again ..disagree.... i do not want to hear have you seen your mother..it would not work live....

i think the set list whiners think they are actually accomplishing something here other than whining... their set list whining, they seem to believe, will lead to what they consider "better" set lists (they all have different ideas of what this magical "better" setlist would be) which will make for better shows for THEM the elite the few the proud the hardcore rolling stones fan who is privileged to criticize shows for their set list and not actually the concert....

what a veritable waste of time..you want new songs? write chuck leavell...at least that would be constructive..

Hey just another night is a good song. What are the chances they play God Gave Me Everything? Can anyone in that band even come close to playing guitar like Lenny Kravitz?

sweetcharmedlife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hey just another night is a good song. What are
> the chances they play God Gave Me Everything? Can
> anyone in that band even come close to playing
> guitar like Lenny Kravitz?

Just Another Night is okay as long as you can get over the "eightees sound."

I would love it if the Stones would someday re-record some of the songs off of "Wandering Spirit" and "Talk is cheap."

bv Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Rolling Stones define their art and they are
> not some sort of "by popular demand" house band.
> They have done this for 44 years now but still
> some people think they are some sort of a house
> band. They are not. They perform for the many and
> not for the few.

They DO play "by popular demand": Satisfaction, STU,JJF,SympathyFTD,...That's what the people who attend stones concerts (not necessarily stones fans) want to hear. Satisfy the numbers.

Yes. Somwe people need to get a life. And some people need to grasp that the Rolling Stones do not exist for their sole personal satisfaction. Love them and admire them yes. But some people are a bit too obsessive and overly critical.

I was in the best tiered seating block at Cardiff and the thing I noticed was the crowds reactions.

They didn't want to stand and seemed to not even know numbers like Live with Me,but when Keith hit the opening courds of SMU they were on their feet singing along and stayed there for the rest of the show.
They are playing for the masses. The Licks tour went a long way towards pleasing hardcore fans and was probably the best chance we ever got to see/hear rare songs performed.

I'll forgive them anything,simply because they listened and actually stuck with SWAY until they had worked it up into the masterpiece it now is !

Performances have been fantastic in Europe !

sc uk

how nice to see Bjornulf, who claims to be against "offensive posts," calling a whole bunch of us Idiots.

BAN BV!

bv Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This is to everybody who is making comments about
> the setlist without going to the show. It is as
> stupid as making comments about a person from
> looking at a picture. Totally nonsense. I have
> been following this tour and the band. I have seen
> the set list, the shows and the crowds around the
> world. And I have see the utterly idiotic comments
> about the set list from people not going to the
> shows. By idiotic I mean without connection to the
> real world i.e. the fans being at the show. It is
> like reading about love and talking about it in
> terms of numbers. If you don't understand that a
> Stones show is about the relation between the band
> and the crowd then it is time to think one more
> time. Why are you so concerned about the set list?
> If you have a partner back at home... Do you have
> a set list? How does your partner perform? Time to
> renew?


Although i agree with the content i can not agree with style it was written.

Imagine this thread was written by another user. It would have been deleted by the boardrunner at once and the user would have been banned.

But i guess that's the way life is different rules for different people.

IMO it's not ok at all to interprete the "rules" in a way that they fit to you at the moment.

But maybe it was just a little too much of his beloved Hansa beer.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-09-03 11:54 by Roadster32.

If we do not bring constructive criitzism to the band,
sites like this one makes no or at least little sense.

We made them do Sway & I'm sure Bitch and some other tunes
aired on this tour is influenced by the fan site 'pressure'.

I am a Stones virgin when it comes to concerts but I have some 5,000
tracks by them and I aint no Mr Anybody. I have the right to complaint.

I could figure TD would need some make-up, as well as the
weary featuring of SFTD nowadays.
I have heard most concerts on recordings
(and - yeah - I know it aint the same, but I still have ears).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-09-03 12:18 by Baboon Bro.

Hahahahahahaha,

That's the best laugh I've had for ages.

