Tell Me :
Talk
Pretty sure the whole show got filmed, local Detroit cable access station.....only three songs circulate, but pretty bad quality.
JR
Quite agree. If by some divine providence a full MSG soundboard or video shows up, I will rest my case, stop trading/torrenting and be happy for the rest of my life. Apart from giving us the best live album of all times, the '69 tour - arguebly their greatest - has been gravely underrepresented.
We should send a young iorr'er to the Maysles brothers, disguised as trainee, and have him/her copy those reels. Hero worship or martyrdom guaranteed.
----------------------------
"Music is the frozen tapioca in the ice chest of history."
"Shit!... No shit, awright!"
This footage is available since at least the mid-80's (in better quality). The footage includes LQ, Sympathy and Stray Cat.
Mathijs
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-12-08 22:19 by Mathijs.
I have it somewhere on a VHS tape, bjut chances are bigger that I become president of the US than that I will find that tape AND a person with an actual VHS recorder.
Mathijs
ANY IDEA'S?? Yeah, first of all, this ISN'T film, Super 8 or 16 or anything else, this is Early video (that's why it's B/W). Film doesn't act that way with glitches and everything..... My theory is the guy set up a video camera on a tripod and shot the ENTIRE SHOW from that spot (they - arena security - didn't care about camera's and recorders and all that in those days, not until bootlegs became really popular and started making serious money) on a big reel of video tape (since it was much less expensive than film). Somewhere out there's someone who probably has the entire Detroit show on B/W video... WHOA, what a find that would be !!!!
DETROIT SETLIST (11/24/1969)
JJF
CAROL
SYMPATHY
STRAY CAT
LOVE IN VAIN
PRODIGAL SON
YOU GOTTA MOVE
UNDER MY THUMB
MIDNIGHT RAMBLER
LIVE WITH ME
LITTLE QUEENIE
SATISFACTION
HONKY TONK WOMEN
STREET FIGHTING MAN
(I'M FREE and GIMME SHELTER not played in Detroit)
I thought Taylor always had a solo in "Sympathy"? Any version from '69 that I've heard had Keith's solo and then Taylor's last.
It seems to be a common myth that Ya-Ya´s is riddled with overdubs and edits but it´s not. Most of the music is actually untouched. There are NO instrumental overdubs on Ya-Ya´s. Two tracks have no overdubs and edits at all (Midnight Rambler and Love In Vain). Most of the other songs have vocal overdubs because Jagger had the flu when they played MSG.
The only instrumental overdub I know of is the Keith guitar solo during the acetate version of Jumpin´ Jack Flash. The released version however is missing this overdubbed solo.
Talk about your favorite band.
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DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
melillo
()
Date: December 7, 2008 18:02
there is a video of little queenie on youtube that says its from this show, black and white and very grainy super 8 film shot, can anyone confirm this, i know i have never seen it before, sorry i dont know how to post the link but just go to youtube and search the rolling stones detroit 1969
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
Tornandfrayed
()
Date: December 7, 2008 18:22
Yep, it´s definitely from Detroit 11/24. Great footage, Keith is playing his Dan Armstrong unlike MSG.
Here is the link:
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-12-07 18:23 by Tornandfrayed.
Here is the link:
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-12-07 18:23 by Tornandfrayed.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
Amused
()
Date: December 7, 2008 18:27
never seen this before! what a wonderful footage, thanks!
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
scottkeef
()
Date: December 7, 2008 18:30
Theres how many songs on the original film of this show, three I think?
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
stone-relics
()
Date: December 7, 2008 19:09
Quote
scottkeef
Theres how many songs on the original film of this show, three I think?
Pretty sure the whole show got filmed, local Detroit cable access station.....only three songs circulate, but pretty bad quality.
JR
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
scottkeef
()
Date: December 7, 2008 20:17
I have a Johnny Winter dvd boot "Detroit Tube Works 1970". In a tv studio-would that possibly be the same station?
