With the current events regarding wiretaps...
plus its a cool groove!
DR

Dillard Richardson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> With the current events regarding wiretaps...
> plus its a cool groove!
> DR


yes indeed Dillard......and it's release during the "watergate" era was perfect......a unique Stones track imo

Unique for sure. especially that synthesizer, from Bill Wyman...and the bass solo from Ronnie! They had fun with it live, too...Jagger acting out going to sleep...but that lick is bad! happy new year!
DR

Agreed!

"These days there's no privacy

Just secrecy..."

Yeah, its a shame that the U.S. has listened to the phone conversations of 30
people who are associated with capyured high level terrorists who want to kill
as many citizens as possible.

How dare the U.S take steps to make sure another 9/11 does not happen.

You may not want to criticize what you did not live thru.

Does anybody else here know what a human bodies looks like after the person had
to jump 1,000 feet to their death so they would not be burned alive? The
bodies, if you can still call it that, looks like a bloody izza.Unrecognizable
as people and seared into your memory.

If you aint doing anything wrong, you have nothing to worry about.

Fingerprint File was not written about listening in on phone conversations
between terrorists associates. Mick was coked out and paranoid (as was Lennon)
and the song reflects MJ's bloated ego at the time.

There are almost 300 million people in America, 30 people, who are friends
with captured Al-Quaida members got wire tapped. TOO @#$%& BAD.



Milo, NYC
Got to get into a fight

Amen to that Milo.

With you all the way, Milo

I just can't understand the people that have a problem with this...how 'liberal' can one be?

Mick was just having fun with this tune, I think

Lennon wasn't being paranoid, the FBI were bugging him and following him as he maintained (and kept a 96 page file on him most of which got released to the public under the Freedom of Information Act). The song's paranoia is very real but this doesn't mean Mick was himself paranoid in the same way that just beacause he sang Midnight Rambler didn't make him a serial killer.

If the FBI and CIA etc did just use bugging in order to prevent real terrorist threats I don't think most people would have a problem but historically they have abused their powers and kept anyone vaguely left-wing or opposed to the government under surveillance as well as interfering with foreign democracies, assaination attempts on foreign leaders, experimenting secretly with LSD on their own troops etc. etc. I wouldn't place a lot of faith in those @#$%& doing anything much for the good of the public.

Regarding the risk this thread will evolve in a mean political way,
I have to weigh my words on golden scales.

But Lennon and Usama aint exactly the same thing, are they?
I wouldnt have a new Grond Zero if I were a US hot shot.
Actually I wouldnt weant it if I was a simple citizen either.
Even in my peaceful & naïve country we have a Security Police.

But I guess we/you gotta continue this somewhere else...

....Maybe we could discuss the song instead?
Nice piece of music, if ya ask me....

That is one badass lick! My fave part is inb the first breakdown, when it gets a bit quiet and Jagger raps a little then it kicks back in. It is mainly the Bass carryinbg the groove, and after Jagger finishes his line that monster lick crashes back in. I wonder is it doubled with a keyboard?

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

I wonder if anyone bugged the recording session? :-)

M. Yammbag- my apologies, the comment I make about this song being relevant today is my opinion about the misuse of government secret surveillance, which has a long historical precedent. it's dangerous. But I never meant to make any flip remarks about those who died 9/11.
DR

FF is more relevant than Neo-Con.

Yeah FF rocks, Sweet neo con is just embarrasing. BTW, the lick, Fingerprint, I just relized Mick plays it in standard tuning.

I´m sure SNC will be received well due to the past time
from aBB:s release... Around the turn of decades 2010´s/2020´s
it will be ranked as high... People take it as hypocrisy
from Jagger´s side plus the song has a monotonous side.
But so has many Stones songs.

Dillard, no need to apologize. I understand where you are coming from regarding Fingerprint File and wire taps in general.

I believe in limited and non-intrusive government (yes that is a founding belief of the Republican party contrary to popular belief) government. I do not think that FF is relevant regarding the phone taps that have been conducted to gain information and/or prevent attacks.

Sorry about the rant. I was there as it was happening. Lets just say I am a civil servant in NYC. I overreacted when I saw a silly song conected to actions taken to stop people from being murdered.

