Hi Cris,

I have brussels and all of the 73 tour i think now but i was not 100% sure he
was playing slide on some parts on MR since his tone was more distorted for the
73 tour. And I never have seen footage of taylor playing MR live - On Ladies and
Gentleman - Taylor is in the dark and out of much of the footage same on the DVD
Gimme Shelter - they had the CAMERA always on JAGGER which was unfortunate if we
want to watch the guitars.

I don't like "soaring guitars." If I did, I would listen to pink floyd instead of the stones. taylor is great until '73, in my view, when he starts "to soar" too much. The air gets rather thin up in the taylor-sphere, and there's no way to breathe in "Time Waits For No One." Maybe he would have adapted, but as it stands, I'm glad there was no more of that from '75 on.

Now, what you say about jagger's vocals responding to his guitar style is interesting. But he was also barking a bit by '73.

The best option may have been a reined-in taylor. But if that wasn't going to happen, I'm glad he left.

cc

floyd - time and space music to THINK -

In my humble opinion (as has been stated by a thousand other people, a thousand times over), the interplay between Taylor / Richards and Woods / Richards is just entirely different...but I don't think either one is better or worse.

With Taylor on board, I think Keith played some absolutely dynamite rhythm guitar - especially on the live stuff I've heard from that era (Midnight Rambler '73, Rip this Joint '72, Stray Cat Blues - early '70s, etc.) which was cool because I think that's what he does best, especially when he concentrates on it (and doesn't screw around with trying to solo in the middle of a song when he should be chopping out awesome, dirty chords...see Licks Tour and beyond)

However - the back and fourth between Keith and Ronnie really makes Keith's scrappy lead playing come to life - stuff like Respectable, Just My Imagination, Beast of Burden,...even into the Undercover material - friggin awesome.

End of the day - different but equal.

Has any other band expressed an interest in Mick Taylor over the years?

Stones = Brian/Taylor/Wood = 1966 --> 1975....other than that - shit !

Esky

I love the late 60's/early 70's live stuff - the Stones were absolutely at the top of their game, but to my ears, Taylor's guitar, as good as it is technically, just doesn't fit with the rest of the band. Keith, for all his faults, was laying down riffs so solid you could stand your pint on them, and Mick sounds like he's a kid in a guitar shop showing off his virtuosity by jamming over top.

Time Waits For No One is my fave Mick T. in stones track.

[www.petitiononline.com]




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-12-02 20:45 by Miss U..

stones had three rhythm guitarist - brian ,woody, keith

Taylor's vibrato was never replaced and that sure effects the LIVE gig and thats
where they have always fallen short since 1981. So the formula of the greatest
rock and roll act was gone when Taylor left the band.No matter how great keith,
charlie and mick were they were never again all three the greatest rock act

Am I right in thinking that Keith does all the guitar work on Gimme Shelter (studio), and most of it on LIB?

oh come on now you know keith is more of a rhythm player and taylor was the only
true lead player the stones ever had.

yes give credit to keith for all his guitar work on BB and LIB - I am talking more about the live perfromances.

OpenG Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> oh come on now you know keith is more of a rhythm
> player and taylor was the only
> true lead player the stones ever had.
>
> yes give credit to keith for all his guitar work
> on BB and LIB - I am talking more about the live
> perfromances.


All I'm saying is that GS is right up there with my favorite Stones Guitar, and it's all Keith. One could argue that the best combination of Stones guitarists is Keith and Keith and . . .

keith also plays most of the leads in the early days, if my ears are correct. Any of the berry-style numbers, it's him taking the solos, just like today. And when brian plays harmonica (or something else, when we move into '66) and keith is the only guitar on the original rhythm track, the overdubbed guitar(s) are always keith.

I wish the wrongheaded idea of keith as "ultimate RHYTHM guitarist" were not so widespread, b/c I think it appealed to him, and we didn't get anymore of the brilliant BB and LIB lead style!

taylor did play with dylan in the studio - the Infidels album - and on tour in '84. A pretty hot band, but he doesn't sound quite the same. dylan did not ask him back. I'm not sure exactly why he wasn't satisfied. On the bootlegs of dylan rehearsing for live aid with keith and ron, they briefly talk about him, but it's hard to grasp exactly what they mean, as it's a bit awkward for all involved (esp ron, I guess).

