What are the other four?

My Amazon review of Undercover:

Put this in perspective:

A.1979's Emotional Rescue was pretty much made up of Some Girls outtakes

B.1981's excellent Tattoo You was in reality an odds and sods release made up of half forgotten gems recorded throughout the 70's, rescued from the vaults and polished up.

C.1982's Still Life was the ragged glory live album documenting the 81-82 tour which was probably the most hyped rock extravaganza in history and re-positioned the Stones as arguably the most loved band in the world

D.In '85 Mick would go solo with She's The Boss

E.1986 brought arguably the lamest album in the Stones cannon, Dirty Work

So that leaves us to consider Undercover, the first batch of newly written tracks since 1978's Some Girls (although Too Tough had been hanging around in the vaults since the mid `70's). This was also the first release since the universally praised glory of Tattoo You and the '81 tour. Interestingly, the band did not go out of their way to replicate the classic rock sound of Tattoo You but instead tried to re-invent themselves for the 80's, exploring some new and "Modern' sounds. Thankfully, it was a little too early in the Miami Vice decade for the "Modern" production techniques of the era to doom this record to sounding embarrassingly dated (see She's The Boss and Dirty Work for examples of this kind of unfortunate excess). Some of the highlights:

1.Undercover of the Night: Title track, first single and centerpiece. Definitely the sound of the Stones re-inventing themselves for the 80's. Phased guitars, jungle rhythms and vaguely politically-themed lyrics suggesting the Central American bloodshed dominating the headlines at the time. This song is very catchy, quite rocking, not embarrassing or dated and earns the band points for trying something new and not just phoning in their performance. The band has been known to pull this one out for live performances over the years and is a welcome addition to their concerts.

2.She Was Hot: Fun, lusty rocker that is good without being great. A little overproduced, this song would have benefited from a more raw production style. This one screams for inclusion in their live set, where it would potentially come into its own as a barn burner ala Respectable or Rip This Joint.

3.Wanna Hold You: A decent rocker but not one of Keith's greatest songs; not bad either. I'd like to see Keith trot this one out for their next tour.

4.Too Much Blood: The most `80's song here but in a good way. This is really a Mick song (the bizarre violence story lyrics recorded when he was drunk) with a guitar tech playing the main riff. Definitely intended for the dance floor, this track works and is considered by some Stones freaks as the best song on the record. Surprisingly, this still sounds fresh and not dated although it certainly is of its era.

5.Pretty Beat Up: This has become my favorite track on the album. Don't believe the Jagger / Richards / Wood credits, this is a Ronnie song that those greedy bastids tacked their names onto. A totally cool 80's dance funk groover that manages to swing and rock at the same time, put this song on loud at your next blowout and watch your guests go nuts. Ronnie has been known to play this live in his solo sets and this is another one that just begs to be played live by the Stones. This is one of the great unappreciated Stones songs, ripe for rediscovery.

6.Too Tough: This simple rocker has got classic status in its blood but never quite gels. It reminds me of Silver Train, a good song that you just know has greatness in it but never quite arrives. As a side note, a great Portland, OR bar band of the 80's and early 90's, The Batz, used to include this in their set and really made it come to life.

Nothing really wrong with the rest of the tracks on this album but I think of them as second tier in comparison to the former. As a matter of fact, if these last ones had been saved for Dirty Work, they would have been the highlights of that lackluster record.

7. Tie You Up (the pain of love): A grinding, riffing groove-rocker. Okay.

8. Feel On Baby: Another groover with a whiff of the jungle

9. All The Way Down: The most Tattoo You-feeling track on the album. A generic rocker in the vein of Neighbors

10. It Must Be Hell: A mid-tempo riff rocker, nothing to get too excited about.

Interesting points, cbt. I mostly agree... though I don't really see the need to give a whole lot of credit for "Pretty Beat Up" to ron. As I said, I love the track. might be my 2nd favorite on the album after "Tie You Up," but it's hardly a "song," just a riff with some great improvised(?) vocals. If he came up with the riff, ok, well that's why he got a co-credit. I recently edited the wikipedia article on ron and included this song among his stones writing credits, but more to call attention to the song than to give him props as a songwriter.

BTW, I checked the liner notes, and it's keith on bass for "PBU," while bill plays an electric piano.

"All the Way Down" is much lighter than "Neighbours."