It is not by accident that the US and other nations in the world have not suffered a MAJOR 9/11 type attack in 4 years. I am no fan of war, but this situation is different and the taps placed upon 30 or so people was justified, legal and needed. What the US is doing is helping many nations also, but the Liberal Controlled American press will never admit that because they hate Bush so much. Nobody needs the press to tell them that the US has been very successful in preventing attacks in the last 4 years

No need to apologize. Fingerprint File has a cool groove to it but I always thought the lyrics were a little over the top and I think it has no relevance today other than the topic is wire taps and surviellance.

If we don't keep an ear and an eye on these @#$%& we will get hit again. They are trying to get a nuke. Put things in perspective: wire tap 30 people associated with matter of fact, captured terrorists VS another 3000 innocent people murdered or a nuke detonation.

Thank god we have a President who is willing to doing everything possible to catch, kill and prevent these @#$%& from killing more people. What he sanctioned was totally legal, but, if some laws need to be bent to get these bastards, so be it.

The real scary part is if some Liberal "stick my head in the sand and make sure I am politically correct when it comes to dealing with terrorism".....yes I am talking about Bill Clinton, Al Gore and other idiots like them........becomes President when Bush's term is up THEN the US will be TOTALLY @#$%&.

Milo, NYC
You'll never make a Saint of me.

PS: Neo-Con is a shitty song, first musically and then the lyrics. Mick should shut up because he is not even American and secondly, and more pathetically, I think he only put that crappy track on BANG as a publicity ploy, which did not work. He could have put "Radar" or "Go Home" on what is a really good album. Plus he really changed his tune since 91's "Highwire". What a @#$%& Phony Hypocrite. He also gets his little jibes in on "Dangerous Beauty". Such a shame that Iraqi Killers got @#$%& with a little bit.....what happened to them was nothing compared to what they did to people before murdering them. Those poor prisoners were not tortuered, they got "mind @#$%&", thats all........but they deserved a lot worse.

Milo Yammbag Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Such a shame that
> Iraqi Killers got @#$%& with a little bit.....what
> happened to them was nothing compared to what they
> did to people before murdering them. Those poor
> prisoners were not tortuered, they got "mind
> @#$%&", thats all........but they deserved a lot
> worse.

How the f*ck do you know that the tortured prisoners had done ANYTHING to deserve what was done to them, you sanctimonious prick? And why hijack this thread with ranting about 9/11? It's a typical Republican tactic to accuse anyone who disagrees with the Bush administration of not caring about 9/11, and it makes me sick.

Treesnake wrote:

"It's a typical Republican tactic to accuse anyone who disagrees with the Bush administration of not caring about 9/11, and it makes me sick."

That's true to a degree. But also, it's a long recognized tactic of the extreme left to hysterically shout down those who disagree with them, while offering no soutions beyond the rhetoric.

BOBM Wrote:
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> That's true to a degree. But also, it's a long
> recognized tactic of the extreme left to
> hysterically shout down those who disagree with
> them, while offering no soutions beyond the
> rhetoric.

This is simply ignorant. A "long recognized tactic of the extreme left"? Please.

"soutions" to what? You're saying that Milo advocates wiretapping to prevent another 9/11 and I have no other "soutions" to offer to prevent 9/11 instead? Bullsh*t. My solution is to respect the First Amendment and NOT wiretap conversations originating within the United States at either end. Show me what these wiretaps have picked up that has resulted in thwarting terrorist attacks, please.

I love how you Republicans bitch and moan about the Constitution being violated when it suits your purposes (e.g., when Democratic Senators hold up the confirmation of a judicial appointee, they are exceeding their constitutional powers to "advise and consent"), but then say it is no big deal when someone else's constitutional rights are being violated.

Well now Treesnake, you just made my point, didn't you?: Hysterical ranting with no solutions and not even a rational interpretation of the issue.

How can you call me ignorant when you don't even know me or what knowledge I have? For one thing was not refering to anything Milo was saying. For another I am a political moderate.

What is your solution to Al Quaeda or the development of a nuke by Iran? Let's hear what course the U.S. should take on these issues? Saying your "solution is to respect the first amendment and not wiretap conversations ....", is a pitiful reply, because it is just another way of saying your solution is to do nothing. That's the same sort of answers we hear every day from the Democrat left: "we can't do this and we shouldn't do that, but I have no clue what we should do instead." Let's hear what you specifically think the U.S. should do re: events in Iran.

Are you ignorant or misinformed? Are you not aware of what often happens when right wing speakers appear at Universities? The tactic is to disrupt and shout down speakers so they cannot be heard. Is that some sort of exception you allow to respect for the first amendment?