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
The Sicilian
()
Date: December 7, 2008 22:01
Were most of the 1969 shows played under lighted conditions?
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
Sighunt
()
Date: December 7, 2008 22:06
Boy, when I see video like that (even in the shape that it is in), it makes me angry that A: we may never see a COMPLETE show aka Madison Square Garden '69 on video ever commercially released and B: we may never hear a complete good quality audio of one of those shows released on CD (other than inferior audience boots). Sad, Sad, Sad....
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
melillo
()
Date: December 7, 2008 22:33
Agreed, its a damn shame that will probably never happen, unless of course the stones do an archive box set, ala bruce , neil , zep, dylan etc, wake me when pigs fly
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-12-07 22:42 by melillo.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-12-07 22:42 by melillo.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
filstan
()
Date: December 7, 2008 22:50
The Sicilian asked:
"Were most of the 1969 shows played under lighted conditions?"
The house lights went up late in the concerts when they played LQ, HTW, Satisfaction, and ended with SFM.
"Were most of the 1969 shows played under lighted conditions?"
The house lights went up late in the concerts when they played LQ, HTW, Satisfaction, and ended with SFM.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
NorthShoreBlues2
()
Date: December 8, 2008 05:00
incredible footage, i particularly appreciate the shots of the crowd, good stuff.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
filstan
()
Date: December 8, 2008 05:17
Yea, this is a real gem. Rockin stuff. More video from this tour would be very cool. You know the Maysles have to have more film. Hopefully it is released before we are dead and gone..
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
pmk251
()
Date: December 8, 2008 08:25
Yep, that's how I remember that tour looking. Great stuff. The band had the house lights come on toward the end of the show to stir the crowd. You can hear Jagger ask Chip to turn them on on many boots. After LQ the show headed to its finish, Satisfaction, HTW then SFM. Detroit is a notable show. There was Jagger's comment "We didn't really get it on until Detroit." A personal theory of mine is that it was that show that Taylor's Sympathy solo was first scripted in. To my knowledge there is only one previous show that he took a solo on that song. Amazing these days how effective that music was and how effective those guitars were and just how sexy it all was without all the other stuff that later became the Stones' spectacle.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
still ill
()
Date: December 8, 2008 11:58
Is this recently discovered footage?What or who was the original scource?Is there more?
Any ideas?
This is great stuff,the crowd scenes are tremendous,a real snapshot in time
Any ideas?
This is great stuff,the crowd scenes are tremendous,a real snapshot in time
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
Greg
()
Date: December 8, 2008 12:52
Quote
Sighunt
Boy, when I see video like that (even in the shape that it is in), it makes me angry that A: we may never see a COMPLETE show aka Madison Square Garden '69 on video ever commercially released and B: we may never hear a complete good quality audio of one of those shows released on CD (other than inferior audience boots). Sad, Sad, Sad....
Quite agree. If by some divine providence a full MSG soundboard or video shows up, I will rest my case, stop trading/torrenting and be happy for the rest of my life. Apart from giving us the best live album of all times, the '69 tour - arguebly their greatest - has been gravely underrepresented.
We should send a young iorr'er to the Maysles brothers, disguised as trainee, and have him/her copy those reels. Hero worship or martyrdom guaranteed.
----------------------------
"Music is the frozen tapioca in the ice chest of history."
"Shit!... No shit, awright!"
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
Mathijs
()
Date: December 8, 2008 22:17
Quote
still ill
Is this recently discovered footage?What or who was the original scource?Is there more?
Any ideas?
This is great stuff,the crowd scenes are tremendous,a real snapshot in time
This footage is available since at least the mid-80's (in better quality). The footage includes LQ, Sympathy and Stray Cat.
Mathijs
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-12-08 22:19 by Mathijs.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
still ill
()
Date: December 8, 2008 22:45
Interesting,makes me wonder what else there is out there i haven't seen
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
MCDDTLC
()
Date: December 8, 2008 23:56
Mathijs,
Can you put Sympathy on Youtube?? will buy you a beer if you do!!
