes combined with audio or video montages (he made over a hundred). Each time his "videos" were quickly blocked by YouTube…. it seems to have been permanently banned from YouTube and Vimeo since then.
With his consent I used his versions of MSG 69 on FP 041.
Here's an example with the 'You’ve Just Made My Day' snippet.
[we.tl]
The stereo effect is obtained by creating a slight offset (a desynchronization of the 2 channels) Initially there is only one signal it was processed in 2 different ways (probably with filters) then the 2 channels are played with a slight time shift (see below): the 2 channels are now slightly different and slightly offset.



Hope this could have helped

Fake stereo on Japanese CDs

Big Hits (High Tide & Green Grass), UK version [P33L 25016], [P25L 25039]
01-Have You Seen Your Mother, Baby, Standing In The Shadow?
04-The Last Time
06-Not Fade Away
07-Come On
08-(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
09-Get Off Of My Cloud
10-As Tears Go By
11-19th Nervous Breakdown
14-Little Red Rooster

Big Hits Vol.2 Through The Past, Darkly, UK version [P33L 25017], [P25L 25044]
05-You Better Move On

So called 'old US ABKCO' CDs are full of out-of-phase mono tracks. I do not know if they make it on intent or that was just mastering/manufacturing error. Anyway, for many of those tracks channels do not cancel out if one will make subtraction. There will be a residual signal (in many cases quite big one). Thus, you can call all those tracks either 'poorly balanced mono' or 'out-of-phase mono' or 'fake stereo'.

As an example - Got Live If You Want It! It supposed to be in mono. But this is not 100% pure digital mono (at some places it is clearly electronically reproduced stereo) and the mix does not correspond to the original LP mono mix. To make things more funny, this old ABKCO mix was reproduced almost identically for 2002 remaster.

Electronically Reproduced Stereo on other CDs (these are easily to get) and very obvious

Flowers [ABKCO 75092]
02-Have You Seen Your Mother, Baby, Standing in the Shadow?
09-Mother's Little Helper

Through The Past Darkly US version [ABKCO 80032]
05-Mother's Little Helper
10-Have You Seen Your Mother Baby, Standing In The Shadow?

Hot Rocks [ABKCO 66672]
07-Mother's Little Helper

More Hot Rocks [ABKCO 62672]
10-Have You Seen Your Mother Baby, Standing In the Shadow?

Little Red Rooster and Good Times, Bad Times on old ABKCO CDs are as good mono as you can get. The residual signal after channel subtraction is on the level ~ -45dB.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-29 16:17 by ironbelly.

Best effect of the digital age: release of previously unheard material

Worst effect: ahistorical remastering not resembling the original releases

In life there is no happiness, only the spectre of it. -- Vladimir Putin



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-30 01:31 by andrews27.

Quote
johnnythunders
I bought "Big Hits (High Tide and Green Grass)" without noticing it was Mono Reprocessed For Stereo

Took it to a party and I was so embarrassed by how weedy it sounded.

That is when I started collecting Stones original 7" vinyl singles

Good story!

Quote
andrews27
Oh, I guarantee you - if you've heard Stones vinyl LPs on London/Decca, you've heard fake stereo.

I'm not sure that I have. Thanks

Quote
StonyRoad
My favorites ‘fake stereo’ were the ones "created" by Ruudtes combined with audio or video montages (he made over a hundred). Each time his "videos" were quickly blocked by YouTube…. it seems to have been permanently banned from YouTube and Vimeo since then.
With his consent I used his versions of MSG 69 on FP 041.
Here's an example with the 'You’ve Just Made My Day' snippet.
[we.tl]
The stereo effect is obtained by creating a slight offset (a desynchronization of the 2 channels) Initially there is only one signal it was processed in 2 different ways (probably with filters) then the 2 channels are played with a slight time shift (see below): the 2 channels are now slightly different and slightly offset.



Hope this could have helped

Very cool! Thanks. I love this thread.

Quote
ironbelly
Fake stereo on Japanese CDs

Big Hits (High Tide & Green Grass), UK version [P33L 25016], [P25L 25039]
01-Have You Seen Your Mother, Baby, Standing In The Shadow?
04-The Last Time
06-Not Fade Away
07-Come On
08-(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
09-Get Off Of My Cloud
10-As Tears Go By
11-19th Nervous Breakdown
14-Little Red Rooster

Big Hits Vol.2 Through The Past, Darkly, UK version [P33L 25017], [P25L 25044]
05-You Better Move On

Thank you for the list. I can't find there albums anywhere to download. I'll keep looking.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-10-16 04:46 by exilestones.

Quote
ironbelly
So called 'old US ABKCO' CDs are full of out-of-phase mono tracks. I do not know if they make it on intent or that was just mastering/manufacturing error. Anyway, for many of those tracks channels do not cancel out if one will make subtraction. There will be a residual signal (in many cases quite big one). Thus, you can call all those tracks either 'poorly balanced mono' or 'out-of-phase mono' or 'fake stereo'.