Nice post BV.

oILY.

bv Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This is to everybody who is making comments about
> the setlist without going to the show. It is as
> stupid as making comments about a person from
> looking at a picture. Totally nonsense. I have
> been following this tour and the band. I have seen
> the set list, the shows and the crowds around the
> world. And I have see the utterly idiotic comments
> about the set list from people not going to the
> shows. By idiotic I mean without connection to the
> real world i.e. the fans being at the show. It is
> like reading about love and talking about it in
> terms of numbers. If you don't understand that a
> Stones show is about the relation between the band
> and the crowd then it is time to think one more
> time. Why are you so concerned about the set list?
> If you have a partner back at home... Do you have
> a set list? How does your partner perform? Time to
> renew?

A partially valid point Bjornulf. Indeed, as you said a little further down in this thread, the Stones today perform not "for the few ...... but for the many". And to my mind, therein lies a little of the problem. As long as they deliberately set out to address themselves to large numbers of people at any single show; in other words by playing stadiums principally, they virtually commit themselves to the type of setlists we're seeing at the moment. For arguments sake, lets say that it's about 75 percent warhorses/well known songs, and perhaps 25 percent lesser known songs that they rotate in and out of different shows to provide as much variety as possible.

To me it's really quite simple. As long as they tour in this kind of form, it's hardly surprising that we see the kind of setlists we do. The setlists are perfectly geared to the typical audience makeup of a venue housing 30-50,000 people. Anyone that sees them in this type of setting and dreams of a club show type setlist of more obscure songs/lesser known material is quite honestly not thinking right, and if they're expecting that ........ then they shouldn't go. The day the Stones announce that they're touring in a completely different form, maybe ONLY doing clubs and/or smallish arenas, then THAT is the day when you can REALISTICALLY live in hope that they'll be offering up the more obscure but no less loved material. Will it happen ? Your guess would perhaps be as good as mine. I'm just happy for the moment to take what I'm given and hope for the day ......... and if it comes .......... GRRRRREAT !! CELEBRATION TIME !!

Baboon Bro Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We made them do Sway & I'm sure Bitch and some other tunes aired on this tour is influenced by the fan site 'pressure'.

They have played Bitch on every tour since 97.

erikjjf Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Baboon Bro Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > We made them do Sway & I'm sure Bitch and some
> other tunes aired on this tour is influenced by
> the fan site 'pressure'.
>
> They have played Bitch on every tour since 97.

Yes, OK. But SWAY (value 1) divided by entire setlist (value 20) equals 5 percent. The point I was making is that when they're playing to 50,000 odd people, they've got to cater to the majority ........... unfortunate as that may be to those of us in the MINORITY that would like them to do SWAY and additionally other gems among the remaining 19 songs. But realistically, they couldn't. They perhaps rotate in/out about 4 or 5 gems, but the majority of the show's content has simply GOT to cater that majority of the audience .............. or would you not agree ?

The day they scale it down (on bended kness praying ..... !!) is perhaps the day we'll see our wishes partly fulfilled !!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-09-03 14:13 by paulywaul.

But not strikingly many times on ABB tour, right?
Anybody updating on these boards ought to notice Sticky Fingers
has a special place among fans.

I've been to two shows this tour, East Hartford and Durham. The set lists were great at both shows. The Stones performances were incredible at both shows. I saw two shows, each was 21 songs long, and four songs were different from one show to the other, for a total of 25 different songs.

On the European tour, in 19 shows they only did 33 different songs. There is plenty to bitch about here BV. The did 60 something to 80 something different songs on the VDL and BTB tours. Even on the abbreviated EURO BTB tour in 1999 [not counting the club gig] they did 35 different songs in only 10 shows.

The Stones have enough war horses so even two or three of these can be changed around at every show. It's hard to believe we haven't heard Street Fighting Man the entire tour. They have plenty of early 60's songs so they do not have to do As Tears Go By and Get Off My Cloud as much as they do. With minimal effort they could mix in songs they have done on recent tours and could easily rehearse [19th Nervous Breakdown, The Last Time, It's All Over Now, Play With Fire, Under My Thumb [I know they did it in Milan], Time is On My Side, and others].

In a word the Stones are lazy, and you should not defend the set lists.

"make up your mind, 'cause I gotta go"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-09-03 13:19 by BOBM.

The reactions of the masses is very telling ;our reaction to Sway at Sheffield was met by looks of amazement from the "locals". I think they thought the people going nuts were insane (I can live with that).

