what are the differences?

both are too expensive for me :-(

funny you should ask - i was just studying this page, which outlines the differences pretty well:
[www.provide.net]
scroll down a bit and you'll find 335s, 345s and 355s

basically the first and foremost difference was:

335: DOT-inlays

345: Paralellogramme (trapeze)-inlays

355: BLOCK-inlays

but then again there are special versions of each model that have features that normally only the others would have, so....

(I've been quite busy at work lately, but I'm glad these guitar threads keep alive. Good work, sssoul darling, have a lot of popcorn, LOL!)

I think the main difference, apart from the 355 being the "top of the line model" (so the inlays and bindings and all that things were the proper ones of the best models) is that the 355 model has/had a stereo circuit, that Varitone thing, if I recall correct. Don't ask me how it worked, but I know many players did change this to the standard mono circuit.

[There'll be no wedding today...]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-10-03 18:40 by bruno.

okay ... ES-355s come in both mono and stereo versions; they have ebony fretboards;
vibrato tailpieces (Bigsbys or those funky-lookin Gibson ones) are standard for 355s.
they have block fretboard inlays and that big "split diamond" headstock inlay.

345s are stereo; they have rosewood fretboards; vibratos are optional, not standard.
like the 355, they have gold-plated hardware, but other "cosmetics" are different:
they double parallelogram fretboard inlays and the "crown" headstock inlay.

335s are mono; like 345s they have rosewood fretboards and vibratos are optional, not standard.
they don't have gold plating; the binding isn't as fancy as on 345s or 355s;
the fretboard inlays were dots except for a spell when they were changed to small blocks.
it's a more popular model than either the 345 or 355, which would be why it's been available
(i'm pretty sure!) in various re-issues ever since it first came out, which is not true (i think) of 345s and 355s,
which were discontinued circa 1981/82 and were only reissued relatively recently.

all the parts of that that are right are courtesy of the patient learned and good-lookin
iorr Guitar Connoisseurs and that vintage site i gave the link to above: [www.provide.net];
all the bits that are wrong are my own invention (patent applied for). :E



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2007-10-02 10:27 by with sssoul.

oh and Bruno honey ... i need to contact you, but your email address is hidden.
if we're both on line at the same time sometime soon, let me know!

with sssoul Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> oh and Bruno honey ... i need to contact you, but
> your email address is hidden.
> if we're both on line at the same time sometime
> soon, let me know!


Drop me a line to xxxxxxxxxxxxx

[There'll be no wedding today...]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-10-03 18:37 by bruno.

thanks my dear! if you want to delete your address i've got it now

i've owned two 335's from the 70's and am super familiar with those particular models...one of mine had the five position vari-switch, tho i didn't use it much. both played like a dream; felt like a dream; and were very serious instruments; wondrous and gorgeous and tough...

these last several years i have played at least a dozen of what "THEY ARE CALLING" gibson 335's, in various stores in various states cross the country, and the thing they had in common was they were all pretty close to pure shit.

Like a low end cheesy and cheap epiphone Copy of a Gibson 335.

I honestly love that model, and over the years have sold mine, so I was seriously on the 'lookout'

i don't know if it's the woods or the hardware or what ever in the manufacturing process these last SEVERAL years in regards to these things, but buyer beware and play a lot of them before you plunk any money down; i seriously wouldn't even consider one at this point.

another case of selling the legend and skimping on the product??; a fantasy that injects one into buying one of the most justifiable famous and incredible instruements ever made, and what they have on the shelf was frankly crap.
Maybe I ran into one bad one. Maybe two. Maybe three. Maybe four...
But almost a dozen over the last few years?
gives one a little pause.

Perhaps the Gib custom shop has some ultra-model that approaches the inherent quality of the older ones, I do not know...it's likely to cost 5 grand or a zillion dollars IF they do...

Just sayin' "I LOVE that model" I loved their playability, versatility and sound, and TOUGHNESS...(strap broke once and band the thing falls down on a hard metal Atlas Stand base then onto a concrete floor...
i was terrified.
I picked it up...the band looking at me in wordless shock.
it wasn't even out of tune...i couldn't even find a mark on the guitar tho I'm sure there must have been one of some kind...
my pal in the band cracked "you almost broke my floor a##Hole" haa...

and the dozen or so I've tried in the last few years, in different shops all over the country, have felt so cheap and alien to what the "real" 335, and it's brothers in that ilk, represent to music history.

A friend of mind owns a retail outlet in the NE and offered me a truly friendly and great discount, and i was a bit embarrassed to refuse his generosity, cause he's a nice guy and was trying to do me a kind service...but there was no way those 'new' or 'modern' 335's felt ANYTHING like the classic 335's I'd owned and played hundreds of times for thousands of hours...
NOTHING even close...sad.
just a personal opinion folks. It just seemed like a lie with a 'gibson 335' somewhere imprinted on the thing...

I'd probably go looking for anothers company's copy of that model;
Some company that took perhaps a little more pride in the instrument, and not, if this is the case, just looking to market the name and the history to people who will never know that, at least in my opinion, those guitars are fake and not even good replicas, regardless of Gibson name or model number...

