Ok this is the @#$%& AAC and MP3 era. But I hope you listen to music on high fidelity systems too ?

I would like to know if you have a dedicated system for music with : a cd/sacd player, a musical amplifier OR if you have just one system with an audio video amplifier and a dvd/cd player.
And which ones ?

What about SACD players ? many are dvd and sacd and audio dvd (dvd/A) players. But do some of you have real and only cd/sacd player ?
what about your personal experience in listening to all the ABKCO remasters and other recordings in 2.0 or 5.1 and more (eg : multichannel Dark side of the moon which is excellent but requires of course a multichannel system).

My personal equipment is an Advance accoustic amplifier, powerful.

and an Element audio cd player (this pic is player 01. I have the 02 more recent - not sacd)


I have also a Sony DVD/SACD player (6 years old) and a Sony rdr recorder but I think about a change for a new one. But there is no blu-ray/sacd for the moment.

Speakers are Infinity Alpha 40 and the 5.1 ones are FOCAL Sib



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-08-08 14:27 by toomuchforme.

Be aware that most,if not all," real and only cd/sacd players " cannot pass the true DSD signal of SA-CD's.The only two connections that can do this are (1) HDMI version 1.2a or above OR (2) I Link a.k.a. Firewire.These connections can be found on the DVD \ CD \ DVD-Audio \ SA-CD combo players.Option two has become quite rare lately.The industry is going towards option 1. Also take into account that not all players with the HDMI 1.2a or higher connection can pass the DSD signal - only some of them,i.e. the Oppo DV-980H,can do it.The same goes for the receiver / amp.It needs one or both of those connections plus the ability to do it.Without the right set up and without one of the two connections that I mentioned,the DSD will be converted to PCM which is what standard CD's use (also DVD's).

a sacd signal is an analogic one on several channel when the hdmi is digital if I am correct.
The Oppo you mention is only 198 euros. I guess this is not a terrific player. Let me know

I listen to the abkco releases on a sacd/dvd player...with a 5.1 speaker set-up.
Of course these (abkco releases) are 2.0 but I also have the
entire Elton John 5.1 multi-channel collection, 2 Billy Joel 5.1 multi-channel
disks, Pink Floyd's 5.1 Dark Side of the Moon, The Police 5.1 Hits,
The Who's TOMMY, Sympathy 5.1 Remixes...and some SACD sampler disks.

The Elton John collections sounds amazing! Dark Side & Tommy are done well too.

Are SACDs still being produced? I read ( a while ago) that they
were going to do more Elton John SACDs (Rock of the Westies etc...)
Haven't seen or heard anything. RE: EJ disks...Producer Gus Dudgeon was killed
in a car crash...he was involved (i think)...I wonder if this is a factor.


IORR............but I like it!

I have a Sony 775 model carousel SACD player which I bought back in 2002. In reading reviews of the player online, I found it uses high end Burr Brown DAC's.
Have all the Stones except Hot Rocks and Through The Past. Beggars has the most improved sound. Also have the other recent ABKCO hybrids of The Animals, Sam Cooke and Herman's Hermits. All sound better than their original CD releases.
Have Dark Side, Police Greatest, Brothers In Arms, Yellow Brick Rd, Honky Chateau in 5.1 and all sound amazing in surround. The one 5.1 SACD that sounds amazing compared to the regular CD is Oasis What's The Story. The regular CD sounds muddy in 2 track stereo but in 5.1, suddenly instruments that were buried in the mix are clear. Also, the Sympathy CD single with a 5.1 version sounds amazing. I only wish ABKCO would have released the whole Stones set in 5.1.
I just bought Yellow Brick Rd. at Best Buy in Vancouver last month for only $21! Pretty cheap for a double SACD. They had several SACD's that were "anniversary" editions with bonus material, but I didn't want to spend too much.
I think the majority of new SACD's coming out seem to be classical music.

Theif you are right about HDMI. Sony produces a new AV amp with hdmi dealing with the DSD

[www.ps3sacd.com]

the PS3 could be a nice idea too : blu-ray + SACD + games

Interesting discussion. I have a question which is probably going to sound really dumb, but here goes:

My car stereo is a Logic 7 surround sound, and it has a direct link to my iPod (via a small cable in the glove compartment).

If I buy a multi-channel compact disc (such as Goodbye Yellow Brick Road or Dark Side of the Moon) and then download it to my iPod, and then play it in my car on the iPod, will it be in surround sound just as if I was playing the disc on a multi-channel home stereo system?