My point is that the Stones can't afford to have too many songs met with indifference.It would spoil the show for them and the audience.

My one gripe is Keith;

Why did he do the same 2, worn out numbers for the entire UK tour. It's not as if the masses know any of his ?

Happy?
TPIE?
YGTS?
Connection ?
Thru &Thru?
The Worst?
Imfamy ?
T&a ...PLEASE !
Wanna hold you?
Theif in the Night?
Coming down again?
All about you?
Too rude?
Sleep tonight?
Can't be seen?
You don't have to mean it?
How can I stop?

sc uk

i dont think stones prefer to play these songs over and over. Mayby its something else..

Totally agree with bv. Only idiots would complain about them incredible setlists. I don't care if they play 5 or 22 songs at every show. The Rolling Stones are still the best rock'n'roll act available. You guys are just a bunch of spoiled whiners. Simple as that.MEZ

and Ay ay baby it hurts

It's a matter of opinion, I don't think we should be using words like "idiots" here. It makes the topic lose seriousness to begin with.

Lets put some depth and nuances in the discussion.
Some are pleased with anything, other want the best of the
Greatest Rock'n'Roll band On Earth.

Anyone who would care to check on my humble comments,
would see I'm pleased 99% of the time. One or two surprises
or unexpected parts of a show is ok with me.
Whining over 19 or 21 songs are pretty ridiculous imho.

But you can achieve variation even within the frames of a predictable
setlist; except an enthusiatic audience as a unreplaceable
ingredient, I'd say the arrangements and zillions of other
factors such as energy level, weather, the looks of the tour plan
around the actual gig etc etc.

I just heard RJ from Glasgow & I hear they have smoothened,
stomped & swinged it up thru a lively Leavell-ish piano.
Dont know if this is a permanent change but it sounds great.
Still I love RJ as a middle register guitar alarmin' song too.

Life is more alive when you embrace many things at the same time.
Many folks here and anywhere would feel better and healthier
if they drop the tunnel view.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-09-03 13:57 by Baboon Bro.

About the setlist. they wrote these songs and they can do what they want with them. They can play like they want, this is their probleme if we are not satisfied we can't get money back. But on thing I can't admitt (euh! 2 in fact, the second is the ticket price), it is the quality of the sound. Yes there have a good sound, but ON STAGE. When you are in the first rows, it's ok too. you take the big sound, but when you are in the stands, the sound is poor. I remember the stade de france 2003, sound was horrible and minus. I can't accept that. the great rock'n'roll band with a poor sound and no power, it's unacceptable. In 2003 olympia halle in munich and bercy in paris had a good sound, There are indoor arena. Back to the setlist. If setlist are warhorses, it's because 95 percent of the audience want to hear the hits and for the stones, they can play by automatism, no songs to learn.

But I clearly remember Jagger often complaining....about doing the same old songs over and over again.

rooster Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> But I clearly remember Jagger often
> complaining....about doing the same old songs over
> and over again.


Me too.

Interesting.

According to someone who think he owns the band and always have the right opinions - I´m an IDIOT.

Once again - it´s sad and scary...

Yeah..in all those interviews...and Keith saying they have to do a couple of horses..otherwise they get killed...but Jagger..he rather do the new ones...and he doesnt...were is hs punk attitude gone?...I love the shows but Jagger himself was the greatest whiner...or idiot if you will...that means also in concert...remember...Atlantic city Steel Wheels..his comment before they ran into Rock in a hard place...and thats just one excample.Cheers.

I’m not usually one to join in on these great ‘setlist debates’ but I am going to give some of my view’s here for what it’s worth.

I believe this is for both sides of the debate?!

I have attended many concert’s by the stones over the years (since 89) and was looking forward to seeing the Cardiff concert in particular for two reason’s 1) I was taking my boys 16 & 10yrs to their first Stones experience and 2) It’s My home town… can’t beat that feeling can you!