Now that's a travesty. again, just an opinion.

Beelyboy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> i've owned two 335's from the 70's and am super
> familiar with those particular models...

> these last several years i have played at least a
> dozen of what "THEY ARE CALLING" gibson 335's, in
> various stores in various states cross the
> country, and the thing they had in common was they
> were all pretty close to pure shit.
> Like a low end cheesy and cheap epiphone Copy of a
> Gibson 335.


mmm...You're opinion can not be any more opposite of mine. And, even though I hardly dare to say it, I think you're oppinion opposes about any guitarist and collector opinion.

First, the '70's were a low period in guitar making for all brands, but especially Gibson went down real low. Aside from just a few models (the Medallion Firebirds, the '72 reissue of the '54 Black Beauty), about all product put out by Gibson in the 70's is junk compared to recent production. The materials used, the construction, the craftmanship -1970's Gibson's are just really bad guitars if you compare them with '50's and current production.

Second, in my personal opinion, the guitars build by Gibson since about 1999 are truly the best instruments Gibson has ever produced. Ever since Gibson has the Custom Shop they truly know what makes a good guitar. Any regular production es Paul or 335 is as goo a it ever was. Pay a premium for Custom Shop, and you simply buy an insrument with '50's hand built quality.

I don't believe in the "vintage is better" hype. I believe that the best ever build, sounding and playing guitars ar build by the current Custom Shops of Fender and Gibson. But the '70's were a true low poin in guitar making, and I can only advise every player to avoid '70's Gibson's (and any Fender made after '75).

Mathijs

thanks Mathijs!

well mathijs, you're encylopedic knowlege of these things is always impressive and appreciated.
i wonder if you've hands on experience tho; because 'collectors' are not necessarily 'players,' especially working players thru sweat hot and cold in all environments...

so it's a useless argument because it's an individual thing but i doubt if you've got the actual 'hands-on' experience with these various models rather than the stats and histories and 'collector' reports etc...

mine recorded and performed and handled with such solidity and grace it was unbelievable; pick up a new one sometime and it's air. let the individual buyer check these things out for themselves.

be well. ty for informative post.
as long we disagree about this; is there a brand that makes a 335 ish semi-hollow with a solid block like the 335, either ibanex or heritage or anybody that is a guitar you'd personally endorse, other than the more modern 335 gibs which u like and i don't. ty.

in any case, it gives me hope that you have expressed large respect for their new product in that i haven't checked out their solid bodies in quite some time and will...!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-10-04 00:08 by Beelyboy.

oops was gonna link borna to with sssoul's explanation the differences in the models (from another thread) but i see she's already done that up here; clever and helpful as always...so, oooposs...edit edit...

what year is that black es model keith is using a lot these days? anyone know?
just curious as to what the years might be for his red one and black one and any others in that general model he may have. ty.

also, where he might have used one on recordings from any of their eras...interesting...curious...as to the model year just for fun...
...it's a special machine in any case.
and i will pick one of the new ones up for a more careful and larger amount of time than previously tested, from what i hear from mathijs...

I'm still thinkin' the tonewoods back in the seventies were probably largely superior stock, older and dried more carefully and slowly...like the 60's...
...and i did notice craftsmanship differences too in the modern ones, but like to keep an open mind; it's only rock and roll.
the ones i had sung beautifully, even before amplification. they were really superior in feel and sound to me, but all that's real subjective i guess.



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 2007-10-04 00:27 by Beelyboy.

Beelyboy, I've never seen an ES-335 with a varitone. Pardon my asking but are you certain the guitar was a 335 and not a 345 or 355?

i guess you must be right Chris. I am pretty sure they said '335' but it was years ago. they definetly had the five position vari tone switch on them, but i think in all other construction and electronic attributes were same as '335'...

so perhaps it was 345 or something...i never did use that vari-tone thing btw...
i found one position which seemed full 'open' tonally; then put the volume and tone pots on max on the rear pickup; shut off the neck pickup; put it thru a pedal or two than into the twin. purty neat.

do you think the woods or body or hardware, (anything other than the 5 position varitone,) would have been different on those models?

did ANY 335's come thru with that vari switch? cause that "335 designation" jogs my memory, but i could well be wrong.

ty for attention to detail...yep they definetly had five position vari-tone, both of 'em...also had hinged tail pieces, which in both cases i had carruthers in venice turn those hinged tailpieces into a stop tailpiece and it seemed to increase sustain and tonality and stability pretty nicely.

so as you could see with that change, tho i don't wear it a badge, i'm not a collector or traditionalist per se in any fashion, and will devalue, HAVE Devalued pre-cbs fenders and those gibsons away from the total tradtional specs and values because i usually end up having to customize things a little for my own sense of comfort and aesthetics...

i've a pre cbs '61 jazzmaster but had no problem getting all the electronics ripped out of it; had a couple of emg humbuckers put in there, and a little hole routed (heavens forbid) for the 9 volt battery. I still have the Fender and it has an entirely different face plate/pick guard that john cut and installed...also got rid of that jazzmaster bridge that kept knocking strings out of their groove...other stuff...

i'm getting a martin acoustic soon and on will probably blow away my life warranty in a second if i want something in there and the company dosen't allow a little hole for tone, volume pots or whatever i decide to have them CUT into that thing...ha...that's the way it goes i guess. couldn't find THE model that had ALL the stuff i needed; so i just go with what i have and try to make it work the best possible for me; cause bottom line, i''m the onlyh one that has to deal with operating these particular monsters...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-10-04 03:32 by Beelyboy.