(By the way, I know that you always lose sound quality when you download any disc to your iPod, but I'm talking about the surround sound itself ... is that retained or lost?)

Thanks,

Drew



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-08-09 15:04 by drewmaster.

Quote
drewmaster

If I buy a multi-channel compact disc (such as Goodbye Yellow Brick Road or Dark Side of the Moon) and then download it to my iPod, and then play it in my car on the iPod, will it be in surround sound just as if I was playing the disc on a multi-channel home stereo system?

I don't pretend to know everything (far from it) but....I think the answer is NO.

SACD technolgy is different from CD technology...and secondly,
I think the disks you mentioned are multi- channel SACD only....not hybrids (stereo CD / SACD).
I don't even think you can upload SACD info to iTunes...can you?
You can upload the CD layer of a HYbrid....but not SACD. right?

and...iPods are not multi-channel.


IORR............but I like it!



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2008-08-09 15:16 by sweet neo con.

Quote
sweet neo con

I don't pretend to know everything (far from it) but....I think the answer is NO.

SACD technolgy is different from CD technology...and secondly,
I think the disks you mentioned are multi- channel SACD only....not hybrids (stereo CD / SACD).
I don't even think you can upload SACD info to iTunes...can you?
You can upload the CD layer of a HYbrid....but not SACD. right?

and...iPods are not multi-channel.

Thank you neo, this is helpful for me.

Drew

Quote
toomuchforme
a sacd signal is an analogic one on several channel when the hdmi is digital if I am correct.
Let me know

SA-CD is digital.It uses a technology called DSD which stands for Direct Stream Digital. [en.wikipedia.org] You are correct that HDMI is digital.

Quote
toomuchforme
Theif you are right about HDMI. Sony produces a new AV amp with hdmi dealing with the DSD

[www.ps3sacd.com]

the PS3 could be a nice idea too : blu-ray + SACD + games

Yes but,I've heard that only some PS 3's can play SA-CD's.I know for a fact that the 60 GB Playstation 3 can along with PS 2 games.The only problem here is that the PS 3 (as of firmware version 1.90) does not pass the DSD signal.That may or may not change with new firmware updates for the PS 3.It may or may not have changed already as they are up to firmware version 2.41 now.

As far as the A/V amps-receivers go,there are few more high end units out there that can accept the DSD signal via HDMI > Denon,Marantz,Yamaha,Integra,and Pioneer but,the exact model is important,not just the brand.Pioneer has just come out with a $7,000 unit ( SC-09TX in the U.S. ) [www.abt.com] that has both HDMI and I Link options for SA-CD. They are not all in this price range,however.

This answers many questions : [www.sa-cd.net] * See " Are there any amplifiers or AV receivers that accept DSD input? " & " Can I output SA-CD audio via digital output? " & " Can I play SA-CDs on my games console? " as well as " Can I output SA-CD audio via digital output? " .

Quote
drewmaster

Quote
sweet neo con

I don't pretend to know everything (far from it) but....I think the answer is NO.

SACD technolgy is different from CD technology...and secondly,
I think the disks you mentioned are multi- channel SACD only....not hybrids (stereo CD / SACD).
I don't even think you can upload SACD info to iTunes...can you?
You can upload the CD layer of a HYbrid....but not SACD. right?

and...iPods are not multi-channel.

Thank you neo, this is helpful for me.

Drew

one more thing...i'm looking at the EJ Goodbye Yellow Brick Road SACD.....
it apparently IS a hybrid which also has a cd layer....so it can be played
in a regular cd player..and can be uploaded to iTunes (& put on your ipod etc..)
but obviously it won't be multi-channel etc....


IORR............but I like it!

I came across this recently, perhaps old news - but I thought it could be interesting for audiophiles
[www.mofi.com]

This answers many questions : [www.sa-cd.net] * See " Are there any amplifiers or AV receivers that accept DSD input? " & " Can I output SA-CD audio via digital output? " & " Can I play SA-CDs on my games console? " as well as " Can I output SA-CD audio via digital output? " .[/quote]

thanks for all the details. Technology and marketing are difficult to understand. Too bad that Sony the inventor of SA-CD is about to condamn it on PS3. I've read since some topics about that.

And the PS3 problem is that it requires an A/V amplifier. For now I just think about buying a Sa-cd Marantz 7001 KI signature or Denon 1500.

Quote
Lorenz
I came across this recently, perhaps old news - but I thought it could be interesting for audiophiles
[www.mofi.com]

nice, thanks

The Denon 1500 is a model from five years ago,unless you're talking about the CDR-W1500 which does not play SA CD's.For SA CD's,I would go with (first choice) the Denon 3930 or the 2930 or the 1940.