As an example - Got Live If You Want It! It supposed to be in mono. But this is not 100% pure digital mono (at some places it is clearly electronically reproduced stereo) and the mix does not correspond to the original LP mono mix. To make things more funny, this old ABKCO mix was reproduced almost identically for 2002 remaster.

Electronically Reproduced Stereo on other CDs (these are easily to get) and very obvious

Flowers [ABKCO 75092]
02-Have You Seen Your Mother, Baby, Standing in the Shadow?
09-Mother's Little Helper

Through The Past Darkly US version [ABKCO 80032]
05-Mother's Little Helper
10-Have You Seen Your Mother Baby, Standing In The Shadow?

Hot Rocks [ABKCO 66672]
07-Mother's Little Helper

More Hot Rocks [ABKCO 62672]
10-Have You Seen Your Mother Baby, Standing In the Shadow?

Little Red Rooster and Good Times, Bad Times on old ABKCO CDs are as good mono as you can get. The residual signal after channel subtraction is on the level ~ -45dB.

Awesome! I may have these.

Quote
andrews27
Best effect of the digital age: release of previously unheard material

Worst effect: ahistorical remastering not resembling the original releases

In life there is no happiness, only the spectre of it. -- Vladimir Putin

Great perspective.

There is so much to the Stones recordings. It's a hobby that I enjoy and will never end. Thanks everyone for all that you do to make this fun and cool. You're cool! I appreciate it.

Second best effect: free bootlegs

Second worst effect: .mp3s



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-30 19:06 by andrews27.

Quote
exilestones
It would be a cool project for someone to collect all of the fake stereo tracks. It's Stones history!

Well - it IS a cool project !
I am collecting it all, - and it is One Hell of a challenge . . . At this point I guess it includes around 125 LP’s . . . and dealing with releases from 1964 - 1982/83 - and later - regarding the few CD-releases.
I found it interesting as the Electronically Re Processed Stereo was almost whiped out when the CD-era started, - but for us who started loving The Stones early, - that was the way we heard it.
I have learned a lot ! - and I am fully aware of, that the ERPS has a bad reputation . . .
The truth is, that both awful and great productions have been made.
I hope that my collecting will end up in a kind of survey in a year or two . . . I have had this intention for the last 4 or 5 years, - but it is not a project that comes easy ! - especially because you will have to deal with some Very rare LP’s !
I’ll Be Back !

Thanks, Hendrik!

It's an awesome project.

Some of the fake stereo is excellent.

Here's a small list of some Stones tracks that have been released on Teldec, Decca, London Records or on various italian Labels on LP and with electronicly reprozessed stereo. I know there are lots more:

Around And Around 1971 Stone Age
As Tears Go By 1971 Stone Age
Blue Turns To Grey 1971 Stone Age
Can I Get A Witness 1981 RS Superstar
Confessin' The Blues 1971 Stone Age
Congratulations 1973 No Stone Unturned
I Just Wanna Make Love To You 1972 Rock 'n' Rolling Stones
I'm Moving On 1973 No Stone Unturned
If You Need Me 1971 Stone Age
It's All Over Now 1971 Stone Age
Long Long While 1973 No Stone Unturned
Money 1973 No Stone Unturned
One More Try 1971 Stone Age
Poison Ivy 1973 No Stone Unturned
Route 66 1972 Rock 'n' Rolling Stones
Sad Day 1973 No Stone Unturned
Stoned 1973 No Stone Unturned
Surprise Surprise 1973 No Stone Unturned
Tell Me - long version 1981 RS Superstar
The Last Time 1971 Stone Age
The Singer Not The Song 1973 No Stone Unturned
The Spider And The Fly 1971 Stone Age
Walking The Dog 1981 RS Superstar
Who's Driving Your Plane 1973 No Stone Unturned
You Better Move On 1981 RS Superstar
You Can Make It If You Try 1981 RS Superstar

Stone Age [www.discogs.com]
No Stone Unturned [www.discogs.com]
RS Superstar [www.discogs.com]
Rock 'n' Rolling Stones [www.discogs.com]


A special release from 2021 by TP4, "The Rolling Stones No.2" comes completely with electronicly reprozessed stereo. But there are a view things, that went wrong. ENSTL is the american "Rolling Stones Now" version. TIOMS, PIMH and DHG have dropouts. I can't believe, that this was released without any proof.

