The Glimmers have been dealin'
with the press since they were eighteen ....
Behind closed doors they'd be rollin on da floor ....



ROCKMAN

==



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2022-06-22 08:14 by TheflyingDutchman.

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FP

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GasLightStreet
At the time Jimmy Miller was not functioning properly. I had to finish the whole record myself, because otherwise there were just the drunks and junkies. I was in L.A. trying to finish the record, up against a deadline. It was a joke.
-Mick Jagger, 2003

Listen, if you believe Mick, you'll believe anything. Once again this is the difference between Mick and me. His recollection is quite honestly bullshit. The only things we did in L.A. were things like, you know, We need three chicks to sing back-up on Let It Loose. Or we need a fiddle player. I mean, just extras. You see, the reason Mick says that is because he doesn't think his vocals are loud enough. But lead vocalists never think their vocals are loud enough. I would never take Mick's recollection of anything seriously. If Mick says that we just took a load of 'grungy' stuff out of France, and really made the record in L.A., that's bullshit.
- Keith Richards, 2009

Not all the lyrics were written in a Nellcote environment. That doesn't mean they're not about Nellcote. But a lot of them were written later in L.A. and they don't reflect the Nellcote thing at all. A lot of them are about going on the road, which was actually what was going to happen next. With Tumbling Dice, there's an outtake I've found that has completely different lyrics. It wasn't until we got to L.A. that I rewrote them. The original lyrics were crap. So it was nothing to do with the original experience of recording the album, if you see what I mean.
- Mick Jagger, 2009

[timeisonourside.com]

Keith's petulant remarks came about the time he was finishing LIFE - not much different than when he had his first solo album coming out and he was tearing Mick down left and right about his "jerk off band" or whatever - because the deluxe reissue of EXILE didn't come out for almost another year (it would be interesting to get the full context of what he said - some of the quotes, like from 2003, are from the Rolling Stone magazine interview that year for the LICKS tour, as I recall).

He has such a bizarre attitude at times, very judgmental and biased. He's admitted he was a junkie but he hasn't ever embraced admitting it. It's just an excuse for his projection, which drowned in jealousy decades ago.

And as much as he slags Mick for saying whatever, Mick's always been quite clear that EXILE wasn't just recorded in France.

As noted by a lot of people over the years, Mick has never said a bad thing about Keith in regard to what Keith has said about Mick. Such a weird dichotomy. At least I think that's the right word.

Great collection of quote, thanks for finding!

Hard to tell the truth really between what Mick and Keith both day, adds to the confusion

Mick tends to feign misrememberance but he has the best memory of anyone. Even Charlie knew the truth. Keith just makes shit up when he has whatever point it is to make yet has his moments of truly remembering things:

Exile is really a mixture of bits and pieces left over from the previous album recorded at Olympic Studios and which, after we got out of the contract with Allen Klein, we didn't want to give him: tracks like Shine a Light, and Sweet Virginia. Those were mixed up with a few slightly more grungy things done in the South of France. It's seen as one album all recorded there and it really wasn't. We just chucked everything in.
- Mick Jagger, 2003


Some songs - Sweet Virginia - were held over from Sticky Fingers. It was the same line-up and I've always felt those two albums kind of fold into each other... there was not much time between them and I think it was all flying out of the same kind of energy.
- Keith Richards


It wasn't made as an album, like you see it there (on the album sleeve). Some of it was made in London, at Olympic. Some of it was made in Mick's house in Berkshire. Then we went to France, and we finished it in L.A. It was just recording, and it was a way of using up old tracks. That's what we did in those days: just recorded. It kept you busy and out of trouble - as you've no doubt recently noticed (refers to Ron Wood's recent amorous troubles) - and it was stuff you could use later.
- Charlie Watts, 2009

[timeisonourside.com]

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dcba

I'd venture say that if Mick had had enough of the stones in the mid-70's and had gone solo, Keith would have started a solo band and... he would have probably ended up like Johnny Thunders (broke, dead from OD in a seedy hotel room in the middle of nowhere).
Keith knows very well what he owes Mick, hence the never-ending ressentment.

(sorry about being so OT).

The difference between Johnny Thunders and Keith is that Thunders absolutely had no talent whatsoever, and Keith is one of the best ever songwriter and guitarist.