MLC
Can you put Sympathy on Youtube?? will buy you a beer if you do!!
MLC
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
Mathijs
()
Date: December 9, 2008 00:22
Quote
MCDDTLC
Mathijs,
Can you put Sympathy on Youtube?? will buy you a beer if you do!!
MLC
I have it somewhere on a VHS tape, bjut chances are bigger that I become president of the US than that I will find that tape AND a person with an actual VHS recorder.
Mathijs
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
Anderson
()
Date: December 9, 2008 12:10
Oh. I got a working VHS-rocorder man...
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
HelterSkelter
()
Date: December 9, 2008 13:09
Quote
MathijsQuote
still ill
Is this recently discovered footage?What or who was the original scource?Is there more?
Any ideas?
This is great stuff,the crowd scenes are tremendous,a real snapshot in time
This footage is available since at least the mid-80's (in better quality). The footage includes LQ, Sympathy and Stray Cat.
Mathijs
ANY IDEA'S?? Yeah, first of all, this ISN'T film, Super 8 or 16 or anything else, this is Early video (that's why it's B/W). Film doesn't act that way with glitches and everything..... My theory is the guy set up a video camera on a tripod and shot the ENTIRE SHOW from that spot (they - arena security - didn't care about camera's and recorders and all that in those days, not until bootlegs became really popular and started making serious money) on a big reel of video tape (since it was much less expensive than film). Somewhere out there's someone who probably has the entire Detroit show on B/W video... WHOA, what a find that would be !!!!
DETROIT SETLIST (11/24/1969)
JJF
CAROL
SYMPATHY
STRAY CAT
LOVE IN VAIN
PRODIGAL SON
YOU GOTTA MOVE
UNDER MY THUMB
MIDNIGHT RAMBLER
LIVE WITH ME
LITTLE QUEENIE
SATISFACTION
HONKY TONK WOMEN
STREET FIGHTING MAN
(I'M FREE and GIMME SHELTER not played in Detroit)
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
Tumblin_Dice_07
()
Date: December 9, 2008 19:08
Quote
pmk251
Yep, that's how I remember that tour looking. Great stuff. The band had the house lights come on toward the end of the show to stir the crowd. You can hear Jagger ask Chip to turn them on on many boots. After LQ the show headed to its finish, Satisfaction, HTW then SFM. Detroit is a notable show. There was Jagger's comment "We didn't really get it on until Detroit." A personal theory of mine is that it was that show that Taylor's Sympathy solo was first scripted in. To my knowledge there is only one previous show that he took a solo on that song. Amazing these days how effective that music was and how effective those guitars were and just how sexy it all was without all the other stuff that later became the Stones' spectacle.
I thought Taylor always had a solo in "Sympathy"? Any version from '69 that I've heard had Keith's solo and then Taylor's last.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
pmk251
()
Date: December 9, 2008 19:33
I thought Taylor always had a solo in "Sympathy"? Any version from '69 that I've heard had Keith's solo and then Taylor's last.[/quote]
Not every show is available, but to my knowledge and with only one exception, prior to Detroit, SFTD was strictly a Taylor-rhythm, Keith-lead song. The exception is one of the Oakland shows. I discount that solo because Taylor did not solo before that performance and did not solo immediately after it. There were some equipment problems in Oakland and perhaps Taylor's single solo that night was an impromptu moment.
BTW: I think the 11/8, 2nd show was the band's best SFTD performance without a Taylor solo. It was a great night of playing by Keith. A highly recommended boot.
By Detroit and then to the end of the tour, Taylor's solo was scripted in and the song takes off. You can feel Taylor's playing inspire the band.