Any SA CD player should be used with an a/v amplifier - receiver.How else would you connect it to speakers?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2008-08-11 03:53 by Winning Ugly VXII.

Pre Amp:

[www.marantz.com]

Power Amp:

[www.marantz.com]

SACD Player:

[www.marantz.com]

Spaekers:

[www.bwspeakers.com]

Thse SASD's from Mr Klein ('02) are not on the same quality level. Satanic ist pretty good, but the two best are Baggars and Let It Bleed. The first records (The Rolling Stones, Now, 12 x 5, Decembers) sounds not better than a standard CD. Between the Buttoms and Get Ya Ya (MSG) are not bed too.

I haven't heard a satisfying or musically rewarding performance from any of it as yet.
I don't think the technology is the problem. We just haven't learnt what to do with it.

Quote
Winning Ugly VXII
The Denon 1500 is a model from five years ago,unless you're talking about the CDR-W1500 which does not play SA CD's.For SA CD's,I would go with (first choice) the Denon 3930 or the 2930 or the 1940.

Any SA CD player should be used with an a/v amplifier - receiver.How else would you connect it to speakers?

the Denon is
Denon DCD-1500AE AL 24
Mécanique S.V.H. anti-vibration
Convertisseurs 24-bits/192-kHz PCM/DSD 179

pure SA-CD player. The others you mention are DVD players and SA-CD but not some only cd players

try this to find used HIGH END equipment
[www.audiogon.com]

the best SA-CD player is the Sony TA-E 9000ES but it is very expensive
Some Marantz SA 11, 15 or 17 are brilliant too but rare now/and or expensive on the second market.

Marantz is about to put on the market some new SA-CD in september
[fficial%26hs%3D1Xw" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">translate.google.com.ag]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-08-11 14:39 by toomuchforme.

High End is f u c k i n expensive. Marantz SA11-S2 SACD player EUR 3500. And very impotant: the whole sound system must be on this high end level, the cabels too.

yes but if listening to music is a passion it's worth it

yes, you're right !!!!

Quote
toomuchforme
try this to find used HIGH END equipment
[www.audiogon.com]

the best SA-CD player is the Sony TA-E 9000ES but it is very expensive
Some Marantz SA 11, 15 or 17 are brilliant too but rare now/and or expensive on the second market.

Marantz is about to put on the market some new SA-CD in september
[fficial%26hs%3D1Xw" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">translate.google.com.ag]

As I understand it,the Sony TA-E 9000ES is not a SA-CD player but a pre-amp.Here is one link to it : [jeffn.com]

There are Marantz players much more advanced than the Sony products.There are Marantz SA-CD players which are not far under $7,000 [us.marantz.com] but,again these SA-CD only players cannot even pass the DSD signal because they don't have the connections needed to do so.

CD vs SACD

CD
44.100 samples/second
response extends to 20.000 Hz
dynamic range 96 db

SACD

2.822.400 samples/second
response extends to 100.000 Hz
dynamyc range 120 db

The SACD player SA-11S2 from Marantz has with filter 3 "olny" 114 db. SC-11S1 pre amp and SM-11S1 power amp (both Marantz) have a dynamic range with 98 db.
You must pay for this Marantz equipment EUR 10.000 in Germany.

You may say "who needs that ?" listen to low level strings, voices, cymbals, the attack of piano and you hear the differnce. If you care passionately about music, then SACD inflame the passion as nver before.

If you really care passionately about music all you need is a good Stones album and a cheap little stereo. If you only care about levels, frequencies, dynamic ranges etc, all you need is to get a life.

thanx !! U R really very professional in music and in life too !

Quote
Svartmer
If you really care passionately about music all you need is a good Stones album and a cheap little stereo. If you only care about levels, frequencies, dynamic ranges etc, all you need is to get a life.

Very true. Many "audiophiles" get so obsessed with the kit that they forget what it's for.
The best HiFi is simply that which makes music more enjoyable and rewarding to listen to. Follow that rule and the rest looks after itself ;^).

Darlings ! Go to an ENT doctor ! Ear wash could help U - hopefully !

Quote
Hungarian Wild Pig
Darlings ! Go to an ENT doctor ! Ear wash could help U - hopefully !

Well, I must admit I had a period in my life when I thought that sound quality was the most important thing, but luckily for me I grew out of that. Do you really think that the actual music gets better every time you buy a better sound system? Just because you suddenly can hear things a little bit clearer?
And hey, there´s no need to be offensive, is it?