Mathijs

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GasLightStreet

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FP

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GasLightStreet
At the time Jimmy Miller was not functioning properly. I had to finish the whole record myself, because otherwise there were just the drunks and junkies. I was in L.A. trying to finish the record, up against a deadline. It was a joke.
-Mick Jagger, 2003

Listen, if you believe Mick, you'll believe anything. Once again this is the difference between Mick and me. His recollection is quite honestly bullshit. The only things we did in L.A. were things like, you know, We need three chicks to sing back-up on Let It Loose. Or we need a fiddle player. I mean, just extras. You see, the reason Mick says that is because he doesn't think his vocals are loud enough. But lead vocalists never think their vocals are loud enough. I would never take Mick's recollection of anything seriously. If Mick says that we just took a load of 'grungy' stuff out of France, and really made the record in L.A., that's bullshit.
- Keith Richards, 2009

Not all the lyrics were written in a Nellcote environment. That doesn't mean they're not about Nellcote. But a lot of them were written later in L.A. and they don't reflect the Nellcote thing at all. A lot of them are about going on the road, which was actually what was going to happen next. With Tumbling Dice, there's an outtake I've found that has completely different lyrics. It wasn't until we got to L.A. that I rewrote them. The original lyrics were crap. So it was nothing to do with the original experience of recording the album, if you see what I mean.
- Mick Jagger, 2009

[timeisonourside.com]

Keith's petulant remarks came about the time he was finishing LIFE - not much different than when he had his first solo album coming out and he was tearing Mick down left and right about his "jerk off band" or whatever - because the deluxe reissue of EXILE didn't come out for almost another year (it would be interesting to get the full context of what he said - some of the quotes, like from 2003, are from the Rolling Stone magazine interview that year for the LICKS tour, as I recall).

He has such a bizarre attitude at times, very judgmental and biased. He's admitted he was a junkie but he hasn't ever embraced admitting it. It's just an excuse for his projection, which drowned in jealousy decades ago.

And as much as he slags Mick for saying whatever, Mick's always been quite clear that EXILE wasn't just recorded in France.

As noted by a lot of people over the years, Mick has never said a bad thing about Keith in regard to what Keith has said about Mick. Such a weird dichotomy. At least I think that's the right word.

Great collection of quote, thanks for finding!

Hard to tell the truth really between what Mick and Keith both day, adds to the confusion

Mick tends to feign misrememberance but he has the best memory of anyone. Even Charlie knew the truth. Keith just makes shit up when he has whatever point it is to make yet has his moments of truly remembering things:

Exile is really a mixture of bits and pieces left over from the previous album recorded at Olympic Studios and which, after we got out of the contract with Allen Klein, we didn't want to give him: tracks like Shine a Light, and Sweet Virginia. Those were mixed up with a few slightly more grungy things done in the South of France. It's seen as one album all recorded there and it really wasn't. We just chucked everything in.
- Mick Jagger, 2003


Some songs - Sweet Virginia - were held over from Sticky Fingers. It was the same line-up and I've always felt those two albums kind of fold into each other... there was not much time between them and I think it was all flying out of the same kind of energy.
- Keith Richards


It wasn't made as an album, like you see it there (on the album sleeve). Some of it was made in London, at Olympic. Some of it was made in Mick's house in Berkshire. Then we went to France, and we finished it in L.A. It was just recording, and it was a way of using up old tracks. That's what we did in those days: just recorded. It kept you busy and out of trouble - as you've no doubt recently noticed (refers to Ron Wood's recent amorous troubles) - and it was stuff you could use later.
- Charlie Watts, 2009

[timeisonourside.com]

Well Exile's reputation as a time and place (Nellcotte '71) is really a stand-in for a band finding/fighting its way to becoming "the greatest rock and roll band in the world" from 1968 through 71. That 3 or 4 year period was the massive breakthrough, aided and enhanced by MT, but STILL would have happened even without him.

As all those quotes show, pretty clearly, they were on that path and Nellcote just happened to be a place they all coexisted for reasons of money, but this music would have been created to one extent or another no matter where they were...not saying they weren't influenced by that location or the lifestyle that it brought, but they already WERE that band in 1971.

And after that massive artistic growth, they crashed with GHS. Still musically competent but now surpassed by the competition, and forever riding on the coattails of that mammoth achievement ending with EOMS.

And this is just my opinion and I love the later stuff, and there have been flashes of greatness since then, but for that brief period they were untouchable.