Maybe this could be an explaination:

Arrest Puts Spotlight On Guitar Fakes
Long Island Arrest Puts Spotlight On The Counterfeiting Of Gibson Guitars

GARDEN CITY, N.Y., Oct. 2, 2007
Answers.com

(AP) It's a familiar tune, a sad lament actually, about a product falling victim to counterfeiters. Lately, they've been picking on guitars.

Last month, a Long Island music dealer was accused of selling $90,000 worth of knockoffs of classic Gibsons, a guitar known for its deep, melodic sound and used by virtually every country, rock and blues artist from Elvis Presley to Eric Clapton.

"Unfortunately, consumers are ending up on the short end of the stick," said Henry Juszkiewicz, chief executive of Nashville-based Gibson Guitars Corp.

Gibson guitars _ inexpensive models start at about $2,000 _ have a rich, distinctive sound that leads musicians to speak about them in reverent tones.

B.B. King is perhaps the best-known devotee; his black Gibson, nicknamed Lucille, shares nearly equal billing with the blues master on stage.

"Signing guitars that are not Gibson is like being married and kissing a woman who is not your wife," King once huffed when asked to autograph a Fender guitar.

Some of Gibson's Les Paul models _ named for the creator of the solid body electric guitar _ can sell for as much as $10,000 new.

Knocking them off is a lucrative and easy business, according to Hank Risan, a founder of the online Museum of Musical Instruments who owns an extensive collection of guitars and other instruments, including a $15 million guitar once owned by Mark Twain.

"To put together a replica might cost me a thousand dollars, more or less, depending on the instruments and parts," Risan said.

Add a fake logo and insert serial numbers that appear genuine, he said, and "the average person, and most experts, won't know if it's a really good forgery."



read more here...
[www.cbsnews.com]

>> what year is that black es model Keith is using a lot these days? anyone know? <<

his ebony and cherry 355s are from 59 or 60, depending on who you ask; the white 345 is from 64.
(here's that thread about Keith's semi-hollows: [www.iorr.org])

>> also, where he might have used one on recordings from any of their eras <<

do you mean specifically a 355? i have a theory, but let me not prejudice the other witnesses -
at least not until i'm a bit more caffeinated. :E

Bellboy; I can't aggree with you more. I have the same experience. Todays 335 are lousey. Bad tone bad action bad feel. I don't think that Mathisj knows what he is talking about I have 5 Gibsons from the 70's. All around 73 to 76 including a 335. You can't beat them.

Beelyboy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> well mathijs, you're encylopedic knowlege of these
> things is always impressive and appreciated.
> i wonder if you've hands on experience tho;
> because 'collectors' are not necessarily
> 'players,' especially working players thru sweat
> hot and cold in all environments...

I am a player and trader for over 15 years. I've owned about every guitar available.

> so it's a useless argument because it's an
> individual thing but i doubt if you've got the
> actual 'hands-on' experience with these various
> models rather than the stats and histories and
> 'collector' reports etc...

It would have been a useless discussion if you would have stated that you "really loved my '70's 335". But your statement is that '70's Gibson guitars are much better than the "junk" Gibson produces these days. And now we do have a discussion with a reason, because its absolutely the opposite.

The main problem with '70's Gibson guitars (and it actually started around '68) is that Gibson was buying a very cheap and terrible quality wood. To make a guitar from a bad piece of wood you have to compromise: neck s were made out of 3, 4, 5 strips of wood glued together, bodies were "pancaked" with up to 8 planks of wood. All these instruments are way too stiff, heavy and dead sounding. Lacquer was put on too thick (they wanted to prevent warranty claims), and general build was just really bad. They just forgot how to build decent guitars.

It all changed when Gibson was sold in '86. It took them some years, but Gibson really got there business up and running again, and they now produce the best guitars since the late '50's again. The wood is excellent again, and craftmanship is on par with the 50's. The Custom Shop produces expensive but fabulous instruments, and the Memphis factory produces the best ever semi ES range guitars ever.

> as long we disagree about this; is there a brand
> that makes a 335 ish semi-hollow with a solid
> block like the 335, either ibanex or heritage or
> anybody that is a guitar you'd personally endorse,
> other than the more modern 335 gibs which u like
> and i don't. ty.

I don't endorse any brand. But Heritage makes very good guitars, but I don't like the snake's head peghead and the mini tuners on the tail piece. I prefer Gibson, and I think the Fat Neck '59 ES-335 is as good as it gets.

Mathijs

"... and I think the Fat Neck '59 ES-335 is as good as it gets."

Never was a truer word spoken ;^)