I have said before, that song is THE song to follow the evolving dynamics of the band during the tour. You hear right before your ears. SFTD was strictly a Keith guitar song. He was there when it was created. He played the solo early in the tour. But by the time the band got to MSG Taylor had made his mark on the song and on the band. The "Ya-Ya's" performance is one of the great live performances in RnR history.
I wonder what Keith thought when the new kid stepped into his territory with those searing leads.
Not every show is available, but to my knowledge and with only one exception, prior to Detroit, SFTD was strictly a Taylor-rhythm, Keith-lead song. The exception is one of the Oakland shows. I discount that solo because Taylor did not solo before that performance and did not solo immediately after it. There were some equipment problems in Oakland and perhaps Taylor's single solo that night was an impromptu moment.
BTW: I think the 11/8, 2nd show was the band's best SFTD performance without a Taylor solo. It was a great night of playing by Keith. A highly recommended boot.
By Detroit and then to the end of the tour, Taylor's solo was scripted in and the song takes off. You can feel Taylor's playing inspire the band.
I have said before, that song is THE song to follow the evolving dynamics of the band during the tour. You hear right before your ears. SFTD was strictly a Keith guitar song. He was there when it was created. He played the solo early in the tour. But by the time the band got to MSG Taylor had made his mark on the song and on the band. The "Ya-Ya's" performance is one of the great live performances in RnR history.
I wonder what Keith thought when the new kid stepped into his territory with those searing leads.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
HEILOOBAAS
()
Date: December 9, 2008 20:49
The "Ya-Ya's" performance is one of the great live performances in RnR history.
Hardly live. That album, w/the exception of MR, Carol and LIV is heavily overdubbed.
Hardly live. That album, w/the exception of MR, Carol and LIV is heavily overdubbed.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
scottkeef
()
Date: December 9, 2008 20:52
Theres definately a Keith, then MT lead on Ya Yas. I have ALOT of 69 tapes and I notice MT getting a turn on more than one occasion on Sympathy but not on all. Another thing that strikes as strange on 69 shows. On the raw Aud tapes sometimes JJF has the isntrumental break as on YA YA s and occasionally MT plays a scorching lead break so whats the deal? I know Keith blew alot of amps on the tour-is that when Mick got his break? Also on Live With Me even though Keith plays the lead runs, Mick plays an accomplished lead/rythm as he reproduces the studio bass run on guitar. I know its doesnt really matter but it seems like more "experimenting" went on between MT and Keith on this tour than any other. Think they were just getting used to the other? Keith seems to be torn between relinquishing the lead duties(on the majority of songs) as he did on later tours with Mick.
sorry pmk251- i didnt realize you addresssed many of these topic already but I think we may be kinda on the same page!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-12-09 20:56 by scottkeef.
sorry pmk251- i didnt realize you addresssed many of these topic already but I think we may be kinda on the same page!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-12-09 20:56 by scottkeef.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
pmk251
()
Date: December 9, 2008 21:38
I know there is an edit on the "Ya-Ya's" SFTD, but I do not recall reading that there are guitar over-dubs on that song. In any event, as far as I'm concerned all is forgiven for that record. It's simply too wonderful for me to criticize.
But to follow your point, that tour did give us definitive versions of MR and LIV without overdubs.
Yeah, the guitar interplay on this tour is my favorite. Musically and perhaps otherwise, it was the band's sexiest tour.
Sometimes Taylor played a solo on JJF and sometimes he riffed it out without one. Yeah, they were working on his place in the arrangements.
The other aspect of that tour that I find sexy is the bold statement of the setlist emphasized by the Uncle Sam top hat: The band is clearly saying that it is worthy inheritor of American RnR and blues. After this tour who would argue the point?
But to follow your point, that tour did give us definitive versions of MR and LIV without overdubs.
Yeah, the guitar interplay on this tour is my favorite. Musically and perhaps otherwise, it was the band's sexiest tour.
Sometimes Taylor played a solo on JJF and sometimes he riffed it out without one. Yeah, they were working on his place in the arrangements.