Milo wrote: Thank god we have a President who is willing to doing everything possible to catch, kill and prevent these @#$%& from killing more people. What he sanctioned was totally legal, but, if some laws need to be bent to get these bastards, so be it. (Stalin would have loved that logic, and, Adolph too for that matter).

Here's a rational interpretation: 'Totally legal? Milo, The president does not have the authority to decide who gets wire-taped without court approval, which is nothing to get anyway. So why not just get it? Answer: Bush and his people think they are above the law! Pretty scary, sounds like something Sadam probably did all the time, in the name of 'national security' of course.

What evidence do you guys have other than right wing fear mongers that they are trying to get a nuke? huh? Show me. Are we back to the 'yellow cake' theory?

And, there is NO proof that Iran is trying to develope a nuke, none. (This kind of crap is how we got into Iraq, remember?)

Oh ya one more thing, the fact that this kind of disinformation is spread WIDELY in the press (almost exclusively) is proof that there is no 'liberal' controlled media, quite the opposite actually. Any kind of dissent is labeled 'liberal'. Gee, that makes me feel free as a bird.

Sorry bv, I know you hate this kind of crap and I hope you ax the whole thread but I just couldn't stand to be brow beat (one more time!!!!!!!) by a bunch of loonies who would let this country become the very thing they say they are fighting.

Oh, I almost forgot, (not because this thread was 'hi-jacked' or anything) I think the song is very relevant today.

I ain't stupid, I'm just guitarded.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-01-04 14:18 by RankOutsider.

LOL. Bärs, do you care to give us a good analyses? I'm too tired to rock but I will say this. Thank God for the "wall", fence, in Israel. It saves lives everyday. Which is the task of any government. If the US can save lives wiretap conversations then go ahead. It's not their job to help the poor misunderstood nazi-terrorists.

Why is it so important for the left to help the terrorists, is it the common ideas about Jews or is there something else?

Easy please. Leave the Left at the streep where they dwell.
The Right has already fallen over.

Rank Outsider - Totally disingenious to site Stalin, @#$%& and Hussein - they killed their own people. Let me repeat that...they killed millions of their own people. Bush is simply using the the assets at his disposal to prevent another attack and for that I thank him.

And if you think there is no liberal media bias in this country then I want whatever it is that you're smoking.

Your gonna get erased by Björnulf. Beware!!

BOBM Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The tactic is to
> disrupt and shout down speakers so they cannot be
> heard. Is that some sort of exception you allow
> to respect for the first amendment?

Just as I said, ignorance: constitutional rights are only enforceable against the government. Private actors can stop anyone they want from speaking without violating the First Amendment.

And as for not offering solutions, do you not realize that some of the "anti-terrorism" tactics that the Bush administrations is engaged in (e.g., torturing prisoners) will have precisely the effect of STIMULATING terrorist activity when brought to light? Now, I'm not saying that domestic wiretapping per se will have this effect, only that it's a wholly illegal activity of questionable efficacy. (Wire-tapping that takes place outside of the United States does not present the same constitututional problem, although its efficacy is still questionable.) But when Milo hijacks a thread about "Fingerprint File" to say that 9/11 justifies torturing people, I'm sorry, but I won't stand by in silence.

I don't believe for a second that you're a moderate, merely another right-winger who likes to CLAIM to be moderate (maybe one who even mistakenly THINKS that he is a moderate). But the ruse fails when you show that you don't know what you're talking about.

George Bush hasn't done a single thing to make American's lives safer. He's a lazy, selfish, ignorant bastard. On the contrary, tens of thousands of innocents have died on his watch.

Regardless of where anyone stands politically you gotta admit Fingerprint File has a great groove. I Love the crunchy guitar. Did someone say that's Ronnie on bass?

Treesnake - Your crusade on civil rights (torture, wire taps) is admirable but let me remind you that you don't have any civil rights if your dead. I want my country to do all it can to keep its citizens safe from terrorist activity.

As for your accusation of current administration policy stimulating terrorist activity - get your head out of the sand...this stuff has been happening since the beginning of time and is vital to winning a war. The only difference now is that the New York Times splashes it on the front page. Could you imagine a 1943 news story about the torture of prisoners? FDR would have had heads rolling at the New York Times but sadly, today's "journalists" feel the need to go way beyond ordinary dissent and head straignt into undermining the effort with some actually inexplicably and treasonously siding with the enemy.