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Mathijs

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FP
I am intrigued by this info to find out when Loving Cup was recorded then? I thought it was one of the Exile tracks completely recorded in LA rather than started in Nellcôte and finished at Sunset Sound (despite earlier alternate versions floating about). However everyone's info seems to suggest Charlie and Bill may have only been there briefly and possibly not contributed to the session?

To date it is for most tracks still difficult to really confirm where they were recorded. My personal best guess is"

Nellcote:

Rocks Off, Rip This Joint, Casino Boogie, Tumbling Dice, Happy, Turd on the Run, All Down the Line, Ventilator Blues, Soul Survivor

Olympic Studios:

Shake Your Hips, Sweet Virginia, Sweet Black Angel, Loving Cup, Torn and Frayed, I Just Wanna See His Face, Let it Loose, Stop Breaking Down, Shine A Light

If there is any distinction to be made it appears that what are considered more 'Keith' songs came from Nellcote and the more 'Mick' songs from Olympic.

Overdubs were done in LA, with session people like Billy Preston and especially Dr.John really important. I think Dr. John's influence and network of musicians is vital for the atmosphere of Exile -much of what we consider the 'Nellcote' vibe is more due to Dr. John than the tracks being recorded there.

Mathijs

One correction though -Sweet Black Angel was recorded at Stargroves.

Mathijs

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Mathijs

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Mathijs

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FP
I am intrigued by this info to find out when Loving Cup was recorded then? I thought it was one of the Exile tracks completely recorded in LA rather than started in Nellcôte and finished at Sunset Sound (despite earlier alternate versions floating about). However everyone's info seems to suggest Charlie and Bill may have only been there briefly and possibly not contributed to the session?

To date it is for most tracks still difficult to really confirm where they were recorded. My personal best guess is"

Nellcote:

Rocks Off, Rip This Joint, Casino Boogie, Tumbling Dice, Happy, Turd on the Run, All Down the Line, Ventilator Blues, Soul Survivor

Olympic Studios:

Shake Your Hips, Sweet Virginia, Sweet Black Angel, Loving Cup, Torn and Frayed, I Just Wanna See His Face, Let it Loose, Stop Breaking Down, Shine A Light

If there is any distinction to be made it appears that what are considered more 'Keith' songs came from Nellcote and the more 'Mick' songs from Olympic.

Overdubs were done in LA, with session people like Billy Preston and especially Dr.John really important. I think Dr. John's influence and network of musicians is vital for the atmosphere of Exile -much of what we consider the 'Nellcote' vibe is more due to Dr. John than the tracks being recorded there.

Mathijs

One correction though -Sweet Black Angel was recorded at Stargroves.

Mathijs

I thought there were a couple songs from Stargroves. Maybe I’m thinking of one of the outtakes on the bonus disk.

Jim Price recalls playing organ on Torn And Frayed at Nellcote. I think he said he didn’t even know they were recording it.

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TravelinMan

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Mathijs

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Mathijs

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FP
I am intrigued by this info to find out when Loving Cup was recorded then? I thought it was one of the Exile tracks completely recorded in LA rather than started in Nellcôte and finished at Sunset Sound (despite earlier alternate versions floating about). However everyone's info seems to suggest Charlie and Bill may have only been there briefly and possibly not contributed to the session?

To date it is for most tracks still difficult to really confirm where they were recorded. My personal best guess is"

Nellcote:

Rocks Off, Rip This Joint, Casino Boogie, Tumbling Dice, Happy, Turd on the Run, All Down the Line, Ventilator Blues, Soul Survivor

Olympic Studios:

Shake Your Hips, Sweet Virginia, Sweet Black Angel, Loving Cup, Torn and Frayed, I Just Wanna See His Face, Let it Loose, Stop Breaking Down, Shine A Light

If there is any distinction to be made it appears that what are considered more 'Keith' songs came from Nellcote and the more 'Mick' songs from Olympic.

Overdubs were done in LA, with session people like Billy Preston and especially Dr.John really important. I think Dr. John's influence and network of musicians is vital for the atmosphere of Exile -much of what we consider the 'Nellcote' vibe is more due to Dr. John than the tracks being recorded there.

Mathijs

One correction though -Sweet Black Angel was recorded at Stargroves.

Mathijs

I thought there were a couple songs from Stargroves. Maybe I’m thinking of one of the outtakes on the bonus disk.

Jim Price recalls playing organ on Torn And Frayed at Nellcote. I think he said he didn’t even know they were recording it.

Yes, 2 or 3 of the Deluxe tracks were from Stargroves.

