What Stones song is this supposed to be a rip off of?

"You'll be studying history and you'll be down the gym. And I'll be down the pub, probably playing pool and drinking."

The Last Time. personally, i don't hear it.

the last time

One of the most asked Q's on the boards LOL.
It is from the "Last Time". But not the actual Stones version. Oldham released these albums back then with the ALO orchestra doing faux-spectorish version sof Stonestunes. The sample is from that version.
Jagger and keith should have let the Verve have the dough. That was small.

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

It was Allen Klein that sued The Verve and demanded that the songwriting credit be Jagger/Richards, since it was released in 1965 so ABKCO owns the publishing rights. I've never heard the Oldham Symphony version but from what I understand, the Verve song is basically their lyrics over the Oldham music. At the time, I was wondering if Mick/Keith even knew who the Verve were or had heard their song.

This is similar to when Chuck Berry sued the Beach Boys/ Brian Wilson for songwriting credit for Surfin USA. Brian basically used Sweet Little 16 and then added different lyrics.

Yeah Chelsea has it...and go for the Japanese version for it has a couple of extra tracks.




ROCKMAN

I've never understood why the Stones could be credited with that song.

They do not own the chord progressdion of A D E and G, or whatever the hell it is. Klein was a prick for suggesting that they are that original with a very simple arrangement like that. There is no clue of the signature lick from "The Last Time" on that song. They got screwed.

#......Go ahead....Bite the Big Apple....Don't mind the Maggots.....Uh Huh...#

The Stones just have excellent lawyers

Here's a lil piece from a Verve interview/article that I hacked outta some music mag back in 1997...




ROCKMAN

I disagree. The first time I heard Bitter Sweet Symphony, I thought that it was a copy of verse of The Last Time. That said, it is a very different track and a great, great song.

Hey Rockman, thanks for the news clipping and CD photo. I wonder, if according to the news clipping, that the piece that was sampled is so small that you can barely hear it, why didn't the Verve just remove it?

moreover, the glimmers basically stole themselves the refrain of TLT from an old traditional spiritual "The Last Time". It was recently published on "spirit of the century" of The blind boys of Alabama (there's also a cover o "just wanna see his face" on it)

Whats the fuzz really about?
When you buy Verve´s record, it says
(Jagger-Richards).

My impressions was that this was a whole own song,
not The Last Time. But what do I know?
He, who hears The Last Time immediately, has good ears.

Jagger walking into Elton John's garden party while a string quartet is playing Bitter Sweet Symphony. He turns to his daughter Elizabeth and says with an ironic voice: "That's a good one.....". Classic Jagger humor! (It's on the Being Mick DVD)

Anyone who doesn't think "Bittersweet Symphony" sounds like "The Last Time" should just sing "I told you once and I told you twice/But you never listen to my advice" along with the Verve song. Every time I hear it, I can't help but sing the words to "The Last Time." Of course, the chorus melody and chord progression aren't there.

It isnt VERY very incredibly similar, is it?

NO its not. Its just the Glimmers being anal. It's a good song. BTW, didnt Brian write that riff?

>> BTW, didnt Brian write that riff? <<

as i understand it the idea that Brian wrote it is based on the fact that he's the one playing and/or miming the riff in TV footage.
i don't know if that's generally regarded as enough reason to assume composership (it's pretty normal for each musician to be playing/miming *something* on stage,
whether they wrote it or not, and whether or not they're the one who played it in the studio), so i'd be fascinated to hear what other evidence there is for this idea.


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith

LA FORUM Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NO its not. Its just the Glimmers being anal. It's
> a good song. BTW, didnt Brian write that riff?
>
> and Ay ay baby it hurts


I think it was Klien that sued for the royalties, Klien owns the rights to the pre 71 songs I believe.

If you can, listen to "the last time" andrew loog oldham orchestra version: exatly the same melody. Ashcroft only added lyrics.

If anyone could post the Oldham version, I'd be curious to hear it. Never thought Bitter Sweet sounded anything like The Last Time. It is one of the great songs of the last 10-15 years.

Its a sample right? But it would be more fair to say that they sampled Loogs version of a Jaggerrichards song. Mick and keith didnt write anything like Bittersweet, its the Verves song alright.

Ashcroft said ironically in the Rolling Stone (back in 1998) that BSS was the best Jagger-Richards song...of the last twenty or so years.
Maybe he's right.

Pretty much says it all.

georgelicks Wrote:
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> Ashcroft said ironically in the Rolling Stone
> (back in 1998) that BSS was the best
> Jagger-Richards song...of the last twenty or so
> years.
> Maybe he's right.

Even if that were true (and it isn't) that would still be one more great song than the Verve have ever done. What are they known for other than BSS? Oh, that's right, absolutely nothing.

BSS doesn't sound too much like the Stones' version of The Last Time to me, but I've heard the Oldham orchestra version of TLT and it is obvious that BSS is a total ripoff of it. They should have known better than to rip it off so blatantly, especially since the rights are owned by Klein, one of the most notorious sharks in the business.

I think we have only fragments of the truth.
It´s not just rich Stones & ice-cold Klein vis-a-vis
poor & idealistic Verve.
The fact BSS have similarities with TLT doesnt mean they´re
the same song*. I once read they were indicated to
some record company´s vault (or The Vault?), where someone picked up the BSS-embryo for them.
I wish I could recall where I saw it.

* There are loads of Stones-songs that have traits from other Stones-songs.

ohnonotyouagain Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Even if that were true (and it isn't) that would
> still be one more great song than the Verve have
> ever done. What are they known for other than BSS?
> Oh, that's right, absolutely nothing.
>
That CD (Urban Hymns) has other great songs, particularly Sonnet. My first thought when I heard Streets of Love was that the intro sounded an awful lot like Sonnet, which is pretty ironic. While I like SOL a lot, Sonnet is much better.

Why shlould Andrew Loog Oldham call the song on his record The Last Time by Jagger Richard

Nico


[s19.yousendit.com]

Brian played the riff to The Last Time live on two occasions: the May 2nd, 1965 appearance on the Ed Sullivan show and the NME Pollwinners Concert at Wembley Stadium in early 1965. It is clearly evident, since he did such a good job of playing the riff live, that Brian wrote the main riff to Last Time, which was really the only original part of the song. It should have at least been a Jagger/ Jones/ Richards credit . . .

NICOS Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Why shlould Andrew Loog Oldham call the song on
> his record The Last Time by Jagger Richard
>
> Nico
>
Thanks for posting! I am shocked by what how blatantly they ripped off this version, and how they would have the audacity to act outraged when they were sued. The strings are lifted entirely from the Oldham version; so is the beat. Yeah, Ashcroft's words and vocals are great but...