It's odd that so many people are fond of "Time Waits for No One." They must be disappointed by the rest of the stones' output, which doesn't sound anything like it.

cc

F.U.C. the Captain Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> BornOnTheBayou Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > And regardless of what a phenomenal guitarist
> Mick
> > Taylor is, if you allow Keith to develop his
> > licks, there's no more interesting guitarist
> on
> > the planet... and Keith's best playing has
> been
> > AFTER MT left, IMO.
>
> This seems a gross statement to me... however I
> think Keith's best playing has not been after Mick
> Taylor but after the Toronto drug bust 1977. He
> reached his peak around 1992 with his solo album
> MAIN OFFENDER but hasn't lived up to his
> reputation since.
>
> "You don't have to mean it", "Losing my touch" and
> "Infamy" are utter BS, sorry. The main riff of
> "Rough justice" was written by Ronnie (probably
> the reason why they didn't kick him out of the
> band). Keith seems to have entirely lost his
> former interest in rock'n'roll. Instead he has
> dived deeper into blues (that's ok), country (it's
> enough now) and reggae (which he still only
> imitates).

Hey Captain...

Well the reason you're wrong is that Keith's guitar playing has done NOTHING BUT IMPROVE since Taylor left...

Not saying that he continued to improve BECAUSE MT left...

Keith NEVER PLAYED BETTER than he did with Ron Wood during the Forty Licks tour.

Your "citations" are all about recorded studio music which I would certainly agree hasn't been steadily less interesting.


"It's just that demon life has got me in it's sway..."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2005-12-04 01:38 by BornOnTheBayou.

KevStonesFan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> In my humble opinion (as has been stated by a
> thousand other people, a thousand times over), the
> interplay between Taylor / Richards and Woods /
> Richards is just entirely different...but I don't
> think either one is better or worse.
>
> With Taylor on board, I think Keith played some
> absolutely dynamite rhythm guitar - especially on
> the live stuff I've heard from that era (Midnight
> Rambler '73, Rip this Joint '72, Stray Cat Blues -
> early '70s, etc.) which was cool because I think
> that's what he does best, especially when he
> concentrates on it (and doesn't screw around with
> trying to solo in the middle of a song when he
> should be chopping out awesome, dirty chords...see
> Licks Tour and beyond)
>
> However - the back and fourth between Keith and
> Ronnie really makes Keith's scrappy lead playing
> come to life - stuff like Respectable, Just My
> Imagination, Beast of Burden,...even into the
> Undercover material - friggin awesome.
>
> End of the day - different but equal.

Very well said... and in the end how can there be any question that Keith isn't a more prominent part of the duo with Ronnie than he was with Mick.

The best examples of this... the last 3 tours where Keith has become far more of a guitar monster than he ever was on tour with Mick Taylor.


"It's just that demon life has got me in it's sway..."

Because he had to - because Ronnie cant play anymore. Mick Taylor isnt stupid.

X



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2008-04-24 22:14 by Erik_Snow.

And you who started this thread:

"Mick Taylor is screaming" all over Jaggers vocals?

Thats your opinion and I respect that very much.

Can you see that?

Cheers Bjorn

Esky Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Stones = Brian/Taylor/Wood = 1966 -->
> 1975....other than that - shit !
>
> Esky


If you think Some girls and Tatto you are shit esky then your a @#$%& moron! both of those albums tower above many things they did before that .better then Between the buttons,satanic, vastly better then GHS and IORR, jesus I would hate to hear the stones if they continued on the path after IORR, they might of ended up like some typical crap 70's rock band. I love Taylor's work on SF and EOMS but the more he got involved on GHS and IORR the more the band suffered. Time waits for No one is one of the worst tracks the Stones ever recorded they were starting to vere into the likes of Kansas and Styx with that one. So he played great solos, so @#$%& what! Thats not what the stones were ever about, jesus if you want to hear long winded "brillaint" guitar solos go listen to Zep or Yes not me I like a bit of ragged. Peace!

Well - sometimes - OpenG, I read things too fast...

Sorry...

I believe that the pinnacle of Stones guitar work occurred during the 60's. The original guitar duo of Keith Richards and Brian Jones was the best, and they wrote the blueprint for how two guitars can most effectively be used in rock n' roll. Keith and Brian were the FIRST 'guitar weavers' in rock, and they both played great leads on various songs. Keith's best leads and solos were from the 60's, and Brian provided excellent slide work. MT and Ronnie never, in my estimation, replaced the orginal magic of Richards/Jones . . .

cc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> keith also plays most of the leads in the early
> days, if my ears are correct.