Mathijs

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Palace Revolution 2000
I too had thought that some tracks had been done entirely in LA. And now I also don't think so anymore. I base that on the remarks by people who were there; the same ones that have already been quoted. Also on the genesis of certain songs. E.g. we know that "Lovin Cup", and ADTL had been kicking around. "Virginia" had also been around.
'All Down the Line" is an interesting question. It is such a rocker; it was started before Nellcote. It has a Keithian feel. It stands to reason that they would have hit that one early on. Jagger is a fan of the song too. Yet - the sheer quality of the recording; the tightness of the Bass/Drums/ Rhythm guitar points to a more sophisticated studio setting.
'Stop Breakin Down' is another odd one out. No Keith; and a cover. Wonder when it got in there.

Edit - I just realized this has nothing to do with original question.

Speaking to Robert Greenfield in December 1972 Ian Stewart says in my book Stu

I guess they laid some tracks down in LA though?

Didn’t lay any tracks there.

They didn’t? They just mixed?

Yes, it was just mixing.

How could they mix for so long? Do you understand that?

No, I don’t. Other groups mix albums in a day or two.

What do you think of Exile? Did they mix too much?

It’s a bit overdone, I think. But at the same time I quite like it. Because the feel is there, you know.

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willnash

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Palace Revolution 2000
I too had thought that some tracks had been done entirely in LA. And now I also don't think so anymore. I base that on the remarks by people who were there; the same ones that have already been quoted. Also on the genesis of certain songs. E.g. we know that "Lovin Cup", and ADTL had been kicking around. "Virginia" had also been around.
'All Down the Line" is an interesting question. It is such a rocker; it was started before Nellcote. It has a Keithian feel. It stands to reason that they would have hit that one early on. Jagger is a fan of the song too. Yet - the sheer quality of the recording; the tightness of the Bass/Drums/ Rhythm guitar points to a more sophisticated studio setting.
'Stop Breakin Down' is another odd one out. No Keith; and a cover. Wonder when it got in there.

Edit - I just realized this has nothing to do with original question.

Speaking to Robert Greenfield in December 1972 Ian Stewart says in my book Stu

I guess they laid some tracks down in LA though?

Didn’t lay any tracks there.

They didn’t? They just mixed?

Yes, it was just mixing.

How could they mix for so long? Do you understand that?

No, I don’t. Other groups mix albums in a day or two.

What do you think of Exile? Did they mix too much?

It’s a bit overdone, I think. But at the same time I quite like it. Because the feel is there, you know.

Interesting info thanks!

So more evidence that LA was focused on mixing although we are fairly certain some overdubs did occur (Dr John etc) there. Perhaps Stu was not present for those sessions but was for the mixing portion, this is why he thinks it too a long time to mix because it was a bit of both mixing and overdubs?

They weren’t supposed to be recording (including overdubs) so I believe Stu was keeping it confidential. They obviously did overdubs, but there were no band sessions laying down new songs from scratch.

They did however start new songs and overdub in LA after coming back from Hawaii (after Jamaica) for Goats Head Soup. I believe Silver Train was re-recorded there from scratch, among others.

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willnash

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Palace Revolution 2000
I too had thought that some tracks had been done entirely in LA. And now I also don't think so anymore. I base that on the remarks by people who were there; the same ones that have already been quoted. Also on the genesis of certain songs. E.g. we know that "Lovin Cup", and ADTL had been kicking around. "Virginia" had also been around.
'All Down the Line" is an interesting question. It is such a rocker; it was started before Nellcote. It has a Keithian feel. It stands to reason that they would have hit that one early on. Jagger is a fan of the song too. Yet - the sheer quality of the recording; the tightness of the Bass/Drums/ Rhythm guitar points to a more sophisticated studio setting.
'Stop Breakin Down' is another odd one out. No Keith; and a cover. Wonder when it got in there.

Edit - I just realized this has nothing to do with original question.

Speaking to Robert Greenfield in December 1972 Ian Stewart says in my book Stu

I guess they laid some tracks down in LA though?

Didn’t lay any tracks there.

They didn’t? They just mixed?

Yes, it was just mixing.

How could they mix for so long? Do you understand that?

No, I don’t. Other groups mix albums in a day or two.

What do you think of Exile? Did they mix too much?

It’s a bit overdone, I think. But at the same time I quite like it. Because the feel is there, you know.

Please specify.

