I forget where or when but this same subject came up and, live, they've never done a poor performance of it. NEVER.

Unlike just about anything else they've done.

I prefer the live version that's on GYYYO! and HOT ROCKS over anything else but anything else is always great.

For once I agree with Gas Light street. When someone says they prefer Baby Break it Down to Midnight Rambler, well, I’m speechless

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GasLightStreet

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NICOS

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VoodooLounge13
I can't stand either.

That's rare ;o)

Yes, I know. I'm an anomaly. Don't like Rambler. And think Shattered, Angie, and Beast of Burden are all amongst their worst songs. Not as bad as MAWGJ, but not far off.

Wow.

That's really something. Beast Of Burden, aside from its radio play, is outright brilliant.

Shattered is exceptional.

And as much as I don't like Angie, it's a killer tune.

AND you don't like Midnight Rambler?


Well, ok. But I think you're missing something elemental in regard to the Stones.

I don’t think so. I just think of them in a very different way I suppose. Gimme Shelter and Sympathy are much better show stopping moments IMO than Rambler. Especially with Miss Lisa. Baby Break It Down is my 2Nd favorite track on a brilliant album.

To me, if I were to hand a stranger one Stones album as an introduction it would be Sticky Fingers. It has everything that makes the Stones sound and swagger what it is. As well as several different musical styles. And if there is one song that best defines them it would be JJF IMHO. I think Satisfaction is far from their best riff. JJF is a brutal onslaught start to finish.

It's not so much about what I like or not, it's more about what they do with the songs, how well they work live. Rambler is a live song, no doubt about that. It never fails.
Start Me Up is the opposite - the studio version is always way better than the live renditions. Tumbling Dice used to work well live but is now a total bore.

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VoodooLounge13
And if there is one song that best defines them it would be JJF IMHO. I think Satisfaction is far from their best riff. JJF is a brutal onslaught start to finish.

I’m afraid I may look like an idiot if I say this — am I the only one who thought the JJF riff sounded like a revamp or reuse of the Satisfaction riff on hearing it for the very first time?

Brussels '73 is perfect

............Whoopsa



ROCKMAN



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-04-08 00:05 by Rockman.

As cool as the studio version is, gotta go with Rambler Live.

Brussels is the top version.

One thing I like about the Ya's Ya's version is the way the song gains momentum before the last verse. They stopped playing in that exact way after the 69 tour.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-04-08 00:30 by ryanpow.

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RisingStone

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VoodooLounge13
And if there is one song that best defines them it would be JJF IMHO. I think Satisfaction is far from their best riff. JJF is a brutal onslaught start to finish.

I’m afraid I may look like an idiot if I say this — am I the only one who thought the JJF riff sounded like a revamp or reuse of the Satisfaction riff on hearing it for the very first time?

Ask Bill Wyman.He came up with the riff to JJ Flash

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Taylor1

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RisingStone

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VoodooLounge13
And if there is one song that best defines them it would be JJF IMHO. I think Satisfaction is far from their best riff. JJF is a brutal onslaught start to finish.

I’m afraid I may look like an idiot if I say this — am I the only one who thought the JJF riff sounded like a revamp or reuse of the Satisfaction riff on hearing it for the very first time?

Ask Bill Wyman.He came up with the riff to JJ Flash

I may be an idiot, but I am not that ignorant of this all too famous anecdote surrounding JJF. Here I’m taking about a first impression.

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RisingStone

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Taylor1

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RisingStone

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VoodooLounge13
And if there is one song that best defines them it would be JJF IMHO. I think Satisfaction is far from their best riff. JJF is a brutal onslaught start to finish.

I’m afraid I may look like an idiot if I say this — am I the only one who thought the JJF riff sounded like a revamp or reuse of the Satisfaction riff on hearing it for the very first time?

Ask Bill Wyman.He came up with the riff to JJ Flash

I may be an idiot, but I am not that ignorant of this all too famous anecdote surrounding JJF. Here I’m taking about a first impression.

I thought it was a common perception amongst most everyone that the JJF riff is basically Satisfaction turned around and upside down.
Give Bill some credit for JJF no doubt, but he basically used the blueprint of Satisfaction to begin with, so you gotta give credit where credit is due - it's really Keith.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

I much prefer the live version of Rambler, but not the one that ended up on Ya Yas (or Hot Rocks). I would trade that version (11/28/69) for a great sounding one from the day before on 11/27.