He was the lead guitarist. Brian generally played leads on slide only.


> taylor did play with dylan in the studio - the
> Infidels album - and on tour in '84. A pretty hot
> band, but he doesn't sound quite the same.

Yes, he developed as an artist since he left the Stones.


> dylan
> did not ask him back. I'm not sure exactly why he
> wasn't satisfied. On the bootlegs of dylan
> rehearsing for live aid with keith and ron, they
> briefly talk about him, but it's hard to grasp
> exactly what they mean, as it's a bit awkward for
> all involved (esp ron, I guess).

In the conversation, Dylan says that Taylor was inconsistent, which is not borne out by the record, and that Taylor generally does not follow up on Dylan's entreaties (blowing off meetings, etc.). But you need not listen to the tape to understand why Taylor didn't play with Dylan again. Dylan spent time trying to hide in plain sight behind personas, face paint, hockey masks and, in 1984, a superband that would play with identifiable virtuosity (rather than the wall of sound he'd worked with previously). After that, Dylan went on to play with celebrities in another failed attempt to humble himself. I am not surprised he did not look back.

> It's odd that so many people are fond of "Time
> Waits for No One." They must be disappointed by
> the rest of the stones' output, which doesn't
> sound anything like it.

In music, TWFNO has an obvious predecessor in WOAF, which was written earlier and released later. Lyrically, it seems to me that Jagger was reaching for a Beggars Banquet-type "statement" rather than the drugs and sex stuff that appeared on the 70s albums to date. I think you're missing that the Stones tastes and output are fairly broad. The band that recorded Stray Cat Blues or GOMC should not have been expected to record treacly versions of Under the Boardwalk or My Girl. But there obviously is a connection between the band that recorded those treacly things and the band that recorded If You Really Want to Be My Friend. Aren't those the Stones too?

BornOnTheBayou Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> IMO, when Keith and Ronnie are at their best their
> weaving is at least as interesting as Keith
> riffing on top of Taylor's lead...
>
> Witness all those awesome shows during the 40
> Licks tour... no 2 guitarists have ever sounded
> better as a duo than Keith & Ronnie on that
> tour.
couldnt hear them over Chuck LOL

BornOnTheBayou Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Keith NEVER PLAYED BETTER than he did with Ron
> Wood during the Forty Licks tour.
LOL

IMO- I think keith developed as a guitar player and songwriter with beggars and
Let It Bleed.Over the last 40 years he has kept it simple and developed is own
sound and style using all his bag of tricks with capo and open tunings.He has
not got better techically and I prefer him on acoustic guitar these days where
I find him to be more challenged and in my mind he has always been perfect on
acoustic making SFM and JJF sound like electric guitars on the studio cuts.

You Guys sometimes don,t give credit to what taylor brought to the stones an element of improvisation and melody that will never be replaced.

Slick Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> BornOnTheBayou Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> > Keith NEVER PLAYED BETTER than he did with
> Ron
> > Wood during the Forty Licks tour.
> LOL


So I guess you think that Keith wasn't playing so good on the Forty Licks Tour... ?

Since you find that suggestion "laughable", why don't you tell us specifically which tours he played better...

"It's just that demon life has got me in it's sway..."

Slick Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> BornOnTheBayou Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> > IMO, when Keith and Ronnie are at their best
> their
> > weaving is at least as interesting as Keith
> > riffing on top of Taylor's lead...
> >
> > Witness all those awesome shows during the
> 40
> > Licks tour... no 2 guitarists have ever
> sounded
> > better as a duo than Keith & Ronnie on
> that
> > tour.
> couldnt hear them over Chuck LOL
>
>


You really can't be serious... that you couldn't hear the guitars during Forty Licks...

Where do you live, we'll try and find you an ear doctor.


"It's just that demon life has got me in it's sway..."

Dylan Infidels album, Mick Taylor played guitar on the opening track of one side, Ron Wood played on the first track of the other side.

Disgusting, dummy Taylor fans. Very old and very boring story for the stupid masses.

everything's turnin' Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Dylan Infidels album, Mick Taylor played guitar on
> the opening track of one side, Ron Wood played on
> the first track of the other side.


You sure of that? Ronnie plays on some of Empire Burlesque, but I believe it's all Knopfler and MT on Infidels....