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TravelinMan
They weren’t supposed to be recording (including overdubs) so I believe Stu was keeping it confidential. They obviously did overdubs, but there were no band sessions laying down new songs from scratch.

They were supposed to be recording, they booked the small studio B for 6 weeks to record vocals and do overdubs, and booked many musicians for the sessions which you can't do in the US without permits from the Union. Also the Stones received working permits for the sessions and for the upcoming rehearsals and tour.

Mathijs

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Mathijs

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TravelinMan
They weren’t supposed to be recording (including overdubs) so I believe Stu was keeping it confidential. They obviously did overdubs, but there were no band sessions laying down new songs from scratch.

They were supposed to be recording, they booked the small studio B for 6 weeks to record vocals and do overdubs, and booked many musicians for the sessions which you can't do in the US without permits from the Union. Also the Stones received working permits for the sessions and for the upcoming rehearsals and tour.

Mathijs

They did not pay the union, hence they were not supposed to be recording. There are multiple stories of them pretending to mix when the union rep dropped by unannounced.

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Mathijs

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TravelinMan
They weren’t supposed to be recording (including overdubs) so I believe Stu was keeping it confidential. They obviously did overdubs, but there were no band sessions laying down new songs from scratch.

They were supposed to be recording, they booked the small studio B for 6 weeks to record vocals and do overdubs, and booked many musicians for the sessions which you can't do in the US without permits from the Union. Also the Stones received working permits for the sessions and for the upcoming rehearsals and tour.

Mathijs

Interesting quote from Andy Johns re Taylor and Sunset Sound.To me this quote doesn't suggest Taylor was quite as MIA on Exile and was considered a key contributor, at least to Andy

The guitar contributions of guitarist Mick Taylor were apparent to you over your working relationship with the Stones in the studio. And he received a co-write on the track ‘Ventilator Blues.’ You have said it got quite steamy in Keith’s basement ‘cause there was one small window and an electric fan blowing in the summer. So you all had the “Ventilator Blues.”

Andy Johns: Mick Taylor in the studio in France or Sunset Sound was just a shining light. As a person somewhat taciturn. When he plays his guitar and we’d do 100 takes on something he would come up with something slightly different every time. Faultless. Every once in a while he’d drop a note. I mean, that’s expected. His slide playing. He’s put a bottle on his little finger and then he’d do chords with the rest of his hand. So he could do both at once. Usually it’s a separate deal but that was part of his style. His sense of melody was unbelievable.

Every time I knew it was Mick Taylor I’d be sitting at the edge of my seat. He was wonderful but became discontent with his situation. On the 1973 tour of Europe I spent quite a lot of time with him and he would say ‘They won’t let me write any songs. Anytime I have an idea I’m blocked out.’

Later I put Mick onto Jack Bruce who was a good friend of mine and still a huge admirer of him, then and still now. They formed The Jack Bruce Band and Mick Taylor Band with drummer Bruce Gary, who would be a good friend for years in L.A. before he was in The Knack and afterward.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-07-24 14:01 by FP.

Another good Andy John's article. About IORR but has a lot of good stuff about Taylor.

[vintageking.com]

OK so to sum up I think we are all agreed on the following:

Most of the Stones were in LA at some point for the Sunset Sound sessions, but the amount of time they spent in the studio and for how long we don't really know.

It seems untrue most of the Nellcote tracks were unusable, many of the basic tracks recorded in France were brought over and used.

It looks likely both overdubbing, by Dr John and Bill Plumber plus backing vocals, as well as mixing took place at SS.

It is possible a couple of tracks were recorded there however we don't know if these were for Exile or GHS. Tracks that may have been recorded (or rerecorded) at SS include T*rd On The Run, Let it Loose, Loving Cup & Torn and Frayed. However no sessionography I have checked agrees on the exact recording location of all the songs.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2022-07-24 14:10 by FP.

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FP
OK so to sum up I think we are all agreed on the following:

Most of the Stones were in LA at some point for the Sunset Sound sessions, but the amount of time they spent in the studio and for how long we don't really know.

It seems untrue most of the Nellcote tracks were unusable, many of the basic tracks recorded in France were brought over and used.

It looks likely both overdubbing, by Dr John and Bill Plumber plus backing vocals, as well as mixing took place at SS.

It is possible a couple of tracks were recorded there however we don't know if these were for Exile or GHS. Tracks that may have been recorded (or rerecorded) at SS include T*rd On The Run, Let it Loose, Loving Cup & Torn and Frayed. However no sessionography I have checked agrees on the exact recording location of all the songs.

