Good one - way to go, Mathijs.

Hey that's very cool, that one can dismiss an article because of one of the guitar threads by with Sssoul. These threads are really something...!

Just wanted to say that the photographs by Fin Costello I posted on page 2 were indeed from San Antonio, as Costello didn't witness the Baton Rouge shows.
Felt pretty silly for starting such a discussion, so good to hear I wasn't wrong in doubting the "Baton Rouge credit"...!



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2007-09-08 02:48 by Erik_Snow.

don't the main article and the sidebar contradict each other? the first seems to say keith got it in the US, the second in London.

>> don't the main article and the sidebar contradict each other? <<

yep! the bit about "Stones people" asking for the return of the guitar is very interesting, though -
i wonder if ... nah, never mind! no point in speculating out loud :E

Erik_Snow Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> WIth Sssoul, it's basically because of Richards'
> pants, Jagger looked quite the same. I think it's
> the pink-striped pants in the photo posted above,
> it's hard to tell from a distance...but I think
> so. Besides, there's a different guitar strap in
> the above pic, than the Goldtop pics from Baton
> Rouge..as seen on page 1 of this thread.
>
>
> Baton Rouge (don't know who took it, but I don't
> think it's Bob Gruen)
>
> [i96.photobucket.com]
> -batonrouge-6.jpg
>
> 2 nights in San Antonio (from "musicpictures")
>
> [i96.photobucket.com]
> -sanantonio3.jpghttp://i96.photobucket.com/albums/
> l176/erik_061/75-sanantonio5.jpg
>
>
> In other words...Keith did for sure use the
> goldtop in San Antonio, there's pictures from 4
> different 75 shows in this thread with that
> guitar. If we had some more shots from the other
> Baton Rouge show + Kansas City, we would have 6
> shows all together.




what song are they playing on the san antonio pictures? looks like happy to me but I've never seen keith playing bottleneck on stage...

Does anyone have a clear pic that shows the inside horn of the keith/taylor burst?

This would help determine whether or not Clapton used it at the 66 Windsor Festival. The bigsby les paul he played that evening has a distinctive marking along the inside horn/binding.

[i51.photobucket.com]
The above pic is BIG so I just posted the link.





I have lots of black and white pics of Eric with this guitar, but they're a bit too dark to see the marking that would be there on on the front/outer horn if it is the keith/taylor burst.













Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2007-09-08 17:30 by His Majesty.

>> I've never seen Keith playing bottleneck on stage... <<

... sorry you've missed that! Keith pretty famously played slide on stage
in 69, 72, 75 and 99 - if you go back through the photos and footage you'll see



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2007-09-09 19:10 by with sssoul.

PS: Grr god damn it!!! I wish they'd research a bit better and realize those pics of Mick with the guitar are from 1970!!!

That whole article is rather frustrating really.

>> Grr god damn it!!! <<

i agree - you should write to the editors, truly!
i've pointed out that particular error to so many publications i'm going crosseyed from it.

with sssoul Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> ... sorry you've missed that! Keith pretty
> famously played slide on stage in 69, 72 and 99 -
> if you go back through the photos you'll see


on which songs?

>> on which songs? <<

You Gotta Move in 69, Happy in 72 and 75 and You Got the Silver in 99



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-09-09 19:09 by with sssoul.

Erik_Snow Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Washington D.C, July 4th 1972
>
> [i96.photobucket.com]
> -WashDC.jpg
> by "Dr Bob"


Great picture from the washington 72 gig, Erik.
Are there any more pictures from this show that you could share please?
Cheers, Vudicus

Vudicus, well I don't know if with Sssoul likes OT pictures in these guitar threads. But since I allready made a reply = a post.....here's one.
Hope with Sssoul won't shoot unpopped popcorn at me.

Washington DC, July 4th 1972

by "Dr. Bob"



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2007-09-08 22:00 by Erik_Snow.

Thank you Erik for risking a severe popcorn related eye injury on my behalf, it is much appreciated!!!

Mathijs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The dear people at Guitarist magazine just
> received a letter concerning this guitar -
>
> Mathijs

Care to elaborate Mathijs? What do you mean exactly?

i suppose Mathijs means he filled the editors in on some of the bits they got wrong and/or left out of the article,
but i too would be fascinated to hear whatever details Mathijs feels like sharing with us.

and Erik honey: lucky for you i am fresh out of popcorn :E



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2007-09-09 00:38 by with sssoul.

wow thnx for doing all this research and for posting all these great pics

Life's just a cocktail party on the street



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-09-09 02:37 by MononoM.

Thats what I dig: - our shared knowledge, research and memories => sort of wikipedia

don't dig: facts mixed with rumours by one person, spread in a magazine.

The article seems more like an advert, linking as many big names as possible...

what a surprise, the guitar is for sale again. :-/

with sssoul Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >> on which songs? <<
>
> You Gotta Move in 69, Happy in 72 and You Got the
> Silver in 99

And Might As Well Get Juiced in 1998 I´m quite sure of!

