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Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: Javadave ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:08

Here’s a good video example of Steve Jordan’s aptitude as a cover drummer:

[m.youtube.com]

John Fogerty & Friends-Born On The Bayou

John Fogerty
Jerry Garcia
Bob Weir
Randy Jackson
Steve Jordan


May 27, 1989
Stop AIDS Concert
Oakland Coliseum
Oakland, California

Here’s a high quality matrix audio of the whole show:

[m.youtube.com]

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: triceratops ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:09

Maybe this was mentioned...Charlie has back problems that required surgery? That require long recovery time. I have read previously that his back bothers him. Though he can hold up, soldier on for tours. Charlie has done so until this surgery.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:10

Quote
WorriedAboutYou
"Music of The Rolling Stones performed by Chuck Leavell, Mick Jagger and friends"

OK, in this difficult time, that did make me laugh out loud.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:12

Quote
triceratops
Maybe this was mentioned...Charlie has back problems that required surgery? That require long recovery time. I have read previously that his back bothers him. Though he can hold up, soldier on for tours. Charlie has done so until this surgery.

It was described as emergency surgery...so I suppose that could include the back. But whatever it was, you don't say 'emergency' if it's 'routine surgery'.

Sounds serious...great he's in recovery mode.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: Bastion ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:17

Quote
Javadave
Here’s a good video example of Steve Jordan’s aptitude as a cover drummer:

[m.youtube.com]

John Fogerty & Friends-Born On The Bayou

John Fogerty
Jerry Garcia
Bob Weir
Randy Jackson
Steve Jordan


May 27, 1989
Stop AIDS Concert
Oakland Coliseum
Oakland, California

Here’s a high quality matrix audio of the whole show:

[m.youtube.com]

Yeah over 30 years ago...

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Date: August 5, 2021 18:21

No doubt they can do very good show and music with Steve Jordan. Just as Keith alone did.
But it is Mick, Keith and Ron with other musicians on stage.
No longer the Rolling Stones.
Take it as a bonus to their unprecedented career. Better than cancelling the shows, for sure.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: DeanGoodman ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:28

Quote
floodonthepage

The RS article indicated Charlie asked Steve. "I asked my great friend Steve....." something like that.

That was the biggest red flag in a quagmire of red flags. Unless Steve is attending horse shows in Poland, I'm not sure how he and Charlie became great friends. It's just not something Charlie would say even if they were great friends. As others have said, it's a PR concoction a million miles from reality.

[www.deangoodman.com]

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:35

Quote
georgelicks
Sadly it's only business and insurance today, no more artistic integrity, the cost of not doing the tour is worse, a big lawsuit of many years against them, a time loss, time that they don't have now.

"Today"? It's always been like that, no? They probably have a buyout clause but they (understandably) don't want to cough up the cash,. make $20 million or pay $XX million to cancel or $X million to postpone ? Also they could have easily added a "no Charlie/Ronnie/Keith" insurance clause (yes, Keith too, re the MT return) but that would have cost them. As always the buck stops with them, they gouge the promoters and fans, it comes at the cost of integrity...

Oh and if Charlie wants to keep his share you can bet that Jordan's salary is coming out of HIS pocket!

--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 2021-08-05 18:41 by gotdablouse.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: saltoftheearth ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:40

Quote
TheflyingDutchman
Quote
saltoftheearth
If they invited Mick Taylor and made him part of the band they would still have four original members on stage.

Mick Taylor is not an original member. He replaced Brian Jones.
Funny to see now that the Stones have a black rhythm section.

If you are that critical about it let's tate that he is former member, and he would be more fitting than someone who has neverbeen part of the Stones.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: Mongoose ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:41

As a die hard Stones fan since I first heard “It’s All Over Now” on a car radio in 1964, a semi-retired professional drummer, and a veteran of ten Stones concerts, I have a few observations.

First, of course, GET WELL SOON, Charlie! We’re all pulling for you, and we have no doubt we’ll see you again, even if it is for a few select shows here and there.

We all knew this day was coming. Not the specific details we have just learned about, of course, but a situation where one of the core members was out of the lineup.

Is it the Rolling Stones without Charlie? I guess that is a personal perception among the fans. Was it the Grateful Dead during the “Fare Thee Well” final tour without Jerry Garcia? Currently, there is not one original member of Blood, Sweat & Tears in the band, so….is it really BS&T? Is it really the Beach Boys with just Mike Love and Bruce Johnston?

Judging by conversations with people in the crowd during the last few shows, I’d say about 35% of any audience at Rolling Stones concerts are die hards, like us. Folks that can tell you that Charlie’s wife’s name is Shirley, that “Wild Horses” was on the Sticky Fingers album, that Nicky Hopkins was one of the great unsung heroes in the band both live and in the studio for his always tasty piano licks, that the 1975 shows were part of the Tour of the Americas, and so on. This is also the “Deep Cuts” group that very much looks forward to hearing tunes like “Monkey Man” or “2000 Man”, and who, most likely, choose “Miss You” as their chance to hit the rest rooms and buy another beer.