I think Let It Loose was pretty old, Olympic.

Loving Cup I now believe was from Nellcote after rewatching the Stones in Exile doc.

Torn And Frayed I believe is Nellcote because of Jim Price’s story.

Turd On The Run is a mystery. It could have been recorded anywhere.

Was Stop Breaking Down at Stargroves or Olympic?




Nellcote early: Tumbling Dice, Rip This Joint, Rocks Off, All Down The Line, Soul Survivor, outtakes: Signifying, untitled instrumental ballad

Nellcote later: Ventilator Blues, Casino Boogie, Loving Cup, Torn And Frayed, Happy, maybe Turd On The Run

I base that last time line on the original Hopkins Tapes. He took some time off and went to LA in the middle of the sessions and made reference tapes.

I believe some songs were attempted again in France, but the Stones stuck with the Olympic versions.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2022-07-24 17:09 by TravelinMan.

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TravelinMan

I think Let It Loose was pretty old, Olympic.

Loving Cup I now believe was from Nellcote after rewatching the Stones in Exile doc.

Torn And Frayed I believe is Nellcote because of Jim Price’s story.

Turd On The Run is a mystery. It could have been recorded anywhere.

Was Stop Breaking Down at Stargroves or Olympic?

Loving Cup, T&F and SBD are all from Olympics, They all have the Olympics drum sound, and not the boomy drum sound sound of Nellcote. Jim Price could have overdubbed at Nellcote, he spend a lot of time overdubbing brass at Nellcote.

Turd on the Run sounds like Nellcote to me, it has the Ampeg guitar sound also found on All Down the Line and Soul Survivor. But this is one of the few tracks that has no outtakes or is ever spoken about, so it is a bit of a mystery.


Nellcote:

Rocks Off, Rip This Joint, Casino Boogie, Tumbling Dice, Happy, Turd on the Run, All Down the Line, Ventilator Blues, Soul Survivor

Olympic Studios:

Shake Your Hips, Sweet Virginia, Loving Cup, Torn and Frayed, I Just Wanna See His Face, Let it Loose, Stop Breaking Down, Shine A Light

Stargroves:

Sweet Black Angel

Mathijs

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FP

It is possible a couple of tracks were recorded there however we don't know if these were for Exile or GHS. Tracks that may have been recorded (or rerecorded) at SS include T*rd On The Run, Let it Loose, Loving Cup & Torn and Frayed. However no sessionography I have checked agrees on the exact recording location of all the songs.

No this is wrong. No tracks were recorded at Sunset, only overdubs and mixing.

Mathijs

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Mathijs

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TravelinMan

I think Let It Loose was pretty old, Olympic.

Loving Cup I now believe was from Nellcote after rewatching the Stones in Exile doc.

Torn And Frayed I believe is Nellcote because of Jim Price’s story.

Turd On The Run is a mystery. It could have been recorded anywhere.

Was Stop Breaking Down at Stargroves or Olympic?

Loving Cup, T&F and SBD are all from Olympics, They all have the Olympics drum sound, and not the boomy drum sound sound of Nellcote. Jim Price could have overdubbed at Nellcote, he spend a lot of time overdubbing brass at Nellcote.

Turd on the Run sounds like Nellcote to me, it has the Ampeg guitar sound also found on All Down the Line and Soul Survivor. But this is one of the few tracks that has no outtakes or is ever spoken about, so it is a bit of a mystery.


Nellcote:

Rocks Off, Rip This Joint, Casino Boogie, Tumbling Dice, Happy, Turd on the Run, All Down the Line, Ventilator Blues, Soul Survivor

Olympic Studios:

Shake Your Hips, Sweet Virginia, Loving Cup, Torn and Frayed, I Just Wanna See His Face, Let it Loose, Stop Breaking Down, Shine A Light

Stargroves:

Sweet Black Angel

Mathijs

The last time I listened, I didn’t think Torn And Frayed and Loving Cup had similar drum sounds. Plus, they moved the kit around the basement.

What do you make of the studio banter during Loving Cup that is featured in Stones In Exile? I suppose it could be from Olympic, but I figured it would have been from France.