Down Home Girl (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster] DROPOUTS
Down The Road Apiece (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
Everybody Needs Somebody To Love 'TRS Now Version' (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
Grown Up Wrong (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
I Can't Be Satisfied (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
Off The Hook (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
Pain In My Heart (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster] DROPOUTS
Susie Q (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
Time Is On My Side (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster] DROPOUTS
Under The Boardwalk (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
What A Shame (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
You Can't Catch Me (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]

The Rolling Stones No. 2 (2021 Remaster by TP4) [www.qobuz.com]



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-20 11:43 by BlueTurns2Grey.

Oh Well by Fleetwood Mac is mono, but if you pull it into a DAW it's actually functioning like stereo. My guess is this is because it was run through a subtle stereo reverb when they transferred it to digital in the 80's.

Quote
BlueTurns2Grey
Here's a small list of some Stones tracks that have been released on Teldec, Decca, London Records or on various italian Labels on LP and with electronicly reprozessed stereo. I know there are lots more:

Around And Around 1971 Stone Age
As Tears Go By 1971 Stone Age
Blue Turns To Grey 1971 Stone Age
Can I Get A Witness 1981 RS Superstar
Confessin' The Blues 1971 Stone Age
Congratulations 1973 No Stone Unturned
I Just Wanna Make Love To You 1972 Rock 'n' Rolling Stones
I'm Moving On 1973 No Stone Unturned
If You Need Me 1971 Stone Age
It's All Over Now 1971 Stone Age
Long Long While 1973 No Stone Unturned
Money 1973 No Stone Unturned
One More Try 1971 Stone Age
Poison Ivy 1973 No Stone Unturned
Route 66 1972 Rock 'n' Rolling Stones
Sad Day 1973 No Stone Unturned
Stoned 1973 No Stone Unturned
Surprise Surprise 1973 No Stone Unturned
Tell Me - long version 1981 RS Superstar
The Last Time 1971 Stone Age
The Singer Not The Song 1973 No Stone Unturned
The Spider And The Fly 1971 Stone Age
Walking The Dog 1981 RS Superstar
Who's Driving Your Plane 1973 No Stone Unturned
You Better Move On 1981 RS Superstar
You Can Make It If You Try 1981 RS Superstar

Stone Age [www.discogs.com]
No Stone Unturned [www.discogs.com]
RS Superstar [www.discogs.com]
Rock 'n' Rolling Stones [www.discogs.com]


A special release from 2021 by TP4, "The Rolling Stones No.2" comes completely with electronicly reprozessed stereo. But there are a view things, that went wrong. ENSTL is the american "Rolling Stones Now" version. TIOMS, PIMH and DHG have dropouts. I can't believe, that this was released without any proof.

Down Home Girl (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster] DROPOUTS
Down The Road Apiece (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
Everybody Needs Somebody To Love 'TRS Now Version' (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
Grown Up Wrong (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
I Can't Be Satisfied (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
Off The Hook (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
Pain In My Heart (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster] DROPOUTS
Susie Q (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
Time Is On My Side (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster] DROPOUTS
Under The Boardwalk (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
What A Shame (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]
You Can't Catch Me (2021 stereo remaster) The Rolling Stones No. 2 [TP4 2021 Remaster]

The Rolling Stones No. 2 (2021 Remaster by TP4) [www.qobuz.com]

WOW! Great list. Thank you. Hendrik probably know even more fake stereo Stones to add to the list?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-21 17:58 by exilestones.

Yeah ! - it will be a long list !

It will hold almost 90 titles. To have some kind of an overwiev, I have used
Ian Mc Phersons terrific site “Time Is On Our Side” - where he numbers the titles.

All songs from No. 1 (Come On) till No. 72 (Lady Jane) have been released in
Electronically Re Processed Stereo (ERPS) and then several songs have to be added -
like Paint It Black, - HYSYMSITH - Who’s Driving Your Plane - Child Of The Moon -
and in the more obscure department Con Le Mie Lacrime (Japanese compilation) - and the material from the Got Live If You Want It - EP (Japanese compilations too)

Most songs exist in different productions, - depending on which release we are talking about.
Just an example : No 1 & No 2 were never released in ERPS in the UK, - but later ERPS’ed in different countries - in different productions.
So all in all we are talking hundreds of versions.
Sometimes I ask myself “Why am I doing this ?” . . . I suppose the answer is “ Because it is Great fun, - and nobody else seems to have done it !

There is a lot of stories in the story, - like the problems with the Chess recordings.
Recorded in true Stereo - folded down to Mono - and then produced in ERPS !
- Normally with a very poor result . . .

I’ll be back with more . . . .
- and just a clarifying : My ERPS-“project” is entirely based on official releases, - whether it is vinyl or CD !



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-22 12:44 by HenrikBB.

For those interested. I've got 19th Nervous Breakdown in fake stereo, recorded at RCA Studio, Los Angeles 1965. Alternate mix.

wetransfer



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-30 12:41 by Mack Jigger.

Is this one fake too?