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bakersfield
For once I agree with Gas Light street. When someone says they prefer Baby Break it Down to Midnight Rambler, well, I’m speechless

LOL!!!

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RisingStone

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VoodooLounge13
And if there is one song that best defines them it would be JJF IMHO. I think Satisfaction is far from their best riff. JJF is a brutal onslaught start to finish.

I’m afraid I may look like an idiot if I say this — am I the only one who thought the JJF riff sounded like a revamp or reuse of the Satisfaction riff on hearing it for the very first time?

Listen to the Satisfaction from 1969 - it was a bit revamped, essentially The Beatles' Drive My Car although modulated (they did similar with Dancing With Mr D). JJF is a kind of similar augmentation of that modulation, although, obviously, before they did Satisfaction in 1969 - and even JJF was completely different by then as well.

It SOUNDS that way. Is it? No telling.

Sad Sad Sad is Brown Sugar inverted.

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RisingStone
I love both, in the studio and live. MR live is of course a killer, always red-hot and crushing, but the original LIB version still retains its cool, dark vibe that fascinates me after listening to numerous live renditions.

I agree. It's almost always a killer version and a highlight of the show. But there's something uniquely eerie about the album version (and not just because it's one of the first couple of albums I ever bought).

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Hairball

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RisingStone

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Taylor1

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RisingStone

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VoodooLounge13
And if there is one song that best defines them it would be JJF IMHO. I think Satisfaction is far from their best riff. JJF is a brutal onslaught start to finish.

I’m afraid I may look like an idiot if I say this — am I the only one who thought the JJF riff sounded like a revamp or reuse of the Satisfaction riff on hearing it for the very first time?

Ask Bill Wyman.He came up with the riff to JJ Flash

I may be an idiot, but I am not that ignorant of this all too famous anecdote surrounding JJF. Here I’m taking about a first impression.

I thought it was a common perception amongst most everyone that the JJF riff is basically Satisfaction turned around and upside down.
Give Bill some credit for JJF no doubt, but he basically used the blueprint of Satisfaction to begin with, so you gotta give credit where credit is due - it's really Keith.

Well, that is news to me!

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Hairball
I thought it was a common perception amongst most everyone that the JJF riff is basically Satisfaction turned around and upside down.
Give Bill some credit for JJF no doubt, but he basically used the blueprint of Satisfaction to begin with, so you gotta give credit where credit is due - it's really Keith.

That kind of explains or justifies the negligence of Bill’s self-proclaimed contribution to the songwriting of JJF on Jagger/Richards side. Because of the similarity between the two riffs, I was often intrigued by his claim and its validity.

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GasLightStreet
Listen to the Satisfaction from 1969 - it was a bit revamped, essentially The Beatles' Drive My Car although modulated (they did similar with Dancing With Mr D). JJF is a kind of similar augmentation of that modulation, although, obviously, before they did Satisfaction in 1969 - and even JJF was completely different by then as well.

It SOUNDS that way. Is it? No telling.

When I was at the Eric Clapton concert at the Budokan, 6 October, 1977, he played Cocaine without introducing the title. That was two months before the Slowhand album was released, the audience had no clue what it was (FYI the song debuted live on stage the previous show, Sapporo, 4 October). Due to the language barrier, quite a few among us wondered if it was a new arrangement of Sunshine Of Your Love. Imagine my surprise the following night when Eric commented, “This is a song written by J.J. Cale, called Cocaine” and then launched into that mysterious song.

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GasLightStreet
Sad Sad Sad is Brown Sugar inverted.

TBHWY I have never felt Sad Sad Sad resembling Brown Sugar in the same way as JJF/Satisfaction.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-04-08 18:43 by RisingStone.

You might be able to write out the notes to the respective riffs and come to the conclusion it's the same thing in reverse yet that amounts to nothing regarding they dynamics of the motifs. Satisfaction is a linear one going up, going back down. JJF is circular, it spins around itself without any directional changes required throughout the song.

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Doxa
The studio version is like a blueprint, and perfect by its own means. BRUSSELS '73 is like a final outcome and fullfilment of the potentiality of the song, like 'this is as far as you can go', perfect by its own means as well. If you add YA-YA'S and Roundhouse '71 there, you will see the greatest development of a rock song ever done.

- Doxa

Excellent explanation!

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Doxa
The studio version is like a blueprint, and perfect by its own means. BRUSSELS '73 is like a final outcome and fullfilment of the potentiality of the song, like 'this is as far as you can go', perfect by its own means as well. If you add YA-YA'S and Roundhouse '71 there, you will see the greatest development of a rock song ever done.