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Mathijs



Nellcote:

Rocks Off, Rip This Joint, Casino Boogie, Tumbling Dice, Happy, Turd on the Run, All Down the Line, Ventilator Blues, Soul Survivor

Olympic Studios:

Shake Your Hips, Sweet Virginia, Loving Cup, Torn and Frayed, I Just Wanna See His Face, Let it Loose, Stop Breaking Down, Shine A Light

Stargroves:

Sweet Black Angel

Mathijs

Which makes sense. Nellcote is basically a Sticky Fingers pt 2, while Olyimpic is a Banquet pt 2 (with the LA overdubs making it somehow more "authentic").

C

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TravelinMan

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Mathijs

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TravelinMan

I think Let It Loose was pretty old, Olympic.

Loving Cup I now believe was from Nellcote after rewatching the Stones in Exile doc.

Torn And Frayed I believe is Nellcote because of Jim Price’s story.

Turd On The Run is a mystery. It could have been recorded anywhere.

Was Stop Breaking Down at Stargroves or Olympic?

Loving Cup, T&F and SBD are all from Olympics, They all have the Olympics drum sound, and not the boomy drum sound sound of Nellcote. Jim Price could have overdubbed at Nellcote, he spend a lot of time overdubbing brass at Nellcote.

Turd on the Run sounds like Nellcote to me, it has the Ampeg guitar sound also found on All Down the Line and Soul Survivor. But this is one of the few tracks that has no outtakes or is ever spoken about, so it is a bit of a mystery.


Nellcote:

Rocks Off, Rip This Joint, Casino Boogie, Tumbling Dice, Happy, Turd on the Run, All Down the Line, Ventilator Blues, Soul Survivor

Olympic Studios:

Shake Your Hips, Sweet Virginia, Loving Cup, Torn and Frayed, I Just Wanna See His Face, Let it Loose, Stop Breaking Down, Shine A Light

Stargroves:

Sweet Black Angel

Mathijs

The last time I listened, I didn’t think Torn And Frayed and Loving Cup had similar drum sounds. Plus, they moved the kit around the basement.

What do you make of the studio banter during Loving Cup that is featured in Stones In Exile? I suppose it could be from Olympic, but I figured it would have been from France.

I think the drum sound is very similar to many Olympic tracks, with this crackling snare and somewhat subdued kick drum.

The studio banter could be from anywhere, and from any day. I mean, they even faked the film footage to look like it was filmed at Nellcote....

Mathijs

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Mathijs

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TravelinMan

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Mathijs

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TravelinMan

I think Let It Loose was pretty old, Olympic.

Loving Cup I now believe was from Nellcote after rewatching the Stones in Exile doc.

Torn And Frayed I believe is Nellcote because of Jim Price’s story.

Turd On The Run is a mystery. It could have been recorded anywhere.

Was Stop Breaking Down at Stargroves or Olympic?

Loving Cup, T&F and SBD are all from Olympics, They all have the Olympics drum sound, and not the boomy drum sound sound of Nellcote. Jim Price could have overdubbed at Nellcote, he spend a lot of time overdubbing brass at Nellcote.

Turd on the Run sounds like Nellcote to me, it has the Ampeg guitar sound also found on All Down the Line and Soul Survivor. But this is one of the few tracks that has no outtakes or is ever spoken about, so it is a bit of a mystery.


Nellcote:

Rocks Off, Rip This Joint, Casino Boogie, Tumbling Dice, Happy, Turd on the Run, All Down the Line, Ventilator Blues, Soul Survivor

Olympic Studios:

Shake Your Hips, Sweet Virginia, Loving Cup, Torn and Frayed, I Just Wanna See His Face, Let it Loose, Stop Breaking Down, Shine A Light

Stargroves:

Sweet Black Angel

Mathijs

The last time I listened, I didn’t think Torn And Frayed and Loving Cup had similar drum sounds. Plus, they moved the kit around the basement.

What do you make of the studio banter during Loving Cup that is featured in Stones In Exile? I suppose it could be from Olympic, but I figured it would have been from France.

I think the drum sound is very similar to many Olympic tracks, with this crackling snare and somewhat subdued kick drum.

The studio banter could be from anywhere, and from any day. I mean, they even faked the film footage to look like it was filmed at Nellcote....

Mathijs

Yeah, the video footage of the jamming is definitely just added in there as filler.

The studio banter is from Loving Cup, but yeah, it could be from anywhere. In fact, I believe I heard Satisfaction from the Dallas Rehearsals at one point.

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Mathijs

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TravelinMan

I think Let It Loose was pretty old, Olympic.