In other words, just about everyone in IORR.

The other 65% of the crowd knows that Mick Jagger is the singer, most likely are aware of Keith Richards, and are at the arena to hear the war horses of “Satisfaction,” “Brown Sugar,” and so on. They went to the Voodoo Lounge Tour without really realizing or caring that Bill Wyman was no longer in the band. They came, they saw, they bought several t shirts, and went home happy. In my mind, this group is not really going to be as concerned as the rest of us about Charlie not being on stage.

Let’s face it, all of that same group will still buy tickets and merchandise, and that, my friends, is what it is all about. This is a business, first and foremost, and I would have actually been surprised to hear that they were calling off these fall shows. They are sort of locked in to having to complete these dates, no matter what happens.

For me, though, Charlie is the heart and soul of this band, and I won’t be spending hundreds of dollars to see a version of the band without him on stage. For those folks that do still buy tickets and attend, good for you, I’d love to hear your thoughts on the show afterwards. And, what the Hell, here’s some money, pick me up a t shirt, will ya?

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Date: August 5, 2021 18:42

Quote
Javadave
Here’s a good video example of Steve Jordan’s aptitude as a cover drummer:

[m.youtube.com]

John Fogerty & Friends-Born On The Bayou

John Fogerty
Jerry Garcia
Bob Weir
Randy Jackson
Steve Jordan


May 27, 1989
Stop AIDS Concert
Oakland Coliseum
Oakland, California

Here’s a high quality matrix audio of the whole show:

[m.youtube.com]

Yes. Good example how different drummer to Charlie Steve Jordan is.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: Topi ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:45

Quote
roryfaninva
I'd wager Steve Jordan was already discreetly identified as a contingency before the tour even started. With an 80 year old cancer survivor anchoring a multi multi million dollar tour , the contracts probably mandated it. An ailing Charlie Watts wasnt cold calling anyone from a hospital bed, regardless of how its framed in the PR/media. The show must go on.

You may be right.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: bam ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:56

Great post, Mongoose.
And get well, Charlie.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: 2014Slayer ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:57

Read this article this morning, and for some really odd reason, it mentions the Stones playing the Rose Bowl Jan. 1, 2022!

[deadline.com]

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: Summergirl ()
Date: August 5, 2021 18:59

"For me, though, Charlie is the heart and soul of this band, and I won’t be spending hundreds of dollars to see a version of the band without him on stage."

Well said, Mr. Mongoose.....I feel the same. sad smiley

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: treaclefingers ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:08

Quote
2014Slayer
Read this article this morning, and for some really odd reason, it mentions the Stones playing the Rose Bowl Jan. 1, 2022!

[deadline.com]

WTF??

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: floodonthepage ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:09

Quote
bye bye johnny
Quote
floodonthepage

The RS article indicated Charlie asked Steve. "I asked my great friend Steve....." something like that.

Prior to the official statement from the band - including Charlie's comments - all articles quoted The Sun.

OK...the Sun. And I'm sure plenty of other places. I just read it in RS.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: Testify ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:09

I have only just read the news and I am very sorry, however it seems that Charlie's operation went well and this is the important thing.
I wish Charlie to come back soon and make a complete recovery.

After that I disagree with some users who have commented.
Surely if it would have happened earlier, the RS would have postponed the dates, unfortunately as Charlie joked his timing this time was bad, so the RS in order not to encounter problems and not to postpone the scheduled dates further, they decided to go the same.
It was the most obvious decision if you think these dates are already a postponement due to the pandemic.
I'm sorry, but at the same time I'm happy that Chalie is fine and she's not going to leave the band.
Now I'm just curious to hear, these reworked Stones.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-08-05 19:11 by Testify.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: floodonthepage ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:13

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Quote
spoonful2
Quote
floodonthepage
A couple things seem clear to me...

1. Charlie wants this, according to the RS article. It sounds like HE asked Steve to do this, which makes a different for me.

2. The fact that theses shows are going forward doesn't (for me) mean that Keith or anyone else still doesn't feel the "No Charlie, No Stones" phrase. It means that the pandemic/contracts/insurers have them "in a spot", a spot that includes the livelihood of many a crew member. Charlie and everyone in the band are helping those people in many ways by going forward, not the least of which financially.

Less clear to me is....

3. The door does seem open for Charlie to come back during the tour, if not later in this tour then down the road with whatever plans they have that we are not aware of...that said, those plans may not include anymore US dates, and with that in mind do I want my (possibly) last Stones show to be w/o Charlie or do I skip the tour...knowing that if I (and enough other people) do that it may in some fashion hurt the larger/extended Stones family (the crew, etc.). I work with someone now who worked on their crew for Licks, and I can imagine what it means to people like him that the "show goes on"....not to mention what if (pie in the sky) Charlie comes back mid-tour...to experience that would be outstanding.