I think it's important to note the dub aspects of "Feel On Baby." Maybe keith's most interesting contribution to the album.

cc

Sorry if I am entering this conversation late, but I LOVE THIS ALBUM.
All the Way Down remains one of my favorite songs of all time.
I really dig the way it kicks off.

cc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Interesting points, cbt. I mostly agree... though
> I don't really see the need to give a whole lot of
> credit for "Pretty Beat Up" to ron. As I said, I
> love the track. might be my 2nd favorite on the
> album after "Tie You Up," but it's hardly a
> "song," just a riff with some great improvised(?)
> vocals. If he came up with the riff, ok, well
> that's why he got a co-credit. I recently edited
> the wikipedia article on ron and included this
> song among his stones writing credits, but more to
> call attention to the song than to give him props
> as a songwriter.
>
> BTW, I checked the liner notes, and it's keith on
> bass for "PBU," while bill plays an electric
> piano.
>
> "All the Way Down" is much lighter than
> "Neighbours."
>
> I think it's important to note the dub aspects of
> "Feel On Baby." Maybe keith's most interesting
> contribution to the album.
>
> cc


You know, you may very well be right about the shared songwriting credit on Pretty Beat Up. But, I have always found it very suspicious that Ronnie was able to write songs for a shelf-full of solo albums all by his lonesome but whenever his name turns up on a Stones song, it is a "shared" credit.

BTW, on a related topic: It seems to me that shortly after the Columbus show this year, I read a quote from Mick saying something like Keith wasn't all that up for playing Sway because he did not contribute to the original track. The inference was that it was a Mick Jagger guitar opus, conveniently forgetting Mick Taylor. Do you recall this? I found it galling.




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-12-20 23:16 by cbtaco19.

Love this sleazy album. It is highly underrated. Got it for Christmas when I was 10 on vinyl. 83 or 84. Can't remember. Listened to the album last night. Love the feel of it.

cbtaco19 Wrote:
> You know, you may very well be right about the
> shared songwriting credit on Pretty Beat Up. But,
> I have always found it very suspicious that Ronnie
> was able to right songs for a shelf-full of solo
> albums all by his lonesome but whenever his name
> turns up on a Stones song, it is a "shared"
> credit.
>
>

gotta news flash for ya - anytime someone other than Jagger-Richards appears in a song credit, it means that person wrote the song. Mick & Keith always get a co-credit no matter who else in the band actually wrote the song. Reason #1 why MT left the band, IMO.....

T&A Wrote:
>
> gotta news flash for ya - anytime someone other
> than Jagger-Richards appears in a song credit, it
> means that person wrote the song. Mick & Keith
> always get a co-credit no matter who else in the
> band actually wrote the song. Reason #1 why MT
> left the band, IMO.....

Yeah. But in this case, my point was just that there was hardly any "writing" to speak of as far as "Pretty Beat Up" is concerned. I think we hear it being written over the course of the track. mick's vocals were probably sharpened up later on. The looseness is why it works so well, IMO (in addition to fitting with the dark vibe of the whole album), but it's not something to highlight on the resume of a songwriter.

cbt, I understand your point about "Sway." But recall that mick wrote that song and plays the riff on the SF version. It's wonderful soloing by MT, but I would agree with mick that what often makes or breaks a song for live performance is keith's interest. So many good jagger numbers haven't made the cut over the years... "100 Years Ago," "Fingerprint File"... though on the other side, there's "Hand of Fate."

There's a CD out there somewhere... Ronnie Wood (Live on Wood??) of Ronnie & friends in 1992 at the Electricladyland. PRETTY BEAT UP is right there in the set, and it sounds good. That doesn't really go towards writing credits, though. I just wanted to mention it.

But, it just underscores the assumption that Ronnie wrote the song...just like he wrote Black Limo and IORR....

Those songs also were played by Ronnie & band at the concert I mentioned. He sang Beat Up & Limo, and I THINK Bernard Fowler sang It's Only. I'll try to post them hear if I can find a copy of the CD.

I've posted this elsewhere, but I'll leave it here, too: Can anyone upload through yousendit the track called CELLOPHANE TROUSER? It's an early instrumental version of TOO TOUGH. I know it's on a comp called MIDNIGHT WOMEN, but I only have that on cassette and have no way of transferring it onto the internet.

>> What's that little vocal bit, really quiet, just before 'It Must Be Hell'?
Is that Keith? "Don't amp it again, just... drop a sec." <<

that's Ronnie - "don't amp it agin, just drop us in" i think he says.
cool thread! i can't stop moving to Undercover. for me it's an album for shakin my tailfeather, not for wondering why,
so it's interesting to read these more analytical (if you'll pardon the expression) approaches. swing on! :E


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith

with sssoul Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >> What's that little vocal bit, really
> quiet, just before 'It Must Be Hell'?
> Is that Keith? "Don't amp it again, just... drop
> a sec." <<
>
> that's Ronnie - "don't amp it agin, just drop us
> in" i think he says.


Isnt it "Dont hear it from the beginning, just drop us in" ?
Erik.

Yeah, could be. It reminds me of that little thing after 'Brown Sugar'.

In the other thread, is a download of an outtake that later became 'Too Tough'

Just want to remind everyone about this wonderful album. The first Stones Album I ever bought. Lots of great tracks: Must Be Hell, She Was Hot, The Pain of Love, Too Tough an of course the title track.