The other aspect of that tour that I find sexy is the bold statement of the setlist emphasized by the Uncle Sam top hat: The band is clearly saying that it is worthy inheritor of American RnR and blues. After this tour who would argue the point?
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
Tornandfrayed
()
Date: December 9, 2008 21:45
Quote
HEILOOBAAS
The "Ya-Ya's" performance is one of the great live performances in RnR history.
Hardly live. That album, w/the exception of MR, Carol and LIV is heavily overdubbed.
It seems to be a common myth that Ya-Ya´s is riddled with overdubs and edits but it´s not. Most of the music is actually untouched. There are NO instrumental overdubs on Ya-Ya´s. Two tracks have no overdubs and edits at all (Midnight Rambler and Love In Vain). Most of the other songs have vocal overdubs because Jagger had the flu when they played MSG.
The only instrumental overdub I know of is the Keith guitar solo during the acetate version of Jumpin´ Jack Flash. The released version however is missing this overdubbed solo.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
Tumblin_Dice_07
()
Date: December 9, 2008 22:44
Quote
pmk251
Not every show is available, but to my knowledge and with only one exception, prior to Detroit, SFTD was strictly a Taylor-rhythm, Keith-lead song. The exception is one of the Oakland shows. I discount that solo because Taylor did not solo before that performance and did not solo immediately after it. There were some equipment problems in Oakland and perhaps Taylor's single solo that night was an impromptu moment.
BTW: I think the 11/8, 2nd show was the band's best SFTD performance without a Taylor solo. It was a great night of playing by Keith. A highly recommended boot.
By Detroit and then to the end of the tour, Taylor's solo was scripted in and the song takes off. You can feel Taylor's playing inspire the band.
quote]
You learn something new everyday. Of the pre-Detroit shows, I have Ft. Collins 11/7, both Los Angelos 11/8, both Oakland 11/9, San Diego 11/10, Phoenix 11/11, Dallas 11/13, both Champaign 11/15, and Chicago 11/16. I only recently acquired Phoenix and Dallas and haven't listened to either of them yet. Chicago is a poor recording which I didn't closely listen to, and the recording of the 2nd Champaign show is incomplete and doesn't include "Sympathy". I didn't realize some of these shows didn't have a Taylor guitar solo on "Sympathy".
I agree with you about the Los Angelos show. I was sort of surprized that they sounded that tight so early in the tour. I think it's a better performance than the fabled Oakland shows.
I think the Oakland "Live'r Than You'll Ever Be" show is over rated. It's a good audience recording considering it's from 1969 but the performance is not that great, especially compared to the shows played from 11/24 on through the end of the tour.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-12-09 22:46 by Tumblin_Dice_07.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
Four Stone Walls
()
Date: December 9, 2008 22:58
ust great playing by Keith. All simple stuff but at that right pace and taking time to lurch.
Not technically difficult. There's no reason he couldn't do that now, even with arthritic hands, is there? It's all about groove/roll - and that roll factor left the band long ago. Now it's all so intense, so hurried. Jagger's moves and gestures were more effective too. You had time to get into the swing of each number - without being bombasted by it. They got your juices flowing, rather than forcing them out of you.
Not technically difficult. There's no reason he couldn't do that now, even with arthritic hands, is there? It's all about groove/roll - and that roll factor left the band long ago. Now it's all so intense, so hurried. Jagger's moves and gestures were more effective too. You had time to get into the swing of each number - without being bombasted by it. They got your juices flowing, rather than forcing them out of you.
Re: DETROIT 1969?
Posted by:
scottkeef
()
Date: December 10, 2008 00:07
It seems like there was a thread not long ago about the 2nd Champaign show recently becoming available in its entirety( I cant remember).The Dallas show you can barely tell its a concert!(and mine is 3rd gen) but the Phoenix show isnt bad although incomplete-I'm gonna go hunt down my cassette of it right now and give a listen.
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