- Doxa

Yes! And today you can add the bright red light flashing when they play it live - it is so intense when you are in the pit! Plus Steve Jordan is pushing it to another level.

Nashville: [youtu.be]

The studio version is priceless.From the very start, it almost sound live.

I also love the short instrumental which saw the light of the day lately

video: [www.youtube.com]

For the live versions they are numerous , but If I have to pick one, it will be the Roundhouse.

HMN

I prefer the live version from the 1969 US tour as I think it is the perfect pacing for the song IMHO.

They seemed to speed it up starting in 1971 and it lost something for me,



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-04-09 15:39 by oldschool.

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GasLightStreet
I forget where or when but this same subject came up and, live, they've never done a poor performance of it. NEVER.

Knebworth 76 or Marquee 71 are not so great

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AntoineParis

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GasLightStreet
I forget where or when but this same subject came up and, live, they've never done a poor performance of it. NEVER.

Knebworth 76 or Marquee 71 are not so great

Hyde Park 1969 is a bit ragged as well

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oldschool

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AntoineParis

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GasLightStreet
I forget where or when but this same subject came up and, live, they've never done a poor performance of it. NEVER.

Knebworth 76 or Marquee 71 are not so great

Hyde Park 1969 is a bit ragged as well

Hyde Park 1969 is in my top 5

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oldschool

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AntoineParis

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GasLightStreet
I forget where or when but this same subject came up and, live, they've never done a poor performance of it. NEVER.

Knebworth 76 or Marquee 71 are not so great

Hyde Park 1969 is a bit ragged as well

Hyde Park 1969 is in my top 5

Too each his own as I find it be be pretty ragged. The band was under rehearsed and out of tune. I love any 1969 version starting with Detroit up to and including the two Boston shows. Earlier versions on the 1969 tour were still good but a little flat by comparison. Also think Altamont could have been one of the best if not for the violence interruptions.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2022-04-09 17:37 by oldschool.

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Honestman
The studio version is priceless.From the very start, it almost sound live.

To me it doesn't sound live at all which means huge and powerful. The LIB version sounds claustrophobic and twisted which adds to its nasty charm.

And overall LIB is a claustrophobic, twisted album, unlike BB. Only at the very end with "You Can't..." that you get to a glimpse of light and hope.

LIB is a very dark place to go to... that's why it's Keith's album mainly. Had "Morphine" been put on LIB in place of "Country Honk", this record would have been truly scary...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022-04-09 17:50 by dcba.

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dcba

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Honestman
The studio version is priceless.From the very start, it almost sound live.

To me it doesn't sound live at all which means huge and powerful. The LIB version sounds claustrophobic and twisted which adds to its nasty charm.

And overall LIB is a claustrophobic, twisted album, unlike BB. Only at the very end with "You Can't..." that you get to a glimpse of light and hope.

LIB is a very dark place to go to... that's why it's Keith's album mainly. Had "Morphine" been put on LIB in place of "Country Honk", this record would have been truly scary...

That's a very interesting, and sadly accurate assessment. I really like Let It Bleed, but I do find the terrain to be very dark, almost like it had to "one up" Beggars Banquet-which I much prefer over Let It Bleed, especially for its lighter overtones (Dear Doctor, Factory Girl). Great observations!

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dcba

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Honestman
The studio version is priceless.From the very start, it almost sound live.

To me it doesn't sound live at all which means huge and powerful. The LIB version sounds claustrophobic and twisted which adds to its nasty charm.

And overall LIB is a claustrophobic, twisted album, unlike BB. Only at the very end with "You Can't..." that you get to a glimpse of light and hope.

LIB is a very dark place to go to... that's why it's Keith's album mainly. Had "Morphine" been put on LIB in place of "Country Honk", this record would have been truly scary...

That's a very interesting, and sadly accurate assessment. I really like Let It Bleed, but I do find the terrain to be very dark, almost like it had to "one up" Beggars Banquet-which I much prefer over Let It Bleed, especially for its lighter overtones (Dear Doctor, Factory Girl). Great observations!

1969 was very, very dark, and filled with turmoil. The center did not hold; the world was spinning out of control —- in the US, in Europe, in Vietnam, and inside The Rolling Stones.

The album caught the spirit of that year, the zeitgeist, better than any other music. It was the brief moment when the Stones were at the forefront of both popular music and culture.

That’s why I like the album version of Rambler (and Shelter) better than the live versions.