Loving Cup I now believe was from Nellcote after rewatching the Stones in Exile doc.

Torn And Frayed I believe is Nellcote because of Jim Price’s story.

Turd On The Run is a mystery. It could have been recorded anywhere.

Was Stop Breaking Down at Stargroves or Olympic?

Loving Cup, T&F and SBD are all from Olympics, They all have the Olympics drum sound, and not the boomy drum sound sound of Nellcote. Jim Price could have overdubbed at Nellcote, he spend a lot of time overdubbing brass at Nellcote.

Turd on the Run sounds like Nellcote to me, it has the Ampeg guitar sound also found on All Down the Line and Soul Survivor. But this is one of the few tracks that has no outtakes or is ever spoken about, so it is a bit of a mystery.


Nellcote:

Rocks Off, Rip This Joint, Casino Boogie, Tumbling Dice, Happy, Turd on the Run, All Down the Line, Ventilator Blues, Soul Survivor

Olympic Studios:

Shake Your Hips, Sweet Virginia, Loving Cup, Torn and Frayed, I Just Wanna See His Face, Let it Loose, Stop Breaking Down, Shine A Light

Stargroves:

Sweet Black Angel

Mathijs

Thanks very helpful Mathijs!

I am going to relisten to the drum sound on these tracks now.

Also yes I forgot you mentioned earlier in this thread no new tracks were recorded at LA.

Btw on our list of Taylor licks, I have to add the harmony to the intro riff on Rock's Off. It has the same Leslie tone as his buried leady parts, also adding a guitar harmony feels more of a Taylor move.

I am also leaning towards Travelin Man's idea that the outro lead part is from a different take, or an overdub, than the earlier buried licks as it does not have a Leslie effect and feels more small room off mic ambience.

I always felt the outro solo was just Taylor messing about rather than a specific solo try out, it almost sounds like he kept playing while the rest of the band faded out so possibly it is from an overdub which they removed but just liked the little end part, or it was mic bleed on another track?

I am always astounded when people say they can't hear the Taylor parts on RO. I always liked them, I used to think the little slidey chords were backing vocals going "ooh". Then I replaced my worn out vinyl with a cd and was like "oh it's guitar"!.

I like the way they snake through the mix, I think Andy Johns was right to keep them but also to mix them as an ambient element. Not a major Taylor part, I always felt RO was the definitive Keith song, but one little detail I like that sort of sums up the experience of listening to Exile.

I wish I could source it but I think there is a Rose Taylor quote that MT said to her that what he thought was some of his best playing was removed from Exile. Anyone know the songs he had in mind?

Intersting quote from Glyn Johns book.

Johns explains how Jagger asked him to work on the tapes of Exile In Main Street in London after sessions at Nellcôte in France “had run riot and people were allowed to do whatever they wanted”. He describes working on a track at Basing Street Studios on which Taylor had overdubbed backing vocals, drums and a bass. When Taylor asked the famously no-nonsense producer why he had removed them, he replied, “The Rolling Stones have a f**king great drummer and a really great bass player. You, sunshine, play the guitar and you’ll hear it rather nicely when I’ve finished this.”

It was then left to Jagger to ask the guitarist to leave the studio so Johns could continue mixing the track to his satisfaction.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-07-25 20:57 by FP.

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FP
Btw on our list of Taylor licks, I have to add the harmony to the intro riff on Rock's Off. It has the same Leslie tone as his buried leady parts, also adding a guitar harmony feels more of a Taylor move.

I am also leaning towards Travelin Man's idea that the outro lead part is from a different take, or an overdub, than the earlier buried licks as it does not have a Leslie effect and feels more small room off mic ambience.

I always felt the outro solo was just Taylor messing about rather than a specific solo try out, it almost sounds like he kept playing while the rest of the band faded out so possibly it is from an overdub which they removed but just liked the little end part, or it was mic bleed on another track?

I am always astounded when people say they can't hear the Taylor parts on RO. I always liked them, I used to think the little slidey chords were backing vocals going "ooh". Then I replaced my worn out vinyl with a cd and was like "oh it's guitar"!.

I like the way they snake through the mix, I think Andy Johns was right to keep them but also to mix them as an ambient element. Not a major Taylor part, I always felt RO was the definitive Keith song, but one little detail I like that sort of sums up the experience of listening to Exile.

I believe it's the same take. Mathijs said otherwise.

It's definitely a Leslie speaker, or a Uni-Vibe.