The crowd at Cardiff ( on the whole) came to be entertained a lot of them did not want to participate .. Many of them around us were absolutely baffled when ONNYA came on ( don’t even get me started on the looks we got when SOL was played )and those around us got more kicks from watching us (kids included) and were amazed we knew the song’s let alone the words.
There was even a couple in front of us who thought Tumbling Dice sounded familiar and the lady asked her companion who recorded it first, as he was struggling I butted in and told them ‘Status Quo’ and they seemed quite happy at that ;-) ...A few more seemed to join in on S.M.U they did a few woo woo’s on SFTD Really got into it on Paint It Black and the last three but that was it.
(Disclaimer : I did see a few people like myself going nut’s for the whole show…im sure I saw Mr. Jimmy and paulywauly)

The Show was Fantastic and the stones in- fairness probably are justified in playing the warhorses meeting the needs for the majority of paying customers (please note my boys had not seen them before and were grateful for them)

Would I have liked to hear Citadel being played you bet your life I would have just loved for them to play Laugh I Nearly Died - Too right I would have! What about Highwire, The Worst , Out of Control, Tie you Up…. hell I would even have looked forward to their rendition of My Granny Got Her Tit Caught In The Mangle……
But I tell You now the majority of the crowd would have simply Fallen asleep!!

My boys wanted to hear Faraway eyes (though I did warn them of the chances) they also happen to love A Bigger Bang and were hoping for more than the three we got to hear and yes they even wanted Keith to sing - This Place Is Empty!

I for one felt they neglected their 90’s songs and was disappointed with that , but B.V come on does that make My family and I Idiot’s -I think not! …..It is an observation about - not a criticism of, the set list.

We were more than happy with what we got though making comments about what we would have liked to have seen /heard does not make us Idiot’s



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-09-03 15:34 by undertheradar.

To Bv:s fairness, please note he
methodically explains in his first posting
he use the word "idiot" in its origin sense, as an Outsider,
not moron.

I just get flattered if I'm compared to or
getting described as an Outsider.

bv Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This is to everybody who is making comments about
> the setlist without going to the show. It is as
> stupid as making comments about a person from
> looking at a picture. Totally nonsense. I have
> been following this tour and the band. I have seen
> the set list, the shows and the crowds around the
> world. And I have see the utterly idiotic comments
> about the set list from people not going to the
> shows. By idiotic I mean without connection to the
> real world i.e. the fans being at the show. It is
> like reading about love and talking about it in
> terms of numbers. If you don't understand that a
> Stones show is about the relation between the band
> and the crowd then it is time to think one more
> time. Why are you so concerned about the set list?
> If you have a partner back at home... Do you have
> a set list? How does your partner perform? Time to
> renew?


As I've stated here before, if you're paying to see the Stones in a stadium these days(especially multiple times) you are either wealthy or a fool...can't figure which bv is. Very simple for me:

Since I am not wealthy I will not pay the ridiculous $$ they want to hear them play the same songs I've seen them play a dozen times before in a stadium! I'm done with that ! Been there!

I am not a fool...

stoned_in_dc : 'i think the set list whiners think they are actually accomplishing something here other than whining... their set list whining, they seem to believe, will lead to what they consider "better" set lists (they all have different ideas of what this magical "better" setlist would be) which will make for better shows for THEM the elite the few the proud the hardcore rolling stones fan who is privileged to criticize shows for their set list and not actually the concert.... '

First off, as has already been stated, the whining HAS changed something (see Licks Tour, Sway getting played on this tour...), and HAS led to better setlists.

As for the 'hardcore RS fan', I'd have to agree : why would a band want to cater to those who have been following them all these years, who are willing to pay hundreds to go to multiple shows a tour (even if the setlist isn't completely satisfactory), who know their songs inside out, to those who are in fact their real fans? Ridiculous eh?

Just came across the Uncut 'top 40 Stones songs' issue. Mick and Ronnie are asked to give their 10 favorites : Mick's list goes :Gimme Shelter/Wild Horses/YCAGWYW/SFTD/Rambler/HTW/Out Of Control/SWAY/Undercover/Miss You. A number of these songs have been played either sporadically or not at all. I suggest that Mick do himself a favour.
As for Ronnie's list, it includes Sister Morphine, Black Limousine, You Got The Silve, No Expectations, Factory Girl, Out of Control, 19th NB and Faraway Eyes. The only 'warhorse' to speak of is Miss You. Maybe he could whisper a few of those in Chuck's ear.