Big T

with sssoul Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >> on which songs? <<
>
> You Gotta Move in 69, Happy in 72 and You Got the
> Silver in 99


right... thought so about silver but alwys assumed mick tayler does the slide on the other ones. thnks lot anyway.

sure thing. there's a series of shots of You Gotta Move in 69 in this thread here: [iorr.org]
it was part of the Glimmer Twins on Stools set, along with Prodigal Son.

now back to the Les Pauls, shall we? staying on topic is a big part of what makes these Guitar Threads great -
the brilliance of our resident kind patient generous learned & good-lookin Guitar Connoisseurs
being the main ingredient, of course (thanks & praises!)

HM, thanks for those ultra-closeups of the LP Clapton had in 66 -
i sure wish i had such detailed shots of Keith's LP for comparison, but alas.
truly, we should all write to the Guitarist editors clamouring for a follow-up article,
with better photos while they're at it. :E

with sssoul Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> now back to the Les Pauls, shall we? staying on
> topic is a big part of what makes these Guitar
> Threads great -
> the brilliance of our resident kind patient
> generous learned & good-lookin Guitar Connoisseurs
>
> being the main ingredient, of course (thanks &
> praises!)


hey, I love your guitar threads... always very interesting to read. should I be able to contribute sometime in the future, I sure will. I bow to your knowledge, sssoul! (as a record dealer in camden once said to me when it came to the stones )

I finally read the article kindly posted by Ms Ssoul and provided by Spud and I have to say it is rife with error. I spoke to Brewis a few times when he had the guitar for sale and explained that some of the photos he had up on this site were not of the same guitar (The Ya-Yas cover for example) I even told him that Mick Taylor had bought it in 1967, a well documented event, and pointed out the dark patch at the cut away and the tops tight figuring as distinctive features as well as Keith and Mick T using the guitar during the '69 tour. Still, one believes what one wants I suppose.

Your Majesty, regarding Clapton's possible use of this guitar at Windsor in 1966 I don't think that it is the same instrument. Though the figuring is very similar I have not been able to detect the dark patch at the cutaway in any picture I have seen. Also the switch tip is white on on Clapton's but amber on Keith's. Still, until I can see a clear picture it is hard to be absolutely certain.

For those that are interested, here is a pic of the guitar as it appears today from the seller's web site [www.wesellguitars.com]. Apparently the original Bigsby and PAFs have been restored to the guitar but I'd like to some more evidence to substantiate this claim. Also note the guitar now has a pick guard which is something it hasn't had since the mid 60's.





Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2007-09-10 21:12 by ChrisM.

>> Still, one believes what one wants I suppose. <<

but ... why wouldn't someone involved with selling that guitar not want to believe
that it was also owned by Mick T? it adds pretty considerably to its value, after all.

what i really want to know is what the article means about "Stones people" agitating for the guitar to be returned.
the article seems to be pointing pretty plainly to Phil Carsons as someone who had no right to give it away
and/or Cosmo Verrico as someone who had no right to sell it (kind of strange, to imply something like that!)
but who is it who wanted it back - the current Stones or Mick T?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-09-10 10:40 by with sssoul.

finally located it on the wesellguitars site - their "history" is kind of all over the place:

"The first ever 'British Burst' owned and played by Keith Richards of The Rolling Stones,
used to record many of The Stones early hits. The guitar later found its way into the hands of Mick Taylor, Eric Clapton and Jimmy Page,
was recently featured in Guitarist Magazine and is possibly the most historically important Les Paul in the world
being the first 'Burst' to be used by a major rock star - way before Page, Clapton, Beck or Taylor.
We have traced the guitar right back to the original owner prior to Keith and have full provenance of its history.
We request that only serious enquiries contact us regarding this guitar. Many thanks."

any of us "serious" enough to enquire? maybe CindyC could run another IORR Fundraiser
and we could give the poor thing a loving home at long last. :E

and while we're at it: i'd love to know more about that original owner they've traced -
the sidebar in the Guitarist article sounds mighty iffy,and yet if Keith got this guitar on the first US tour
then how come it didn't turn up in any footage/photos until the autumn of 64?
it's a mystery ... have some popcorn :E

There's a big, big problem with this guitar, and that problem is the main reason why the current owner and everybody else involved does not acknowledge that this is the guitar Mick Taylor bought from Keith in '67.

The Mick Taylor Bigsby guitar was stolen in July '71 from Nellcote, and this was reported to the police. Hence, if anyone now officially claims this guitar now on sale IS the Mick Taylor Bigsby burst, you have to explain where you got it from.

So, it's safe to claim this guitar is the Keith Richards burst from '64 and '65, as long as you state that you don't know what happened to the instrument after '66. You see, this guitar is worth anything above $500.000, so there's quite some politics involved.

Of course, WE all know this is the Mick Taylor burst used on Ya-Ya's and Sticky Fingers (Sway anyone?).

Mathijs

ahh so - thanks Mathijs. yeah, that would explain why the dealer would prefer
to "overlook" the fact that Mick T owned it, wouldn't it.
and that insight makes the Guitarist article seem even weirder in several ways.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-09-10 01:03 by with sssoul.

By the way, I don't think Clapton is using Keith's burst in '66. The pickups are uncovered, there's not stripe pattern on Clapton's burst, and Clapton's burst has lots of wear on the backside's edge, under the lower horn, that I have never seen on the Keith burst.

Mathijs