What a Shame no label 2007

[dbboots.com]

[we.tl]

Quote
Mack Jigger
For those interested. I've got 19th Nervous Breakdown in fake stereo, recorded at RCA Studio, Los Angeles 1965. Alternate mix.

wetransfer

Thanks, Mick Jigger! How's Keith Rickards?

I was actually looking for this CD because I read that it has the 1965 mix of "The Under Assistant West Coast Man." There mast be a few goodies on here.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-31 11:28 by exilestones.

Quote
edwinholland
Is this one fake too?

What a Shame no label 2007

[dbboots.com]

[we.tl]

Thanks, Edwin. I'm not sure if it's fake but I'm glad to get it. Thank you!

I'll give it a listen and see if I can figure out if it's fake. There's people here who would know better than me.

Quote
exilestones

Quote
edwinholland
Is this one fake too?

What a Shame no label 2007

[dbboots.com]

[we.tl]

Thanks, Edwin. I'm not sure if it's fake but I'm glad to get it. Thank you!

I'll give it a listen and see if I can figure out if it's fake. There's people here who would know better than me.

This is real stereo and was released officially on "The Rolling Stones, Now" [CD 820 133-2]. The channels might been swapped here.

Quote
HenrikBB


There is a lot of stories in the story, - like the problems with the Chess recordings.
Recorded in true Stereo - folded down to Mono - and then produced in ERPS !
- Normally with a very poor result . . .

It's crazy!

Quote
HenrikBB
I’ll be back with more . . . .
- and just a clarifying : My ERPS-“project” is entirely based on official releases, - whether it is vinyl or CD !

It would be good to have a list of ERPS songs then build on the list of where to find them.

It would be great to have every ERPS digitally but may of them only seem to be on vinyl.

Quote
BlueTurns2Grey
Here's a small list of some Stones tracks that have been released on Teldec, Decca, London Records or on various italian Labels on LP and with electronically reprocessed stereo. I know there are lots more:

Around And Around 1971 Stone Age
As Tears Go By 1971 Stone Age
Blue Turns To Grey 1971 Stone Age
Can I Get A Witness 1981 RS Superstar
Confessin' The Blues 1971 Stone Age
Congratulations 1973 No Stone Unturned
I Just Wanna Make Love To You 1972 Rock 'n' Rolling Stones
I'm Moving On 1973 No Stone Unturned
If You Need Me 1971 Stone Age
It's All Over Now 1971 Stone Age
Long Long While 1973 No Stone Unturned
Money 1973 No Stone Unturned
One More Try 1971 Stone Age
Poison Ivy 1973 No Stone Unturned
Route 66 1972 Rock 'n' Rolling Stones
Sad Day 1973 No Stone Unturned
Stoned 1973 No Stone Unturned
Surprise Surprise 1973 No Stone Unturned
Tell Me - long version 1981 RS Superstar
The Last Time 1971 Stone Age
The Singer Not The Song 1973 No Stone Unturned
The Spider And The Fly 1971 Stone Age
Walking The Dog 1981 RS Superstar
Who's Driving Your Plane 1973 No Stone Unturned
You Better Move On 1981 RS Superstar
You Can Make It If You Try 1981 RS Superstar

Stone Age [www.discogs.com]
No Stone Unturned [www.discogs.com]
RS Superstar [www.discogs.com]
Rock 'n' Rolling Stones [www.discogs.com]

These albums were never released on CD.



Can I Get A Witness
Tell Me - long version
Walking The Dog
You Better Move On
You Can Make It If You Try




Around And Around
As Tears Go By
Blue Turns To Grey
Confessin' The Blues
If You Need Me
It's All Over Now
One More Try
The Last Time
The Spider And The Fly






A1 (I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
A4 I Just Want To Make Love To You
A6 I Wanna Be Your Man
B2 Get Off Of My Cloud
B3 Not Fade Away
B5 She Said "Yeah"





A1 Poison Ivy
A3 Surprise Surprise
A5 Stoned
A6 Sad Day
B1 Money
B2 Congratulations
B3 I'm Moving On
B5 Long Long While
B6 Who's Driving Your Plane
On back cover: "Stereo - The tracks marked * are mono recordings electronically reprocessed to give stereo effect on stereo equipment."
(All tracks except A2, A4 and B4) are marked *)




Tracks A1, A3, A5, A6, B1, B4 are mono recordings electronically reprocessed to give stereo effect on stereo equipment.


A1 Route 66
A2 The Singer Not the Song *
A3 Come On
A4 Child of the Moon *
A5 Bye Bye Johnny
A6 Down The Road Apiece
B1 I Just Wanna Make Love To You
B2 Congratulations
B3 I'm Moving On
B4 19th Nervous Breakdown *
B5 Long Long While
B6 Who's Driving Your Plane

[www.discogs.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-10-17 14:12 by exilestones.