Lastly and ultimately, I think if this truly were a "Charlie is out" scenario, as in done with touring or worse.....if he had passed...then the "No Charlie, No Stones" would take hold and the band would stop. I could be wrong about that (as was exampled by the Who with Entwistle which has been pointed out was likely a contractual jam as well) but I'd like to think I'm right about that.

Charlie did not ask Steve Jordan to play for him, that was Mick and Keith. He was the obvious choice anyway.

Most likely Keith and Ronnie's choice. Btw, do you have sources for this and the surgery-thing?

Charlie was given a lot (if not final?) say in the selection of Darryl. You don't think his say wasn't considered heavily in the selection of Steve? I think Mick and Keith respect him enough for that to be the case, just my opinion. Sure the Glimmers are the Glimmers, but Charlie is not just a hired hand. I'm sure he was in on the Steve decision....even if that decision was ultimately made in some contract many years ago for all I know.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: micha063 ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:17

Best wishes to Charlie Watts!
The Rolling Stones without him may be a good RR Band.
But its not the Rolling Stones.
So sad.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: Topi ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:18

Sure looks like The Sun had learned of the Stones' official statement before it was released. I mean, the quotes are verbatim.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:20

Quote
MidnightDevilRambler
Just a bad omen for this tour in many respects.
Glad I'm taking a pass this time...

Hoping the best for Charlie as another dark cloud hangs over this tour.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021-08-05 19:24 by Hairball.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Date: August 5, 2021 19:23

I doubt Charlie delivered any message. He might have aproved it at most.

Steve Jordan might have been flash decision made by Keith that nobody cared or dared to question (or Mick just thought as Keith and thought it was right).



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021-08-05 19:28 by emotionalbarbecue.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: VoodooLounge13 ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:28

Best of luck for a speedy and complete recovery, Mr. Watts!!! That is all that truly matters here.

That being said, I, too, am of the sentiment that it is not quite the Rolling Stones without Charlie. But to say Ronnie is not a Stone either does plague me some - the man has been releasing albums with them for as long as I've been alive!!!! 1976's Black & Blue.

While I have no intentions of going to see them this tour due to COVID, this turn of events, actually has me PONDERING going. When else would we be able to say that we say such an UNprecedented event as a Stones concert without Charlie??? And yes, I do wonder what the band will sound like - will they take any chances? Probably not. To hear One Hit, would be Phenomenal. Would LOVE for them to open with it!!!! That's the opener of my dream setlist actually - comprised only of all songs not heard live that I'd love to. How awesome would that be? I most likely still won't go, but I am at least now open to the possibility of going vs. it being out of the question all together.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: micha063 ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:31

I'm so glad, I saw them so many times! They are the mson üsrt of the soundtrsck of my life.
Since 2012 they realy prooved themselves. I saw them 14. 17 and 18. Hopefully Charlie will join them again. But it ferls like the Stones are History.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:36

Quote
bv
First of all I hope Charlie will recover completely soon. Then it will be very interesting to see how Steve Jordan will solve complex RS drumming challenges - mastered in an excellent way by Charlie - like Midnight Rambler.

Maybe they'll not even attempt Midnight Rambler and just retire it until Charlie's return for the 60th anniversary - without him it could never be the same.
The same could be said about many songs in the Stones catalogue though as Charlie's drumming is so unique and essential to the Stones' sound.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: jbwelda ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:40

I think it will push them to actually work on songs instead of just relying on memory and reflex. Not having Charlie on drums could add a lot of life to the band, he has reached the point where an enthusiastic drum backing is not in him, he just mostly kind of keeps time and is a physical presence more than the necessary drum backing for a vibrant band. Its hard work for a thirty year old to play drums, almost impossible for an eighty year old to do it energetically.

jb

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Date: August 5, 2021 19:40

Quote
saltoftheearth
Quote
TheflyingDutchman
Quote
saltoftheearth
If they invited Mick Taylor and made him part of the band they would still have four original members on stage.

Mick Taylor is not an original member. He replaced Brian Jones.
Funny to see now that the Stones have a black rhythm section.

If you are that critical about it let's tate that he is former member, and he would be more fitting than someone who has neverbeen part of the Stones.

No. Not anymore. Maybe 15 or 20 years ago.

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: crawdaddy ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:43

Best wishes to Charlie for a complete and speedy recovery. smileys with beer

I think Steve Jordan has probably been first choice drummer, if ever needed, for some time now.

We have always dreaded news like this, for any of the band.

Time is not on their side to put the Tour on hold again, and they have done exactly the right thing in my opinion. thumbs up

Looking forward to September 26th, and Charlie watching and listening to it all from afar, in Devon or London I guess. thumbs up

Re: Charlie Watts pulls out of US tour after undergoing emergency surgery
Posted by: ErwinH ()
Date: August 5, 2021 19:50

Quote
TheflyingDutchman

Mick Taylor is not an original member. He replaced Brian Jones.

Charlie is not an original member. He replaced Tony Chapman. :-)

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