I think this one is much better than many other albums from the 90's/00's like BTB, Bigger Bang and SW!

I hope they will play a lot of Undercover songs on the new tour!

Undercover is my favorite Stones album after the Big 4 and Some Girls. and I would like to point out that the final 1 and a half or so minutes of It Must Be Hell is the greatest ending to a Stones album since Moonlight Mile.

I love Undercover. I think it's the last experimental Stones album, a dance version of Satanic Majesties, and one of the bleakest, darkest things they ever released - lyrically. The album would, I think, have been improved if they'd dropped "I Wanna Hold You" and included I Think I'm Going Mad (the long version on the Static In The Attic boot) at the end, as well as the superb extended version of She Was Hot too. I Wanna Hold You doesn't fit the album at all, thematically, or musically. In fact it sticks out like a wart covered hunchback on a catwalk.

i love undercover
my fav song on the album is all the way down

it's_all_wrong Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Undercover is my favorite Stones album after the
> Big 4 and Some Girls. and I would like to point
> out that the final 1 and a half or so minutes of
> It Must Be Hell is the greatest ending to a Stones
> album since Moonlight Mile.


I'll have to check that out. I can honestly say I've never listened to that one all the way through.

Undercover Of The Night. Live in Atlantic City, 1989.

I think it is a more cohesive album than Tatoo You and I actually like it better than Some Girls. It's strength lies in Jagger's great lyrics.

I still rank this album right up there with the big four, BB to Exile. I rank it higher than Some Girls. It's just such a nasty, raw, aggressive album, I love it.

By the way, it's Keith whom says "don't play it from the beginning, just drop us in". I never can really understand the word "play" though. It's recorded through the talk-back mike of the studio.

Mathijs

For me more sentimental....first album new since I became a fan....But whenever I think of life as a whole the line from all the way down comes to me..."how the years rush on by ...bithdays kids an suicides.....only thing missing is not one single ballad...but if you have the out takes you have Keith singing "your too much"...why did this one get away????

MAINOFFENDER_2000 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> but if you have the out takes you have
> Keith singing "your too much"...why did this one
> get away????



That is a Dirty Work outtake...

Mathijs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I still rank this album right up there with the
> big four, BB to Exile. I rank it higher than Some
> Girls. It's just such a nasty, raw, aggressive
> album, I love it.
>
> By the way, it's Keith whom says "don't play it
> from the beginning, just drop us in". I never can
> really understand the word "play" though. It's
> recorded through the talk-back mike of the studio.
>
>
> Mathijs

couldn't that be a request (or directive) to 'drop him in' (have engineer hit 'record' on the new 'overdub' track...) on a song section somewhere close to the actual new part (or re-done bit etc...) being recorded?...rather than wait and wait time and time again thru sections of the song not targetted for the new part? sort of like heavily decreasing the amount of 'pre-roll' before a dubbed 'take'?
i would guess that could be it....?

I don't profess or pretend to be a rock writer by any stretch, but here's by 2 cents on Undercover...

While there is very little actual reggae on the disc, it's production values (bass up front, heavy reverb on the percussion heavliy split stereo nuances) scream Carribean lust. This album is very, very under-valued. Like Goats Head Soup before it (almost like a 10-year anniversary), this Mick-driven work is loved by some who "get it", and wrongly written off by others who would prefer the Stones stick to the same-old 3 chord 4/4 Berry-sounding Keef twiddling.

Sorry, this album uses that method sparingly (She Was Hot, All The Way Down) - but even those two songs carry enough of Mick's mischevious narrative and Mick's sometimes thoughful chord progressions beyond what you would expect.

For Many Mick fans, this album seems like his last attempt to bring his and along with him into this kind of risk-taking, before the albums sounded like split hybrid-solo efforts (DW, BT or weak comprimises (SW, AB.

I feel that Keith's moment to shine after this LP wasn't DW, it was VL. But undercover is Mick's genius all the way down (except for Keef's admittedly great Wanna Hold You).

Mathijs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>>
> By the way, it's Keith whom says "don't play it
> from the beginning, just drop us in". I never can
> really understand the word "play" though. It's
> recorded through the talk-back mike of the studio.
>

Isn't Chris Kinsey the one who says that? As far as I know, the Stones wrot a riff for tha song, but Kimsey suggests them not to play, and just "drop it (the song) in".

Don't AMP from the beginning, just drop us in? That's what I think anyway. Some great stuff on here, some not so great too.

Like: She Was Hot, Pain Of Love, Too Tough, All The Way Down

Don't Dig : Undercover, Dogshit AKA Pretty Beat Up

"No Anchovies, Please"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2007-03-27 16:49 by Elmo Lewis.